Bear Down Wildcats

az91 wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:This is a young team. Having ugly games early was always a probability. How we progress is the big thing for success this year and onwards. Let's not be a bunch of Chicken Littles yet.

Maybe some players will improve (Trier in particular) as the season progresses, but this team lacks elite players. Even with growth, it is hard to imagine much more than a first round exit in the NCAA Tournament this year.

It will be interesting if Miller can land some of the remaining elite recruits for 2016. That will determine whether this program can take the next step or "fall back into the middle of the PAC-12."

I would offer up a longer post, but I have to head to the bomb shelter and I have no internet coverage. The sky Is apparently falling outside.

We need to finish the class with a bang if we want to continue dominating the conference in the coming years... But suggesting that recent stumbles indicate that our program is headed back to the middle of the Pac are pure comedy.

Considering we have not been there in >30 years.

Too many dumbass comments to comment on...

az91 wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:This is a young team. Having ugly games early was always a probability. How we progress is the big thing for success this year and onwards. Let's not be a bunch of Chicken Littles yet.

Maybe some players will improve (Trier in particular) as the season progresses, but this team lacks elite players. Even with growth, it is hard to imagine much more than a first round exit in the NCAA Tournament this year.

It will be interesting if Miller can land some of the remaining elite recruits for 2016. That will determine whether this program can take the next step or fall back into the middle of the PAC-12.

this is just so crazy I can't begin to respond to it, but I'm going to try.

First round exit? Just because we had a tough weekend without our most important defensive presence at a time when our defense is still on a huge learning curve??

I'm proud of the way they fought back and played Boise St, even if we are having issues putting our foot on a team's throat (how is that not to be expected when this group has barely played together).

Are we really THAT far away from that Michigan State team, who has so much more continuity than us and a national player of the year candidate? From what I saw in their games against Boise and Providence, we aren't that far from them at all.

The thing is, our defensive system looks really bad when even one piece is out of line, and certainly we have a lot of work to do there. It will take time, maybe all season, to get to a point where we can rely on it. But the potential is there when healthy. This team has great chemistry and will work hard to make sure that each guy can be relied on to be in the right place at the right time. I believe CSM will get them there. But it will be UGLY, that's obvious. It's tough to go from the last two teams we had to this one because we are used to a well oiled machine from the start.

Offensively, do people really think that someone like Gabe is just immune to shooting slumps? All over this and every Arizona board it's "Gabe is too streaky to rely on" a week after everyone was saying "This is the go-to York we've been waiting for his entire 4 years!". It's insane how quickly we flip-flop. I for one see a guy who, when his shot starts falling like I know it can, is going to be much more dangerous because he has started attacking with purpose.

Tollefsen is figuring things out just like the rest of the new guys. Just because he's a 5th year guy doesn't mean that it's easy to learn CSM's system just like that. I have seen slight improvements in his defense within the system (admittedly he's still getting beat off of the dribble too much, but that seems a lot worse when the rest of the team doesn't know where to be on the help side). Tolly seems to be one of the few guys who is at least trying to provide help defense properly, which seems to go completely unnoticed on this board. He is stuffing the stat sheet and makes a lot of energy/hustle plays. Happy to see him drain that long three yesterday, and I think by the end of the year we will be happy to have him.

I hope Zeus and RA get healthy quick and are 100% for Gonzaga. I want to see what this team is made of in a tough environment, but I am expecting a good effort and I believe we will be in that game until the end.

Nothing wrong with curbing expectations and being absolutely frustrated with the team's current state. But the talk of us not making the tournament, or having a sure fire exit in the first game, or the program regressing is crazy talk. The Boise State game, for as sloppy as we played, was a gutsy win without Tarc on a night where they easily could have hung their heads and packed it in. Boise State wanted and needed that game a hell of a lot more than we did and outside of letting off the gas late, we beat them down.

