Bear Down Wildcats

Okay so we're not exactly KU's b*tch. But KU and AZ went all in on this guy, and he ended up thinking KU was a better fit. Just not sure how that happens, given JJ's relationship with Sean and the general appeal of our program. It seemed for months like we had the edge.

Anyway, moving on. Our '16 class is very good. Just not JJ good.

Did I miss something and JJ made it official? All I see anywhere is still rumors.

billk78 wrote:Did I miss something and JJ made it official? All I see anywhere is still rumors.

You didn't miss anything. Someone's just being a little bitch.

I wasn't expecting all the sudden buzz about JJ to UCLA. I knew something was up with Adidas but this was out of nowhere.

Lol

Beachcat97 wrote:Okay so we're not exactly KU's b*tch. But KU and AZ went all in on this guy, and he ended up thinking KU was a better fit. Just not sure how that happens, given JJ's relationship with Sean and the general appeal of our program. It seemed for months like we had the edge.

Anyway, moving on. Our '16 class is very good. Just not JJ good.

If I remember correctly, all the buzz was Jackson favoring Kansas and then he played for the US team coached by Miller and then all the buzz was AZ was trending, then his boys commit to MSU and the buzz became a three way race. AZ wasn't the favored from the get go, as I'm reading your post to mean.

Arizona was seemingly the favorite for a long time

Geez another shoe driven recruitment. Man elite level recruiting really sucks ass

azcat49 wrote:Geez another shoe driven recruitment. Man elite level recruiting really sucks ass

Not shoe driven. If it was he'd be at Maryland.

I thought Kansas was an Adidas driven school and Longhorn ed mentioned UCLA? Fill me in Chi

I think LH is fucking with BeachCat.

azcat49 wrote:I thought Kansas was an Adidas driven school and Longhorn ed mentioned UCLA? Fill me in Chi

I'm just being a little bitch.

Chicat wrote:

azcat49 wrote:Geez another shoe driven recruitment. Man elite level recruiting really sucks ass

Not shoe driven. If it was he'd be at Maryland.

Just because he played for a UA AAU team doesn't mean they're the highest bidder for his future services.

Andrew Wiggins played for a Nike AAU team. Ended up at an Adidas sponsored school and is now sponsored by Adidas.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

thenewazcats wrote:

Chicat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

thenewazcats wrote:Here is what I saw (sorry would embed but I can't figure it out and posting from my phone): https://youtu.be/XTK4sXTTASg" target="_blank

Pretty sure that video is from a year ago. Here's a link to the same highlights from a year ago.

https://youtu.be/OUC-o6IFgto" target="_blank

The more recent videos are different. As noted, he's played very well against some highly regarded guys, and it isn't odd to see a lot of physical development from a kid his age. What is evident is the skillset.

The Goat wrote:And here is Markkanen taking top 10 Kentucky commit Wenyen Gabriel to task.

http://www.courtsidefilms.com/news_arti ... -markkanen" target="_blank

Seems to finish through contact well (did those euro refs ever call an and-1??), which is surprising. Thought he was going to be a string bean. Also runs the floor with his head up. Good looking prospect. You can tell he watches a lot of Dirk.

Didn't realize those were old highlights. It was posted in March this year but you're correct, SS, it looks like old stuff just reposted. The video from GOAT is more reassuring. Looks like he has beefed up. Still not impressed with his speed or hops and think that could be an issue at the NCAA level and above, but the shot is pretty and he looks skilled and coordinated. Like with most of these guys, I guess we really have to wait until they get here to see what we truly have. I'm definitely more interested after seeing that other video.

Eh, he's just about 7 foot tall. Short of a few freaks like Willie Cauley-Stein, people that height generally aren't gonna have explosive speed or hops. The coordination and agility is a way bigger issue at that height. Even guys like Kaleb, who was really good at hedging, aren't guys you want consistently squaring up with guards or wings.

I see him as Wiltjer with more strength and athletic ability. Wiltjer was a senior this year, and Lauri's latest HS tape shows more athleticism and strength already.

