Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

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Spaceman Spiff
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

ASUCatFan wrote:I had a confrontation on my flight from Heathrow to Miami last winter because the dude in front of me insisted on reclining his seat and at 6'8" tall, there was absolutely nowhere for my legs to go. After about an hour and a half on the plane, he turned around red in the face and started yelling at me about my knees. I was equally pissed and said some not so nice things to him and he put his seat back up and didn't bother me for the rest of the flight. I'll definitely be investing in some knee defenders the next time I fly. Passive aggressive or not, I'd rather annoy the inconsiderate asshole in front of me than get thrown off of the plane.
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Salty
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Salty »

Flying from Bahrain to London earlier this year, the lady in front of me reclined before we had even taken off and didn't move until we landed.

When this happens, I typically will get up to use the restroom and I'll grab their seat to help me get to my feet. It usually shakes their chair a bit.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Alieberman »

People are going to recline.

Tall folks complaining- do you try to upgrade to the "economy plus" to get a couple extra inches of room? Or in an exit row? 1st row behind 1st class? Or even the row right behind exit rows? (exit rows don't recline)
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by CalStateTempe »

Wow, this editorial hits many of the points made by the "right to recliners".

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/28/upsho ... 0002&abg=1

also this:
A no-recline norm would also have troubling social justice implications — for short people. Complaints about knee-room are not spread equally across our society. They are voiced mostly by the tall, a privileged group that already enjoys many advantages. I don’t just mean they can see well at concerts and reach high shelves. Tall people earn more money than short people, an average of $789 per inch per year, according to a 2004 paper in the Journal of Applied Psychology.

The economists Anne Case and Christina Paxson advanced the theory that tall people earn more because they have higher I.Q.s. Taller men on the dating website OkCupid receive more messages from women and have more sex partners than their short counterparts.

Instead of counting their blessings, or buying extra-legroom seats with some of their extra income, the tall have the gall to demand that the rules of flying be reconfigured to their advantage, just as everything else in life already has been. Sometimes — one Upshot editor who shall remain nameless included — they even use the Knee Defender to steal from their fellow passengers.

Now that’s just wrong.
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Puerco
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Puerco »

Why can't tall people just be more normal? I mean I don't have any sympathy for the fat dude who has to buy an extra seat because he can't fit in just one, so why sympathize with the other weirdos in the world, right? :D
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by azgreg »

Puerco wrote:Why can't tall people just be more normal? I mean I don't have any sympathy for the fat dude who has to buy an extra seat because he can't fit in just one, so why sympathize with the other weirdos in the world, right? :D
Frickin midgets.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by 77HoyaCat4Ever »

I am 6'2". I almost never recline. If I do, I look back first, ask permission, and only recline part way. I consider it rude to do otherwise.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by 84Cat »

Now that 2 flights have been diverted, I hope this doesn't become a big deal. I am flying to Seattle for a week and I just hope my flights have no issues with this. Why can't people be nice to each other?
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the real dill
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by the real dill »

84Cat wrote:Now that 2 flights have been diverted, I hope this doesn't become a big deal. I am flying to Seattle for a week and I just hope my flights have no issues with this. Why can't people be nice to each other?
I think you're seeing why right here. Even though it's a complete dick move, people in this thread are going to continue to recline all the way because it's their "right." Just like it's their "right" to drive 55 in the left lane of the freeway.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by 84Cat »

I think I will be proactive and initiate a conversation before I recline.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by CalStateTempe »

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/travelbu ... uette.html

Very interesting thread on a forum for frequent flyers.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

Puerco wrote:Why can't tall people just be more normal? I mean I don't have any sympathy for the fat dude who has to buy an extra seat because he can't fit in just one, so why sympathize with the other weirdos in the world, right? :D
Being over six feet tall is normal. Frankly, if it wasn't for modern contracting building low shelves, short people would already be extinct.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by azgreg »

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Frankly, if it wasn't for modern contracting building low shelves, short people would already be extinct.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by UAEebs86 »

We are the people our parents warned us about.
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Puerco
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Puerco »

I fly a lot. I have never once been asked by someone in front of me whether they could recline or not, and when people do recline fully I am only mildly irritated. I'm 6'0".