As for the recruiting, it cannot be stated enough that one off recruiting year, when it is still far from being over, means nothing. People losing their minds over losing out on Rabb (wanted to stay home), Leaf's decommit (salty over U19 snubb?), and Lee (still want to hear explanation on possible Ace issue, but I think he made up his mind before Stanley declared, plus may have been worried about competing for minutes w York, Smith and Trier), all three can probably easily be explained and it isn't Miller losing his luster. What was it, five straight top 7 classes going by ESPN rankings (higher if you use other rankings) they showed in yesterday's graphic? Only Kentucky can say that.

I think the fact that we lost four starters, were still preseason top 15, climbed as high as 10, and have only lost one game speaks to the current state of our program. Our one loss came without starter number 5, against a team that was up late on Michigan state and may have only lost because Dunn picked up his fourth foul. And then again, without Zeus, we were up 19 on Boise State, Im not sure Michigan State was even up on them that much.

Look. Cal has an outstanding recruiting class this year, and arguably (by some at least) the best starting 5 in the PAC.

They also have 2 losses...

They gave up a 15 point lead to SDSU in Vegas, by allowing a 32-7 run by a team with problems on the offensive end. The ended up losing by 14 points.
They then allowed Richmond to go on a 21-7 run and ended up losing to them by 4 points, 94-90.

I get tired of hearing about recruiting classes and rankings and such, when coaching the actual players is what matters. If you think that Sean Miller is doing something wrong, or that he isn't a good coach because we lost by 4 to a team with perhaps the best college player on the team this year (without our 4 year starting center in the game) then that's your prerogative.

But gawdamn it is still fucking November.

Olsondogg wrote:Look. Cal has an outstanding recruiting class this year, and arguably (by some at least) the best starting 5 in the PAC.

They also have 2 losses...

They gave up a 15 point lead to SDSU in Vegas, by allowing a 32-7 run by a team with problems on the offensive end. The ended up losing by 14 points.
They then allowed Richmond to go on a 21-7 run and ended up losing to them by 4 points, 94-90.

I get tired of hearing about recruiting classes and rankings and such, when coaching the actual players is what matters. If you think that Sean Miller is doing something wrong, or that he isn't a good coach because we lost by 4 to a team with perhaps the best college player on the team this year (without our 4 year starting center in the game) then that's your prerogative.

But gawdamn it is still fucking November.

wurd

I think CSM is doing an amazing job with all these new players, and dealing with Zeus' injuries. Making a lot of adjustments which are working, look at 5 guards on the floor end of game.

Merkin wrote:I think CSM is doing an amazing job with all these new players, and dealing with Zeus' injuries. Making a lot of adjustments which are working, look at 5 guards on the floor end of game.

I still trust message board administrator and posters fantasy adjustments more.

Totally odogg. Fridays game sucked but looking back we still showed very well.

No worried about what miller will do with this team. And damn he is fun to watch coach in person.

az91 wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:This is a young team. Having ugly games early was always a probability. How we progress is the big thing for success this year and onwards. Let's not be a bunch of Chicken Littles yet.

Maybe some players will improve (Trier in particular) as the season progresses, but this team lacks elite players. Even with growth, it is hard to imagine much more than a first round exit in the NCAA Tournament this year.

It will be interesting if Miller can land some of the remaining elite recruits for 2016. That will determine whether this program can take the next step or fall back into the middle of the PAC-12.

Geez.

Trier was a McD's AA. Zeus and Smith would have been if not for age and injury. Anderson was all conference at BC. Allen was national Juco POY. We don't have a single rotation player who was not a top 100 recruit.

We're winning the NC after 4 home games and unable to get out of the first round two games later. Our entire talent base is good to elite. Just because we don't have a one and done this year does not mean we suck.

Lose one game and damn. World ends.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

az91 wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:This is a young team. Having ugly games early was always a probability. How we progress is the big thing for success this year and onwards. Let's not be a bunch of Chicken Littles yet.

