Sean Miller

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CalStateTempe
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CalStateTempe »

And to follow don’t think K forgot about getting his ass handed to him by the “young gun” in Anaheim

I’m sure the mandrains or five families college basketball had a day in millers rep.

He’s no angel I’m sure, if he isn’t doing anything different than the others at the top of their field.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by 97cats »

CalStateTempe wrote:And to follow don’t think K forgot about getting his ass handed to him by the “young gun” in Anaheim

I’m sure the mandrains or five families college basketball had a day in millers rep.

He’s no angel I’m sure, if he isn’t doing anything different than the others at the top of their field.
97cats wrote:let me make this clear for about the 100th time -- every, and i mean every, big-time college program pays for its top players.

and to that, 90% of the middeling programs do as well, and shockingly enough some Division II and even blooming up and coming schools - its college basketballs culture.

just want to make sure thats crystal clear -- so when Andy Enfield says to my face that nobody can compete with how Sean Miller cheats, he just means that USC's basketball machine isnt up to the standards of AZ's well oiled machine, cause SC is right therein the money fight, but the resources for basketball in tucson are PLENTIFUL.

and mind you, there are many many many culpable people here who arent coaches, Greg Byrne being one of them and hundreds of boosters.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Beachcat97 »

97cats wrote:let me make this clear for about the 100th time -- every, and i mean every, big-time college program pays for its top players.

and to that, 90% of the middeling programs do as well, and shockingly enough some Division II and even blooming schools.

just want to make sure thats crystal clear -- so when Andy Enfield says to my face that nobody can compete with how Sean Miller cheats, he just means that USC's basketball machine isnt up to the standards of AZ's well oiled machine, cause SC is right therein the money fight, but the resources for basketball in tucson are PLENTIFUL.

and mind you, there are many many many culpable people here who arent coaches, Greg Byrne being one of them and hundreds of boosters.
I get it, 97. That all makes sense. Thanks.

I just hate to see Miller get this treatment. Doesn't seem right.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

97cats wrote:let me make this clear for about the 100th time -- every, and i mean every, big-time college program pays for its top players.

and to that, 90% of the middeling programs do as well, and shockingly enough some Division II and even blooming schools.

just want to make sure thats crystal clear -- so when Andy Enfield says to my face that nobody can compete with how Sean Miller cheats, he just means that USC's basketball machine isnt up to the standards of AZ's well oiled machine, cause SC is right therein the money fight, but the resources for basketball in tucson are PLENTIFUL.

and mind you, there are many many many culpable people here who arent coaches, Greg Byrne being one of them and hundreds of boosters.
This is the only thing that is truly frustrating about this. Arizona is pushed as the face of this, but the reality isn't that players are choosing between Arizona money and a free scholarship with no outside benefits at Duke, UNC, KY, KU, etc.

Heck, Josh Jackson's mom got paid by two shoe companies and an agent, and that's only based on ASM's records. Did he get more from the agent he signed with or KU? Billy Preston got quietly ushered aside after the free car, and that's just the last two years of KU ball. Add guys with "interesting" recruitments like Malik Newman, and tell me what it is.

This is endemic. I can take being a major player. I can't deal with a whitewashing to allege we're the only player.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CalStateTempe »

97cats wrote:
CalStateTempe wrote:And to follow don’t think K forgot about getting his ass handed to him by the “young gun” in Anaheim

I’m sure the mandrains or five families college basketball had a day in millers rep.

He’s no angel I’m sure, if he isn’t doing anything different than the others at the top of their field.
97cats wrote:let me make this clear for about the 100th time -- every, and i mean every, big-time college program pays for its top players.

and to that, 90% of the middeling programs do as well, and shockingly enough some Division II and even blooming up and coming schools - its college basketballs culture.

just want to make sure thats crystal clear -- so when Andy Enfield says to my face that nobody can compete with how Sean Miller cheats, he just means that USC's basketball machine isnt up to the standards of AZ's well oiled machine, cause SC is right therein the money fight, but the resources for basketball in tucson are PLENTIFUL.

and mind you, there are many many many culpable people here who arent coaches, Greg Byrne being one of them and hundreds of boosters.
Saw your excellent post right after I hit send on mine.

