The 2019-2020 Season Thread

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:07 pm

It's the Sean Miller year...one way or another, it's now or never IMO

97cats · Post by **97cats** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:14 pm

yes this is it for Coach Miller - if he survives the next 45 days and makes it to the fall...

if he does i think he needs a top two conf finish and a sweet 16 or better showing in the NCAA's and another top incoming class to stay at AZ.

otherwise, cue up the flight tracker

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:16 pm

What 97 said.

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:16 pm

97cats wrote:yes this is it for Coach Miller - if he survives the next 45 days and makes it to the fall...

if he does i think he needs sweet 16 or better and another top incoming class to stay at AZ.

otherwise, cue up the flight tracker

Dude needs a Final 4 and fast.

Also he's there in 45 unless Schlabaugh says that Miller is harvesting kidneys from the mothers of players again.

KillerKlown · Post by **KillerKlown** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:19 pm

Azgirl · Post by **Azgirl** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:22 pm

First and foremost, he will survive the next 45 days. Secondly if he ever testifies, I will be totally shocked. From some of the attorneys I have spoken to, he and the University have a pretty good understanding of what will probably transpire. Once that is over with hopefully sooner than later, I agree with most of you. I think next year will be a do or die for Coach Miller. I am not as generous as 97cats, I believe an Elite Eight is the minimum.

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:26 pm

I really think that he needs a Final 4 and anything less is not going to cut it. You bring in the #1 class then you gotta do something with it. It's been a decade here, it's time.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:27 pm

Nice to see Lee and Williams talking about next year. Not sure what is up with Jeter.

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:33 pm

Want all those guys back in an Arizona uni. In fact, I would take anyone back, yes anyone, who was on this team this year. Much better than what you'd get on grad transfer market IMO.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:47 pm

Olsondogg wrote:I really think that he needs a Final 4 and anything less is not going to cut it. You bring in the #1 class then you gotta do something with it. It's been a decade here, it's time.

I disagree. The one and done tourney format is as unpredictable as it gets. I want to see a team that performs to the talent level in the regular and postseason.

I just think you always have to operate with the assumption that crazy shit happens in the tournament. The remainder of our performance should be solid, but at the end, there's always the who knows factor in the tourney.

TucsonClip · Post by **TucsonClip** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:47 pm

Merkin wrote:

Dude even pumps fakes giving quotes in the locker room.

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:48 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Olsondogg wrote:I really think that he needs a Final 4 and anything less is not going to cut it. You bring in the #1 class then you gotta do something with it. It's been a decade here, it's time.
I disagree. The one and done tourney format is as unpredictable as it gets. I want to see a team that performs to the talent level in the regular and postseason.

I just think you always have to operate with the assumption that crazy shit happens in the tournament. The remainder of our performance should be solid, but at the end, there's always the who knows factor in the tourney.

Yes exactly...and Arizona has been on the short end of that for a while.

The Final 4 needs to happen ASAP.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:50 pm

Olsondogg wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Olsondogg wrote:I really think that he needs a Final 4 and anything less is not going to cut it. You bring in the #1 class then you gotta do something with it. It's been a decade here, it's time.
I disagree. The one and done tourney format is as unpredictable as it gets. I want to see a team that performs to the talent level in the regular and postseason.

I just think you always have to operate with the assumption that crazy shit happens in the tournament. The remainder of our performance should be solid, but at the end, there's always the who knows factor in the tourney.
Yes exactly...and Arizona has been on the short end of that for a while.

The Final 4 needs to happen ASAP.

Yeah, but luck doesn't work like that.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:54 pm

Going to be a very interesting off season. I would love to see some of these guys who logged big minutes (Smith for sure) revert to lessor roles next season.

A little surprised the expectation is as high as an elite 8. I would not expect the committee being kind to us next season in march

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:55 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Olsondogg wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Olsondogg wrote:I really think that he needs a Final 4 and anything less is not going to cut it. You bring in the #1 class then you gotta do something with it. It's been a decade here, it's time.
I disagree. The one and done tourney format is as unpredictable as it gets. I want to see a team that performs to the talent level in the regular and postseason.

I just think you always have to operate with the assumption that crazy shit happens in the tournament. The remainder of our performance should be solid, but at the end, there's always the who knows factor in the tourney.
Yes exactly...and Arizona has been on the short end of that for a while.

The Final 4 needs to happen ASAP.
Yeah, but luck doesn't work like that.

