Bear Down Wildcats

ChooChooCat wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:He could theoretically be eligible immediately with the way the NCAA is clearing guys whose head coach left, so that could solve a perceived problem (if you think we really need another post).

I was gonna say - may be an unpopular opinion, but I prefer him not being eligible this next year so that we can have him for a full 3 years after next year. And I think our chances at landing him go down substantially if he is likely to be ruled eligible immediately because we just don't have the front court minutes available that he may be looking for...would think Cal would have plenty of mins available right away if that is priority #1 for him.

1000% agree with you.

Btw some things about this entire situation that I absolutely love (inject it into my veins love):

1. Brown's circle had concerns about Sean Miller's job security at Arizona, meanwhile his 4 primary schools in his recruitment were Arizona, Cal, UCLA, & Nevada. Only school whose coach returned for the following season among that group? Arizona.
2. Brown was very likely headed for UCLA until Reef pulled out and Alford decided to grab him immediately.
3. Brown decided to transfer the second he heard Nevada was going to hire Alford, who obviously he doesn't like much after he chose Reef over him.

So much quality good shit in this situation, it's truly amazing looking at it all.

I think the vernacular term you're looking for is karma. And even better, Miller is essentially stealing one right back from Alford after the O'Neal drama. Classic.

That was fast

NYCat wrote:That was fast

Let's get this done.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:...would think Cal would have plenty of mins available right away if that is priority #1 for him.

True...but Cal vs. AZ? That feels like a no brainer, but then, Ivan Rabb.

Big thing for him was being close to home. Cal is close to home. If he qualified to get into Stanford he probably would've went there after UCLA decided to pass on him for Reef. Arizona already has a relationship built with him though, while this Cal staff would be starting from scratch, so we'll see.

Would be surprised if CAL is an option. Especially if he has any interest in winning (at all). Cal is under mass exodus with 4 current players leaving and it's only two players of consequence (Sueing/Vanover) transferring. They basically have Bradley and....? Hopefully the staff's and Brown's familiarity with each other produces a quick decision.

I know JB was highly rated out of HS, but for those who've seen him play, are there any players you'd compare him to? College or pro?

Beachcat97 wrote:I know JB was highly rated out of HS, but for those who've seen him play, are there any players you'd compare him to? College or pro?

Honestly, he sort of compares to Jeter, which is why I think he's a great fit. He's a little smaller and more mobile, but pretty comparable to Chase, at least among recent Cats.

Yikes. Height of 6'11 with a 7'0 wingspan, add that to the fact that he's pretty thin and he'll be more useful on the offensive side. Hopefully he becomes a capable shooter.

Fwiw Jeter was also a PF out of HS, height: 6'10 - wingspan: 7'1
Nnaji height: 6'11 - wingspan: 7-1

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:I know JB was highly rated out of HS, but for those who've seen him play, are there any players you'd compare him to? College or pro?

Honestly, he sort of compares to Jeter, which is why I think he's a great fit. He's a little smaller and more mobile, but pretty comparable to Chase, at least among recent Cats.

Yup.

Jeter is superior at drawing charges, Brown is superior at blocking shots.

I say with confidence that he would be the best post player we could land, whether he's eligible immediately or in 2020.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:That was fast

Let's get this done.

Seconded.

I love this incoming class, but frankly landing Jordan Brown would be Miller's most exciting off-season pickup.

Want

Oh yea, come back Mr Brown.

I like this better as a traditional transfer too. Sit a year and then have 3 years of eligibility left. We need size for those years.

Looks like Max Hazzard, Jacob's brother, is visiting next week.

How is there room for Hazzard and/or Brown? Thought all our scholarships were used for next year and haven't heard anything definite about someone leaving.

Beachcat97 wrote:How is there room for Hazzard and/or Brown? Thought all our scholarships were used for next year and haven't heard anything definite about someone leaving.

As it stands now, yes we are at the limit for next year:

Brandon Randolph
Brandon Williams
Ira Lee
Dylan Smith
Chase Jeter
Alex Barcello
Devonaire Doutrive
Stone Gettings
Nico Mannion
Josh Green
Christian Koloko
Terry Armstrong
Zeke Nnaji

Someone’s gotta go. Any volunteers? (Looking at you Dylan...)

Chicat wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:How is there room for Hazzard and/or Brown? Thought all our scholarships were used for next year and haven't heard anything definite about someone leaving.