I get that bigs aren't built like wings or guards. For a big man, his speed and hops are concerning. Or at least it looks like that based on a couple videos against questionable competition. I really do want to reserve judgment until he gets here and I can see who he is now and against relevant competition. To put my assessment in perspective, he looks slower and less bouncy than Zeus, Frye, Bramlett, Blair, Williams, Rooks (college style), etc. Has about the same package in those two areas as Ristic, whom I like but is limited in the things he can do well. The barely-dunks at that height make me think his game around the basket will be a big earpy challenge.

I don't think LM will be bad, but I just haven't seen enough yet to inspire the same confidence I have seen in others here who project him as a positive asset as an immediate starter next year. The young man has potential. I won't deny that. But I wouldn't put him in the same class of impact as recent bigs who have come through the program, including Zeus as a freshman. Again though, just not enough quality video to go around in my opinion. Excited to see him in person next year. I remember hearing great things about Allen. Pretty good player but legend can grow when relying too much on word of mouth. If that makes sense.

Chicat wrote:

azcat49 wrote:Geez another shoe driven recruitment. Man elite level recruiting really sucks ass

Not shoe driven. If it was he'd be at Maryland.

Don't really believe he was ever going to realistically sign a pro deal with Under Armour. I would be beyond shocked if he goes to KU and signs anywhere besides Adidas when he declares for the pros.

Jeebus in a handbasket.

I sure wish Josh and Fergie would announce already and put youse guys out of your misery fer cryin' out loud.

thenewazcats wrote: I get that bigs aren't built like wings or guards. For a big man, his speed and hops are concerning. Or at least it looks like that based on a couple videos against questionable competition. I really do want to reserve judgment until he gets here and I can see who he is now and against relevant competition. To put my assessment in perspective, he looks slower and less bouncy than Zeus, Frye, Bramlett, Blair, Williams, Rooks (college style), etc. Has about the same package in those two areas as Ristic, whom I like but is limited in the things he can do well. The barely-dunks at that height make me think his game around the basket will be a big earpy challenge.

I don't think LM will be bad, but I just haven't seen enough yet to inspire the same confidence I have seen in others here who project him as a positive asset as an immediate starter next year. The young man has potential. I won't deny that. But I wouldn't put him in the same class of impact as recent bigs who have come through the program, including Zeus as a freshman. Again though, just not enough quality video to go around in my opinion. Excited to see him in person next year. I remember hearing great things about Allen. Pretty good player but legend can grow when relying too much on word of mouth. If that makes sense.

Are Euros even allowed to dunk these days? I think they can, but it's certainly not common.

thenewazcats wrote:I get that bigs aren't built like wings or guards. For a big man, his speed and hops are concerning. Or at least it looks like that based on a couple videos against questionable competition. I really do want to reserve judgment until he gets here and I can see who he is now and against relevant competition. To put my assessment in perspective, he looks slower and less bouncy than Zeus, Frye, Bramlett, Blair, Williams, Rooks (college style), etc. Has about the same package in those two areas as Ristic, whom I like but is limited in the things he can do well. The barely-dunks at that height make me think his game around the basket will be a big earpy challenge.

I don't think LM will be bad, but I just haven't seen enough yet to inspire the same confidence I have seen in others here who project him as a positive asset as an immediate starter next year. The young man has potential. I won't deny that. But I wouldn't put him in the same class of impact as recent bigs who have come through the program, including Zeus as a freshman. Again though, just not enough quality video to go around in my opinion. Excited to see him in person next year. I remember hearing great things about Allen. Pretty good player but legend can grow when relying too much on word of mouth. If that makes sense.

Have you seen what coaches who have scouted him have said about his game and how he stacks up against other 2016 big men?

Chicat wrote:

thenewazcats wrote:I get that bigs aren't built like wings or guards. For a big man, his speed and hops are concerning. Or at least it looks like that based on a couple videos against questionable competition. I really do want to reserve judgment until he gets here and I can see who he is now and against relevant competition. To put my assessment in perspective, he looks slower and less bouncy than Zeus, Frye, Bramlett, Blair, Williams, Rooks (college style), etc. Has about the same package in those two areas as Ristic, whom I like but is limited in the things he can do well. The barely-dunks at that height make me think his game around the basket will be a big earpy challenge.

