Bear Down Wildcats

BigSkyCatinMT wrote:

Bangkok Wildcat wrote:

BigSkyCatinMT wrote:Without gushing, the Finn is a very special player. That is all.

Go ahead and gush...I am! What a STUD!!!

OK, gush I will! reminds me of Kaminsky, but much younger. All over the court. Special player.

You had me until you said Kaminsky! Ouch, that name causes me serious pain.....still hurts....but, yes, you are right....possibly bigger / stronger than Kaminsky? Probably as a Frosh to Frosh comparison!

Can you imagine having Lauri for 4 years???

Markkanen is way better than Kaminsky, especially comparing them as freshmen. Kaminsky didn't even start to get major minutes until his junior year while Lauri is easily one of the twenty best players in all of college basketball in just the second week of his first season.

Chicat wrote:Markkanen is way better than Kaminsky, especially comparing them as freshmen. Kaminsky didn't even start to get major minutes until his junior year while Lauri is easily one of the twenty best players in all of college basketball in just the second week of his first season.

Yeah, it's not a meaningful comparison talent-wise. But I do hope we'll get a deep tourney draw against a very good team that doesn't have a 4 or 5 who can guard him.

Main Event wrote:This kids a top 5 pick

Definitely is making a strong case early on. Took my buddy to the game last night, his first time seeing him play. I gave him advanced warning and his jaw was still on the floor. Someone already said it in another thread so I'm just gonna be an echo here, but every time he shoots I think it's going in. Like Chappelle in the Prince skit, "good" right as he is releasing. That spurt he had that made things a little more comfortable when they got it down to 4. That was a concerted team effort to ride his back when they were struggling. Thing is, they should be doing that the entire game. Force them to throw the house at him and open up looks for everyone else. If this team figures that out, hes a consistent 20 plus guy and will give us multiple 30 plus games.

Here is the bottom line: 26 points on 11 shots. Let that sink in. 8-11, 1-3 3pt (an off night for him from deep lol), 9-9 FT. A freshman playing his second regular season game. Not too many freshmen are going to do that type of stuff, especially ones who favor playing on the perimeter, doesn't matter if it's 2016 or 1998. He's going to get some match ups wherein things aren't going to come as easy, but he needs them to build for March. Special player.

Lauri could be the best player to ever suit up for Arizona.

Olsondogg wrote:Lauri could be the best player to ever suit up for Arizona.

Sean Elliot is laughing at you

whatisee wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:Lauri could be the best player to ever suit up for Arizona.

Sean Elliot is laughing at you

He shouldn't be...especially if Lauri stayed four years...

At least so far, Markkanen does look like the most talented player ever to play in an Arizona uniform. The only thing he's shown he can't do is shut down smaller combo-forwards and small forwards who are themselves lottery picks. Otherwise, he looks like he can guard just about anyone. More importantly, he's the most polished, athletic, and powerful player on offense that I've ever seen from a brand-new Arizona freshman.

Did Sean Elliot play the 2, 3, 4 and 5?

Lauri looked great, definitely still working on staying in front of smaller guys on the perimeter and holding his ground against heavier guys in the paint. I think that's just mental toughness that comes with the game (now that he's playing outside of Europe and being asked to guard twos and threes off the perimeter).

Lauri + PJC in the pick and roll is ridiculous though. Those two went to fucking work last night and brought the team back.

It's great to see - hopefully that can open up space for Dusan and Chance down low and for Kobi and Rawle on the wings.

Merkin wrote:Secret is out.

Not a power forward.

I remember arguing with Beachcat and I think also Choochoo about whether he would start at the 4.

I think it's still questionable whether he's an instant starter...in the NBA next year. Kid is next in the line of Sean Miller lottery picks.

Merkin wrote:Did Sean Elliot play the 2, 3, 4 and 5?

Played the 1, 2, 3. Senior year, he was the press buster. They just gave him the ball and let him dribble up. Made up for relatively weak guards (Kerr and McMillan departed). He could guard all but 5s.

LM won't play four years, so this is moot. But he is a special talent.

Lauri = Dirk. Suns need to lose every damn game the rest of the year for this guy. Bledsoe, Booker, Warren, Lauri, Len would be an amazing young core to build around. I might actually like the NBA again.