As it stands now, yes we are at the limit for next year:

Brandon Randolph
Brandon Williams
Ira Lee
Dylan Smith
Chase Jeter
Alex Barcello
Devonaire Doutrive
Stone Gettings
Nico Mannion
Josh Green
Christian Koloko
Terry Armstrong
Zeke Nnaji

Someone’s gotta go. Any volunteers? (Looking at you Dylan...)

I genuinely don't understand why Smith would return. Everyone else, I get it, but we are jam packed with talent on the wing and he can be immediately eligible somewhere else.

I just don't get it, guard and wing is the position of least need. He's 6' so he's going to take Williams' backup mins at the point?

1. Mannion, Williams, Barcello
2. Williams, Randolph, Doutrieve
3. Green, Randolph, Smith, Armstrong
4. Nnaji, Lee, Gettings, (Brown*)
5. Jeter, Nnaji, (Brown*) Koloko

NYCat wrote:I just don't get it, guard and wing is the position of least need. He's 6' so he's going to take Williams' backup mins at the point?

Takes Barcello's minutes. I figure we start Nico and BWill together and Barcello would be our off the bench option at PG. Hazzard would eat that bench role up.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:I just don't get it, guard and wing is the position of least need. He's 6' so he's going to take Williams' backup mins at the point?

Takes Barcello's minutes. I figure we start Nico and BWill together and Barcello would be our off the bench option at PG. Hazzard would eat that bench role up.

Well that's why you stagger minutes, Williams or Mannion should be running the point/on the floor at any given time in a game.

I mean he'd literally play the role Alex Barcello would play i.e. facilitating the offense and being a designated 3 point shooter. This won't be the only guy we hotly pursue that's not a post btw.

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:I just don't get it, guard and wing is the position of least need. He's 6' so he's going to take Williams' backup mins at the point?

Takes Barcello's minutes. I figure we start Nico and BWill together and Barcello would be our off the bench option at PG. Hazzard would eat that bench role up.

Well that's why you stagger minutes, Williams or Mannion should be running the point/on the floor at any given time in a game.

I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

I'd rather have Brown on a single open scholarship, though. He offers a lot more going forward with 3 years to play. It's not close in terms of who I want if I'd choose between Brown and Hazzard.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:I just don't get it, guard and wing is the position of least need. He's 6' so he's going to take Williams' backup mins at the point?

Takes Barcello's minutes. I figure we start Nico and BWill together and Barcello would be our off the bench option at PG. Hazzard would eat that bench role up.

Well that's why you stagger minutes, Williams or Mannion should be running the point/on the floor at any given time in a game.

I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

I'd rather have Brown on a single open scholarship, though. He offers a lot more going forward with 3 years to play. It's not close in terms of who I want if I'd choose between Brown and Hazzard.

I'd get used to the idea of both or at the very least Hazzard and a post player of some kind along with possibility one more addition.

I don't think Miller realizes he only plays 7 or 8 players over the course of one season. Why is he worrying about filling scrub minutes with outside players.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

Barcello/Hazzard aren't coming onto the floor (barring injuries) if it's a close game, so why worry about the third option in blowouts/cleanup minutes? This only makes sense if Miller doesn't trust Williams' is not injury prone.

NYCat wrote:I don't think Miller realizes he only plays 7 or 8 players over the course of one season. Why is he worrying about filling scrub minutes with outside players.

Maybe he ultimately doesn't trust many of the guys he had on the team this past season one way or another? That's just me throwing shit at the wall, I honestly don't know.

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

Barcello/Hazzard aren't coming onto the floor (barring injuries) if it's a close game, so why worry about the third option in blowouts/cleanup minutes? This only makes sense if Miller doesn't trust Williams' is not injury prone.

That may be it or ultimately this gif represents what Miller is planning to do via competition.

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

Barcello/Hazzard aren't coming onto the floor (barring injuries) if it's a close game, so why worry about the third option in blowouts/cleanup minutes? This only makes sense if Miller doesn't trust Williams' is not injury prone.

If we should take any lesson from our past, the possibility of bad luck should be one. It isn't just injuries. We get PED suspensions, inexplicably timed transfers...**** happens.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

Barcello/Hazzard aren't coming onto the floor (barring injuries) if it's a close game, so why worry about the third option in blowouts/cleanup minutes? This only makes sense if Miller doesn't trust Williams' is not injury prone.

If we should take any lesson from our past, the possibility of bad luck should be one. It isn't just injuries. We get PED suspensions, inexplicably timed transfers...**** happens.

Exactly right. We could have players 1-12 all 5* players but by March we will probably only have 5 available players who aren't suspended, injured, deathly ill, etc.

We are who we are.