Thanks again for the glimpse behind the curtain.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Bosy Billups »

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Bosy Billups wrote:
97cats wrote:
Beachcat97 wrote:
Seriously, 97? You're ready to close the book on the Miller era?
ive thought this was the last season for Miller since September - what i didnt know what was the perception of him among many folks that fly at a different altitude than me.

a cocktail party here an xmas party there and its easy for me to understand why Bilas and Greenberg jumped on his ass prematurely, the narrative inside college sports is that Miller is dirty, he just cheats better than anyone else.

is this true? i dont know about to that extent, but as soon as people smelled one drop of blood it was pile on time, and i tell you that because off the record thats the reputation he has inside and around college basketball.

so, am i ready to close the book (no pun intended)? im not sure.

but i can tell you i could care far less about him leaving now than i did any year before this season - i just dont want him to leave like Todd Bozemon with shit stain trail.

thats why im praying he gets through these next few days and finds his way back onto the court...thats what all AZ fans should be hoping for.
Sounds like people became jealous of Sean, he was the golden boy, cool, got the best recruits, always played it off casual. Funny, before Arizona at a small school, he was considered clean. So he played hardball against K, Self, etc. I can see those "execs" planting the seed against Miller. Waiting for this moment.

Funny, how many have come to his defense in the coaching elite? When you know damn well they pay for recruits.
Right now, I don't know if any coach will stick his neck out. Miller's friends in the pros have supported more, but in college, the underlying scandal is wide enough that no one wants to be sucked into it.
Naa, even Calipari hasn't offered a word like "let's see the facts before deciding." Didn't the royal coaches all cut Boheim slack when his pedophile coach was busted?

Fuck, Bernie Fine pedo and the same calls for him to resign..

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/9666 ... l-explodes" target="_blank

Didn't Boheim get busted after too?

Yet, that fuck bag is still coaching.

Miller needs to keep coaching because fuck you (not you personally), that's why.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

You want a conspiracy theory:

ESPN is carrying the water for the NCAA. The Yahoo stories implicating a wide range of schools were dominating news, so ESPN dropped a scapegoat in to deflect from the more widespread corruption.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CalStateTempe »

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
97cats wrote:let me make this clear for about the 100th time -- every, and i mean every, big-time college program pays for its top players.

and to that, 90% of the middeling programs do as well, and shockingly enough some Division II and even blooming schools.

just want to make sure thats crystal clear -- so when Andy Enfield says to my face that nobody can compete with how Sean Miller cheats, he just means that USC's basketball machine isnt up to the standards of AZ's well oiled machine, cause SC is right therein the money fight, but the resources for basketball in tucson are PLENTIFUL.

and mind you, there are many many many culpable people here who arent coaches, Greg Byrne being one of them and hundreds of boosters.
This is the only thing that is truly frustrating about this. Arizona is pushed as the face of this, but the reality isn't that players are choosing between Arizona money and a free scholarship with no outside benefits at Duke, UNC, KY, KU, etc.

Heck, Josh Jackson's mom got paid by two shoe companies and an agent, and that's only based on ASM's records. Did he get more from the agent he signed with or KU? Billy Preston got quietly ushered aside after the free car, and that's just the last two years of KU ball. Add guys with "interesting" recruitments like Malik Newman, and tell me what it is.

This is endemic. I can take being a major player. I can't deal with a whitewashing to allege we're the only player.
Which is why the seems more like Braveheart than The Godfather (although allusions to both and others like Shawshank are appropriate)

We’re going down so that others can get away.

And it pisses me off.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CalStateTempe »

Yes spiff, see my post above and it isn’t so far off when you consider how much money ESPN has at stake with those other programs if they go down too.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Bosy Billups »

Spaceman Spiff wrote:You want a conspiracy theory:

ESPN is carrying the water for the NCAA. The Yahoo stories implicating a wide range of schools were dominating news, so ESPN dropped a scapegoat in to deflect from the more widespread corruption.
Not s conspiracy theory, it's obvious.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

Bosy, the difference with Boeheim's pedo scandal is that no one else was concerned they'd be complicit. This time, the first guy to speak up invites scrutiny on his own program.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by PHXCATS »

Spaceman Spiff wrote:You want a conspiracy theory:

ESPN is carrying the water for the NCAA. The Yahoo stories implicating a wide range of schools were dominating news, so ESPN dropped a scapegoat in to deflect from the more widespread corruption.

I think ESPN ran with it early without vetting properly to get there first. Not sure if it to help the NCAA, but I dont dismiss it. Interesting idea, thanks for sharing
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CalStateTempe »

Next thought; does Sean Miller have a dead man switch; if he gets canned does he have the reach, resources, and evidence to take as many down with him as he can?

Is he weaponized against the current system? (I need to take a break from all of this)
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

CalStateTempe wrote:Yes spiff, see my post above and it isn’t so far off when you consider how much money ESPN has at stake with those other programs if they go down too.
ESPN is in a position of need as well, they're bleeding subscribers and viewers.