The fact that Miller trusts a 7 foot freshman to inbound the ball when the other team is putting on a serious full court press says a lot. This guy literally does do it all.

The Finnisher is a match up nightmare. He is mature beyond his years. I still think we struggle and give up runs when he and Ristic are in there with the smaller line up. In fact I think the two 17-4 runs that MSU had and the 17-0 run last night started with this line up on the floor.

Still this kid is special as Miller indicated. He is a certain lottery pick in my eye. Just a bummer we only get to see these special kids for one year. Could you imagine this team if he was here next year with Ayton and he played the 4, OMG

azcat49 wrote:The Finnisher is a match up nightmare. He is mature beyond his years. I still think we struggle and give up runs when he and Ristic are in there with the smaller line up. In fact I think the two 17-4 runs that MSU had and the 17-0 run last night started with this line up on the floor.

Still this kid is special as Miller indicated. He is a certain lottery pick in my eye. Just a bummer we only get to see these special kids for one year. Could you imagine this team if he was here next year with Ayton and he played the 4, OMG

Guys, Ivan Rabb came back. So this means Lauri is coming back. It's science.

Wooden watch btw.

dcZONAfan wrote: Guys, Ivan Rabb came back. So this means Lauri is coming back. It's science.

No chance.

Anyway, Rabb isn't in the same universe with Markkanen.

In terms of the best talent to ever put on an Arizona uniform, I need a larger sample size and some games against some better competition before I will officially crown him that. There are going to be games where he looks human. But gun to my head, make a decision right now, I would agree with that. I do think he is the most special player who has ever put on our uniform though. If you think about it, he may be one of, if not the most special players in the country this year. Josh Jackson is a special talent, but there are multiple Josh Jackson's or Josh Jackson lights in the NBA right now. How many 7 footers have a stroke that is better than just about any other player in his age bracket, wings included? And then add the mobility/athleticism and his frame to that mix? I mean how good is this kid really going to be? His shot is going to get better. His release is going to get quicker. He is going to improve in the two man game. He is going to learn how to play off his shot and fully tap into his non-shooting gifts and became even more dynamic offensively. His D is going to improve. And it is apparent this kid wants it and is going to have the work ethic to get to where he wants to be, it shows with how much muscle he has added to his once super-skinny frame. It is scary how good Lauri can be and I think he is going to get there.

Being 100 percent honest, I'm not sure I would trade him for any other freshman right now. And you can go back to the last few pages and see how high my expectations were on this kid before we even saw him suit up. If Kansas said, we will swap Josh Jackson for Lauri, I would really need to take a long time to weigh that trade. Gun to my head, we keep him. As bad/average as our PG situation is here, think about it. Swap him for one of the two or three great frosh PGs playing right now. Do you like that team, minus Trier, or what we have right now, minus Trier, better?

Draft stock: How are top NBA prospects looking?

Stock: Hot

Lauri Markkanen, F, Fr., Arizona

A Finland native, Markkanen has been a small mystery to some after foregoing basketball at the highest level to come to Arizona. He has the NBA body and a lethal outside jumper. He just needs to continue to get more comfortable on the court.

Markkanen was solid against Michigan State (13 points and six rebounds) and dominant against CSU Bakersfield (26 points and 8 rebounds). He has a lot to work on, but the raw talent is there.

http://insider.espn.com/nba/insider/sto ... ckson-more" target="_blank

rgdeuce wrote:In terms of the best talent to ever put on an Arizona uniform, I need a larger sample size and some games against some better competition before I will officially crown him that. There are going to be games where he looks human. But gun to my head, make a decision right now, I would agree with that. I do think he is the most special player who has ever put on our uniform though. If you think about it, he may be one of, if not the most special players in the country this year. Josh Jackson is a special talent, but there are multiple Josh Jackson's or Josh Jackson lights in the NBA right now. How many 7 footers have a stroke that is better than just about any other player in his age bracket, wings included? And then add the mobility/athleticism and his frame to that mix? I mean how good is this kid really going to be? His shot is going to get better. His release is going to get quicker. He is going to improve in the two man game. He is going to learn how to play off his shot and fully tap into his non-shooting gifts and became even more dynamic offensively. His D is going to improve. And it is apparent this kid wants it and is going to have the work ethic to get to where he wants to be, it shows with how much muscle he has added to his once super-skinny frame. It is scary how good Lauri can be and I think he is going to get there.