Not saying it does. But at some point the tide turns in support...I mean even Miller knows what he has in Tucson--even this past year--but that tide shifts. Final 4's would fix a hell of a lot for him and the program in general.

Consider this, if the year is average or even sub par, but enough to dance, and Miller gets them to go on a run (like his second year) then that can change everything. If he has a great regular season, and a great PAC season but flames out early again...I think he's done.

It's all a crapshoot, but he's gotta get over that hump fast.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:36 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Olsondogg wrote:I really think that he needs a Final 4 and anything less is not going to cut it. You bring in the #1 class then you gotta do something with it. It's been a decade here, it's time.
I disagree. The one and done tourney format is as unpredictable as it gets. I want to see a team that performs to the talent level in the regular and postseason.

I just think you always have to operate with the assumption that crazy shit happens in the tournament. The remainder of our performance should be solid, but at the end, there's always the who knows factor in the tourney.

Agree completely, Spiff.

Tourney is not the best benchmark of a program's health. Look at UVA, for example. They're thriving and yet bear the ignominious distinction of being the only team in history to lose to a 16 seed as a 1.

I do think winning the Pac is a must, though. We have the best roster in the Pac next season.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:45 pm

Compete for a conference title and win a couple tournament games. He needs to get to the final 4 soon, but I'm not elite eight (or better) or bust with Miller at this point. Winning a couple of tournament games isnt really much to ask. I just want to see the trends of late shift the other way.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:56 pm

I'm of the following mind.

You never know how next year plays out. We could be undefeated into the tourney, then have 3 starters go down and have an opponent shoot 80% from 3 in the Sweet 16. If we lose then, does that mean a bad/fireable year?

If we set Final Four as the goal, have a crappy regular season, then a crazy tourney run to the Final Four, does that mean we ignore the bad regular season? Are we better off than the first scenario?

The best thing is to let it play out and judge what happens. No season, no team, no coach, gives you everything. There are good and bad things.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:03 pm

Looking over this past season, it’s interesting to see how people view Miller and what he has to do to make this program successful. I used to be a person of FF or else, but the more I look at college basketball and I look at how the climate is changing, it is become quite clear to me that while FF’s are a cherry on top of a successful season, it’s more difficult than ever to make it there based on the one and done model.
Pretty much all fans overlook the fact Miller’s problems with FF’s is more about attrition, than coaching ability. Nick Johnson leaving early (and going undrafted) hurt us quite a bit. Same thing goes for Kobi and Chance. The teams that make the FF typically have those guys return and contribute significantly. Without having experienced high level players it’s hard to develop the teeth to make a deep run.
I’ve thought about this quite a bit, I believe it’s more important for Arizona to be relevant than it is to make FF’s. When you consider Duke and Kentucky’s rosters and their multiple one and dones and they still can’t make the third weekend, it shows how difficult it is to make it there. And those teams have 7-10 five stars. You can’t make a FF simple one talent alone; you have to have the right pieces. A lot of fans think that having a top recruiting class entitles you to make a FF run, but if they aren’t the right pieces, it doesn’t matter.
You can be relevant and have a chance every year to make the FF, or you can be a one hit wonder and suffer through seasons of mediocrity. The teams that are making the FF like Villanova, UNC and Michigan have very different programs than Duke, Kentucky and Arizona. Seasoned, tough guys are necessary to weather the storms of the tourney. One and done factory’s typically don’t get there. And the last time that Duke and Kentucky got there, they had essentially super teams with 3 or more one and dones where we typically have only one.
Next year I expect us to be good, but I will take a wait and see approach. Depending on who returns, Oregon can be really good, USC can be really good, ditto for UCLA (depending on who the coach is). In my opinion, Miller needs to jettison some players on this team. I have a serious problem with Chase’s availability as a leader. They say the best ability is availability, and if Chase cannot turn the corner emotionally, he’ll just become a liability for us. This will hurt some feelings, but I do without Randolph, Jeter and Smith if Miller was able to find competent replacements either with recruiting or on the transfer market, that could step in and play with the maturity that Miller needs for his team. We desperately need another strong frontcourt player
With next year’s roster, I could see us winning the conference. It will be tough, but it can be done. In the tournament we have the talent to make the sweet 16 relatively painlessly. Beyond that, a lot of things would have to fall into place in order for us to start thinking about FF’s.

