Let's talk '25

[Chicat]

So when recruits, their families, and/or their handlers were getting paid under the table we could bring in top-10 recruiting classes but now that the payments are out in the open we don’t have the money? Someone explain to me how that works.

Also, how is it that USC, a school where basketball is definitely second banana to their powerhouse football program, has a better NIL structure in place than Arizona where basketball is king but that fact is somehow no fault of Arizona’s? And please don’t look foolish by saying it’s because they are in the B1G because no money from the conferences can go to NIL funds.

We were bringing in Top 10 classes because the billionaire booster class (like Phil Knight) were not engaged in paying basketball players under the table. If he was then Oregon would have been hauling in Top 10 classes years ago. They are now that NIL is in effect.

Regarding USC/B1G please don't look foolish and tell me that you are not aware that NCAA schools are going to be engaged in revenue sharing (and B1G schools like USC have a hell of a lot more of that than the UA) beginning in 2025?

https://apnews.com/article/ncaa-settlem ... 358b9bb339

You do know that the revenue sharing agreement isn’t in place yet, right? And that the schools get to choose what percentage of revenue goes to the student athletes? And that this doesn’t answer the football vs basketball question and in fact makes it more important because most of that revenue sharing will be going to the football team? And that you’re a freakin’ broken record?

As for your billionaire booster class take, how is it that you know their intentions now vs then? Before NIL the USC billionaire boosters were content to see their team lose recruits to UA? Or did they always get good recruits (Demarr Derozan, OJ Mayo, the Mobleys, the Stewarts, Harold Minor, Nick Young, etc) and you’re just talking out of your ass?

[Fishclamps]

Let's be real, Alijah's gonna be the centerpiece of that team from day one. Best case scenario at Arizona is he follows in Carter's footsteps, doesn't start, very limited minutes until you can prove yourself.

If you're a kid trying to be a one and done and maybe the team part of basketball might not interest you as much, it's very clear you pick the place that let's you put up the most shots.

[TheCat]

Smoke not good for Arizona.. Tommy needs to really change his high school recruiting approach. I had issues with Miller, he would never loose a recruit like this especially in the NIL era. Tommy needs to maximize our NIL resources, no reason we can't be top 15 in NIL at a minimum. This is Arizona we should be getting top 15 recruiting classes with a couple 5 stars. Not relying on the transfer portal and international recruits.

And how exactly is CTL supposed to "Maximize" our NIL?? Rob a bank???

The NIL he has is solely up to the alumni and thus far, they are not ponying up.

Miller would never have lost a recruiting battle like this with NIL. Tommy's high school recruiting sucks and our NIL not being in the top 15 in the country says to me we aren't maximizing it. That responsibility lays with Tommy. Go raise the money with the boosters and alumni. If a booster can ear mark $1 million for Love, i doubt it would be hard to make sure we raise enough to not loose any bidding war for the son of Gilbert Arenas. Terrible look for the program and another big domestic prep recruit miss by Tommy.

Miller loses NIL battles everyday and had a star player transfer before the start of this year. Not sure what Sean has to do with anything.

I'm disappointed in his selection because we really need a great shooter. Just to put it in a bit of perspective we signed a Mikey D player last year who is looking better every game and we have signed a 5 star this year and are on the trail of two other great players. The days of consistent top 5 recruiting classes are mostly over. Rutgers got two incredible players last year, ASU got the number 1 rated center, BYU is going to get some unbelievable guys because I think they have what was speculated as a top 3-5 NIL. I think you can see this already starting to show with a team like Gonzaga where they will not be able to compete in the long term on the basis of NIL. Teams like them and Arizona and many others are going to have to show development of players is what give long term success. The above mention schools have one other thing in common. Losing in conference.

What I predicted last year is coming true. The SEC will start to dominate in basketball because of the amount of money they will have for NIL. I heard someone say the SEC might get more teams from that conference in the tournament than ever before. It is not just HS kids it is transfers that are looking for some more dollars.

