Tommy Lloyd

WildcatStunner · Post by **WildcatStunner** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:23 pm

Tommy needs has a lot to answer for. How can a team that plays so well over the regular season struggle in every tournament game?

Carcassdragger · Post by **Carcassdragger** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:25 pm

The PAC 12 tournament has got to go. It just wears our guys out and beats us up when we should be preparing to peak.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:25 pm

Lute the 2nd with the early exits!

Carcassdragger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:25 pm The PAC 12 tournament has got to go. It just wears our guys out and beats us up when we should be preparing to peak.

I blame Lloyd's 7 man rotation

dmjcat · Post by **dmjcat** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:26 pm

Carcassdragger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:25 pm The PAC 12 tournament has got to go. It just wears our guys out and beats us up when we should be preparing to peak.

Only going 7 deep down the stretch doesn't help

EastCoastCat · Post by **EastCoastCat** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:29 pm

He’s going to have to live with this like Lute did.

azgreg · Post by **azgreg** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:34 pm

Carcassdragger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:25 pm The PAC 12 tournament has got to go. It just wears our guys out and beats us up when we should be preparing to peak.

Didn't seem to hurt Alabama or Kansas.

CardiacCats97 · Post by **CardiacCats97** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:34 pm

I don’t care what his regular season record is. A 2-2 record as a top-2 seed is downright shameful.

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:36 pm

Euro guards just don't have the dawg in them to win in March

Too soft up and down

arizonawildcats · Post by **arizonawildcats** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm

I'm excited for KJ Lewis, but Tommy has to find a lot of talent in a hurry.

jsbowl16 · Post by **jsbowl16** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm

For the first time since Tommy started, I miss Sean Miller.

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:48 pm

jsbowl16 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm For the first time since Tommy started, I miss Sean Miller.

I want to see how his teams look with non Euro guards (and maybe wings also) first

Kerr shoots 37% from the field, not from 3 but the field and doesn't even think of attacking

Even last year w Kerr but with Terry and Mathurin, they were nearly unstoppable. Ready for Boz to take over honestly

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:51 pm

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:48 pm
jsbowl16 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm For the first time since Tommy started, I miss Sean Miller.
I want to see how his teams look with non Euro guards (and maybe wings also) first

Kerr shoots 37% from the field, not from 3 but the field and doesn't even think of attacking

Even last year w Kerr but with Terry and Mathurin, they were nearly unstoppable. Ready for Boz to take over honestly

Obviously not a Euro, but even the announcers were calling out Henderson for being too timid. Why wasn't Boswell out there end of game?

Nothing but best wishes for him and Ramey, but time to move on.

arizonawildcats · Post by **arizonawildcats** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:51 pm

jsbowl16 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm For the first time since Tommy started, I miss Sean Miller.

CSM wouldn't have been fired if he modernized his offense. His recruiting was always elite.

jsbowl16 · Post by **jsbowl16** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:53 pm

There is no use watching this team before March next season because even when we are a 1 or 2 under Tommy Boy, we don't go anywhere so the regular season doesn't matter.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:58 pm

arizonawildcats wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:51 pm
jsbowl16 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm For the first time since Tommy started, I miss Sean Miller.
CSM wouldn't have been fired if he modernized his offense. His recruiting was always elite.

I don't think on court performance has anything to do with CSM getting fired.

Dick Tomey he is not. Although CSM has grown quite a bit O wise.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:01 pm

Needs to follow the metrics that Oats does. If you are a guard you either attack the rim off the drive of you shoot the open three ball.

Lloyd seemed to hint at that at times. He wanted the guards to feed the post or get more aggressive or hunt a three. Problem was Ramey, Henderson and Krissa couldn’t beat anybody off the bounce.

It will be interesting to hear his comments in the coming days on what happened and what the plan is

arizonawildcats · Post by **arizonawildcats** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:02 pm

azcat49 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:01 pm Needs to follow the metrics that Oats does. If you are a guard you either attack the rim off the drive of you shoot the open three ball.

Lloyd seemed to hint at that at times. He wanted the guards to feed the post or get more aggressive or hunt a three. Problem was Ramey, Henderson and Krissa couldn’t beat anybody off the bounce.

Exactly

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:05 pm

Merkin wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:58 pm
arizonawildcats wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:51 pm
jsbowl16 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm For the first time since Tommy started, I miss Sean Miller.
CSM wouldn't have been fired if he modernized his offense. His recruiting was always elite.
I don't think on court performance has anything to do with CSM getting fired.

Dick Tomey he is not. Although CSM has grown quite a bit O wise.

He didn't grow until he was fired though, he said so himself

If he was still here, he'd be doing the same thing

dovecanyoncat · Post by **dovecanyoncat** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:06 pm

azcat49 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:01 pm

Lloyd seemed to hint at that at times. He wanted the guards to feed the post or get more aggressive or hunt a three. Problem was Ramey, Henderson and Krissa couldn’t beat anybody off the bounce.