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:07 pm

Olsondogg wrote:Want all those guys back in an Arizona uni. In fact, I would take anyone back, yes anyone, who was on this team this year. Much better than what you'd get on grad transfer market IMO.

I do NOT want Dylan Smith back.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:15 pm

zonagrad wrote:
Olsondogg wrote:Want all those guys back in an Arizona uni. In fact, I would take anyone back, yes anyone, who was on this team this year. Much better than what you'd get on grad transfer market IMO.
I do NOT want Dylan Smith back.

Me neither. And if DD and BW are back, we don't need him.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:49 pm

To be clear from a fan standpoint I believe ODogg's view is pretty much dead on. Hell many are ready to move on at this point if not for the current recruiting class. From an important booster POV, however I believe 97's view is the correct one.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:25 pm

Olsondogg wrote:I really think that he needs a Final 4 and anything less is not going to cut it. You bring in the #1 class then you gotta do something with it. It's been a decade here, it's time.

This is where I am at.

At some point it speaks to not using the talent you acquire properly.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:23 pm

I'm not buying that. Lute had a seven year drought before he retired and was on pace to have the same lack of FF's that Miller had over a ten year span. We're applying 1990s standards to 2019 basketball. It never works.

I think we want that FF so much that we're willing to kill the goose that's laying the golden eggs.

Postmaster · Post by **Postmaster** » Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:06 pm

I’m a bit worried about “veteran presence” and leadership. Not sure where it comes from next season. If all goes as planned, the talent should be there.

I’m sorta done with the grad transfer route. I don’t know if it’s because they are older and trying to mesh with a new (younger) group or what but I’m not sure it’s that great of an approach.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:14 am

Frankly I don’t see Miller as the golden goose. What golden eggs has he brought up the last 5 years?

Poor recruiting and mgmt at PG
Stifling talent and athleticism in a cutely branded “player program” running an inflexible system?
Have multiple assistant coaches under ncaa suspicion? Keeping book after spilling the beans on the program?

I get he’s a top coach of the non FF tier but at some point you have to cut bait.

Captain Obvious · Post by **Captain Obvious** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:32 am

CalStateTempe wrote:Frankly I don’t see Miller as the golden goose. What golden eggs has he brought up the last 5 years?

Poor recruiting and mgmt at PG
Stifling talent and athleticism in a cutely branded “player program” running an inflexible system?
Have multiple assistant coaches under ncaa suspicion? Keeping book after spilling the beans on the program?

I get he’s a top coach of the non FF tier but at some point you have to cut bait.

This.......and this. I've felt for quite some time that the last Wisconsin loss was where Miller lost his window of opportunity. The program has been in a steady decline in most aspects not including recruiting over the past few years if you want to look at things realistically. Underutilizing top tier recruits has been a pattern for some time now and I'm amazed Miller is able to still get them to come here. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't believe Miller will be our HC at the start of next season. And to be honest If that's the case I'm fine with it.

UAallDay · Post by **UAallDay** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:51 am

Captain Obvious wrote:
CalStateTempe wrote:Frankly I don’t see Miller as the golden goose. What golden eggs has he brought up the last 5 years?

Poor recruiting and mgmt at PG
Stifling talent and athleticism in a cutely branded “player program” running an inflexible system?
Have multiple assistant coaches under ncaa suspicion? Keeping book after spilling the beans on the program?

I get he’s a top coach of the non FF tier but at some point you have to cut bait.

This.......and this. I've felt for quite some time that the last Wisconsin loss was where Miller lost his window of opportunity. The program has been in a steady decline in most aspects not including recruiting over the past few years if you want to look at things realistically. Underutilizing top tier recruits has been a pattern for some time now and I'm amazed Miller is able to still get them to come here. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't believe Miller will be our HC at the start of next season. And to be honest If that's the case I'm fine with it.

And who do think we should hire? We have an incompetent AD and we don’t have the money to bring in a quality coach. Miller gives us a better shot at a final four than anyone we could possibly bring in

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:02 am

UAallDay wrote: And who do think we should hire? We have an incompetent AD and we don’t have the money to bring in a quality coach. Miller gives us a better shot at a final four than anyone we could possibly bring in

Exactly.

The UA AD has been running at a deficit the last 3 years, and if you fire Miller, even with cause, the UA still owes him 85% of salary.

Major donors Cole and Jeannie Davis have Miller's back too, which Miller has mentioned intentionally.