[dmjcat]

So when recruits, their families, and/or their handlers were getting paid under the table we could bring in top-10 recruiting classes but now that the payments are out in the open we don’t have the money? Someone explain to me how that works.

Also, how is it that USC, a school where basketball is definitely second banana to their powerhouse football program, has a better NIL structure in place than Arizona where basketball is king but that fact is somehow no fault of Arizona’s? And please don’t look foolish by saying it’s because they are in the B1G because no money from the conferences can go to NIL funds.

We were bringing in Top 10 classes because the billionaire booster class (like Phil Knight) were not engaged in paying basketball players under the table. If he was then Oregon would have been hauling in Top 10 classes years ago. They are now that NIL is in effect.

Regarding USC/B1G please don't look foolish and tell me that you are not aware that NCAA schools are going to be engaged in revenue sharing (and B1G schools like USC have a hell of a lot more of that than the UA) beginning in 2025?

https://apnews.com/article/ncaa-settlem ... 358b9bb339

You do know that the revenue sharing agreement isn’t in place yet, right? And that the schools get to choose what percentage of revenue goes to the student athletes? And that this doesn’t answer the football vs basketball question and in fact makes it more important because most of that revenue sharing will be going to the football team? And that you’re a freakin’ broken record?

As for your billionaire booster class take, how is it that you know their intentions now vs then? Before NIL the USC billionaire boosters were content to see their team lose recruits to UA? Or did they always get good recruits (Demarr Derozan, OJ Mayo, the Mobleys, the Stewarts, Harold Minor, Nick Young, etc) and you’re just talking out of your ass?

The revenue sharing is in place for 25......which Alijah Arenas will benefit from. And you do realize (probably not) that the power conferences are certainly going to revenue share with the money making sports (footbal & basketball)??? And that you are pretty much clueless???

Regarding Pre-NIL, Power schools like USC always out recruited us........they had better facilities, a winning , and a school located near the beach. Obviously you have been clueless for years. Try and keep up.

[dmjcat]

Fuck, Arenas to USC

Yea that one is unreal - should have been in drivers seat for Gil's kid

Why should we have been in the drivers seat??? Other than, maybe, Louisville every other school that made his final list most assuredly had larger NIL packages for him. The kids are going to go where the $$$$$$$$ are.

Wake up folks, this is NOT 2013. We are not going to be signing Top 10 recruiting classes every year in the NIL era. We are not going to consistently out-recruit SEC/B1G schools that have tens of millions more $$$revenue$$$$ and significantly more NIL to dole out than we do.

I know you've been tooting the NIL horn for a while now - does it play a part, absolutely.

I'm sure you also know why we should have been in the drivers seat for him being who his dad is and what he meant to our program as well.

I'm not expecting us to stack up 5 star after 5 star either, but this is a kid we should have went all-in on. Unless we are ending up with Peat/Burries both and he was the odd man out.

If we've got donors earmarking $1mil for caleb love but we can't put together a solid package for a top prospect (who is the son of a UA great bball player) then CTL is struggling to do his job of selling the program/NIL to our donors.

I would not count on getting both Burries & Peat. I can't see getting Burries while Jaden Bradley is running the point for us.

From what I have read we have pretty much thrown most of our NIL at Peat (and asu has thrown even more than we have). Hopefully, an extra $100K or so is negated by playing at an empty Wells Fargo arena for a clown coach.

[Chicat]

The revenue sharing is in place for 25......which Alijah Arenas will benefit from. And you do realize (probably not) that the power conferences are certainly going to revenue share with the money making sports (footbal & basketball)??? And that you are pretty much clueless???

Regarding Pre-NIL, Power schools like USC always out recruited us........they had better facilities, a winning , and a school located near the beach. Obviously you have been clueless for years. Try and keep up.

You are precious.