I don't think LM will be bad, but I just haven't seen enough yet to inspire the same confidence I have seen in others here who project him as a positive asset as an immediate starter next year. The young man has potential. I won't deny that. But I wouldn't put him in the same class of impact as recent bigs who have come through the program, including Zeus as a freshman. Again though, just not enough quality video to go around in my opinion. Excited to see him in person next year. I remember hearing great things about Allen. Pretty good player but legend can grow when relying too much on word of mouth. If that makes sense.

Have you seen what coaches who have scouted him have said about his game and how he stacks up against other 2016 big men?

To the quality opponents, Wenyen Gabriel is #15 in his class and Markkanen got the better of the matchup. That is from the non-Euro video.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/baske ... en-gabriel" target="_blank

Gabriel is a big, athletic guy who will either play SF or a perimeter PF, and Lauri's athleticism is comparable.

An opinion from Draft Express. Bolded address a lot of the concerns expressed here or give me an absolute boner.
Strengths:
-Great size for a power forward at 6-11. Big enough to play some center in smaller “stretchy” lineups; Very nice frame that is continuously filling out. Solid upper body; Fluid athlete. Moves well. Can play above the rim; Terrific shooter. Made 41% of 3-point attempts at U18s. Career 41% 3-point shooter in 26 FIBA competition games; Excellent mechanics on jumper with a quick release; Very reliable shooter with feet set; Can come off screens even; Excellent first step. Can attack closeouts with long strides for impressive straight-line drives and finishes; Gets to the free throw line at a great rate (8.1 times per-40 at U18s); Will grab a rebound and handle ball in open floor; Can score inside the post with nice footwork and soft touch. Has a jump-hook with either hand; Highly efficient and unselfish team player; Fundamentally sound with a high basketball IQ; Competitive on defense. Team switched on every pick and roll and he did not look out of place on perimeter. Very nice mobility. Steps out onto smaller players and moves feet. Doesn't get abused; Gets in passing lanes. 2.6 steals per-40 at U18s. Career 2.5

Weaknesses:
-Possesses just an average wingspan relative to his height; Not a great rebounder on either end of the floor; Doesn't block shots; Can continue to improve his back to the basket game to allow him to post up smaller power forwards. Will likely come with added strength and maturity; Struggles holding his ground inside the paint at times. Lower body strength still a work in progress; Lacks a degree of physicality when stronger players try and back him down; Bites on pump-fakes; As prolific as he was offensively, team maybe could have benefited from him being a little more selfish. Tends to play passively and blend in at times. Doesn't quite realize how good he is at this stage? May not be as much of an issue playing with better players

Now look at the weaknesses. The bolded is the only really big concern I have for him here. Then again, if Chance and Dusan can board adequately at the 5, and the wings can pick up the slack, not that big of a deal. Or if hes out there as a 5 and Ray can step up. We are generally a very good rebounding team, so I'm not super worried. We dont care about wingspan here, he has plenty for the college level. We dont need him as a shotblocker and if he bites on pump fakes, Miller can address both of those things in practice and get him where he needs to be. Pretty much everything else can be improved in practice and our strength program, common deficiencies for a lot of bigs his age.Its impossible to read that write up and not have a big grin on your face. Some of those weaknesses are nitpicking and/or issues most 18 year olds have.

RG, I wouldn't freak too much. We should be very big and athletic 1-3, which will ease the need for LM to be a big time rebounder. Sort of how Kaleb just blended in as a rebounder when we had guys like TJ, NJ, AG, RHJ and SJ on the perimeter.

The agility on the perimeter on D is a big reason I have high hopes. Miller requires a lot of hedge and recover, and LM seems very strong in that area.

Even though we'll be quite young, I'm not sure CSM has ever had a team this loaded in the backcourt, and that's even *without* TF.

Beachcat97 wrote:Even though we'll be quite young, I'm not sure CSM has ever had a team this loaded in the backcourt, and that's even *without* TF.

Too soon to say about Simmons as a PG, but still have Allen and PJC at PG.

I would say this is the most loaded team at the 2/3, University of Arizona, Wing U!

RichardCranium wrote:Jeebus in a handbasket.

I sure wish Josh and Fergie would announce already and put youse guys out of your misery fer cryin' out loud.

Are you not entertained?

RichardCranium wrote:Jeebus in a handbasket.

