'17/18 Polls

btfd16 · Post by **btfd16** » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:09 am

TatetheGreat wrote:It's crazy that TCU is #15 without having played a single road game. They are 10-0 against cupcakes and play 0-11 Texas Southern tonight, again at home.

They're undefeated so don't really mind it. It will play itself out. That is pretty crazy though they don't have a true road game until their 14th game.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:14 am

btfd16 wrote:
TatetheGreat wrote:It's crazy that TCU is #15 without having played a single road game. They are 10-0 against cupcakes and play 0-11 Texas Southern tonight, again at home.
They're undefeated so don't really mind it. It will play itself out. That is pretty crazy though they don't have a true road game until their 14th game.

KU was true road

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:21 am

PHXCATS wrote:
btfd16 wrote:
TatetheGreat wrote:It's crazy that TCU is #15 without having played a single road game. They are 10-0 against cupcakes and play 0-11 Texas Southern tonight, again at home.
They're undefeated so don't really mind it. It will play itself out. That is pretty crazy though they don't have a true road game until their 14th game.
KU was true road

He's talking about TCU.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:22 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
PHXCATS wrote:
btfd16 wrote:
TatetheGreat wrote:It's crazy that TCU is #15 without having played a single road game. They are 10-0 against cupcakes and play 0-11 Texas Southern tonight, again at home.
They're undefeated so don't really mind it. It will play itself out. That is pretty crazy though they don't have a true road game until their 14th game.
KU was true road
He's talking about TCU.

My bad. Read it wrong

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Mon Dec 25, 2017 5:09 am

College basketball rankings: Kentucky, Miami tumble after losing to unranked teams
UK and Miami have combined for zero top-35 KenPom wins

by Gary Parrish @GaryParrishCBS 19h ago • 1 min read

16
Arizona The Wildcats have won seven straight games since losing three straight in the Battle 4 Atlantis. Rawle Alkins is averaging 16.0 points per game since returning from injury. 2 10-3

https://www.cbssports.com/college-baske ... ked-teams/" target="_blank

Data through games of Saturday, December 23
https://kenpom.com/" target="_blank

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Mon Dec 25, 2017 11:06 am

1. Villanova
2. Michigan State
3. Asu
4. Duke
5. Texas a&m
6. Xavier
7. West Virginia
8. Wichita State
9. Virginia
10. TCU

17. Arizona

https://collegebasketball.ap.org/poll" target="_blank

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:25 pm

I wanna take their seed

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:31 pm

CalStateTempe wrote:I wanna take their seed

Sorry. I know I'm an immature child.

scumdevils86 · Post by **scumdevils86** » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:36 pm

Heyoo

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:04 am

16. Arizona The Wildcats have won eight straight games since losing three straight in the Battle 4 Atlantis. The streak includes victories over Arizona State and Texas A&M.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-baske ... -new-no-1/" target="_blank

The Bahama affect

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:10 am

HiCat wrote:16. Arizona The Wildcats have won eight straight games since losing three straight in the Battle 4 Atlantis. The streak includes victories over Arizona State and Texas A&M.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-baske ... -new-no-1/" target="_blank

The Bahama affect

Hahaha, preseason we were so talented that we were top 5 everywhere but one bad pre-conference season tourney and now we can’t crack the top 15 even with a bunch of good wins under our belt?

FOH

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:17 am

fwiw

(And before anyone asks, I know I’m on an island with Arizona. You can hear my justification for their ranking at the 32:00 mark of the podcast below):

Anyway, here my full Power Rankings:

