Bribery Scandal - FBI Probe - Book Richardson Involved

[NYCat]

Even if they get Andy Miller's records they'll still have to prove the kids knew about it and it wasn't the parents getting it. Not to mention he's been an agent along time so no telling how far back it goes. I think ncaa makes some rule changes before next year and most of this is handled with minor penalties over the next few years. NCAA will say all the right things but will be kinda swept away

https://sports.yahoo.com/sources-spread ... 18078.html" target="_blank

I've always felt ok if it focused on ASM. Arizona had no ex-players in their client list, so if they were dropping money on our guys, you'd assume it was (at the least) significantly less than othe schools.

Lists Zeus as a client here

https://basketball.realgm.com/info/agen ... -Miller/14" target="_blank

Also here, idk if he's still a client

Press release here from the initial signing of Zeus

http://www.asmsports.com/welcome-to-the ... ss-of-2016" target="_blank

[ChooChooCat]

This is accurate, if Miller seriously created a fricken spreadsheet about how much he was illegally paying players then he's the biggest idiot in history.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Even if they get Andy Miller's records they'll still have to prove the kids knew about it and it wasn't the parents getting it. Not to mention he's been an agent along time so no telling how far back it goes. I think ncaa makes some rule changes before next year and most of this is handled with minor penalties over the next few years. NCAA will say all the right things but will be kinda swept away

https://sports.yahoo.com/sources-spread ... 18078.html" target="_blank

I've always felt ok if it focused on ASM. Arizona had no ex-players in their client list, so if they were dropping money on our guys, you'd assume it was (at the least) significantly less than othe schools.

Lists Zeus as a client here

https://basketball.realgm.com/info/agen ... -Miller/14" target="_blank

Also here, idk if he's still a client

That sucks. I took my info off the ASM site and their list of current players (NBA or international) they rep. None of it is really a protection.

Look, if this is legit, a lot of programs are going down.

[NYCat]

This is accurate, if Miller seriously created a fricken spreadsheet about how much he was illegally paying players then he's the biggest idiot in history.

These are stupid times

BTW could've been for numerous reasons why he would create record keeping of his payments. Mob's/organized crime/cartels/criminal enterprises etc keep accounting books & ledgers all the time. This is obviously smaller -and not necessarily illegal- still the same reasons why criminal organizations do it.

[CatFanOneMil]

There's no way ASM ONLY repped players it bought, no one has that kind of money, Zeus has his degree in Business I have serious suspicions about him going a dirty direction at ANY time of his BB career, the fact that there might have been a connection via Book makes it seem reasonable and if you are somewhat insulated then there's a really good chance that Zeus just found an agent via a relationship he had formed for 4 years in school...he's not exactly a money bucket for teams to dump into.

[Longhorned]

If true, this would implicate every decent high major and mid major program in America. That's exactly what you want if you're a fan of Arizona, Louisville, Auburn, or USC. It lays a system-wide reality on the doorstep of the NCAA, making it hard to punish a scapegoat.

[Spaceman Spiff]

If true, this would implicate every decent high major and mid major program in America. That's exactly what you want if you're a fan of Arizona, Louisville, Auburn, or USC. It lays a system-wide reality on the doorstep of the NCAA, making it hard to punish a scapegoat.

Just read the list of their family:

http://www.asmsports.com/asm-family" target="_blank

Duke, UNC, Miami, Ok. St., Colorado, Stanford, Utah...the list goes on and on. You have to be pretty naieve to think ASM was the only agency doing this. I've beaten this drum hard for a while, but this is not an abnormality. It is the system.

[azcat49]

Hansen's article today was so depressing comparing us to the Miller era OSU Beavers

[Spaceman Spiff]

Hansen's article today was so depressing comparing us to the Miller era OSU Beavers

Hansen is getting really old with every article clamoring for drama and scandal and constantly injecting the possibility of firing, sanctioning, etc.

Just have a rotating column asking if we'll get sanctioned and Sean Miller will be regarded like (worst coach in opponent this week's) history. Rehash some FBI talking points, play Mad Libs with only negative words, and you basically have his columns.

He seems like a turd.