Being 100 percent honest, I'm not sure I would trade him for any other freshman right now. And you can go back to the last few pages and see how high my expectations were on this kid before we even saw him suit up. If Kansas said, we will swap Josh Jackson for Lauri, I would really need to take a long time to weigh that trade. Gun to my head, we keep him. As bad/average as our PG situation is here, think about it. Swap him for one of the two or three great frosh PGs playing right now. Do you like that team, minus Trier, or what we have right now, minus Trier, better?

It depends on how you measure best talent. If you look at physical talent, we have never seen anything like Aaron Gordon and it will be a while (if ever) until we do. AG was a 6'8 guy with otherworldly speed, agility and bounce. The dunk contest last year made it clear that even in the NBA, AG's athletic talent is freakish. He was just young and is still developing the skill to match his physical tools.

In terms of whole package talent, I'm not sure Lauri matches Bibby. Bibby was a better defender than Lauri will be. Plus, there has to be some inherent edge for being the starting PG for a national championship team. If Lauri matches the NC...well, I'll be so happy I won't care to discuss.

In terms of basketball skill and IQ, I could see Lauri being the most talented AZ player ever. Every shot he takes looks like it's going in, and I'm surprised when it doesn't. He has great hands, can handle and is a tremendous passer for a big guy. He needs to be more physical in establishing position, but in terms of post moves and finishing, that's also top level. Even a guy like Bibby, we've never had anyone this polished offensively as a freshman.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

rgdeuce wrote:In terms of the best talent to ever put on an Arizona uniform, I need a larger sample size and some games against some better competition before I will officially crown him that. There are going to be games where he looks human. But gun to my head, make a decision right now, I would agree with that. I do think he is the most special player who has ever put on our uniform though. If you think about it, he may be one of, if not the most special players in the country this year. Josh Jackson is a special talent, but there are multiple Josh Jackson's or Josh Jackson lights in the NBA right now. How many 7 footers have a stroke that is better than just about any other player in his age bracket, wings included? And then add the mobility/athleticism and his frame to that mix? I mean how good is this kid really going to be? His shot is going to get better. His release is going to get quicker. He is going to improve in the two man game. He is going to learn how to play off his shot and fully tap into his non-shooting gifts and became even more dynamic offensively. His D is going to improve. And it is apparent this kid wants it and is going to have the work ethic to get to where he wants to be, it shows with how much muscle he has added to his once super-skinny frame. It is scary how good Lauri can be and I think he is going to get there.

Being 100 percent honest, I'm not sure I would trade him for any other freshman right now. And you can go back to the last few pages and see how high my expectations were on this kid before we even saw him suit up. If Kansas said, we will swap Josh Jackson for Lauri, I would really need to take a long time to weigh that trade. Gun to my head, we keep him. As bad/average as our PG situation is here, think about it. Swap him for one of the two or three great frosh PGs playing right now. Do you like that team, minus Trier, or what we have right now, minus Trier, better?

It depends on how you measure best talent. If you look at physical talent, we have never seen anything like Aaron Gordon and it will be a while (if ever) until we do. AG was a 6'8 guy with otherworldly speed, agility and bounce. The dunk contest last year made it clear that even in the NBA, AG's athletic talent is freakish. He was just young and is still developing the skill to match his physical tools.

In terms of whole package talent, I'm not sure Lauri matches Bibby. Bibby was a better defender than Lauri will be. Plus, there has to be some inherent edge for being the starting PG for a national championship team. If Lauri matches the NC...well, I'll be so happy I won't care to discuss.

In terms of basketball skill and IQ, I could see Lauri being the most talented AZ player ever. Every shot he takes looks like it's going in, and I'm surprised when it doesn't. He has great hands, can handle and is a tremendous passer for a big guy. He needs to be more physical in establishing position, but in terms of post moves and finishing, that's also top level. Even a guy like Bibby, we've never had anyone this polished offensively as a freshman.