And we couldn't keep their drivers from getting to the rim.

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:07 pm

azcat49 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:01 pm Needs to follow the metrics that Oats does. If you are a guard you either attack the rim off the drive of you shoot the open three ball.

Lloyd seemed to hint at that at times. He wanted the guards to feed the post or get more aggressive or hunt a three. Problem was Ramey, Henderson and Krissa couldn’t beat anybody off the bounce.

It will be interesting to hear his comments in the coming days on what happened and what the plan is

He needs to go with Boswell next year, even if Kerr is back

dmjcat · Post by **dmjcat** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:11 pm

I for one am happy with Lloyd. He may be the best we can do in the NIL period.

We are not going to outbid most teams for the Top 50 players. We don't have a Phil Knight.

We need a coach who can:

1) Develop players
2) Recruit Intl. players
3) Identify and recruit the #50-100 HS players

I think CTL is an ideal coach for that.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:12 pm

Even Gumby from TOS is down on Lloyd.

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:07 pm He needs to go with Boswell next year, even if Kerr is back

With Ramey and Henderson gone I am pretty sure Kriisa will slide back over to the 2.

g32knights · Post by **g32knights** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:21 pm

Merkin wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:12 pm Even Gumby from TOS is down on Lloyd.

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:07 pm He needs to go with Boswell next year, even if Kerr is back
With Ramey and Henderson gone I am pretty sure Kriisa will slide back over to the 2.

That sounds... awful

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:28 pm

Kerr at the 2 sounds even worse than at the point lol

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:36 pm

Ok, DMJ think Lloyd is the guy but I am not sure now. It looks like we are the Atlanta Braves of the 90’s. Built for the regular season.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:38 pm

Kerr is still a 37% 3-pt shooter, but streaky AF and cannot drive at all. When he was a freshman at the 2 he only had 1 FG attempt. All the rest were 3s.

CatsbyAZ · Post by **CatsbyAZ** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:42 pm

WildcatStunner wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:23 pm Tommy needs has a lot to answer for. How can a team that plays so well over the regular season struggle in every tournament game?

In the aftermath of all this, I'll say what's already probably been said. Does anybody get the sense Tommy has parlayed the program into Gonzaga 2.0, before they started breaking through past the Sweet Sixteen fifteen years into Mark Few's tenure? 1999-2013?

In Few's first fifteen years at Gonzaga achieved FOUR S16s, EIGHT 2nd Rnds, & THREE 1st Rnd losses. Often losing as the higher seed to more physical teams? Similar to the way we were out-bodied by TCU/Houston? With Euro-heavy rosters that CTL likes putting on the court?

That sounds A LOT like what we're seeing with CTL these first two seasons.

azgreg · Post by **azgreg** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:44 pm

Merkin wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:38 pm Kerr is still a 37% 3-pt shooter, but streaky AF and cannot drive at all. When he was a freshman at the 2 he only had 1 FG attempt. All the rest were 3s.

He's 37.8% from the floor period.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:53 pm

Good point here. Lute used to intentionally tank in the PAC tourney to rest his players.

And now doing a Mick Cronin? Chucking 3s won't get you to the line.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:02 pm

WTF, what BS. People have to be laughing at us and that’s what he comes up with

CardiacCats97 · Post by **CardiacCats97** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:04 pm

He also said this was just a “small setback”.

Like getting a 1 or 2 seed will happen every year because we’re Arizona and aw shucks no big deal if from time to time we shit ourselves against incredibly inferior competition.

dovecanyoncat · Post by **dovecanyoncat** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:06 pm

Merkin wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:53 pm

And now doing a Mick Cronin? Chucking 3s won't get you to the line.

Yes. Tommy, don't. Just don't.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:06 pm

Gonzaga lite

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:06 pm

When will the pressor be posted?

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:09 pm

arizonawildcats · Post by **arizonawildcats** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:10 pm

I'm sure he heard this a lot at Gonzaga. This fan base deserves a winner.

84Cat · Post by **84Cat** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:46 pm

CalStateTempe wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:06 pm When will the pressor be posted?

Irish27 · Post by **Irish27** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:46 pm

Lute's first three UofA teams lost in the first round. I have been very happy with Lloyd. It's been 22 years since their last final four appearance, so I am a patient person.

arizonawildcats · Post by **arizonawildcats** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:48 pm

Boswell needs to improve as a distributor and start getting to the rim. KJ Lewis should help as an athletic two-way wing. I don't put much stock into the other guys improving at this point. Tommy has to recruit his ass off for us to make a deep run.

Postmaster · Post by **Postmaster** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:00 pm

Princeton had one free throw before the end of the game.

If no fouls are being called why was Princeton able to dominate inside against Zu and Ballo?

I think a lot of people owe Goetlieb an apology.

Postmaster · Post by **Postmaster** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:04 pm

Irish27 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:46 pm Lute's first three UofA teams lost in the first round. I have been very happy with Lloyd. It's been 22 years since their last final four appearance, so I am a patient person.