It's just notable that this seems like an active effort to reshape the narrative from overall corruption to one where Miller is the rogue actor.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Lando05 »

97Cats apprecite all the knowledge dropped, ride or die with Miller. Btw is the attorney leaking Tony Bland's? U$C and Andy trying to fuck with us?
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by SportsMind »

I have little doubt in my mind that Sean Miller has cheated numerous times. I frankly don't care.

Saying that, Sean Miller has not been sloppy and this would be incredibly sloppy considering Dawkins is a nobody. The only connections that he truly has/had is in the Michigan basketball scene bc of who his dad is, and the few Andy Miller guys he could have helped with. Outside of that, you have some asst NCAA coaches, AAU coaches, and other guys that are trying to make it like him. Most of them are just low level coaches in small schools or the AAU program. I don't believe he succeeded much outside of the Michigan scene. Even his lawyer is a "shady" Michigan guy who has long been connected to the scene. He just doesn't have the resources to go much outside of that scene and he became the fall guy because of how sloppy he is.

This is a kid who couldn't even google Marty Blazer, of course his digital footprint is damning. I don't want to get into too many specifics of the players he tried to get to know bc he might have failed, and never even talked to them. I will say that I have failed to find ONE connection to Ayton.

From what I've found, he has definite connections to the following UofA guys or guys that have worked under Miller in the past:

Kaleb Tarczewski (Was at one time an Andy Miller client. I assume he knows Dawkins at least a little bc Dawkins def knows Andy Miller's clients from the same draft class)

Members of the Wise family (Not surprising that he would know some of them considering AAU)

Laval Lucas Perry (Mich guy, not surprising)

Book Richardson (FBI)


The following is a list of people he MIGHT know that are UofA guys or guys that have worked under Miller in the past.

1 current Xavier asst coach
2 or 3 former or current UofA asst coaches (this does not include Book)


The assistant coach possible connections are troubling but he knows a lot of asst coaches. The good part is that any of the players/coaches he has REAL connections to have not sniffed Arizona. That's not to say that he even paid some of those guys as he was a guy struggling for money, and could have easily told someone at ASM he paid a player or a family member and never did.


So after going through some stuff online, it is my assumption that he likely never talked to Miller or any head coaches on the phone. They are just too big time for him. It is also my assumption that the probability that he has been around an Arizona practice once or twice, is very high.

It is definitely possible that the "leak" could have been put out by his lawyer who has constantly brought up the fact that there are big fish the FBI needs to go after. I'm not so sure though. It seems like the 2 Adidas executives that were indicted would benefit more and/or have possible grudges.
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Re: Sean Miller

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Lando05 wrote:97Cats apprecite all the knowledge dropped, ride or die with Miller. Btw is the attorney leaking Tony Bland's? U$C and Andy trying to fuck with us?
youre welcome and i have no idea who the source is for ESPN, i just know its not the FBI.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Lando05 »

97cats wrote:
Lando05 wrote:97Cats apprecite all the knowledge dropped, ride or die with Miller. Btw is the attorney leaking Tony Bland's? U$C and Andy trying to fuck with us?
youre welcome and i have no idea who the source is for ESPN, i just know its not the FBI.
Thank you. Good to know it wasn't the FBI
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by OSCat »

Don't see how this turns out well for us. Miller should go balls to the wall on this season if we can get trier back. Then we start 2 or 3 year rebuild. This sucks.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Bosy Billups »

CalStateTempe wrote:Next thought; does Sean Miller have a dead man switch; if he gets canned does he have the reach, resources, and evidence to take as many down with him as he can?

Is he weaponized against the current system? (I need to take a break from all of this)
If Miller goes full Jose Conseco, don't you think ESPN and the geriatric elite will smear Miller? Call him names, dirty, not to be trusted? That's the entire gist of this whole fight
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Bosy Billups »

'97, if you've read any of my posts, how close to the truth am I? Honestly, how far off am I?
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by NYCat »

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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Beachcat97 »

If Miller is fired, he'll probably take some much needed time off. I definitely don't think his coaching career is over, especially if he's vindicated, as he expects to be. Give it a year or two, he'll re-surface somewhere.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by LBdCactus »

CalStateTempe wrote:Next thought; does Sean Miller have a dead man switch; if he gets canned does he have the reach, resources, and evidence to take as many down with him as he can?

Is he weaponized against the current system? (I need to take a break from all of this)
Doesn't strike me as the Judas type.

More like a "Never rat on your friends, and always keep your mouth shut" guy.