Boring, wrong, stubborn, pedantic, and non-sensical… but most of all precious. Going back to ignoring your histrionics now Chicken Little.

[dmjcat]

The revenue sharing is in place for 25......which Alijah Arenas will benefit from. And you do realize (probably not) that the power conferences are certainly going to revenue share with the money making sports (footbal & basketball)??? And that you are pretty much clueless???

Regarding Pre-NIL, Power schools like USC always out recruited us........they had better facilities, a winning , and a school located near the beach. Obviously you have been clueless for years. Try and keep up.

You are precious.

Boring, wrong, stubborn, pedantic, and non-sensical… but most of all precious. Going back to ignoring your histrionics now Chicken Little.

Still clueless, eh???

You didn't even know about revenue sharing before I educated you about it today.

Good for you that you have decided to quit while you are behind. Its the first intelligent thing you have done today.

[Chicat]

Fuck, Arenas to USC

This one hurts.

Does it? It’s not like it’s RJ’s kid. Gil doesn’t have a particularly strong connection to the school, and didn’t seem to have much of a relationship to the program during the Lute, Sean, or Lloyd eras.

Arenas is good, and he’s an alum’s kid, so I get it that we should have had an in, but it’s not like he grew up with any kind of special connection to the Cats like even Carter Bryant or KJ Lewis did. So yeah it sucks we didn’t get him, but I get why he’s staying in LA and I’m not hurt. Lot of kids still out there for next year.

[AZCatGirl]

Yeah, I'm not getting the meltdown on social media over not getting him. I think people are thinking back on Gil's past with rose colored glasses a bit.

Also, did anyone think we'd be 8-1 in the Big 12 with this lineup? Not saying we should do the OKG thing like Football, but it's not like highly rated kids guarantees you success. As long as we don't lose out on all the highly rated kids we'll be okay. I think Tommy has earned some trust at this point.

[Chicat]

Yeah, I'm not getting the meltdown on social media over not getting him. I think people are thinking back on Gil's past with rose colored glasses a bit.

After we lost the ‘01 national championship RJ was talking to everyone in the locker room about coming back the next year to try and win it all.

Gil laughed in his face.

He’s not like a Wildcat for Life guy like Channing, RJ, and Gardner are, which is fine. Love what he did when he was a Cat and it was cool to call him an alum right up until him and Javaris Crittendon started waving guns at each other (and it’s back to being cool now) but in no way did I think it was a foregone conclusion his kid would also be a Cat.

[Beachcat97]

As long as we get Koa, this won’t matter.

[dmjcat]

Smoke not good for Arizona.. Tommy needs to really change his high school recruiting approach. I had issues with Miller, he would never loose a recruit like this especially in the NIL era. Tommy needs to maximize our NIL resources, no reason we can't be top 15 in NIL at a minimum. This is Arizona we should be getting top 15 recruiting classes with a couple 5 stars. Not relying on the transfer portal and international recruits.

And how exactly is CTL supposed to "Maximize" our NIL?? Rob a bank???

The NIL he has is solely up to the alumni and thus far, they are not ponying up.

Miller would never have lost a recruiting battle like this with NIL. Tommy's high school recruiting sucks and our NIL not being in the top 15 in the country says to me we aren't maximizing it. That responsibility lays with Tommy. Go raise the money with the boosters and alumni. If a booster can ear mark $1 million for Love, i doubt it would be hard to make sure we raise enough to not loose any bidding war for the son of Gilbert Arenas. Terrible look for the program and another big domestic prep recruit miss by Tommy.

So you believe that UA football/basketball coaches are now responsible for fund-raising in addition to coaching??? I think you are in for a very hard reality check. UA Alumni have never been in the top 40 (or 50 for that matter) when it comes to donating to the athletic dept. I remember a statement that Mike Stoops once made:

"We may have got it as good as it can get. You have to be realistic with what your expectations are and you should have high expectations, I certainly did. But what you're capable of and what the circumstances that are dealt to you, it's hard to achieve those big goals of winning a championship there," Stoops said of his time at Arizona. "There's a reason they haven't won a championship at Arizona and it's not bad coaching or bad players. You can blame it on anything you want, football and championships are about commitments made university wide. It's a commitment made to winning, not at all costs but there is a cost.