Yes, there are several ways one can define talent. If we are talking just pure talent that translates on the court, a well-polished product, clearly Mike Bibby takes the cake. I dont think many would argue that if we are talking in that manner, its Elliott and him. My definition factors in long-term professional potential and rarity. Bibby was an outstanding freshman, in my opinion the 2nd best basketball player in the country as a sophomore (Pierce), the 2nd pick in the draft, and had an excellent pro career and maybe the best NBA player in recent NBA history to never make an all star team. Pro career though, it looks like LM has the "it" that can give him the better pro career than Bibby and be the best professional who ever wore an Arizona jersey. Like I said above, you have a 7 footer with a Dennis Scott stroke, who has the physical attributes of guys several inches shorter, man. He will work on his back to the basket game in the league and become even deadlier. The kid just has the knack for scoring and has the tools to maybe someday be a 7 footer who can kill you three ways on offense.

I dont want to gas myself up here, but would you really be surprised if at age 25 Lauri was a 25+ ppg guy in the league? Not a "don't get ahead of yourself" answer, would it surprise you? He may not be a Dirk Nowitzki or a Kevin Garnett, but he has that "special" about him like those guys did. Dirk may have the most beautiful shot in the world, but who is to say that Lauri couldn't come close and learn how to get his shot off like Dirk does and still have it not touch rim? And can Dirk move or finish like Lauri? KG obviously did everything at a high level and could be argued as a top 20 all time guy, so I why I wont even go there. So yea, I am factoring all that stuff into my definition. You wont be hard pressed to find Mike Bibbys in the league. Not a perfect mold, maybe you give some on the shot and awareness for raw explosiveness. But how many Dirks are there? How many 7 footers that can kill you three ways? That requires him to fill into that, but I think it is very possible he does.

Main Event wrote:Draft stock: How are top NBA prospects looking?

Stock: Hot

Lauri Markkanen, F, Fr., Arizona

A Finland native, Markkanen has been a small mystery to some after foregoing basketball at the highest level to come to Arizona. He has the NBA body and a lethal outside jumper. He just needs to continue to get more comfortable on the court.

Markkanen was solid against Michigan State (13 points and six rebounds) and dominant against CSU Bakersfield (26 points and 8 rebounds). He has a lot to work on, but the raw talent is there.

http://insider.espn.com/nba/insider/sto ... ckson-more" target="_blank

There were a good amount of scouts in Hawaii. There will be even more in Vegas.

Him and Kobi quickly becoming my favorite players

I think he'll wind up being the best player in the Miller era

Main Event wrote:I think he'll wind up being the best player in the Miller era

Wait until DeAndre Ayton shows up!

But don't forget Derrick Williams was a #2 pick, and Aaron Gordon #4.

Don't think LM will go that high.

Merkin wrote:

Main Event wrote:I think he'll wind up being the best player in the Miller era

Wait until DeAndre Ayton shows up!

But don't forget Derrick Williams was a #2 pick, and Aaron Gordon #4.

Don't think LM will go that high.

Not with JJ, Fultz, Giles, and Fox in the draft. But who knows? Some people might look at LM and see a slightly shorter Porzingis.

splitsecond wrote:Lauri = Dirk. Suns need to lose every damn game the rest of the year for this guy. Bledsoe, Booker, Warren, Lauri, Len would be an amazing young core to build around. I might actually like the NBA again.

Don MacLean was on PMS and thinks he'll be the top pick in the draft

I agree with Sean Miller. Got to get Lauri the ball more. He went long stretches tonight where he didn't touch the ball and that should not happen.

The kid can flat out play.

Couple of others were saying top pick on twitter. Jay Bilas now bunching him up w Josh jackson and a couple of the other top freshman.

Yeah Chicat. Lauri could easily be averaging 26 plus a game right now. Its like they forget about him and then they have an "oh yeah" moment and he drops 8 points in two minutes.

Lauri is going to get the most defensive attention this year by opponents...but he's insanely hard to guard and hard to find many teams that have someone that can guard him. he should be getting 20 touches a game.

Merkin wrote:Did Sean Elliot play the 2, 3, 4 and 5?

I believe he played at times the 1,2,3,4,5

So yeah

Lauri is really really really good. Don't get me wrong.