I sure wish Josh and Fergie would announce already and put youse guys out of your misery fer cryin' out loud.

Fergie announced that London Bridge is falling down or something a while back.

Video of Lauri vs Wenyen Gabriel

http://www.courtsidefilms.com/news_arti ... -markkanen" target="_blank

ChooChooCat wrote:Video of Lauri vs Wenyen Gabriel

http://www.courtsidefilms.com/news_arti ... -markkanen" target="_blank

Thanks, Choo.

Major growth from the much older vids. Like his shot mechanics, especially the release a lot. He looked accurate in this vid, and the Draft express stat quotes say this is true.

Smart and alert: at about 35 sec he's staying with the smaller man down court, sees an opportunity at midcourt and I think ticks the ball down through his own legs and takes the low bouncer immediately up into dribble to head back and score. Very opportunistc play and follow through.

Shows very nice handles for a big, and moving without the ball to take a pass is relaxed, balanced and confident.

Okay feet at this stage. One nice left pivot about 12 feet out while being covered tight---fall-away and score from 15.

Yeah, Lauri's gonna be nice. Weight program, develop a gnarly attitude and he's going to compete.

Chi, I haven't read what coaches have said about him. Young kids and work have taken over my life. Admittedly not as informed as I once was. Everything I know comes from this forum. I trust you all but I still want to reserve final judgment until I see him in person next Fall.

SS, like I said, that video GOAT posted was more encouraging. Definitely changed my outlook a bit, but I didn't see LM really going up against Gabriel much there. They were obviously playing in the same game but other than one block of Gabriel by LM, it didn't seem like they were matched up against each other much in the highlights.

I'm not anti-LM. Hope it doesn't come across like that. Just remains somewhat of an unknown to me. Wiltjer was really solid. If LM is better at this stage than Wiltjer was, we're in good shape. Hope he is here for more than a year though.

You're right. He sucks. Sean Miller and all the recruiting analysts don't know anything

Jwsisliving wrote:You're right. He sucks. Sean Miller and all the recruiting analysts don't know anything

Why? When nobody said he sucks?

enfuego wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:Okay so we're not exactly KU's b*tch. But KU and AZ went all in on this guy, and he ended up thinking KU was a better fit. Just not sure how that happens, given JJ's relationship with Sean and the general appeal of our program. It seemed for months like we had the edge.

Anyway, moving on. Our '16 class is very good. Just not JJ good.

If I remember correctly, all the buzz was Jackson favoring Kansas and then he played for the US team coached by Miller and then all the buzz was AZ was trending, then his boys commit to MSU and the buzz became a three way race. AZ wasn't the favored from the get go, as I'm reading your post to mean.

I normally despise all your posts, but this one is dead on. I think most on here forgot that Jackson was a strong lean for Kansas before Arizona emerged as a potential suitor.

97cats wrote:Arizona is now two and three yrs ahead of the curve in terms of recruiting -- Coach Miller has developed the flexibility to be super selective in who he takes; below for '16 is no different.

TJ Leaf -- verbal commit

top prospects

Derryck Thornton Jr
Josh Jackson
M.J. Cage

thats top 5 class again -- and most likely there would be one more addition.

win win win

Whiffed on everyone but somehow we might end up with a better class than the above. if we get Ferguson we would have the #3 recruiting class according to 247 composite

I know people in the know are saying Jacksons decision has no bearing on Ferguson's, but plenty of minutes shine over here

Yeah. Add TF, and we've got the #3 class. Ahead of KU.

rgdeuce wrote:I know people in the know are saying Jacksons decision has no bearing on Ferguson's, but plenty of minutes shine over here

Yeah. It didn't look great for JJ for a while now, but losing TF would really hurt. The opportunity is here.

Did we ever recruit Justin Jackson out of Findlay Prep? He's a top 30 6'7" forward who committed to UNLV but his lead recruiter won't be retained and the head coach is gone. My friend that's close to the UNLV program said he's expected to decommit.

VegasCatFan wrote:Did we ever recruit Justin Jackson out of Findlay Prep? He's a top 30 6'7" forward who committed to UNLV but his lead recruiter won't be retained and the head coach is gone. My friend that's close to the UNLV program said he's expected to decommit.