"When you don't have a football facility and every Mountain West team has one and you don't, that's a problem. We were playing at a BCS level and I feel like I was fighting with a toothpick and they've got a bat."

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/111 ... nt-matters

If you don't think it's thier job to maximize NIL, booster donations, and any other way to improve the program I don't know what you think being the head of a program like Arizona basketball means.

We have a top 8 college basketball program there's no excuse for we can't have a top 15 NIL. Before NIL was even legal Miller sure pulled it off because he maximized the resources available to him with Arizonas brand and alumni. Tommy hasn't done that yet and he better figure it out quickly.

I agree that football and basketball coaches are ambassadors of the university and should engage in pressing the flesh......but only in the traditional sense. Its one thing to convince alumni to contribute to the library fund. Its a completely different thing to convince alumni to donate large amounts of cash (every year) to athletics. Think about it. Do you want Brad Brennan to be out convincing the alumni to cough up over $25M/year to be competitive (in addition to coaching and recruiting)?. We are talking about tens of millions every year...that should be the job of the AD, who will probably assemble a separate group to conduct these kinds of activities. Raising millions and millions of dollars annually is a full time job in itself (for a group of people), much less a single coach.

[Fishclamps]

I give 0 fucks how Tommy recruits as long as we keep winning. Isn't that what we all watch Arizona Basketball for?

[gronk4heisman]

The NIL talk is stupid and old and repetitive, especially when the recruits own dad said during the recruitment regardless of the numbers being thrown around the Arenas name at Arizona is going to make for more NIL opportunities and money in Tucson than anywhere else. If we were talking Brayden Burries maybe you could do your same old song and dance, but not with this recruitment. This recruitment boils down to Tommy not prioritizing Arenas and showing him enough love, maybe due to him preferring Burries or maybe due to his recruiting style.

[Lando05]

The NIL talk is stupid and old and repetitive, especially when the recruits own dad said during the recruitment regardless of the numbers being thrown around the Arenas name at Arizona is going to make for more NIL opportunities and money in Tucson than anywhere else. If we were talking Brayden Burries maybe you could do your same old song and dance, but not with this recruitment. This recruitment boils down to Tommy not prioritizing Arenas and showing him enough love, maybe due to him preferring Burries or maybe due to his recruiting style.

Well said.

[dmjcat]

The NIL talk is stupid and old and repetitive, especially when the recruits own dad said during the recruitment regardless of the numbers being thrown around the Arenas name at Arizona is going to make for more NIL opportunities and money in Tucson than anywhere else. If we were talking Brayden Burries maybe you could do your same old song and dance, but not with this recruitment. This recruitment boils down to Tommy not prioritizing Arenas and showing him enough love, maybe due to him preferring Burries or maybe due to his recruiting style.

You keep right on living in that fantasy world of yours.

In another 4-5 years after you watch all of the top prospects in basketball & football head off to the power conferences (who have the money) maybe reality will finally dawn on you.

I'm not holding my breath.

Have a nice weekend.

[gronk4heisman]

The NIL talk is stupid and old and repetitive, especially when the recruits own dad said during the recruitment regardless of the numbers being thrown around the Arenas name at Arizona is going to make for more NIL opportunities and money in Tucson than anywhere else. If we were talking Brayden Burries maybe you could do your same old song and dance, but not with this recruitment. This recruitment boils down to Tommy not prioritizing Arenas and showing him enough love, maybe due to him preferring Burries or maybe due to his recruiting style.

You keep right on living in that fantasy world of yours.