Maybe some players will improve (Trier in particular) as the season progresses, but this team lacks elite players. Even with growth, it is hard to imagine much more than a first round exit in the NCAA Tournament this year.

It will be interesting if Miller can land some of the remaining elite recruits for 2016. That will determine whether this program can take the next step or fall back into the middle of the PAC-12.

Geez.

Trier was a McD's AA. Zeus and Smith would have been if not for age and injury. Anderson was all conference at BC. Allen was national Juco POY. We don't have a single rotation player who was not a top 100 recruit.

We're winning the NC after 4 home games and unable to get out of the first round two games later. Our entire talent base is good to elite. Just because we don't have a one and done this year does not mean we suck.

Lose one game and damn. World ends.

So at the end of the year, like last year, and Sean Miller sounds off on those not supporting the program...this is why. Some people are never satisfied with anything.

Pretty sure I read similar things last year after losing to UNLV and Oregon state in a span of 4 games. The world was ending.

Olsondogg wrote:
So at the end of the year, like last year, and Sean Miller sounds off on those not supporting the program...this is why. Some people are never satisfied with anything.

Pretty sure I read similar things last year after losing to UNLV and Oregon state in a span of 4 games. The world was ending.

But the world did end, duh. We didn't break the FF streak. So the season was a complete and utter failure.

So when enough of you get tired of Miller and his act, any chance we give Luke a call? I gotta think his coaching stock has skyrocketed the past few weeks.

It's the internet, guys. Truth is whatever was written most recently. Just ask The Donald.

Beachcat97 wrote:So when enough of you get tired of Miller and his act, any chance we give Luke a call? I gotta think his coaching stock has skyrocketed the past few weeks.

Yeah...for NBA jobs.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Lose one game and damn. World ends.

Much more concerned with the Santa Clara game, we were free throw away from a catastrophe of a game there. Providence has a NBA talent that simply made plays and that'll happen, so that's more than excusable.

I also think you're using the word "elite" far too liberally. Who on our team that's currently playing this year is an elite talent honestly? There's good talent on this team, but no physical specimens that other teams have to gameplan for or anything.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:So when enough of you get tired of Miller and his act, any chance we give Luke a call? I gotta think his coaching stock has skyrocketed the past few weeks.

Yeah...for NBA jobs.

Call me crazy, but I sorta think Luke would have interest in the AZ job. Remember that he was an assistant for Josh at Memphis for a little while. Luke would be a terrific recruiter and promoter for AZ hoops. Just day-dreaming

Beachcat97 wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:So when enough of you get tired of Miller and his act, any chance we give Luke a call? I gotta think his coaching stock has skyrocketed the past few weeks.

Yeah...for NBA jobs.

Call me crazy, but I sorta think Luke would have interest in the AZ job. Remember that he was an assistant for Josh at Memphis for a little while. Luke would be a terrific recruiter and promoter for AZ hoops. Just day-dreaming

Nah he's a NBA guy all the way just like Kerr. They care about the well being of their alma mater, but they have no interest in the life style of a college coach. Luke was an assistant under Josh for a couple of months of the NBA lockout and didn't do any recruiting or anything that's college basketball specific in his coaching role. It's not as if he could coach a NBA team during the lockout Beachcat, especially while he was still a player.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Lose one game and damn. World ends.

Much more concerned with the Santa Clara game, we were free throw away from a catastrophe of a game there. Providence has a NBA talent that simply made plays and that'll happen, so that's more than excusable.

I also think you're using the word "elite" far too liberally. Who on our team that's currently playing this year is an elite talent honestly? There's good talent on this team, but no physical specimens that other teams have to gameplan for or anything.

Top 20 in your class is elite, and we have a number of those guys. If you classify it beyond that, we had no elite players last year with no one on 1st, 2nd or 3rd all american teams.

We were bad against Santa Clara, but we have an inexperienced team. It happens.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Lose one game and damn. World ends.