Since when did reclining a reclining seat on an airplane become a 'dick move'? That's just asinine.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by CryptoCat »

I flew home from Boston to Colorado last night on JetVBlue, which doesn't specifically ban the Knee Defender, and sure enough I had a French dude (I HATE the fucking French) who had a KD hooked up. This is a late-night flight, 10:50 PM departure, lands at 1:30 PM local Colorado time. People should be able to (respectfully) recline and sleep. I got mad, and I stood up, and told him: I am a big a guy (6'3, 240 lbs, and a pretty solid build for someone pushing 40). Those things are cheap pieces of plastic. If I want to break them, I will. You can be polite, remove the devices and keep them another day, or you can test me, I'll break them, we'll make a scene, and divert the plane.

He mumbled angrily in French, took the device off, and I reclined respectfully enough to be semi-comfortable while respecting his space, and everything was fine after that.

I fucking HATE the French.
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Puerco
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Puerco »

Did he have his seat reclined? :D
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CryptoCat
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by CryptoCat »

Yeah, he reclined his own seat with no problem. Typical French behavior: "Fuck you, I'm le French".
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Alieberman »

I'm about to get on a plane.

To recline or not to recline...

I'm ready to stand my ground
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Alieberman »

Everybody around me is talking about knee defenders. Move over gay rights and racial equality... This is the next great social movement
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by azgreg »

Stay alive brother.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Chicat »

If the gestapo would just allow us to bring guns on planes, we wouldn't need the knee defender...
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Longhorned »

Alieberman wrote:Everybody around me is talking about knee defenders. Move over gay rights and racial equality... This is the next great social movement
For the return flight, show up with some kind of random, highly visible plastic device on which you've written, "THE KNEE BREAKER".
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Chicat »

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Of the 12 coaches, Rush picked the one whose fans have the deepest passion, the longest memories, the greatest lung capacity and … did I mention deep passion?
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Longhorned »

The more you recline, the more I fart.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ioey-e- ... ata_player

As with most things, Arnold has the answer.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by the real dill »

Yahoo Finance ‏@YahooFinance 1h
MT @JeffMacke: called @Delta for an interview w/ head of rev. (guy masterminding selling leg room). Response (paraphrased): "email us". huh
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Puerco »

Y'all should be revotling against American carriers. You're getting screwed incrementally every year.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Longhorned »

Puerco wrote:Y'all should be revotling against American carriers. You're getting screwed incrementally every year.
Lol you know jack shit about the airline industry.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

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NEW YORK (AP) — The businessman whose dispute with a fellow airline passenger over a reclined seat sparked a national debate about air-travel etiquette says he's embarrassed by the way the confrontation unfolded and that he regrets his behavior.

But don't expect James Beach to stop using the Knee Defender, a $22 gadget that attaches to a passenger's tray table and prevents the person in front from reclining. He just plans to be nicer about it.

"I'm pretty ashamed and embarrassed by what happened," Beach told The Associated Press on Wednesday. "I could have handled it so much better."

The argument became so tense that the pilots of the Aug. 24 fight diverted the Boeing 737 to Chicago. An AP story about the incident started a broad public discussion of whether passengers should be allowed to recline. In the days that followed, two other flights were diverted under similar circumstances.

Beach, 48, reached out to the AP to clarify a few things about the episode, primarily that he initially complied with flight attendant instructions to remove the device.

For the record, he said, he never reclines his seat.

"You have the right, but it seems rude to do it," said Beach, who is 6 feet 1 inch tall.

The dispute occurred on the final leg of Beach's trip back to his home near Denver. He had been in Moscow on business and was given a middle seat for the leg from Newark, New Jersey, to Denver. Beach took out his laptop to review a contract for his company, which develops waste recycling facilities, primarily in Russia. He used the Knee Defender — a Christmas gift a few years ago from his wife — to prevent the woman in front from reclining.

U.S. airlines prohibit use of the Knee Defender, but the devices are not illegal.

"I put them in maybe a third of the time. Usually, the person in front tries (to recline) their seat a couple of times, and then they forget about it," Beach said. The device comes with a courtesy card to tell passengers that you've blocked them, but he doesn't use it.

"I'd rather just kind of let them think the seat is broken, rather than start a confrontation," he said.