UA AD needs to finish paying off RichRod first, then balance the budget, then think about a new coach.

U.P. Zona Fan · Post by **U.P. Zona Fan** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:43 am

What does it mean that Jeter and Randolph didn't start?

Is it foreshadowing the coming entrants to the transfer porthole?

prh · Post by **prh** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:45 am

I bet Gonzaga is glad they never tired of Few not making a FF for well over a decade

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:55 am

prh wrote:I bet Gonzaga is glad they never tired of Few not making a FF for well over a decade

It's fricken Gonzaga, what other options did they have? They didn't have the money nor the natural resources to attract a high caliber replacement at the time.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:56 am

U.P. Zona Fan wrote:What does it mean that Jeter and Randolph didn't start?

Is it foreshadowing the coming entrants to the transfer porthole?

You already know what's going to happen with Randolph. It didn't mean anything in regards to Jeter.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:00 am

UAallDay wrote:
Captain Obvious wrote:
CalStateTempe wrote:Frankly I don’t see Miller as the golden goose. What golden eggs has he brought up the last 5 years?

Poor recruiting and mgmt at PG
Stifling talent and athleticism in a cutely branded “player program” running an inflexible system?
Have multiple assistant coaches under ncaa suspicion? Keeping book after spilling the beans on the program?

I get he’s a top coach of the non FF tier but at some point you have to cut bait.

This.......and this. I've felt for quite some time that the last Wisconsin loss was where Miller lost his window of opportunity. The program has been in a steady decline in most aspects not including recruiting over the past few years if you want to look at things realistically. Underutilizing top tier recruits has been a pattern for some time now and I'm amazed Miller is able to still get them to come here. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't believe Miller will be our HC at the start of next season. And to be honest If that's the case I'm fine with it.
And who do think we should hire? We have an incompetent AD and we don’t have the money to bring in a quality coach. Miller gives us a better shot at a final four than anyone we could possibly bring in

What makes you think the AD would be the one making a basketball hire? Guy wasn't even allowed to make the football hire ultimately.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:02 am

He being “Romer’d”?

Would’ve been nice miller Romer’d PJC.

Still want to know the backstory to millers ride or die with PJC.

Alieberman · Post by **Alieberman** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:22 am

A couple serviceable upperclassman and a highly regarded freshmen class and we are thinking final 4?

I don't see it. I wish I saw it.... but I don't.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:27 am

To those on the "fire Miller" bandwagon:

I'm not sure you've really thought through who his replacement could be, not to mention the business side that Merk has touched on above. It sucks, but I don't think the AZ job is as appealing now as it was when Miller was hired. In part because of the scandal, but also because the Pac has fallen off nationally. Don't get me wrong: AZ, UCLA, Oregon...these will always be good jobs. But whereas in '09 we were talking about Calipari and Izzo and Few, now we'd be talking about an inferior group of candidates.

I think you gotta stick with Miller for now. In years where he's had loaded rosters, he's won Pac titles and gotten to the second weekend of the tourney. That's success in my book. We all want a FF, but that's not the only measure of a coach and program's success.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:41 am

Alieberman wrote:A couple serviceable upperclassman and a highly regarded freshmen class and we are thinking final 4?

I don't see it. I wish I saw it.... but I don't.

The talent is there and Nico is a natural born leader regardless how young he is. With that being said can Sean Miller get out of his own way? That's honestly the probably key difference between a 2nd round exit and a possibility at a final four.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:43 am

ChooChooCat wrote: With that being said can Sean Miller get out of his own way? That's honestly the probably key difference between a 2nd round exit and a possibility at a final four.

What does "get out of his own way" even mean? Do you want him to refrain from calling plays on offense? Scrap the packline? I'm asking seriously, Choo.

legallykenny · Post by **legallykenny** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:44 am

Beachcat97 wrote:To those on the "fire Miller" bandwagon:

I'm not sure you've really thought through who his replacement could be, not to mention the business side that Merk has touched on above. It sucks, but I don't think the AZ job is as appealing now as it was when Miller was hired. In part because of the scandal, but also because the Pac has fallen off nationally. Don't get me wrong: AZ, UCLA, Oregon...these will always be good jobs. But whereas in '09 we were talking about Calipari and Izzo and Few, now we'd be talking about an inferior group of candidates.

