NCAA looks at transfer rule

[gumby]

http://www.ibj.com/articles/52912-new-n ... ority-list

"You have one line of thinking that says when a student has earned their undergraduate degree they've earned the right to go wherever they want without any kind of NCAA restrictions," Lennon said. "I think, unfortunately, what the data has shown is that people are transferring and they are not completing their graduate degrees because the vast majority of those degrees are two years."

Making them sit out a year a possible solution.

[Merkin]

Grad transfers have benefited Arizona more than hurt the program, but I think if this passes that will be the end of it.

Will schools give up 2 years of scholarships to get one year out of a player? UA did it with Ryan Anderson, but he was always a projected starter.

[Olsondogg]

The NCAA should look at the rules regarding a coach who transfers from a university for more money, even after signing an extension.

I mean it's stupid that there are rules regarding where a kid can attend college or not and play ball, but not for coaches.

[Merkin]

Extended to 2017/8 at Xavier:



Extensions generally only benefit the coach, not the university.

[gumby]

Miller should attend classes.

[Jefe]

Crazy how many kids transfer

http://insider.espn.go.com/blog/jeff-go ... nsfer-list

[Spaceman Spiff]

If kids put the work in to graduate with a year of eligibility remaining, whether they finish the grad degree wouldn't be a concern for me. Frankly, the sit out a year to transfer rule was always a bit unnecessarily parental.

It is not unusual to see the NCAA take a stand against educational achievement should it give players slightly more equal a seat at the table.

[Chicat]

So the NCAA's stance is that if the choice is one year of grad school or none, they'd rather kids get none?

That's some bold thinking from an organization with "Collegiate" in their name.

[gumby]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

[Merkin]

Are undergrads using the UA as a pit stop to get into the NBA with no intention of ever getting a degree?

NCAA needs to decide whether college basketball is a minor league for professional basketball or not.

[Chicat]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

The NCAA is going to judge intent now? Maybe hook the kids up to a polygraph to make sure they really really want that advanced degree in family studies?

[Olsondogg]

Extended to 2017/8 at Xavier:



Extensions generally only benefit the coach, not the university.

Just cause our coach did it, doesn't make it right. I am sick of hearing all the restrictions the athletes have and the flexibility coaches do...in regards to their employment opportunities.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

That creates the incentive for players to drag their heels in graduating and perpetuates the myth that this is about school first.

If a player wants to go to grad school, and his primary motivation is to showcase himself for the NBA or Europe, you can make more in Europe than with a graduate degree in philosophy. Non sports grad students could take a year to improve their employability, leave if a good job came along, not finish and no one cares. When it's sports, ooh, it's bad.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

The NCAA is going to judge intent now? Maybe hook the kids up to a polygraph to make sure they really really want that advanced degree in family studies?

You can't go to grad school, you're too good at basketball.

[gumby]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

The NCAA is going to judge intent now? Maybe hook the kids up to a polygraph to make sure they really really want that advanced degree in family studies?

Are undergrads using the UA as a pit stop to get into the NBA with no intention of ever getting a degree?

NCAA needs to decide whether college basketball is a minor league for professional basketball or not.

This is the balance they're struggling with. The presidents need to justify this activity taking place on college campuses without driving this off college campuses. Some of it is pure perception. They certainly can't come right out and say that academics is a charade, though it may be. So it's "student athlete" this and "student athlete" that. And tweaking rules to "show" you care.

Certainly on a message board like this, there will be a predominantly sports-centric view. But there are many people at institutions who don't care about sports or who wonder why jocks are taking slots.

[gumby]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

The NCAA is going to judge intent now? Maybe hook the kids up to a polygraph to make sure they really really want that advanced degree in family studies?

You can't go to grad school, you're too good at basketball.

No barrier to going to grad school. The barrier is playing ball right away. Just like undergrads.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

The NCAA is going to judge intent now? Maybe hook the kids up to a polygraph to make sure they really really want that advanced degree in family studies?

You can't go to grad school, you're too good at basketball.

No barrier to going to grad school. The barrier is playing ball right away. Just like undergrads.

So, a player who graduates can't use his 4th year of eligibility, but if he had pulled a few more F's and not graduated, he could?

How about this: if your gpa is higher than your ppg, you get to use grad transfer.

[Chicat]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

The NCAA is going to judge intent now? Maybe hook the kids up to a polygraph to make sure they really really want that advanced degree in family studies?

You can't go to grad school, you're too good at basketball.

No barrier to going to grad school. The barrier is playing ball right away. Just like undergrads.

But this cuts down on opportunity since as Merkin pointed out there will be few programs that will use two years of a scholarship for one year of service.

If they really want to do this, make the sit out year not count against the scholarship limit. And if they are truly concerned about graduate program grad rates, tie that into APR. Otherwise it seems like they are just trying to kill it because it benefits some programs over others.

[gumby]

I like the APR idea. Shows that there is some effort to link it to academics.

