Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Moderators: UAdevil, JMarkJohns
- Longhorned
- Posts: 14758
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 1:04 pm
- Reputation: 975
- Location: In a guayabera at The Sands Club, Arizona Stadium
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He's going to put on a lot of muscle in the off season as well.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
I remember seeing that stat. That was partially inflated by Tarc not starting in favor of Korcheck, but I love our bench.CatsbyAZ wrote:Glad to see PJC's minute up these last 5 or 6 games. And he's contributed while playing. Same goes for Ristic. Wish we'd see more of Pitts, but it's good to know Miller is playing so much of the bench. At halftime something like 23 (over half) of Arizona's production was from the bench. That'll pay for itself next season when York, PJC, Ristic, and Pitts get starting time.
PJC will hit the weight room and get stronger. In one of these threads I posted his stats compared to TJ's, and adjusting for similar minutes, nearly identical. He isn't the defender, leader, or have the intangibles that TJ has, but he's only a frosh. I'm very happy with him and think he has a bright future for us
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
not feelin it one bit, not one bit -- he's been down right awful and frankly doesn't look like he belongs at this level one bit.
to say Kadeem Allen is light years ahead of him is a drastic understatement.
to say Kadeem Allen is light years ahead of him is a drastic understatement.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
And without Pitts to count on, that leaves this team dangerously thin at guard until PJC decides to grow up--and play up to his talent.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He just needs to slow things down
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
really? So you think that's it??rgdeuce wrote:He just needs to slow things down
"slowing things down"
i don't think so
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Just finished watching the game, and was thinking every time PJC was in that I was wrong. I thought, after watching him last year, that he would be just fine and really thought he would be our starter. It is clear, however, that he just can't play on this level. Sad to see, and thank god Kadeem redshirted last year so that we have him next year as well.97cats wrote:not feelin it one bit, not one bit -- he's been down right awful and frankly doesn't look like he belongs at this level one bit.
to say Kadeem Allen is light years ahead of him is a drastic understatement.
Whenever PJC is on the floor we are bad offensively and defensively. I'm not sure if they track +/- in college but I get the feeling it would have been something like a -20 tonight. He isn't a threat on offense to do ANYTHING, and every time he goes by someone on the dribble it seems like they just poke it away from him from behind. He can't shoot (I thought he would become a good shooter), isn't making free throws, and makes horrible decisions on when to try and take it at the bigs for layups.
PJC's minutes should be going to Simon. I never thought i'd say that, but I believe it wholeheartedly now
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Lol. No thats not it. its a nice way of saying he is stinking the place up for the most part so he should just stick to managing the game and making the simple play.97cats wrote:really? So you think that's it??rgdeuce wrote:He just needs to slow things down
"slowing things down"
i don't think so
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
There were some bad lineups out there tonight and he was the constant in all of themdcZONAfan wrote:Just finished watching the game, and was thinking every time PJC was in that I was wrong. I thought, after watching him last year, that he would be just fine and really thought he would be our starter. It is clear, however, that he just can't play on this level. Sad to see, and thank god Kadeem redshirted last year so that we have him next year as well.97cats wrote:not feelin it one bit, not one bit -- he's been down right awful and frankly doesn't look like he belongs at this level one bit.
to say Kadeem Allen is light years ahead of him is a drastic understatement.
Whenever PJC is on the floor we are bad offensively and defensively. I'm not sure if they track +/- in college but I get the feeling it would have been something like a -20 tonight. He isn't a threat on offense to do ANYTHING, and every time he goes by someone on the dribble it seems like they just poke it away from him from behind. He can't shoot (I thought he would become a good shooter), isn't making free throws, and makes horrible decisions on when to try and take it at the bigs for layups.
PJC's minutes should be going to Simon. I never thought i'd say that, but I believe it wholeheartedly now
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
stinkin it up? no question about it
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Seriously. It's very rare that I direct my yelling at CSM, but tonight I was because of some of the lineups out there.rgdeuce wrote:
There were some bad lineups out there tonight and he was the constant in all of them
-
- Posts: 8719
- Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:47 pm
- Reputation: 1176
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Definitely an issue, but what does Miller do about this? Keep Parker as his back up for the next 3 years or turn to Simon for that role?
-
- Posts: 1819
- Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:40 pm
- Reputation: 82
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
There was a brief period last year where I thought he'd be better than TJ. Was definitely wrong about that.
He's just too small. Even if he ever figures it out offensively, or finds a shot, he's going to continue to get torched defensively.