Alieberman wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

Barcello/Hazzard aren't coming onto the floor (barring injuries) if it's a close game, so why worry about the third option in blowouts/cleanup minutes? This only makes sense if Miller doesn't trust Williams' is not injury prone.

If we should take any lesson from our past, the possibility of bad luck should be one. It isn't just injuries. We get PED suspensions, inexplicably timed transfers...**** happens.

Exactly right. We could have players 1-12 all 5* players but by March we will probably only have 5 available players who aren't suspended, injured, deathly ill, etc.

We are who we are.

We do what we do. Break lisfrancs in what should be national championship seasons and have numerous performance enhancing FBI related distractions.

ChooChooCat wrote:

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

Barcello/Hazzard aren't coming onto the floor (barring injuries) if it's a close game, so why worry about the third option in blowouts/cleanup minutes? This only makes sense if Miller doesn't trust Williams' is not injury prone.

That may be it or ultimately this gif represents what Miller is planning to do via competition.

Not a good idea if we want a cohesive team chemistry....and I really hope it doesn't mean DD leaves. Fine with Randolph and Smith, but really want DD to stay, primarily due to his impact in 2020.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

NYCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I don't disagree, but a third option behind the starters is good. We do have that in Barcello, which is why I think Hazzard would be a replacement.

Barcello/Hazzard aren't coming onto the floor (barring injuries) if it's a close game, so why worry about the third option in blowouts/cleanup minutes? This only makes sense if Miller doesn't trust Williams' is not injury prone.

If we should take any lesson from our past, the possibility of bad luck should be one. It isn't just injuries. We get PED suspensions, inexplicably timed transfers...**** happens.

But he's pushing out other players like Doutrieve/Randolph who at least have size to play a couple positions. Hazzard can only play PG, here's no room for a third option 5'10 pg to play clean up minutes.

There's literally no room for Jordan Brown unless Smith (or someone else) doesn't return and opens up the lone scholarship spot

1. Mannion
2. Green
3. Nnaji
4. Armstrong
5. Koloko
6. Williams
7. Jeter
8. Lee
9. Gettings
10. Randolph
11. Doutrieve
12. Barcello
13. Smith -- hopefully Brown

But Choo says we're adding a post player (Brown or someone else) and at least 2 non post players. Where the hell is the room. If Barcello, Doutrieve & Randolph all bounce well that solves it, but is the team really better? Equal? If it's not dramatically better why go through all this roster turnover and make seniors learn the packline?

Miller's rotation will be only 7-8 like always, there's not enough mins in the backcourt to give Randolph, Doutrieve, Williams

Starters:
Mannion 30+mpg
Williams 28-30+mpg
Green 30+mpg
Nnaji 25mpg
Jeter 27mpg

Rotation players:
Randolph 27mpg
Lee 22+mpg
Gettings 22+mpg

fringe rotation:
Doutrieve 15mpg<

NYCat wrote:
But Choo says we're adding a post player (Brown or someone else) and at least 2 non post players. Where the hell is the room. If Barcello, Doutrieve & Randolph all bounce well that solves it, but is the team really better? Equal? If it's not dramatically better why go through all this roster turnover and make seniors learn the packline?

To be clear I said we're going to add a post player, probably Hazzard, and Miller will try for one more. I'm not convinced Miller can land that third guy, but we'll see.

Ultimately I feel that Miller wants Brandon Williams knee insurance and Hazzard who is a family legacy is an easy pick for that. Miller needs Chase Jeter insurance and even if he didn't Jordan Brown is a no brainer to add. As far as the third guy goes I dunno, but the guy he's pursuing for that spot is an excellent 3 point shooter, so maybe he feels he needs more shooting?

Could not agree more NYC.

CSM is going all in for next year, damn the future (his or someone else's?)

2020 Roster
Williams
Barcello
Armstrong
Lee
Koloko
hopefully Brown

with a likely recruiting group mostly in the 4* variety and/or more Grad Transfers.

I would think a roster of...
Williams
Barcello
Doutrive
Randolph
Armstrong
Koloko
Brown

... would look a lot better and have a chance to compete.

ChooChooCat wrote:

NYCat wrote:
But Choo says we're adding a post player (Brown or someone else) and at least 2 non post players. Where the hell is the room. If Barcello, Doutrieve & Randolph all bounce well that solves it, but is the team really better? Equal? If it's not dramatically better why go through all this roster turnover and make seniors learn the packline?

To be clear I said we're going to add a post player, probably Hazzard, and Miller will try for one more. I'm not convinced Miller can land that third guy, but we'll see.