In another 4-5 years after you watch all of the top prospects in basketball & football head off to the power conferences (who have the money) maybe reality will finally dawn on you.

I'm not holding my breath.

Have a nice weekend.

Of the top 9 recruits only 1 is currently going to the SEC or Big 10, 3 of the top 19. But you are right no one else should bother recruiting, keep the broken record on loop.

[mofo]

Wasn't very long ago during the Deandre Ayton/Nico Mannion years that it seemed most people here were over 5* recruits and wanted 4* guys who would play team ball and stay a few years. The grass is always greener!

[84Cat]

According to Scheer, Tommy thinks Burries fits our team better and so wasn't really recruiting Arenas anymore. Of course if he misses on Burries, it won't look good.

[pc in NM]

Wasn't very long ago during the Deandre Ayton/Nico Mannion years that it seemed most people here were over 5* recruits and wanted 4* guys who would play team ball and stay a few years. The grass is always greener!

And, Nico was about as big a disappointment as we've ever had...

[azcat49]

Pretty gutsy to pass over a 5star legacy. While the fit may be true It sounds a bit like white washing the outcome

[Winger]

Yeah, I'm not getting the meltdown on social media over not getting him. I think people are thinking back on Gil's past with rose colored glasses a bit.

Also, did anyone think we'd be 8-1 in the Big 12 with this lineup? Not saying we should do the OKG thing like Football, but it's not like highly rated kids guarantees you success. As long as we don't lose out on all the highly rated kids we'll be okay. I think Tommy has earned some trust at this point.

100

I don’t know about every booster but there is a subset of Arizona hoops boosters who aren’t and have never been stoked on collectives and NIL. They can’t see the return on their investment, they aren’t sure how much goes to the players, revenue sharing is on the horizon, and importantly they believe this current system is to be short lived. Further you have the free transfer era coupled with lack of contracts to lock up the Arenas of the world who are free to bail on you (and your investment) after 1 season even if they don’t go the League. And the record clearly shows that there aren’t than many Cooper Flag’s in the world (making FFs and winning natties on the backs of 5-star freshmen mostly ended a while ago).

Imv the tract record on elite level recruiting the in the NIL era is spotty. How are Rutgers and BYU doing? Even Arkansas is struggling. Duke still has Nike feeding multiple 5-stars to it just about each class and is an exception but that seems to be about it. Mussleman stinks is a bad dude and will fail at SC, I’d put big money on that.

It’s been more difficult this season due to our lousy OOC performance but, heretofore, with the exception of NCAA Tournament performance (which admittedly is a big deal), Lloyd has won enough games at Arizona imo to allow for letting the leash out on his recruiting some.

And, let the record show, Miller — in a vastly different and more easy to navigate environment — got 0 Final Fours from his 5-stars and I would argue that his panic-reaching for Ayton (am biased here because I always believed his recruitment was a giant mistake) and the rest after the glow had come off of his program on the recruiting trail (the Kobe and Alkins reaches were your 1st clue) 1) ended his tenure and 2) just about destroyed our great program.

This story — Lloyd’s recruiting, NIL, transfer era — continues to be a work in progress imo and is TBD.

[Beachcat97]

Yeah, I'm not getting the meltdown on social media over not getting him. I think people are thinking back on Gil's past with rose colored glasses a bit.

Also, did anyone think we'd be 8-1 in the Big 12 with this lineup? Not saying we should do the OKG thing like Football, but it's not like highly rated kids guarantees you success. As long as we don't lose out on all the highly rated kids we'll be okay. I think Tommy has earned some trust at this point.

100

I don’t know about every booster but there is a subset of Arizona hoops boosters who aren’t and have never been stoked on collectives and NIL. They can’t see the return on their investment, they aren’t sure how much goes to the players, revenue sharing is on the horizon, and importantly they believe this current system is to be short lived. Further you have the free transfer era coupled with lack of contracts to lock up the Arenas of the world who are free to bail on you (and your investment) after 1 season even if they don’t go the League. And the record clearly shows that there aren’t than many Cooper Flag’s in the world (making FFs and winning natties on the backs of 5-star freshmen mostly ended a while ago).