He's just too small. Even if he ever figures it out offensively, or finds a shot, he's going to continue to get torched defensively.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
recruit and land another top level PG -- in the short term, Josh Jackson will solve some of thatChooChooCat wrote:Definitely an issue, but what does Miller do about this? Keep Parker as his back up for the next 3 years or turn to Simon for that role?
-
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:35 pm
- Reputation: 17
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Flashbacks to #SpitFreely and #YorkCity.
Even if he were to not improve, and with his diminutive stature, infinitely more valuable and effective than Mayes.
Even if he were to not improve, and with his diminutive stature, infinitely more valuable and effective than Mayes.
- Merkin
- Posts: 43386
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 10:31 am
- Reputation: 1581
- Location: UA basketball smells like....victory
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Like the kid, but he seems to have regressed from last year. Certainly didn't get the freshman to sophomore jump Lute liked to talk about.
-
- Posts: 8719
- Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:47 pm
- Reputation: 1176
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Troy Brown can come on down then!97cats wrote:recruit and land another top level PG -- in the short term, Josh Jackson will solve some of thatChooChooCat wrote:Definitely an issue, but what does Miller do about this? Keep Parker as his back up for the next 3 years or turn to Simon for that role?
I guess next year Kadeem/Jackson/Simon can handle the duties. Would recruiting over Parker effect much in Los Angeles for us?
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
I wouldnt give up on this kid yet guys, he's in a really bad funk and I bet quite a bit of that is his shooting slump from long range. And a couple of those drives last night should have been fouls from my seats. We need to recognize he is a career backup point most likely and thats ok. He isnt a five star top 20 guy and hes only a sophomore. We got Kadeem now and next year, and contrary to some of the complaints in the game thread, I like what Kadeem brings at that position. He isnt TJ, and its going to be a LONG time before we get another TJ. There is a reason TJ spent two years here and is probably the most beloved wildcat of all time (dont believe me, go to a game and watch the intro and hear his cheers twice as loud as anyone else).
He can still push the ball up the floor and i like his on ball pressure. He isnt a ball stopper, but he makes things uncomfortable like Muggsy Bogues used to do. Hopefully he turns it around this season. And although Simon has done some nice things, you really think he can handle the rock and quarterback a team for 16 plus minutes a game? Not sure about that. Simons cool w a limited role and fading into the background, but I dont think he is ready for that yet
All I want at this point is CSM to pull back on the PJC at point and Kadeem off ball backcourt. At least til he gets things right. That would help quite a bit and i expect he will back off this backcourt for a bit
He can still push the ball up the floor and i like his on ball pressure. He isnt a ball stopper, but he makes things uncomfortable like Muggsy Bogues used to do. Hopefully he turns it around this season. And although Simon has done some nice things, you really think he can handle the rock and quarterback a team for 16 plus minutes a game? Not sure about that. Simons cool w a limited role and fading into the background, but I dont think he is ready for that yet
All I want at this point is CSM to pull back on the PJC at point and Kadeem off ball backcourt. At least til he gets things right. That would help quite a bit and i expect he will back off this backcourt for a bit
-
- Posts: 8719
- Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:47 pm
- Reputation: 1176
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
I <3 Kadeem.
Fwiw Parker has moments of absolute brilliance from time to time. The problem is those moments have been few and far between as of late.
Fwiw Parker has moments of absolute brilliance from time to time. The problem is those moments have been few and far between as of late.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
This is a great post RG. I think I (and others) were hasty on the parker hate, but would definitely like to see him reigned in a little bit. If he went to about 8-10 min/game just spelling Kadeem (not playing alonside him) it's probably best for everyone. You're right that Simon can't run a team yet and Parker can still do that, just not for 15 minutes.rgdeuce wrote:I wouldnt give up on this kid yet guys, he's in a really bad funk and I bet quite a bit of that is his shooting slump from long range. And a couple of those drives last night should have been fouls from my seats. We need to recognize he is a career backup point most likely and thats ok. He isnt a five star top 20 guy and hes only a sophomore. We got Kadeem now and next year, and contrary to some of the complaints in the game thread, I like what Kadeem brings at that position. He isnt TJ, and its going to be a LONG time before we get another TJ. There is a reason TJ spent two years here and is probably the most beloved wildcat of all time (dont believe me, go to a game and watch the intro and hear his cheers twice as loud as anyone else).