Ultimately I feel that Miller wants Brandon Williams knee insurance and Hazzard who is a family legacy is an easy pick for that. Miller needs Chase Jeter insurance and even if he didn't Jordan Brown is a no brainer to add. As far as the third guy goes I dunno, but the guy he's pursuing for that spot is an excellent 3 point shooter, so maybe he feels he needs more shooting?

So the previous thought that Smith, Randolph, and DD could all come back now has no chance of happening, and at most one of them will come back? Damn. Please be Devonaire.

ChooChooCat wrote:Looks like Max Hazzard, Jacob's brother, is visiting next week.

Seen him play, he is short but well built, very quick, and looks to be a strong leader too

Nice shot too

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

NYCat wrote:
But Choo says we're adding a post player (Brown or someone else) and at least 2 non post players. Where the hell is the room. If Barcello, Doutrieve & Randolph all bounce well that solves it, but is the team really better? Equal? If it's not dramatically better why go through all this roster turnover and make seniors learn the packline?

To be clear I said we're going to add a post player, probably Hazzard, and Miller will try for one more. I'm not convinced Miller can land that third guy, but we'll see.

Ultimately I feel that Miller wants Brandon Williams knee insurance and Hazzard who is a family legacy is an easy pick for that. Miller needs Chase Jeter insurance and even if he didn't Jordan Brown is a no brainer to add. As far as the third guy goes I dunno, but the guy he's pursuing for that spot is an excellent 3 point shooter, so maybe he feels he needs more shooting?

So the previous thought that Smith, Randolph, and DD could all come back now has no chance of happening, and at most one of them will come back? Damn. Please be Devonaire.

I have no idea who will be nudged out, but there will be guys nudged out. Hard money on Smith being the first guy nudged and I'm unsure of who would be 2nd.

Honestly in my completely hypothetical world it goes like this:

Barcello for Hazzard
Smith for Brown or another post
Randolph for the third guy if it happens

ChooChooCat wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

NYCat wrote:
But Choo says we're adding a post player (Brown or someone else) and at least 2 non post players. Where the hell is the room. If Barcello, Doutrieve & Randolph all bounce well that solves it, but is the team really better? Equal? If it's not dramatically better why go through all this roster turnover and make seniors learn the packline?

To be clear I said we're going to add a post player, probably Hazzard, and Miller will try for one more. I'm not convinced Miller can land that third guy, but we'll see.

Ultimately I feel that Miller wants Brandon Williams knee insurance and Hazzard who is a family legacy is an easy pick for that. Miller needs Chase Jeter insurance and even if he didn't Jordan Brown is a no brainer to add. As far as the third guy goes I dunno, but the guy he's pursuing for that spot is an excellent 3 point shooter, so maybe he feels he needs more shooting?

So the previous thought that Smith, Randolph, and DD could all come back now has no chance of happening, and at most one of them will come back? Damn. Please be Devonaire.

I have no idea who will be nudged out, but there will be guys nudged out. Hard money on Smith being the first guy nudged and I'm unsure of who would be 2nd.

Honestly in my completely hypothetical world it goes like this:

Barcello for Hazzard
Smith for Brown or another post
Randolph for the third guy if it happens

That would be ideal. Seems like Barcello wants to stay so that may be tough to make happen. I'm perfectly fine going Randolph for Hazzard and Smith for Brown and calling it a day though.

ChooChooCat wrote: Barcello for Hazzard
Smith for Brown or another post

If it works out this way, I'd be fine with it. Barcello never sees the court as is, Hazzard would be a better clean up PG/third option in case of injury. Brown is a no doubter and Smith can transfer and play immediately and leave a spot open for Brown.

ChooChooCat wrote:Randolph for the third guy if it happens

Can't imagine there's a better option in the transfer portal than Randolph. Randolph is a perfect scoring 6th man who gets starter-esque minutes, hopefully year 3 clicks for him defensively.

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

NYCat wrote:
But Choo says we're adding a post player (Brown or someone else) and at least 2 non post players. Where the hell is the room. If Barcello, Doutrieve & Randolph all bounce well that solves it, but is the team really better? Equal? If it's not dramatically better why go through all this roster turnover and make seniors learn the packline?

To be clear I said we're going to add a post player, probably Hazzard, and Miller will try for one more. I'm not convinced Miller can land that third guy, but we'll see.

Ultimately I feel that Miller wants Brandon Williams knee insurance and Hazzard who is a family legacy is an easy pick for that. Miller needs Chase Jeter insurance and even if he didn't Jordan Brown is a no brainer to add. As far as the third guy goes I dunno, but the guy he's pursuing for that spot is an excellent 3 point shooter, so maybe he feels he needs more shooting?