[gumby]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

The NCAA is going to judge intent now? Maybe hook the kids up to a polygraph to make sure they really really want that advanced degree in family studies?

You can't go to grad school, you're too good at basketball.

No barrier to going to grad school. The barrier is playing ball right away. Just like undergrads.

So, a player who graduates can't use his 4th year of eligibility, but if he had pulled a few more F's and not graduated, he could?

How about this: if your gpa is higher than your ppg, you get to use grad transfer.

Affix an APR link and go shopping for a school that will take you.

[Spaceman Spiff]

http://www.ibj.com/articles/52912-new-n ... ority-list

"You have one line of thinking that says when a student has earned their undergraduate degree they've earned the right to go wherever they want without any kind of NCAA restrictions," Lennon said. "I think, unfortunately, what the data has shown is that people are transferring and they are not completing their graduate degrees because the vast majority of those degrees are two years."

Making them sit out a year a possible solution.

I don't see the issue with the first line of thinking. God forbid the NCAA allow players to make their own decisions about where they want to play if they have earned a college degree and still have eligibility.

After all, the NCAA isn't interested in the players. It's the television rights that count, and it's the facade of amateurism that makes the networks pony up the dough.

[biggles]

Anything that rewards a kid for actually getting his degree is a good thing.

I'd love someone to pass a rule that simply states that players and coaches are bound by the exact same restrictions when switching schools, then see where everything ended up when the dust settled. Hell, if paying athletes is unfair to smaller schools who are unable to compete, then why not extend that to coaching salaries...

[gumby]

Anything that rewards a kid for actually getting his degree is a good thing.

I'd love someone to pass a rule that simply states that players and coaches are bound by the exact same restrictions when switching schools, then see where everything ended up when the dust settled. Hell, if paying athletes is unfair to smaller schools who are unable to compete, then why not extend that to coaching salaries...

Don't pay the coaches?

In any event, the problem of paying athletes extends to big schools, too.

[biggles]

Anything that rewards a kid for actually getting his degree is a good thing.

I'd love someone to pass a rule that simply states that players and coaches are bound by the exact same restrictions when switching schools, then see where everything ended up when the dust settled. Hell, if paying athletes is unfair to smaller schools who are unable to compete, then why not extend that to coaching salaries...

Don't pay the coaches?

In any event, the problem of paying athletes extends to big schools, too.

My point is that the argument against paying players usually goes something along the lines like

"If you allow schools to pay players, then the few top schools with all of the money will amass all the top talent and it will be completely unfair."

This may in fact be true, but then why not limit top schools' abilities to lavishly outspend everyone else on things like coaches' salaries, facilities, etc. If someone is arguing for enforcing a competitive balance then why only limit that to what schools can spend on players? Shouldn't it simply be a limit on the overall budget for the program?

I'm not actually saying I'd like to see this happen, I just hate the way the college students are the only ones who have to sacrifice to keep a more "level playing field". The fact that coaches are able to hop between jobs paying hundreds of thousands or millions of dollars at will, while college students who don't get paid and only have five years to make the most of the experience/opportunity are far more restricted doesn't sit right with me.

And this is doubly true for grad transfers, who have (in theory) already attained the supreme goal of the student-athlete by earning a degree, and want to enjoy their last year of eligibility in a different environment for whatever reason (more playing time, bigger stage, closer to home, etc).

[Reydituto]

Or, are you attending grad school to get a grad degree? If so, you're all set. Doing it to play one more year of ball? No slot for you.

Why should I or anyone else care?

Clearly this is coming from the smaller schools/programs that have lost a kid or two this way, but what's the actual harm done though? The NCAA seems to be trying to solve a "problem" that doesn't really exist, but even if it is some sort of a "problem" it's low hanging fruit compared with all the other, real problems they have.

We're talking about graduate school here. Presumably they completed their undergrad degrees on purpose, otherwise they could have taken the minimum amount of classes, reduced their summer school load and spread things out to coincide their graduation with the end of their eligibility. Pursuing a grad degree, by definition, links such a move to academics.

As far as pointy-headed academics being concerned about athletes taking grad school slots, it would seem to me that participating in an NCAA sport while completing one's degree is quite the extra-curricular activity that would look well on an application - I know it did in law school, where I graduated with scholarship basketball players, gymnasts, and soccer players. Reality is most of these players are not going to the NBA or the equivalent professional level in their sport. Many are just trying to exhaust their eligibility and/or make progress towards a Masters degree in a situation they perceive as being more advantageous to their post-college pursuits.

So why make them sit out a year? It's a barrier to entry that is tantamount to a punishment because few institutions will spend 2 years of scholarship on 1 year of eligibility. Fact is, I know several non-scholarship athletes who have taken grad school classes or made progress towards a graduate degree without having completed the degree, due to Real World factors and concerns, so there shouldn't be a difference with a kid who takes grad school for 1 year and then gets a professional opportunity in his chosen field.

Typical of the hypocritical, image-obsessed NCAA though, to solve a non-problem for the optics.