He can still push the ball up the floor and i like his on ball pressure. He isnt a ball stopper, but he makes things uncomfortable like Muggsy Bogues used to do. Hopefully he turns it around this season. And although Simon has done some nice things, you really think he can handle the rock and quarterback a team for 16 plus minutes a game? Not sure about that. Simons cool w a limited role and fading into the background, but I dont think he is ready for that yet
All I want at this point is CSM to pull back on the PJC at point and Kadeem off ball backcourt. At least til he gets things right. That would help quite a bit and i expect he will back off this backcourt for a bit
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
look, he's fine as a backup/spot duty/gap filler but he's not a 20+ min a game guy that folks thought he would be, at lease not yet.
im good with 8-12min(s) a game at this point
im good with 8-12min(s) a game at this point
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He was awful last night. I've seen small players that play bigger (Damon). He seems to play his size - which is a real problem. He's not the future at PG. In fact, I would be surprised if he finishes his career at Arizona.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
I was having a hard time not screaming out at him at the game last night. Had a few nice passes and it was good to see him knock down a 3 (id be curious to see his numbers over the last 4 or 5), but he wasnt just bad last night, he was a liability. We are a completely different team when Kadeem is running the point, it's night and day. Both ends too. He has been awful at keeping his man in front of him, too frequently someone has to step in to help, and a man is left wide open for an easy bucket. This happened at least five times last night. Really dumb and bad fouls too, outside of one ridiculous call when he was matched up w a bigger guy on a switch.
Im hoping he can go home and be with family and have a few days to leave basketball in Tucson and get a mental break. Come back w a clean slate in a new year and have some nice practices. I really really think it is mental with this kid. Perhaps he thought the PG job was his and Kadeem came in and now hes pressing too hard. And now his shot is completely off which is messing with him even more. I still trust he can help us down the stretch and this is not who he is. I think Miller feels the same; he stuck with him and even had him closing out the game
Im hoping he can go home and be with family and have a few days to leave basketball in Tucson and get a mental break. Come back w a clean slate in a new year and have some nice practices. I really really think it is mental with this kid. Perhaps he thought the PG job was his and Kadeem came in and now hes pressing too hard. And now his shot is completely off which is messing with him even more. I still trust he can help us down the stretch and this is not who he is. I think Miller feels the same; he stuck with him and even had him closing out the game
-
- Posts: 14664
- Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2014 7:28 am
- Reputation: 1150
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
My two cents. To be really productive at his size, a player has to have at least one exceptional quality. Damon was great because he had exceptional quickness and was an exceptional shooter. Even Nic Wise succeeded because he could really shoot the ball.cpt wrote:He was awful last night. I've seen small players that play bigger (Damon). He seems to play his size - which is a real problem. He's not the future at PG. In fact, I would be surprised if he finishes his career at Arizona.
PJC does not have exceptional quickness. It is good, but no one will ever call him a jet. His jumper has not been stellar this year. Without those things, I can't see him exceeding being a rotation player.
At his size, if he can't use speed to break a defender down or make a defender get in his jersey because he's a shooter, he just becomes an easy cover. Because of his height, he needs space to shoot it so the defender can hang back further than with Allen. Because he isn't super quick, he has trouble breaking down the defender to create.
I wasn't quite as negative about last night, but I really have a hard time seeing him in a larger role than backup unless his shooting really gets better.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
PJC looked better last night, hopefully he's getting more confident. Coach has been working with him during practice.. and expects his shooting to get better in January.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Rooting for him. He seems like a really great kid. Just needs to knock down a few open J's and he will be off and running
Waiting at the Rose Bowl patiently for the cats to arrive
"I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more wildcat sports"
2019 BDW Survivor Pool Champion
"I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more wildcat sports"
2019 BDW Survivor Pool Champion
-
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:35 pm
- Reputation: 17
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He looks a lot quicker to me than most here seem to give him credit for...
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
I dont know, he seemed quicker last year
The PAC12 announcers said that Coach was out on the floor before the game with PJC working on his shot. I've been to several games an hour early and Coach is never out there, let alone working with players. AmazingHiCat wrote:PJC looked better last night, hopefully he's getting more confident. Coach has been working with him during practice.. and expects his shooting to get better in January.
- Merkin
- Posts: 43386
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 10:31 am
- Reputation: 1581
- Location: UA basketball smells like....victory
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Jefe wrote:I dont know, he seemed quicker last year
The PAC12 announcers said that Coach was out on the floor before the game with PJC working on his shot. I've been to several games an hour early and Coach is never out there, let alone working with players. AmazingHiCat wrote:PJC looked better last night, hopefully he's getting more confident. Coach has been working with him during practice.. and expects his shooting to get better in January.