1. Michigan State, 14-1 (Last Week: No. 2)
2. Villanova, 13-1 (1)
3. Duke, 13-1 (3)
4. Arizona, 11-3 (4)
5. Arizona State, 12-1 (5)
6. Xavier, 13-1 (7)
7. Oklahoma, 11-1 (13)
8. West Virginia, 12-1 (8)
9. Purdue, 13-2 (9)
10. Texas A&M, 11-2 (6)
11. Miami, 12-1 (10)
12. North Carolina, 12-2 (11)
13. Kansas, 11-2 (12)
14. Wichita State, 11-2 (14)
15. Seton Hall, 13-2 (15)
16. Virginia, 12-1 (16)
17. Kentucky, 11-2 (19)
18. Gonzaga, 12-3 (18)
19. TCU, 12-1 (17)
20. Notre Dame, 11-3 (20)
21. Cincinnati, 12-2 (21)
22. Texas Tech, 12-1 (23)
23. Arkansas, 11-2 (25)
24. Tennessee, 9-3 (22)
25. Clemson, 12-1 (NR)

DROPPED: No. 24 Baylor

NEW ADDITIONS: No. 25 Clemson

http://collegebasketball.nbcsports.com/ ... tens-fall/" target="_blank

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 8:12 am

People are so fucking dumb.

Its like they don't watch this games. They just look at numbers and three is greater than two so Arizona must be worse than all these other teams.

Also implies that the nation doesn't think much of ASU if we beat them an only move up one spot. But yet they stay high in the polls?

FML

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:07 am

MountainCat · Post by **MountainCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:14 am

Let me get this straight!

We beat then No. 3 Arizona State and No. now 10 Texas A & M in which ASU beat now No. 15 Kansas and No. 9. Xavier - All of which are all ranked above us.

AND...... ASU moves up one spot to No. 2 ??

Wow, we really showed them.

I guess that's what you get when the posters vote on New Years Eve without looking at ESPN box scores. Total East Coast bias - The Hurley Factor.

I now believe we will beat ASU On their court by 30 points. Maybe then can we move up to No. 10 and ASU drop to No. 3.

MountainCat · Post by **MountainCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:17 am

...... Also - I wonder what Jay Bias has to say about this?? ( Yes I spelled his name correctly)

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:18 am

MountainCat wrote:Let me get this straight!

We beat then No. 3 Arizona State and No. now 10 Texas A & M in which ASU beat now No. 15 Kansas and No. 9. Xavier - All of which are all ranked above us.

AND...... ASU moves up one spot to No. 2 ??

Wow, we really showed them.

I guess that's what you get when the posters vote on New Years Eve without looking at ESPN box scores. Total East Coast bias - The Hurley Factor.

I now believe we will beat ASU On their court by 30 points. Maybe then can we move up to No. 10 and ASU drop to No. 3.

I take it you’re talking about the CBS rankings done by Gary Parrish? I don’t put much stock in those. I doubt Jay Bilas does either. Parrish blows.

I bet the AP rankings look more like Haller’s when they come out.

MountainCat · Post by **MountainCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:29 am

… Yes I know who did the rankings. He also showed Florida State moving up five spots after losing to Duke. What a joke. This guy should be run out of town by the general media.

On another note – I do like Bilas, but even he favors the East Coast when push comes to shove.

It will be interesting when both the ESPN and the Coaches Polls come out later today.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:55 am

Just beat Utah on Thursday. Fuck the polls.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:58 am

Espn

9. Arizona Wildcats
Record: 11-3
Last week: 15

Back in the top 10 for the first time since losing three in a row in the Bahamas, Arizona is still the Pac-12 favorite after beating Arizona State on Saturday night. Rawle Alkins' return to health has been a huge boost, with 20-plus points in two of his first five games back. The Wildcats' defense is also looking better in the past month.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basket ... no-1-while" target="_blank

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:14 am

#1 Michigan State
#2 Duke
#3 Villanova
#4 ASU
#5 Xavier
#6 West Virginia
#7 Oklahoma
#8 Virginia
#9 Wichita State
#10 Kansas
#11 Texas A&M

#14 Arizona

https://collegebasketball.ap.org/poll" target="_blank

scumdevils86 · Post by **scumdevils86** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:18 am

Lol we are never gonna get respect this season after the Bahamas debacle. We could go 31-3 and win 28 in a row and be undefeated in the conference and would still not be in the top 5. Probably be given a low 3 seed. Unreal.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:20 am