He also started from scratch.
CTL started with a team that should have made the S16.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:24 pm

arizonawildcats wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 5:10 pm I'm sure he heard this a lot at Gonzaga. This fan base deserves a winner.

CTL was here for TCU? I thought that was Miller.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:25 pm

Merkin wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 4:53 pm Good point here. Lute used to intentionally tank in the PAC tourney to rest his players.

And now doing a Mick Cronin? Chucking 3s won't get you to the line.

arizonawildcats wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:51 pm
jsbowl16 wrote: ↑Thu Mar 16, 2023 3:43 pm For the first time since Tommy started, I miss Sean Miller.
CSM wouldn't have been fired if he modernized his offense. His recruiting was always elite.

This is dejecting and humiliating. ASU fans are laughing at us even more than when they hit the buzzer beater in McKale. CTL doesn't get it. The reason why our players don't show up is because the attitude of players reflect leadership. CTL has some immaturity in his responses to challenges and lacks grit and toughness to impart to his players. You think UCLA would stink up the court like that with no adjustments? I knew we were in trouble after the ASU game when he seemed unfazed about the fact that Sparky and crew came into our house and beat us. For true Wildcat fans, it's like a day of mourning.

There's no way we should lose to a 15 seed and have our head coach just brush it off. This is what has turned me off of CTL this season. Sure, I like the wins, but everything we do in this program is for March. It's something he doesn't seem to get. And despite everything somehow ASU found a way to put their foot on the gas pedal against Nevada and now we're sent packing back home.

If he recruited like Miller this whole situation would have never happened. We would have athletes that could take over the game when it got rough. I know he's excited about Carter Bryant and some other guys, but the fact of the matter is he just can't close. We're ARIZONA for Pete's sake and he has one of the highest winning percentages in the game and still can't get high caliber athletes here. It's embarrassing. Also lets not forget Carter Bryant is still considering us and Louisville when it should be no contest. He already lost on Kwame Evans, Cody Williams, Keion Brooks and all the other major in state talent that is going elsewhere. When are people gonna start telling him to step it up? He certainly not getting it done.

Some posters are calling out the obvious by stating that we are turning into Gonzaga lite. Well, the problem is Lloyd leans on his recruiting connections with Europe too much and hasn't learned to step up his domestic recruiting. And to be quite frank his European recruits are underwhelming. I don't think he feels the pain of this loss like we do. His whole 'Aw shucks' strategy can work at Gonzaga, but not here. I guarantee you if any of our alumni were coaching here they would have closed far more high level athletes than Lloyd has. I knew we were trouble when he said that recruiting at Arizona was 'hard.' No, it's not hard, you're just not good at it. He needs to hire staff to help him with recruiting and defense or we're gonna be in the same position as this year. There has been zero growth in our strategy in the tourney since he's been here. If he doesn't get that, he needs to be reminded that there are plenty of qualified Arizona alums who coach in the league that do.

Also by the way, Jamari Phillips and Bryant are not enough for the '24 class. By the time '24 comes, he needs to pull in at least 6-8 studs for that roster because our entire starting five will be gone.

Carcassdragger · Post by **Carcassdragger** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:28 pm

I'm a big CTL fan, but after watching the presser, I've never been so disappointed in him. Shame on Tommy for blaming this loss on the way the game was officiated. Princeton beat us because they played better and, unlike our guys, were ready to play.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:37 pm

Sorry but I am tired of his Ted Lasso BS. That was horseshit. They weren’t ready on the bench or the court.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:51 pm

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 6:51 pm

Wow, that opening statement from coach with some shit. With all those compliments, he gave Princeton, what does that say about us, lacking fundamentals, not making the right place, not being a well coached team.

He better not the “ah shucks” attitude off next go around if he wants to get anywhere in this tournament

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 7:07 pm

SabinoDrifter · Post by **SabinoDrifter** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 7:11 pm

There's not a lot of pressure when you win 33 and 28 games in your first two seasons after the Miller / Book fallout. He has been a little less than subtle with his postgame comments this year and they didn't respond.

Brendan Haywood said it during the Northwestern-Boise game - Arizona lost that game because their guards were terrible. We weren't playing Houston, or Alabama, we were playing fucking Princeton and Kerr was 1-7 from three, didn't take a two point shot, had four turnovers and two assists. He's not a high-level point guard.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Thu Mar 16, 2023 7:20 pm

Then a coach who was tough would move Boswell into the starting role (especially when your PG has a bad shoulder) or would have him in at the end.

He would also go out and get a high level PG assuming he noted the current PG’s deficiencies.

He also would note that maybe his finess ball doesn’t work in the tourney and go get some junkyard dogs who respond In March when it counts.

This loss is so on LLoyd. It was preventable. I see UCLA has chased out to an 11-0 lead and looks ready to make a deep run. Maybe that loss helped them of maybe their coach is not awe shucks, great game guys.

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