I was wondering if that would exceed PJC's practice time, which is limited to 20 hours a week, but looking it up, there is no maximum when school is not in session. http://www.ncaa.org/sites/default/files/Charts.pdf" target="_blank
- DiehardDave37
- Posts: 525
- Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:18 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: West Virginia, USA
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He did not look better to me. I fussed at CSM for playing him so much at the end. Allen just seems so much better to these amateur old eyes of mine.HiCat wrote:PJC looked better last night, hopefully he's getting more confident. Coach has been working with him during practice.. and expects his shooting to get better in January.
I'll DVR it later tonight and concentrate on PJC and Kaboom (my new name for him after several rugged plays).
I hope I see the same improvement you did after I watch it again.
- DiehardDave37
- Posts: 525
- Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:18 pm
- Reputation: 0
- Location: West Virginia, USA
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
I thought he was quick last year, not so much this year. That could just be increased expectations after his sophomore "jump" that I somehow missed.Harvey Specter wrote:He looks a lot quicker to me than most here seem to give him credit for...
-
- Posts: 14664
- Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2014 7:28 am
- Reputation: 1150
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He is decently fast end to end, but I don't see him as quick. He can go when he gets room and a head of steam, but he does not blow by people off the dribble in the half court and does not have exceptional lateral speed on D. That mix of agility and speed is what I'd label quick, and I don't see him as outstanding. I could say fast, but not quick.Harvey Specter wrote:He looks a lot quicker to me than most here seem to give him credit for...
-
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:35 pm
- Reputation: 17
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He looks to me like the quickest and fastest player on this team. At his size, he'd better be.
Not sure how much upside he has and whether or not I ever see him starting... But regardless of others' views - I would rather have PJC than Nic Wizard 7 days a week and twice on Sunday's. Get through this shooting slump and it is a no-brainier.
Not sure how much upside he has and whether or not I ever see him starting... But regardless of others' views - I would rather have PJC than Nic Wizard 7 days a week and twice on Sunday's. Get through this shooting slump and it is a no-brainier.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Thats a very accurate description of his speed and quickness Space. Give him the ball in the open court and he takes off and glides almost. Off triple threat, not so much
-
- Posts: 14664
- Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2014 7:28 am
- Reputation: 1150
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Eh, I would rate Allen and maybe even Simon above him in the quickness department. End to end speed, I agree it is PJC.Harvey Specter wrote:He looks to me like the quickest and fastest player on this team. At his size, he'd better be.
Not sure how much upside he has and whether or not I ever see him starting... But regardless of others' views - I would rather have PJC than Nic Wizard 7 days a week and twice on Sunday's. Get through this shooting slump and it is a no-brainier.
Part of the issue is again his size. To be able to penetrate or defend, it is also about his ability to absorb contact and get where he needs to go. Defensively, I have that criticism of him, that even when he's not screened but just chipped, he gets put in recovery mode too often.
Again, I don't think he's bad, just that at his size, more than good is usually required to be a big time college player.
- Chicat
- Posts: 46634
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 12:19 pm
- Reputation: 3978
- Location: Your mother's basement
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Tonight he showed the offensive game we saw in spurts last year. Finally.
I have to wonder if maybe he missed TJ's mentorship a little this year....
I have to wonder if maybe he missed TJ's mentorship a little this year....
Of the 12 coaches, Rush picked the one whose fans have the deepest passion, the longest memories, the greatest lung capacity and … did I mention deep passion?
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Best game in an Arizona uniform.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Happy for him. Great to see multiple players step up tonight.84Cat wrote:Best game in an Arizona uniform.
-
- Posts: 2140
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:35 pm
- Reputation: 17
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Or maybe he has been reading the boards lately. He was sensational.Chicat wrote:Tonight he showed the offensive game we saw in spurts last year. Finally.
I have to wonder if maybe he missed TJ's mentorship a little this year....
- Bangkok Wildcat
- Posts: 2918
- Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2014 6:44 pm
- Reputation: 88
- Location: Bangkok, Thailand
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
No doubt.....great job PJC!84Cat wrote:Best game in an Arizona uniform.
- BBQ wildcat
- Posts: 1095
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 3:01 pm
- Reputation: 251
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
PJC channeling his inner TJ. I hope this gives a huge boost to his confidence and his motivation because he just showed what he CAN do. Having him play like that every game would move this team up a nice notch.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Another stellar game. He and Tolly put the game away late in the first half. Good thing, because Allen had a rough first half.
Right where I want to be.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Good game PJC! Shots falling...beautiful thing to see.