RondaeShimmy wrote:#1 Michigan State
#2 Duke
#3 Villanova
#4 ASU
#5 Xavier
#6 West Virginia
#7 Oklahoma
#8 Virginia
#9 Wichita State
#10 Kansas
#11 Texas A&M

#14 Arizona

https://collegebasketball.ap.org/poll" target="_blank

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:21 am

I don't understand how 3 straight losses in a fictional location has hurt our reputation and perception of the program more than anything

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:26 am

RondaeShimmy wrote:I don't understand how 3 straight losses in a fictional location has hurt our reputation and perception of the program more than anything

I'm enjoying this. It's like Rocky 3, and we're Clubber Lang leading into the first title fight.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:28 am

scumdevils86 wrote:Lol we are never gonna get respect this season after the Bahamas debacle. We could go 31-3 and win 28 in a row and be undefeated in the conference and would still not be in the top 5. Probably be given a low 3 seed. Unreal.

Its such bullshit...I remember recent seasons where Michigan St and Duke had terrible non-con and conference schedules and its "well Izzo/K will have them ready by march, they always do"

We drop three for a talent team still trying to figure out roles and leadership and no such benefit of the doubt is given.

Fuck them.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:31 am

Either ASU is highly valued for their ranking or they aren't.

If deserving, then fine, keep them high, but then Arizona's ranking should jump accordingly.

If now, then Arizona's ranking should only move up slightly with a win, but then ASU's should drop like a stone.

I don't see how it can be Arizona gets a nudge forward AND ASU keeps a high ranking unless there is some severe duke ECB at play.

Additionally, its like the pollsters again are doing simple math to vote "um, well ASU only has one loss, and Arizona has three...we can't have arizona above a 2 loss program, so lets vote them low. Its only fair."

UAEebs86 · Post by **UAEebs86** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:33 am

In the Bahamas, we had no Alkins, and two of the teams we lost to are top 25 in KenPom (Purdue #3, SMU #24).

If we had just beaten the worst team we played down there (NC State KenPom #83), we never would have played those two and may have just lost to 'Nova (KenPom #1) in the championship.

84Cat · Post by **84Cat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:37 am

It's all good. Gives our guys a reason to play with a chip on their shoulders. Us vs the world. Nasty is required

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:38 am

RondaeShimmy wrote:#1 Michigan State
#2 Duke
#3 Villanova
#4 ASU
#5 Xavier
#6 West Virginia
#7 Oklahoma
#8 Virginia
#9 Wichita State
#10 Kansas
#11 Texas A&M

#14 Arizona

https://collegebasketball.ap.org/poll" target="_blank

That’s so cute.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 10:58 am

84Cat wrote:It's all good. Gives our guys a reason to play with a chip on their shoulders. Us vs the world. Nasty is required

Yes this exactly! Savage life! No crying, just keep getting better everyday.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:09 am

Douglas Doughty at the Roanoke Times had us 18th last week and dropped us to 23rd this week.

You can find him at @doughtysports if you’d like to write him a love note.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:16 am

Chicat wrote:Douglas Doughty at the Roanoke Times had us 18th last week and dropped us to 23rd this week.

You can find him at @doughtysports if you’d like to write him a love note.

I would enjoy knowing his reasoning. We went 1-0 and beat an undefeated team ranked #3.

Longhorned · Post by **Longhorned** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:22 pm

Arizona is ranked where they are because they have more losses than any of the top teams in the country. Nobody ranked above Arizona has three losses. There are only two other teams in the top 25 with three losses (#19 Gonzaga and #23 Tennessee).

prh · Post by **prh** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:25 pm

Interestingly enough, Dick Vitale has us at 3 (along with Seth Davis). Not sure how to feel about that. Davis also has Purdue at 8 (they're 13 overall), so he has definitely moved on from the Bahamas. Purdue is undefeated except for that trip.

scumdevils86 · Post by **scumdevils86** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:26 pm

Yea it's like the last 30 years don't matter anymore and we are treated like a mid major because of this 3 losses

Alieberman · Post by **Alieberman** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:29 pm

Longhorned wrote:Arizona is ranked where they are because they have more losses than any of the top teams in the country. Nobody ranked above Arizona has three losses. There are only two other teams in the top 25 with three losses (#19 Gonzaga and #23 Tennessee).