Much more concerned with the Santa Clara game, we were free throw away from a catastrophe of a game there. Providence has a NBA talent that simply made plays and that'll happen, so that's more than excusable.

I also think you're using the word "elite" far too liberally. Who on our team that's currently playing this year is an elite talent honestly? There's good talent on this team, but no physical specimens that other teams have to gameplan for or anything.

Top 20 in your class is elite, and we have a number of those guys. If you classify it beyond that, we had no elite players last year with no one on 1st, 2nd or 3rd all american teams.

We were bad against Santa Clara, but we have an inexperienced team. It happens.

That's certainly a blanket statement, especially considering all recruiting classes are far from equal. I mean look at the 2012 class (Ashley, Zeus, and Jerrett's class). Just how many of those top 20 guys really were elite players at the college level? You have to classify it beyond a blanket top 20 ranking in their recruiting classes. Frank Kaminsky was an elite college basketball player and came nowhere near top 20 in his recruiting class.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/baske ... order/true" target="_blank

We have an "inexperienced team" that typically starts 4 players who are at minimum starting their 4th year of college experience. I'd sure hate to see how bad we'd look with numerous guys who have less experience than that.

Beachcat97 wrote: So when enough of you get tired of Miller and his act, any chance we give Luke a call? I gotta think his coaching stock has skyrocketed the past few weeks.

Yes, because we are in charge. It all hinges on our opinions. I have Luke on speed dial.

Not a threat, Miller! A promise!

P.S. His act? Explain.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:So when enough of you get tired of Miller and his act, any chance we give Luke a call? I gotta think his coaching stock has skyrocketed the past few weeks.

Yeah...for NBA jobs.

Relax. We got this.

completely hypothetical, apropos of nothing, if CSM vanished off the face of the planet tomorrow, do you opt for luke or archie?



actually, don't answer that. i don't wanna know.

Luke is an NBA guy.

Kerr. He's been exposed as an inferior coach, as evidenced by Walton's better record with the same team.

So he'll need a job.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Lose one game and damn. World ends.

Much more concerned with the Santa Clara game, we were free throw away from a catastrophe of a game there. Providence has a NBA talent that simply made plays and that'll happen, so that's more than excusable.

I also think you're using the word "elite" far too liberally. Who on our team that's currently playing this year is an elite talent honestly? There's good talent on this team, but no physical specimens that other teams have to gameplan for or anything.

Top 20 in your class is elite, and we have a number of those guys. If you classify it beyond that, we had no elite players last year with no one on 1st, 2nd or 3rd all american teams.

We were bad against Santa Clara, but we have an inexperienced team. It happens.

That's certainly a blanket statement, especially considering all recruiting classes are far from equal. I mean look at the 2012 class (Ashley, Zeus, and Jerrett's class). Just how many of those top 20 guys really were elite players at the college level? You have to classify it beyond a blanket top 20 ranking in their recruiting classes. Frank Kaminsky was an elite college basketball player and came nowhere near top 20 in his recruiting class.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/baske ... order/true" target="_blank

We have an "inexperienced team" that typically starts 4 players who are at minimum starting their 4th year of college experience. I'd sure hate to see how bad we'd look with numerous guys who have less experience than that.

Then we can count guys like Allen and Anderson, who have those post-HS accolades. With Frosh, you have to rely on recruiting rankings. I didn't count Zeus and York, but even without accolades, those good players contribute to a team's overall elite talent level.

I'm not a fan of Jon Rothstein, but I partially agree with his tweet the other day:

"I've said it before and I'll say it again: If Arizona wins the Pac-12 it will be BY FAR the best coaching job of Sean Miller's career."

I would say the Elite 8 job with Derrick Williams may be considered better, depending on the final outcome and tournament success. I cannot speak for his time at Xavier, I'm sure he did a hell of a job there. But people are forgetting what he lost and how hard it is to bounce back, especially when you aren't bringing in 5 top 10 recruits like a Kentucky.