So the previous thought that Smith, Randolph, and DD could all come back now has no chance of happening, and at most one of them will come back? Damn. Please be Devonaire.

I have no idea who will be nudged out, but there will be guys nudged out. Hard money on Smith being the first guy nudged and I'm unsure of who would be 2nd.

Honestly in my completely hypothetical world it goes like this:

Barcello for Hazzard
Smith for Brown or another post
Randolph for the third guy if it happens

That would be ideal. Seems like Barcello wants to stay so that may be tough to make happen. I'm perfectly fine going Randolph for Hazzard and Smith for Brown and calling it a day though.

Arizona has had other guys that wanted to stay under Sean Miller that ended up "not staying." I'm not saying he'd push Barcello out (because I don't know), but man it makes a whole world of sense if you're bringing in Hazzard.

Good point Choo. Just feels to me like we shouldn't have 13 guys on the team that all think they are going to be playing real minutes....I think there's value in having a couple guys like Barcello that are happy in their situation, can play a few minutes in a pinch but that aren't in the rotation, etc. Just my opinion though. Seems very clear that Miller is absolutely intent on taking no chances this next year, which I get I guess. Just hope he doesn't over-do it.

NYCat wrote:I don't think Miller realizes he only plays 7 or 8 players over the course of one season. Why is he worrying about filling scrub minutes with outside players.

Because injuries happen and sometimes guys aren't as good as we expect them to be based on recruiting ranking.

ChooChooCat wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:

ChooChooCat wrote:

NYCat wrote:
But Choo says we're adding a post player (Brown or someone else) and at least 2 non post players. Where the hell is the room. If Barcello, Doutrieve & Randolph all bounce well that solves it, but is the team really better? Equal? If it's not dramatically better why go through all this roster turnover and make seniors learn the packline?

To be clear I said we're going to add a post player, probably Hazzard, and Miller will try for one more. I'm not convinced Miller can land that third guy, but we'll see.

Ultimately I feel that Miller wants Brandon Williams knee insurance and Hazzard who is a family legacy is an easy pick for that. Miller needs Chase Jeter insurance and even if he didn't Jordan Brown is a no brainer to add. As far as the third guy goes I dunno, but the guy he's pursuing for that spot is an excellent 3 point shooter, so maybe he feels he needs more shooting?

So the previous thought that Smith, Randolph, and DD could all come back now has no chance of happening, and at most one of them will come back? Damn. Please be Devonaire.

I have no idea who will be nudged out, but there will be guys nudged out. Hard money on Smith being the first guy nudged and I'm unsure of who would be 2nd.

Honestly in my completely hypothetical world it goes like this:

Barcello for Hazzard
Smith for Brown or another post
Randolph for the third guy if it happens

The Hazzard/Barcello thing is because they're so similar. Why would we get a grad transfer that plays just like a current player unless...

I like Barcello, but I'm not sure that he isn't better off with a mutual split here. Smith for Brown would be a great roster move. What I'm not sure about with AB is if things ever change for him. If it isn't Hazzard taking his spot this year, who is it next year?

Beachcat97 wrote:I know JB was highly rated out of HS, but for those who've seen him play, are there any players you'd compare him to? College or pro?

he reminds me of dusan tbh. a nonathletic, nonexplosive, low post scorer. tho he is skinnier and a little more mobile.

goslingswagg wrote:I'm perfectly fine going Randolph for Hazzard and Smith for Brown and calling it a day though.

but why?
dude is 5'10, shot 41FG%, and only averaged 2 APG. In the Big West. I don't see what his value would be.

SunnyAZ wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:I'm perfectly fine going Randolph for Hazzard and Smith for Brown and calling it a day though.

but why?
dude is 5'10, shot 41FG%, and only averaged 2 APG. In the Big West. I don't see what his value would be.

3's.

SunnyAZ wrote:

goslingswagg wrote:I'm perfectly fine going Randolph for Hazzard and Smith for Brown and calling it a day though.

but why?
dude is 5'10, shot 41FG%, and only averaged 2 APG. In the Big West. I don't see what his value would be.

Have you looked at Randolph’s stats from this year?

Nico and Green taking on Team USA at the Nike Hoop Summit on ESPN2 RN. Nico opens up with two easy layups and an assist for a 7-0 lead.

goslingswagg wrote: Have you looked at Randolph’s stats from this year?

Yeah at least he has potential and isn't 5'10. Also he played against yeams that i actually have heard of. All these transfers have a significant drop in numbers, and for him there isn't far to drop lol.

Nico balling out early. 7 points and two assists in 3 minutes.