Top level teams are basically being dinged about 3 spots for every loss. We got dinged over 25 spots for 3 straight losses (about 8 spots a loss)

I am actually fine with our ranking except I cannot explain how you could rank Kansas ahead of us.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:38 pm

Longhorned wrote:Arizona is ranked where they are because they have more losses than any of the top teams in the country. Nobody ranked above Arizona has three losses. There are only two other teams in the top 25 with three losses (#19 Gonzaga and #23 Tennessee).

Three losses is generally a pretty decent amount. I think it's mitigating that we lost them in the span of about 48 hours, but 3 is a lot. We had 4 entering the tourney last year and were a 2 seed.

Hopefully we'll be better than our record suggests come March.

SunnyAZ · Post by **SunnyAZ** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:47 pm

It depends how much stock you put in resume vs how someone is playing now. ASU definitely has a better resume, don't think it is particularly close. But obviously people value us because ASU would've dropped further than they did if they didn't.

FreeSpiritCat · Post by **FreeSpiritCat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:02 pm

Alieberman wrote:
Longhorned wrote:Arizona is ranked where they are because they have more losses than any of the top teams in the country. Nobody ranked above Arizona has three losses. There are only two other teams in the top 25 with three losses (#19 Gonzaga and #23 Tennessee).
Top level teams are basically being dinged about 3 spots for every loss. We got dinged over 25 spots for 3 straight losses (about 8 spots a loss)

I am actually fine with our ranking except I cannot explain how you could rank Kansas ahead of us.

This is precisely the way I look at it. I find it humorous that people are angry over the rankings. By gosh stop disrespecting us! My answer is just win and continue to improve. The only rankings that count are the NCAA tourney committee's seedings.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:10 pm

Catintheheat wrote:
Alieberman wrote:
Longhorned wrote:Arizona is ranked where they are because they have more losses than any of the top teams in the country. Nobody ranked above Arizona has three losses. There are only two other teams in the top 25 with three losses (#19 Gonzaga and #23 Tennessee).
Top level teams are basically being dinged about 3 spots for every loss. We got dinged over 25 spots for 3 straight losses (about 8 spots a loss)

I am actually fine with our ranking except I cannot explain how you could rank Kansas ahead of us.
This is precisely the way I look at it. I find it humorous that people are angry over the rankings. By gosh stop disrespecting us! My answer is just win and continue to improve. The only rankings that count are the NCAA tourney committee's seedings.

Rankings do have an effect on seedings though, and therefore they should make sense. ASU only dropping one spot shows that Arizona was a quality opponent. And yet for some reason Arizona doesn’t move up that much and remains four spots behind a team ASU handled easily (Kansas).

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:14 pm

Power polls and media/coaches polls are different things.

Asu has had the better season even with the loss and should be ahead of UA in media/coaches polls.

UA is better right now and should be ahead of power polls

whatisee · Post by **whatisee** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:12 pm

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:20 pm

Alieberman wrote:
Longhorned wrote:Arizona is ranked where they are because they have more losses than any of the top teams in the country. Nobody ranked above Arizona has three losses. There are only two other teams in the top 25 with three losses (#19 Gonzaga and #23 Tennessee).
Top level teams are basically being dinged about 3 spots for every loss. We got dinged over 25 spots for 3 straight losses (about 8 spots a loss)

I am actually fine with our ranking except I cannot explain how you could rank Kansas ahead of us.

More than that, we were like #40 after the tournament or something. Penalized over 10 spots per loss.

Longhorned · Post by **Longhorned** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:31 pm

I don't know, but I wouldn't be surprised if successive losses are weighted more. On the one hand, I'd agree with that practice. On the other hand, three losses in three days in November with a role player out should hardly count as three losses. It was one tailspin that the team learned from and has been flying upward from ever since.