I think you gotta stick with Miller for now. In years where he's had loaded rosters, he's won Pac titles and gotten to the second weekend of the tourney. That's success in my book. We all want a FF, but that's not the only measure of a coach and program's success.

That may well be true.

But what his supporters are missing is that you don't continue to reward failure. If he takes a paycut reflective of his performance, goes on a PR tour to stop pissing off the conference and the national press (as deserved as sniping at them may be his attitude is a big part of the reason we are where we are) and shows any indication that he is changing the problems in the program, then we can talk.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:46 am

Beachcat97 wrote:To those on the "fire Miller" bandwagon:

I'm not sure you've really thought through who his replacement could be, not to mention the business side that Merk has touched on above. It sucks, but I don't think the AZ job is as appealing now as it was when Miller was hired. In part because of the scandal, but also because the Pac has fallen off nationally. Don't get me wrong: AZ, UCLA, Oregon...these will always be good jobs. But whereas in '09 we were talking about Calipari and Izzo and Few, now we'd be talking about an inferior group of candidates.

I think you gotta stick with Miller for now. In years where he's had loaded rosters, he's won Pac titles and gotten to the second weekend of the tourney. That's success in my book. We all want a FF, but that's not the only measure of a coach and program's success.

Ehh the Pac 12 doesn't matter. Can Arizona pay enough? The boosters will make that happen (as long as they're not paying a huge buyout too). Can Arizona recruit elite talent? We know the answer to that is yes. Can Arizona easily win its conference? We know the answer to that as well, which is why the Pac 12 being weak doesn't matter. If anything the Pac 12 being the fire dumpster it is makes the Arizona job more attractive as wins will be aplenty regardless.

Ultimately you're right about the rest though, as the timing is tough. The boosters will have to come through if they, not Dave Heeke, not Robbins (unless his hands are tied), deem it's time to move on. We're kind of in a purgatory like place if we do fire Miller after next year and move on. Arizona will still be an attractive job regardless of any mucky waters we're in, but we may have to go a level lower than a Xavier type school to find our next head coach.

EVCat · Post by **EVCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:49 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
Alieberman wrote:A couple serviceable upperclassman and a highly regarded freshmen class and we are thinking final 4?

I don't see it. I wish I saw it.... but I don't.
The talent is there and Nico is a natural born leader regardless how young he is. With that being said can Sean Miller get out of his own way? That's honestly the probably key difference between a 2nd round exit and a possibility at a final four.

If we flash back to Maui and the early season, we saw Miller give the keys to the offense. The motion was faster, the rebounds were sped up the court, the secondary break was a source of shots.

The problem was...we sucked. We have no finishers, there was no one dynamic with the ball in the open court, and all the penetration in the world couldn't help midgets get shots off or kicks for 3 to be made.

So the offense was tightened back up to give as much help to the defensive side as possible. Lesser runouts, more players on the boards...the "choke" style some refer to. It was necessity. We couldn't rebound, we needed 5 guys on defense to the last possible second, and we needed both extra rebounders and guards to come back for the ball because our rebounders were not particularly adept at quick outlets.

We tried to be what Miller talked about, a more open offense. But that comes with consequence, especially when your fast break leaves 3 guys under then rim and the other team on 4-on-2 breakouts. Our early offense was more offense for the other team in advantage breaks off the miss or turnover.

I don't see that as a problem. I was encouraged by the style I saw early this year. Turns out we didn't have the personnel to run it. But we will...

84Cat · Post by **84Cat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:54 am

The problem that I see with the Pac being weak is the putrid amount of money we are getting from the media deals that Larry has whiffed on. Other than that, I agree with you Choo.

MountainCat · Post by **MountainCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:55 am

U.P. Zona Fan wrote:What does it mean that Jeter and Randolph didn't start?

Is it foreshadowing the coming entrants to the transfer porthole?

Randolph = Yes

Jeter = Back Problems, limited action on the court

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:56 am

Beachcat97 wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote: With that being said can Sean Miller get out of his own way? That's honestly the probably key difference between a 2nd round exit and a possibility at a final four.
What does "get out of his own way" even mean? Do you want him to refrain from calling plays on offense? Scrap the packline? I'm asking seriously, Choo.

How many plays does he call on offense? An alley oop play off an inbounds under the basket (if he has the personnel to pull the play off)? The patented last possession play where he has his lead guard let the clock wind down and just do whatever the hell he wants?