Also, when/if AT returns, we then have another player on the floor that defenses have to respect, rather than giving more attention to LM. It's hard to win a league title or advance deep in the tourney with only a single star offensive player. And if KS and RA are getting to be more dependable with the ball by January, against respectable competition, it'll help LM's game that much more. But AT is the key. An AT/LM combo could be really dangerous come tourney time.

imagine if we had tferg on the perimeter, man that would space things out and give lauri some freedom. agree that getting 'zo back will make a world of difference but kobi and rawle will be fine taking some of the heat off of LM. lauri being lauri also creates nice opportunities for PJC and kadeem on the give and go. we have a sufficient offensive arsenal. with the exception of the occasional lapse into aau ball mode, it's great to see an improvement in on- and off-ball movement over just a few games.

Just play defense and exploit the mismatches and we can be all world. LM was pretty patient last night while a few others were impatient at times.

So happy we gave up TJ Leaf for Lauri... Sean knows...

I don't really get the hype RE: Josh Jackson. Granted it's a small sample size with his foul trouble and so few games played, but as far as the NBA is concerned what exactly makes him so special. I can see that he's a freak athlete, excellent ball handler and creative passer but I don't think that jump shot of his is ever going to be above average. His profile reminds me of RHJ in a way and while we all know that Rondae was drafted too low and that Jackson is likely a better NBA prospect I don't think that there is that big of a difference. Lauri is a better NBA prospect than Jackson IMO.

Fulz is the one freshman I'd consider swapping Lauri for.

https://youtu.be/IZ6ZIG28OPY" target="_blank

Everyone's noticing.

I love how the bench already knows it's going in anytime he throws one up lol

RaisingArizona wrote:I don't really get the hype RE: Josh Jackson. Granted it's a small sample size with his foul trouble and so few games played, but as far as the NBA is concerned what exactly makes him so special. I can see that he's a freak athlete, excellent ball handler and creative passer but I don't think that jump shot of his is ever going to be above average. His profile reminds me of RHJ in a way and while we all know that Rondae was drafted too low and that Jackson is likely a better NBA prospect I don't think that there is that big of a difference. Lauri is a better NBA prospect than Jackson IMO.

Fulz is the one freshman I'd consider swapping Lauri for.

It's been 3 games. And he doesn't need to be the man on that team. Snap judgement much?

The competition hasn't been top notch yet, but that really doesn't matter when you see Lauri drive right baseline and step back for a 17 foot jump shot, or (around the 6:30 left in 2nd half mark) drive left and drop step into a spin move and finish. At 7 ft, those shots are going to be there no matter the competition...just the fact that he can execute those maneuvers at all at his size is remarkable.

His match up with Chris Bouche from Oregon will be fun to watch.

Can't wait to see him and Trier on the floor at the same time and what the might mean for our offensive output

Bangkok Wildcat wrote:

BigSkyCatinMT wrote:

Bangkok Wildcat wrote:

BigSkyCatinMT wrote:Without gushing, the Finn is a very special player. That is all.

Go ahead and gush...I am! What a STUD!!!

OK, gush I will! reminds me of Kaminsky, but much younger. All over the court. Special player.

You had me until you said Kaminsky! Ouch, that name causes me serious pain.....still hurts....but, yes, you are right....possibly bigger / stronger than Kaminsky? Probably as a Frosh to Frosh comparison!

Can you imagine having Lauri for 4 years???

If I recall correctly, Kaminsky did not start until his junior year. Frosh Lauri vs Kaminsky as a senior may be in the ballpark.

azcat49 wrote:Just play defense and exploit the mission matches and we can be all world. LM was pretty patient last night while a few others were impatient at times.

Explain mission matches to der alte.

He really is one of the best offensive frosh I've ever seen.

His ceiling is Dirk in the NBA and his floor might be Bargniani who went #1 overall (albeit it in a historically weak draft).

DiehardDave37 wrote:

azcat49 wrote:Just play defense and exploit the mission matches and we can be all world. LM was pretty patient last night while a few others were impatient at times.

Explain mission matches to der alte.

Meant mismatches. Damn auto correct. Good to hear from you again Dave