The word is that since he's a Findlay kid he'll end up sticking it out at UNLV.

Could be worse. Could've lost on JJ and lost Trier like MSU lost Davis. We're in good shape.

Chicat wrote:

VegasCatFan wrote:Did we ever recruit Justin Jackson out of Findlay Prep? He's a top 30 6'7" forward who committed to UNLV but his lead recruiter won't be retained and the head coach is gone. My friend that's close to the UNLV program said he's expected to decommit.

The word is that since he's a Findlay kid he'll end up sticking it out at UNLV.

I know he's supposed to be in Canada for a week or so and is then supposed to have a meeting with the new coach to talk about the future of the program. But if his main recruiter is gone and the head coach he was going to play for is gone, the new coach better impress the hell out of him. I know we've gotten Findlay kids in the past and the UNLV team is going to be trash for a couple years. Didn't know if we had shown any interest in him during his recruitment or not.

VegasCatFan wrote:

Chicat wrote:

VegasCatFan wrote:Did we ever recruit Justin Jackson out of Findlay Prep? He's a top 30 6'7" forward who committed to UNLV but his lead recruiter won't be retained and the head coach is gone. My friend that's close to the UNLV program said he's expected to decommit.

The word is that since he's a Findlay kid he'll end up sticking it out at UNLV.

I know he's supposed to be in Canada for a week or so and is then supposed to have a meeting with the new coach to talk about the future of the program. But if his main recruiter is gone and the head coach he was going to play for is gone, the new coach better impress the hell out of him. I know we've gotten Findlay kids in the past and the UNLV team is going to be trash for a couple years. Didn't know if we had shown any interest in him during his recruitment or not.

I think there will be a lot of pressure on him because UNLV might be willing to take a lower rated Findlay kid, but if Jackson decommits that might sour the relationship.

So where are we at with scholarships?

Cruz?
Mason?
Pitts?

Everyone is running away from Vegas. Ben Carter? How many times can that dude transfer...and is he gonna end his career as a Wildcat?

Jefe wrote:So where are we at with scholarships?

PJC
Allen
Simmons
Alkins
Trier
Smith
Lauri
Chance
Ristic
Ferguson(?)
Pitts(?)

So between 2 and 4 more to give.

If Pitts isn't on the team but stays at Arizona, any idea if he gets a scholie and does it count against our total?

84Cat wrote:If Pitts isn't on the team but stays at Arizona, any idea if he gets a scholie and does it count against our total?

Pitts is rounding out the semester so it won't hurt the APR. I doubt you ever see him on campus after that.

Olsondogg wrote:

84Cat wrote:If Pitts isn't on the team but stays at Arizona, any idea if he gets a scholie and does it count against our total?

Pitts is rounding out the semester so it won't hurt the APR. I doubt you ever see him on campus after that.

Hmm, that would make sense but I would thought he would transfer to a smaller CA school so he could play and get space from the situation here.

84Cat wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:

84Cat wrote:If Pitts isn't on the team but stays at Arizona, any idea if he gets a scholie and does it count against our total?

Pitts is rounding out the semester so it won't hurt the APR. I doubt you ever see him on campus after that.

Hmm, that would make sense but I would thought he would transfer to a smaller CA school so he could play and get space from the situation here.

He already started the Spring semester, so his hands are tied. Finish up school and move on elsewhere.

Olsondogg wrote:Everyone is running away from Vegas. Ben Carter? How many times can that dude transfer...and is he gonna end his career as a Wildcat?

I'd welcome him with open arms as long as he's fine with playing a smaller role than he even did at UNLV, but in return win. This is transfer #3 for him, which oddly enough isn't that rare nowadays.

ChooChooCat wrote:

84Cat wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:

84Cat wrote:If Pitts isn't on the team but stays at Arizona, any idea if he gets a scholie and does it count against our total?

Pitts is rounding out the semester so it won't hurt the APR. I doubt you ever see him on campus after that.

Hmm, that would make sense but I would thought he would transfer to a smaller CA school so he could play and get space from the situation here.

He already started the Spring semester, so his hands are tied. Finish up school and move on elsewhere.

Yeah spring semester started 3 months ago. Classes end in 3 weeks.