Beach, who said he flies 75,000 to 100,000 miles a year, wasn't so lucky this time.

When the flight attendants came through the cabin to serve beverages, the woman said her seat was broken. That's when Beach told one of them about the Knee Defender. The flight attendant asked him to remove the device, and Beach said he did.

"As soon as I started to move it, she just full force, blasted the seat back, right on the laptop, almost shattered the screen. My laptop came flying onto my lap," he said.

Beach complained, saying that he couldn't work like that, but the flight attendant informed him that the woman had the right to recline. Both passengers were sitting in United's Economy Plus section, which offers 4 more inches of legroom than the rest of coach.

His reply: "You asked me to let her recline a few inches, and she just took 100 percent of it."

That's when Beach's anger boiled over. He said he pushed the woman's seat forward and put the Knee Defender back in. The woman stood up and threw a cup of soda — not water, as previously reported water — at him.

It was the first time anybody had ever thrown a drink at him.

"It was really just surreal and shocking. Did that just happen?" Beach recalls. "I said, 'I hope you brought your checkbook because you just threw your Sprite all over my $2,000 laptop.'"

The flight attendant stepped in quickly and moved the woman to another seat.

"I said a lot of things I shouldn't have said to the flight attendant: some bad words, what's your name and 'I can't believe you're treating me like this,'" he recalled.

The pilots then changed course for Chicago — a decision that Beach said "amazed" him.

"The plane was dead quiet for the rest of that flight," he added. "Nobody said a word."

Ira Goldman, who invented the Knee Defender, said the passengers on the other diverted flights got upset after their knees and head were hit by reclining seats. He said airlines are "trying to wish this problem away."

His solution: Install seats that slide forward within a shell to recline or to allow the use of his device, which has been sold since 2003.

"They're selling the same space twice — to me to sit down and then inviting people to put their seat backs there as well," he said.

When the plane landed in Chicago, police escorted Beach and the woman off. Neither police, nor the airline or the Transportation Security Administration has released any information about the passenger seated in front of Beach.

No criminal or civil charges were brought against them, but United would not let them continue on to Denver.

Beach says he spent the night at an airport hotel and then caught a flight home the next morning. He flew Spirit Airlines. It has no reclining seats.

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/passenge ... y-context=
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by CalStateTempe »

I would say Beach's inflated opinion of himself is a bigger problem in this situation than his height.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by scumdevils86 »

CalStateTempe wrote:I would say Beach's inflated opinion of himself is a bigger problem in this situation than his height.
no kidding. what a d bag.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Longhorned »

I think the biggest risk is that if somebody loses their cool, the whole plane land at the nearest airport. It's the realization of that empty threat your mother used to make when you and your siblings fought in the back seat on long road trips. Holy shit, mom wasn't kidding. Enjoy Lincoln, Nebraska and try to find some other way home. See you in the next lifetime.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by Coop Cat »

How does one think that they are going to get away with this:
A passenger was sexually assaulted in an airliner's bathroom while flying from Hawaii to Japan, officials said. FBI agents were waiting at Honolulu International Airport to arrest the suspect after Japan Airlines Flight 791 turned back following Saturday's incident.

Michael Tanouye, 29, of Hilo, Hawaii, was arraigned Tuesday charged with interfering with a flight crew and aggravated sexual assault aboard an aircraft, The Associated Press reported. Tanouye allegedly forced his way into the bathroom, exposed himself to a Japanese woman and attempted to undress her, NBC station KHNL reported Tuesday. He was being held without bail at the Honolulu Federal Detention Center.
http://www.nbcnews.com/business/travel/ ... om-n226176
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the real dill
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by the real dill »

If you recline in coach, you're a dickhead on the speed limit in left lane level. Let's just put it out there. This isn't even a tall person thing. It's a being a decent human thing.
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by CalStateTempe »

Upgrade your seat.
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the real dill
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Re: Do you ask permission before reclining your seat?

Post by the real dill »

CalStateTempe wrote:Upgrade your seat.
I don't fly economy often, and this was a last minute trip with no available upgrades. Either way, don't recline, don't drive slow in the left lane, and walk your shopping cart to the appropriate place in the grocery store parking lot. Little things that matter.
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