Seriously doubt he goes out in a blaze of glory when he can just go get a gig in the pros.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by 97cats »

NYCat wrote:
this is important

they were waiting to put this out - this is a good sign for Arizona fans that want to keep Sean Miller.

one of these people is close to him and wants to help, i have no doubt this timing was calculated.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

97cats wrote:
Lando05 wrote:97Cats apprecite all the knowledge dropped, ride or die with Miller. Btw is the attorney leaking Tony Bland's? U$C and Andy trying to fuck with us?
youre welcome and i have no idea who the source is for ESPN, i just know its not the FBI.
I'd be shocked if it's an attorney. In addition to legal consequences for leaking wiretaps, it really doesn't help a case.

If anything, it strengthens the conspiracy, which makes it so odd that it isn't in the FBI complaint.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by 97cats »

Bosy Billups wrote:'97, if you've read any of my posts, how close to the truth am I? Honestly, how far off am I?
its hard for me to gather everything you said...
Bosy Billups wrote:
If Miller goes full Jose Conseco
this = zero chance
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CatHoops »

Miller ain't going down no way in hell he's walking away. Well get a damning rebuttal tomorrow or Wednesday denying this. Beardown we lost fire because he missed practice.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Bosy Billups »

97cats wrote:
NYCat wrote:
this is important

they were waiting to put this out - this is a good sign for Arizona fans that want to keep Sean Miller.

one of these people is close to him and wants to help, i have no doubt this timing was calculated.
About time someone grew some balls! Matt DuCourcy or Doug Gottlieb should be spearheading this, but they don't want to make enemies for future career prospects. Cowards.

Glad someone stepped up to confront Goliath
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by BBQ wildcat »

I hope Miller's absence from practice was just because he was in Phoenix meeting with ABOR and telling them the story is nothing but a crock of shit.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Beachcat97 »

I doubt we get to Thursday without some big news.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Bosy Billups »

97cats wrote:
Bosy Billups wrote:'97, if you've read any of my posts, how close to the truth am I? Honestly, how far off am I?
its hard for me to gather everything you said...

1. The leak was timed to deflect from Yahoo
2. Known it's poorly sourced, lacks credibility, designed amd worded to not just deflect, but take down Miller's career.
3. The coordinated attacks by the talking heads are nothing but talking points given to them to inflict maximum damage.
4. The geriatric monarchs want Miller gone.
5. No unaffiliated but credible journalist will pursue this for fear of ruining future career prospects.
6. Camp Miller and Arizona know this and are treading carefully to respond, like WUSSIES, rather than hit them back harder with truth bombs about the industry.
7. Bonus: ESPN sat on this story for months waiting for the perfect time to deflect and/or destroy Miller
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Spaceman Spiff »

97cats wrote:
Bosy Billups wrote:'97, if you've read any of my posts, how close to the truth am I? Honestly, how far off am I?
its hard for me to gather everything you said...
Bosy Billups wrote:
If Miller goes full Jose Conseco
this = zero chance
Selling out other coaches is basically career suicide. Miller has a future as an NBA assistant regardless of how this ends, but not if he rats.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CatHoops »

Does anyone find it interesting we are no longer on the espn ticker???? Az is doing work behind the scenes guaranteed.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Beachcat97 »

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
97cats wrote:
Bosy Billups wrote:'97, if you've read any of my posts, how close to the truth am I? Honestly, how far off am I?
its hard for me to gather everything you said...
Bosy Billups wrote:
If Miller goes full Jose Conseco
this = zero chance
Selling out other coaches is basically career suicide. Miller has a future as an NBA assistant regardless of how this ends, but not if he rats.
Assistant? Not hard to imagine him being an NBA head coach. Quin Snyder? That guy was an awful college coach, got busted for cheating, and now he's thriving in the pros.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by tucsonsean »

BBQ wildcat wrote:I hope Miller's absence from practice was just because he was in Phoenix meeting with ABOR and telling them the story is nothing but a crock of shit.
My concern is that ABOR and UA decide it is all just too much. The implication of what Miller is being accused of itself may be something that the Arizona "powers that be” just say, "we are sorry and don't disbelieve you, but under the circumstances, we feel it is best if we part ways..."

I sure hope not.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by catinfl »

Why do I feel like Sean Miller is bout to come back and coach Thursday. Trier gets re-instated and we get to the first final four in 15 years because of a pissed Trier, Miller, and Ayton. Just a weird feeling I've been getting god I hope it's right because if Sean does come back he has his work cut out for him for awhile to get back to the top of college ball.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Frybry02 »

I don't know what to think. I am a huge supporter of Miller. I have always viewed him as a smart and calculated individual. So personally speaking to Dawkins would paint a totally opposite picture of Miller than I had painted.