Incredible job. Can Miller coach for another 40 years? What a game.

Give him a raise

I would love to know what he said to the team at half time. Whatever it was it worked

baconus66 wrote:I would love to know what he said to the team at half time. Whatever it was it worked

Keep battling.
Make some shots.
Stop/slow Wiltjer.

Whatever happens the rest of the way this season, that 2nd half performance is (for me) one of the finest moments of the Miller era at AZ. Where the hell did that come from?!

I love being wrong sometimes!

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketb ... a-wildcats" target="_blank

Beachcat97 wrote:Whatever happens the rest of the way this season, that 2nd half performance is (for me) one of the finest moments of the Miller era at AZ. Where the hell did that come from?!

I love being wrong sometimes!

I agree!

baconus66 wrote:I would love to know what he said to the team at half time. Whatever it was it worked

York going into here:

i suppose we somewhat live and die by the york, and whether he shows up to play on any given day. while CSM got great production out of gabe today, let's not forget that he closed out the game looking like his first half self -- missing all of his shots (incl FTs), turning the ball over twice, and going totally cold offensively in the last 10 minutes of the game.

hopefully this game will help his confidence and result in some greater consistency and decision making by york. dude is unstoppable when he gets hot.

York is about the streakiest player I have ever watched in UA history. Just awful beginning and end of game, but his 3's brought the Cats back.

Merkin wrote:York is about the streakiest player I have ever watched in UA history. Just awful beginning and end of game, but his 3's brought the Cats back.

It's just an issue of assertion. When he makes strong cuts off screens and starts driving to the rim or pulling up for midrange Js, it just makes him that much more dangerous and his 3 starts dropping. At the end he had a couple of unfortunate TOs and missed some freebies, which he normally makes

That may have been one of the finest coaching jobs I have seen. The adjustments, subs, and defensive changes the second half were monumental. Few couldn't even keep up. CSM coached circles around him the second half.

Yesterday was a coaching clinic y'all

Merkin wrote:York is about the streakiest player I have ever watched in UA history. Just awful beginning and end of game, but his 3's brought the Cats back.

He's so polarizing isn't he? I just wish his very bad wasn't equal to his very good game in and game out. You definitely have to take the good with the bad with him. Guy singlehandedly brought us back from the dead and almost put us back there at the end of the game until that great pass to Anderson.

Was Dusan listening to the presser?

Lol. Bruin honk and message board shit stirrer Russ Smith is starting rumors of Miller to the 76ers next year. lol.

UAdevil wrote:Lol. Bruin honk and message board shit stirrer Russ Smith is starting rumors of Miller to the 76ers next year. lol.

lol...Miller is a college coach. Period. I'd be concerned if UNC or Syracuse or some other east coast powerhouse came calling. And he already turned down Maryland, so...

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/f54 ... ost3266070" target="_blank

UAdevil wrote:http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/f54 ... ost3266070

This guy is just making sh*t up. Pay it no mind.

UAdevil wrote:http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/f54 ... ost3266070

Isn't Philly worlds away from Pittsburgh? It's like saying you want to live in San Francisco since you grew up in LA.

Merkin wrote: Isn't Philly worlds away from Pittsburgh? It's like saying you want to live in San Francisco since you grew up in LA.

yup they aren't close at all. Miller would NEVER want to go coach there, it's ludicrous

since the start of the 2012 season, 44-2 in OOC tilts with five to play in '15

FYI:

It's been 1015 days since Arizona lost a game by double digits, and that was to a PAC opponent...care to guess which one?

Oh, and it's been 1453 days since Arizona lost to an OOC opponent by double digits....care to guess which one?

Olsondogg wrote:FYI:

It's been 1015 days since Arizona lost a game by double digits, and that was to a PAC opponent...care to guess which one?

Oh, and it's been 1453 days since Arizona lost to an OOC opponent by double digits....care to guess which one?

USC in 2013 and Gonzaga 2011