He'll never scrap the packline, so how about maybe just let his talent play? Let's be clear if he has a job after next season it's not going to be because of an awesome coaching job, it'll be because his players made plays. Let them take risks here and there on defense. Let Nico and Brandon make plays for themselves and others. Get out of your own way and let these guys save your job. That's really it.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:57 am

EVCat wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
Alieberman wrote:A couple serviceable upperclassman and a highly regarded freshmen class and we are thinking final 4?

I don't see it. I wish I saw it.... but I don't.
The talent is there and Nico is a natural born leader regardless how young he is. With that being said can Sean Miller get out of his own way? That's honestly the probably key difference between a 2nd round exit and a possibility at a final four.
If we flash back to Maui and the early season, we saw Miller give the keys to the offense. The motion was faster, the rebounds were sped up the court, the secondary break was a source of shots.

The problem was...we sucked. We have no finishers, there was no one dynamic with the ball in the open court, and all the penetration in the world couldn't help midgets get shots off or kicks for 3 to be made.

So the offense was tightened back up to give as much help to the defensive side as possible. Lesser runouts, more players on the boards...the "choke" style some refer to. It was necessity. We couldn't rebound, we needed 5 guys on defense to the last possible second, and we needed both extra rebounders and guards to come back for the ball because our rebounders were not particularly adept at quick outlets.

We tried to be what Miller talked about, a more open offense. But that comes with consequence, especially when your fast break leaves 3 guys under then rim and the other team on 4-on-2 breakouts. Our early offense was more offense for the other team in advantage breaks off the miss or turnover.

I don't see that as a problem. I was encouraged by the style I saw early this year. Turns out we didn't have the personnel to run it. But we will...

I hope you're right.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:12 am

EVCat wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
Alieberman wrote:A couple serviceable upperclassman and a highly regarded freshmen class and we are thinking final 4?

I don't see it. I wish I saw it.... but I don't.
The talent is there and Nico is a natural born leader regardless how young he is. With that being said can Sean Miller get out of his own way? That's honestly the probably key difference between a 2nd round exit and a possibility at a final four.
If we flash back to Maui and the early season, we saw Miller give the keys to the offense. The motion was faster, the rebounds were sped up the court, the secondary break was a source of shots.

The problem was...we sucked. We have no finishers, there was no one dynamic with the ball in the open court, and all the penetration in the world couldn't help midgets get shots off or kicks for 3 to be made.

So the offense was tightened back up to give as much help to the defensive side as possible. Lesser runouts, more players on the boards...the "choke" style some refer to. It was necessity. We couldn't rebound, we needed 5 guys on defense to the last possible second, and we needed both extra rebounders and guards to come back for the ball because our rebounders were not particularly adept at quick outlets.

We tried to be what Miller talked about, a more open offense. But that comes with consequence, especially when your fast break leaves 3 guys under then rim and the other team on 4-on-2 breakouts. Our early offense was more offense for the other team in advantage breaks off the miss or turnover.

I don't see that as a problem. I was encouraged by the style I saw early this year. Turns out we didn't have the personnel to run it. But we will...

I think Miller dialed it back because we lost a ton of depth. We were playing a walkon for meaningful minutes during the losing streak. It's hard to open the throttle when you're shorthanded. It's begging to get worn down in a wide open game.

BWill is the only perimeter player we had this year that's really built for a fluid 4 out game. Coleman, small and inconsistent (but probably the second best). Randolph, too black holeish and shot poorly. Smith, can't dribble or finish and shot poorly. Doutrive, needs development.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:17 am

I'd like to see an attempt at a list of coaches we could realistically court as a replacement for Miller (provided we can offer big money).

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:33 am

84Cat wrote:The problem that I see with the Pac being weak is the putrid amount of money we are getting from the media deals that Larry has whiffed on. Other than that, I agree with you Choo.

Larry's failures on that end is why Arizona desperately needs booster help. Well that and us firing Rich Rod and paying him a bunch of money to go away.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:47 am

Beachcat97 wrote:I'd like to see an attempt at a list of coaches we could realistically court as a replacement for Miller (provided we can offer big money).

I think a realistic top three would involve:

Walton
Musselman--Although he clearly has a significant background issue.
Beard--Although if Texas opens, we probably have zero chance at beating them.

One of the glaring things about that list to me is the fact it includes no one with a better resume than Miller, either now or when he was hired from Xavier. It's a change, but I significantly pause about whether there's any real possibility of an upgrade.

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