Regardless, polls don't matter in December and January, and I like Arizona's chances against any team anywhere right now.

midnightx · Post by **midnightx** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:48 pm

That is an appalling AP poll. The writers are so aroused by Duke alum Bobby Hurley that they basically give ASU a pass for its first loss. They beat Kansas and shoot up the polls like a slingshot and even receive number one votes, then lose a similar game of magnitude and nothing happens. The irony is that if ASU is so good, and Arizona defeated ASU, Arizona should have shot up the polls like ASU did when they defeated Kansas. Oh well, it is a meaningless, mid-season poll. But it is nice to see your team receive valid consideration — a multi game winning streak with two wins over top ten teams deserves much greater respect, particularly for a program that was ranked number three earlier in the season.

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:26 pm

midnightx wrote:That is an appalling AP poll. The writers are so aroused by Duke alum Bobby Hurley that they basically give ASU a pass for its first loss. They beat Kansas and shoot up the polls like a slingshot and even receive number one votes, then lose a similar game of magnitude and nothing happens. The irony is that if ASU is so good, and Arizona defeated ASU, Arizona should have shot up the polls like ASU did when they defeated Kansas. Oh well, it is a meaningless, mid-season poll. But it is nice to see your team receive valid consideration — a multi game winning streak with two wins over top ten teams deserves much greater respect, particularly for a program that was ranked number three earlier in the season.

If we were ranked #3 and dropped a conference game to a ranked opponent on the road, we'd raise a fit if we dropped out of the top ten. And rightly so. I think ASU is getting a little more respect than they deserve, but maybe by only 3-5 spots in the polls. But in the last several weeks we've beaten A&M, ASU and Alabama(which by all accounts is a top 25 caliber team and will be when the season is over). The voters don't have to have exact opinions on their votes but at least need to be in the same solar system. I don't know how any voter could drop a team that is on a solid win streak and just took down the #3 team in the country. Looney.

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:46 pm

Worried that the weak Pac-12 won’t afford us the liberty of many more losses - just not enough good competition to offset/bolster. We have three more KenPom A-rated games, includingbthis weekend at Utah. Kentucky has a dozen. UNC thirteen.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 4:42 pm

Yeah basically our two games against Utah, and our 3 remaining games against ASU, USC and UCLA are about all we have left to get any kind of quality wins

midnightx · Post by **midnightx** » Mon Jan 01, 2018 5:02 pm

zonagrad wrote:
midnightx wrote:That is an appalling AP poll. The writers are so aroused by Duke alum Bobby Hurley that they basically give ASU a pass for its first loss. They beat Kansas and shoot up the polls like a slingshot and even receive number one votes, then lose a similar game of magnitude and nothing happens. The irony is that if ASU is so good, and Arizona defeated ASU, Arizona should have shot up the polls like ASU did when they defeated Kansas. Oh well, it is a meaningless, mid-season poll. But it is nice to see your team receive valid consideration — a multi game winning streak with two wins over top ten teams deserves much greater respect, particularly for a program that was ranked number three earlier in the season.
If we were ranked #3 and dropped a conference game to a ranked opponent on the road, we'd raise a fit if we dropped out of the top ten. And rightly so. I think ASU is getting a little more respect than they deserve, but maybe by only 3-5 spots in the polls. But in the last several weeks we've beaten A&M, ASU and Alabama(which by all accounts is a top 25 caliber team and will be when the season is over). The voters don't have to have exact opinions on their votes but at least need to be in the same solar system. I don't know how any voter could drop a team that is on a solid win streak and just took down the #3 team in the country. Looney.

Your point is well taken and for the record I never said or even suggested that ASU should receive a big drop, or even be knocked out of the top ten. But only dropping one spot? If Arizona is as mediocre as many voters seem to think the team is, and if ASU is a number one candidate like a number of voters think that team is, then ASU should have won that game making the Arizona loss more significant. Arizona would have been dropped a few spots with a similar loss. And ASU also does not have the recent history to suggest that it should receive a pass. But ASU has Hurley and he is a major Duke alum, and a lot of the voters love Duke and love the Hurley story (ignoring the fact that his first few years at ASU were really quite substandard).

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