Imv the tract record on elite level recruiting the in the NIL era is spotty. How are Rutgers and BYU doing? Even Arkansas is struggling. Duke still has Nike feeding multiple 5-stars to it just about each class and is an exception but that seems to be about it. Mussleman stinks is a bad dude and will fail at SC, I’d put big money on that.

It’s been more difficult this season due to our lousy OOC performance but, heretofore, with the exception of NCAA Tournament performance (which admittedly is a big deal), Lloyd has won enough games at Arizona imo to allow for letting the leash out on his recruiting some.

And, let the record show, Miller — in a vastly different and more easy to navigate environment — got 0 Final Fours from his 5-stars and I would argue that his panic-reaching for Ayton (am biased here because I always believed his recruitment was a giant mistake) and the rest after the glow had come off of his program on the recruiting trail (the Kobe and Alkins reaches were your 1st clue) 1) ended his tenure and 2) just about destroyed our great program.

This story — Lloyd’s recruiting, NIL, transfer era — continues to be a work in progress imo and is TBD.

Excellent post.

I disagree on Musselman. That's a pretty good hire for USC. They just knocked off Michigan State and probably still have an outside shot at the NCAA tourney. And they're recruiting very well.

I 100% agree, though, on the overvaluation of 5-star recruits. Those guys rarely amount to a FF team, even when a team gets a cluster of them. It's always good to land one every few years, but the lifeblood of a program is those 4-star guys who stay in school 2-3 years, plus key transfers. That's how Tommy's had success so far.

[Winger]

I disagree on Musselman. That's a pretty good hire for USC.

I can't stand Mussleman. Personal issues at play here. I can't be objective. But I'd bet big money he won't make it long term at SC. He either will get lucky and pull a Fisch after a season or 2 or he will burn out and fade away like he did at Arky (and bail right before getting canned, again). He is 13-8 and 5-5 to date this season FTR with zero quality OOC wins.

[Alieberman]

I disagree on Musselman. That's a pretty good hire for USC.

I can't stand Mussleman. Personal issues at play here. I can't be objective. But I'd bet big money he won't make it long term at SC. He either will get lucky and pull a Fisch after a season or 2 or he will burn out and fade away like he did at Arky (and bail right before getting canned, again). He is 13-8 and 5-5 to date this season FTR with zero quality OOC wins.

That sounds like the record of every USC coach throughout history

[TheCat]

What it is important to me is that those recruits or potential transfers on the fence after our early struggles are getting a much better view on our player development and the temperament and loyalty of our coaching staff. They can see Carter's development first hand and that we have a coach that supports all player's in good times and bad. Their parents see that their sons will not be thrown under the bus so the coach can avoid the heat. There is a joy that this program has and a level of trust and support they have in one another. In the world of NIL which might be the most important to some there are no guarantees but I am proud of the image that program is displaying to the outside.

Now if we can just get rid of some of the over the top comments by fan sites (both positive now and negative before) we have a chance to get another batch of quality recruits that no one likes and then loves.

[Fishclamps]

Hope Bruce Branch had fun at the game last night!

[Merkin]

Someone posted this on Facebook. I take it as a good sign.

[dmjcat]

Travis Branhams best guess, at the moment, is Koa Peat to UA and Burries to Tennessee

[IndianaZonaFan]

Would we rather have Burries or KP?

I think we need Burries more than Peat, especially since we are getting Aristode and could keep a sophomore Bryant.

What are thoughts from those with more knowledge about incoming/outgoing players?

[Merkin]

Interesting, to me anyway, the effort Musselman and staff put into getting Arenas. Especially in comparison to UA efforts regarding prep players.

https://www.sgvtribune.com/2025/01/30/h ... ah-arenas/