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Really think that shooting slump was in his head and he was letting it affect his whole game. We need this from Parker, because Kadeem is the king of picking up two dumb fouls in the first 10 minutes
- Longhorned
- Posts: 14758
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 1:04 pm
- Reputation: 975
- Location: In a guayabera at The Sands Club, Arizona Stadium
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
To me, the only thing of value in PJC's solid games against the Cougars and Huskies is if those could give him the confidence to turn the corner this season. After Stanford, it looks like confidence may not be enough. That was another typically weak game by him. 3 turnovers, 4 fouls, and pretty much lost on the court. Gabe York is a better point guard, which in addition to the absurdity of that reality, it forces Miller to take York away from what he does best.
- Chicat
- Posts: 46634
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 12:19 pm
- Reputation: 3978
- Location: Your mother's basement
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Gimino made a good point about PJC being better in an up-and-down game.
Against an aggressive zone he was terrible. I thought Dawkins did him a favor by extending to three quarter court. He had a lot more room to work with and pushed pace.
Against an aggressive zone he was terrible. I thought Dawkins did him a favor by extending to three quarter court. He had a lot more room to work with and pushed pace.
Of the 12 coaches, Rush picked the one whose fans have the deepest passion, the longest memories, the greatest lung capacity and … did I mention deep passion?
- Longhorned
- Posts: 14758
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 1:04 pm
- Reputation: 975
- Location: In a guayabera at The Sands Club, Arizona Stadium
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
He needs an up-and-down game, he needs to play at home, he needs something that no game other than the Washington schools gave him last weekend. I have nothing against who he is as a player, and I feel for whatever it is off the court that's distracting him this season, and since I'm just a 4'1" former childhood TV actor, who am I to say anything? But from my various seats that have left little impressions of my butt over the past 28 years of watching Arizona basketball, a point guard is a floor leader who sets the tone in hostile arenas and pushes his teammates through all kinds of defensive looks. The fact that he can completely vanish at Maples and basically everywhere else tells me he probably isn't Arizona's point guard despite what we saw the week before.Chicat wrote:Gimino made a good point about PJC being better in an up-and-down game.
Against an aggressive zone he was terrible. I thought Dawkins did him a favor by extending to three quarter court. He had a lot more room to work with and pushed pace.
Maybe he takes over at Haas this weekend, but I've never been less sure that he's going to become Arizona's point guard at any point this season other than when the right circumstances come together in the course of a given game. When Trier comes back, I wouldn't be surprised to see three-guard lineups that don't include him.
- Merkin
- Posts: 43386
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 10:31 am
- Reputation: 1581
- Location: UA basketball smells like....victory
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
PJC's first matchup was against Sheffield who is listed at 6'5". That has to be a little intimidating, that kid looked a whole head taller than PJC and would go right at him.
- Chicat
- Posts: 46634
- Joined: Tue Jun 03, 2014 12:19 pm
- Reputation: 3978
- Location: Your mother's basement
Re: Parker Jackson-Cartwright
Trust me, I don't know that anyone is going to mistake him for Jason Gardner out there. I did think though that he tried to be aggressive, but he's not assertive vocally and he's often tentative which is deadly for an offense against a zone. When he picks up his dribble he allows defenders to cut off passing lanes and the offense stagnates leading to him either being doubled (which he's too small to see over) or forcing something. He's got to keep his dribble alive and get to the free throw line to find Anderson cutting or York/Tolly/Kadeem for kick-out threes. Easier said than done though of course.Longhorned wrote:He needs an up-and-down game, he needs to play at home, he needs something that no game other than the Washington schools gave him last weekend. I have nothing against who he is as a player, and I feel for whatever it is off the court that's distracting him this season, and since I'm just a 4'1" former childhood TV actor, who am I to say anything? But from my various seats that have left little impressions of my butt over the past 28 years of watching Arizona basketball, a point guard is a floor leader who sets the tone in hostile arenas and pushes his teammates through all kinds of defensive looks. The fact that he can completely vanish at Maples and basically everywhere else tells me he probably isn't Arizona's point guard despite what we saw the week before.Chicat wrote:Gimino made a good point about PJC being better in an up-and-down game.
Against an aggressive zone he was terrible. I thought Dawkins did him a favor by extending to three quarter court. He had a lot more room to work with and pushed pace.
Maybe he takes over at Haas this weekend, but I've never been less sure that he's going to become Arizona's point guard at any point this season other than when the right circumstances come together in the course of a given game. When Trier comes back, I wouldn't be surprised to see three-guard lineups that don't include him.
Of the 12 coaches, Rush picked the one whose fans have the deepest passion, the longest memories, the greatest lung capacity and … did I mention deep passion?