[PHXCATS]

Thanks Millers

[Spaceman Spiff]

Even if they get Andy Miller's records they'll still have to prove the kids knew about it and it wasn't the parents getting it. Not to mention he's been an agent along time so no telling how far back it goes. I think ncaa makes some rule changes before next year and most of this is handled with minor penalties over the next few years. NCAA will say all the right things but will be kinda swept away

https://sports.yahoo.com/sources-spread ... 18078.html" target="_blank

I've always felt ok if it focused on ASM. Arizona had no ex-players in their client list, so if they were dropping money on our guys, you'd assume it was (at the least) significantly less than othe schools.

Lists Zeus as a client here

https://basketball.realgm.com/info/agen ... -Miller/14" target="_blank

Also here, idk if he's still a client

That realgm list has to be old. It has Lorenzen Wright as a client and he died in 2010.

Also, PHXCATS is just trolling at this point. My ignore list is up to 2.

[Bangkok Wildcat]

Hansen's article today was so depressing comparing us to the Miller era OSU Beavers

Hansen is getting really old with every article clamoring for drama and scandal and constantly injecting the possibility of firing, sanctioning, etc.

Just have a rotating column asking if we'll get sanctioned and Sean Miller will be regarded like (worst coach in opponent this week's) history. Rehash some FBI talking points, play Mad Libs with only negative words, and you basically have his columns.

He seems like a turd.

Agreed....as desperate as I am for anything UA Men’s Hoops related, I ignore Hansen on a regular basis. He lost a lot of credibility IMO during his feud with Lute and, from your account above, seems like he needs to create news / drama rather than just commenting on it.....I can’t believe he’s still got a job.

Anyways, assuming the worst and if there’s any NCAA sanctions we should just go full ‘UNC’ on that hypocritical and incompetent organization. They have ZERO credibility after letting UNC not only get away with massive fraud but with punking them throughout the process. I’m dead serious.

[NYCat]

That realgm list has to be old. It has Lorenzen Wright as a client and he died in 2010.

Even if he's not a Miller client currently, he signed with ASM & Miller immediately after college and that's makes me nervous tbh. Could've been a relationship/payment/etc beforehand. Hopefully Zeus is not in a stupid spreadsheet.

Here's the press release when Zeus & others got signed

http://www.asmsports.com/welcome-to-the ... ss-of-2016" target="_blank

To me even if he's not an current client isn't even important, but he was coming out of college which is a bigger deal. Zeus could've been involved with Miller.

[Bangkok Wildcat]

I also have a really, really difficult time believing that CSM did anything unethical or illegal. It just doesn’t make any sense to me from his work ethic, talent, and lineage.

If anything maybe / probably he had a blind spot for Book. Also, whatever happened to the presumption of innocence until proven guilty? Seems like that is a dead concept these days...smh.

[Spaceman Spiff]

That realgm list has to be old. It has Lorenzen Wright as a client and he died in 2010.

Even if he's not a Miller client currently, he signed with ASM & Miller immediately after college and that's makes me nervous tbh. Could've been a relationship/payment/etc beforehand. Hopefully Zeus is not in a stupid spreadsheet.

Here's the press release when Zeus & others got signed

http://www.asmsports.com/welcome-to-the ... ss-of-2016" target="_blank

To me even if he's not an current client isn't even important, but he was coming out of college which is a bigger deal. Zeus could've been involved with Miller.

I'm not saying Zeus couldn't have been involved, but a single guy compared to some other schools really isn't half bad. OSU had multiple guys, including one named by the FBI. Duke and UNC had multiple guys. This thing is big.

[NYCat]

TBH the more stuff leaks the more it seems like there won't be any major crimes or outcomes like the leaked stories are portraying it to be. In the end..

NCAA violations ≠ Federal crimes

Then it'll be up to the DOJ, FBI if they release any if not all evidence to the NCAA to use for punishment of schools(or if the NCAA gets them from discovery, pre trials & trials themselves). It's not 100% guaranteed the NCAA gets access to whatever the FBI has, then it's a question if the NCAA can even use said evidence without being taken to court.

[CatHoops]

Why wouldn't agents cast a wide net of money and try and generate more clients? Throw thousands and in a few years a player could be making his agent a few million. I dont get how this is made out to be so terrible just cause the ncaa says so? Kinda hard for a school to police outside agents and family members in other states.

[EVCat]

This sounds so much like a leak/non-specific specifics to try to get someone to talk.

Some of the stuff is just fantasy level...

"If your school produced a first-round pick in the past three years, be worried." Really. ASM has paid every frickin' 1st round pick and gotten who? That's such bullshit.