Ayton's family lawyer stated ayton spoke to the FBI more than 6 months ago. There is no way Miller, nor the university, Didn't know of that interview(s). Wouldn't he be sweating through his shirt again? That interview must taken place before Book gets arrested. Then, Book gets busted and Miller doubled down and the university backs him. Then, the alleged wiretap breaks and Miller tripled down.

Either Miller and the University know more than what's out or Miller's balls are much bigger than his brain.

However, this silence is becoming deafening. It has been more than 48 hours since the university comment.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Beachcat97 »

tucsonsean wrote:My concern is that ABOR and UA decide it is all just too much. The implication of what Miller is being accused of itself may be something that the Arizona "powers that by" just say, "we are sorry and don't disbelieve you, but under the circumstances, we feel it is best if we part ways..."

I sure hope not.
This is pretty much where I'm at.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by OSCat »

Beachcat97 wrote:
tucsonsean wrote:My concern is that ABOR and UA decide it is all just too much. The implication of what Miller is being accused of itself may be something that the Arizona "powers that by" just say, "we are sorry and don't disbelieve you, but under the circumstances, we feel it is best if we part ways..."

I sure hope not.
This is pretty much where I'm at.
Me too but Millers is a fighter so who knows.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by rgdeuce »

Spaceman Spiff wrote:You want a conspiracy theory:

ESPN is carrying the water for the NCAA. The Yahoo stories implicating a wide range of schools were dominating news, so ESPN dropped a scapegoat in to deflect from the more widespread corruption.
You may very well be right. Follow the money, both get tons of money from the status quo and both would lose tons and possibly fail to exist if things get cleaned up.

Good always wins in the end. Trust in that.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CalStateTempe »

I know its stupid, it I’m still holding out hope that Miller is working with the feds. That is the only reason why having a conversation with Dawkins about a player already on campus makes sense.

No way miller is so greedy (100k is chump change for him) that he’d risk his career to deliver ayton to ASM.

A boy can hope.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by BibbysTowelDude »

The University can't just up and say anything even in defense of Miller. There are so many legal hurdles and what not, I wouldn't be shocked if its operation shutdown until 5 minutes before tip-off if not longer.


Anyways, to the doom and gloomers who think we're about to be Chernobyl... It's all good, we'll be back to paying top notch recruits before you know it and ESPN will get to make its dough on the redemption in the desert.
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by 97cats »

Bosy Billups wrote:
1. The leak was timed to deflect from Yahoo - i dont think so, but it was rushed to keep up with the Jones's, and resulted in inaccuracies.
2. Known it's poorly sourced, lacks credibility, designed amd worded to not just deflect, but take down Miller's career. i dont think so
3. The coordinated attacks by the talking heads are nothing but talking points given to them to inflict maximum damage. maybe, i cant say
4. The geriatric monarchs want Miller gone. who is this exactly??
5. No unaffiliated but credible journalist will pursue this for fear of ruining future career prospects. not sure but the initial reporting was beyond irresponsible
6. Camp Miller and Arizona know this and are treading carefully to respond, like WUSSIES, rather than hit them back harder with truth bombs about the industry. dont know
7. Bonus: ESPN sat on this story for months waiting for the perfect time to deflect and/or destroy Miller dont know but the sloppy and inaccurate reporting leads me to think otherwise and hence the knee-jerk reaction.
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zonagrad
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by zonagrad »

I still remember Roy Williams making a totally unsubstantiated claim that Billy Donovan must've cheated to land Mike Miller because why would a Dakota kid spurn Kansas for Florida. That's kinda how I feel Miller is looked at.
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BE4RDOWN21
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by BE4RDOWN21 »

Someone is cutting onions over here...

https://twitter.com/kfogg21/status/968284868328206337" target="_blank
CatHoops
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CatHoops »

BibbysTowelDude wrote:The University can't just up and say anything even in defense of Miller. There are so many legal hurdles and what not, I wouldn't be shocked if its operation shutdown until 5 minutes before tip-off if not longer.


Anyways, to the doom and gloomers who think we're about to be Chernobyl... It's all good, we'll be back to paying top notch recruits before you know it and ESPN will get to make its dough on the redemption in the desert.
This! Like I said espn is not covering this at all anymore miller will be here Thursday
Postmaster
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Postmaster »

97, can you elaborate a bit on the well oiled machine?
Not looking for names, just some idea of what miller does better than the others
Postmaster
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by Postmaster »

Maybe espn is just bitter that we fired RR, who was one of their OKGs
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Re: Sean Miller

Post by CatHoops »

Postmaster wrote:97, can you elaborate a bit on the well oiled machine?
Not looking for names, just some idea of what miller does better than the others
Funnels money so well the feds can't find it.....
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