"Nearly 5 months have passed..." with that kind of information? About activity that is not a crime at the player level, only at the coach/bag man level? They are shaking it down with player payments, but players aren't breaking a law, and the FBI is supposedly sitting on this EXPLOSIVE, ALL ENCOMPASSING DATA to arrest 50 coaches? For knowing their players were paid? For steering players like Book?

This reads like a hard boiled detective series...

[Spaceman Spiff]

This sounds so much like a leak/non-specific specifics to try to get someone to talk.

Some of the stuff is just fantasy level...

"If your school produced a first-round pick in the past three years, be worried." Really. ASM has paid every frickin' 1st round pick and gotten who? That's such bullshit.

"Nearly 5 months have passed..." with that kind of information? About activity that is not a crime at the player level, only at the coach/bag man level? They are shaking it down with player payments, but players aren't breaking a law, and the FBI is supposedly sitting on this EXPLOSIVE, ALL ENCOMPASSING DATA to arrest 50 coaches? For knowing their players were paid? For steering players like Book?

This reads like a hard boiled detective series...

Look, it's not just ASM. Agents have no reason not to pay players. Agents don't have to maintain NCAA eligibility. It strains credulity that Andy Miller pays but other agents are pure as the driven snow.

It's a legit statement, IMO, that all first rounders have received some sort of benefit. That's more an indictment of the NCAA than anything. Sadly, the NCAA will probably double down on the hypocrisy of the current system.

[EVCat]

This sounds so much like a leak/non-specific specifics to try to get someone to talk.

Some of the stuff is just fantasy level...

"If your school produced a first-round pick in the past three years, be worried." Really. ASM has paid every frickin' 1st round pick and gotten who? That's such bullshit.

"Nearly 5 months have passed..." with that kind of information? About activity that is not a crime at the player level, only at the coach/bag man level? They are shaking it down with player payments, but players aren't breaking a law, and the FBI is supposedly sitting on this EXPLOSIVE, ALL ENCOMPASSING DATA to arrest 50 coaches? For knowing their players were paid? For steering players like Book?

This reads like a hard boiled detective series...

Look, it's not just ASM. Agents have no reason not to pay players. Agents don't have to maintain NCAA eligibility. It strains credulity that Andy Miller pays but other agents are pure as the driven snow.

It's a legit statement, IMO, that all first rounders have received some sort of benefit. That's more an indictment of the NCAA than anything. Sadly, the NCAA will probably double down on the hypocrisy of the current system.

I'm talking the magic evidence that covers everything, released mere days after the case almost fell apart.

I am sure there are plenty of inducements. I am also sure not every player has their hands out.

[Chicat]

No mention of Arizona except for background on Book’s arrest. Lot of our rivals mentioned though...

[btfd16]

WOW... so many schools and top talent

[Newportcat]

Hansen's article today was so depressing comparing us to the Miller era OSU Beavers

Hansen is getting really old with every article clamoring for drama and scandal and constantly injecting the possibility of firing, sanctioning, etc.

Just have a rotating column asking if we'll get sanctioned and Sean Miller will be regarded like (worst coach in opponent this week's) history. Rehash some FBI talking points, play Mad Libs with only negative words, and you basically have his columns.

He seems like a turd.

So does Hansen write an article now saying every college basketball program is going to be the OSU Beavers?

He just writes things to get attention

[Gilbertcat]

Kuzma, Fultz for Utah and Washington mentioned. Few more USC players. I'm sure more to come. But how dumb is that, let's save a file called "crimes I did".

[jsbowl16]

This must be important. They are talking about it on ESPN. I hope we get to hear from Bilas and JWill this morning about how clean Duke is.

[UAEebs86]

This must be important. They are talking about it on ESPN. I hope we get to hear from Bilas and JWill this morning about how clean Duke is.

Yeah no kidding.

I may have told this story before, but one summer when I was in college I worked with a couple of Penn St. guys. I made a comment that every school cheats, it's just a matter of degrees. "Not Joe Pa!" they said. "He's clean!"


Well, maybe on recruiting violations, but there was that whole pedophilia thing on his watch...

[Spaceman Spiff]

Hansen's article today was so depressing comparing us to the Miller era OSU Beavers

Hansen is getting really old with every article clamoring for drama and scandal and constantly injecting the possibility of firing, sanctioning, etc.

Just have a rotating column asking if we'll get sanctioned and Sean Miller will be regarded like (worst coach in opponent this week's) history. Rehash some FBI talking points, play Mad Libs with only negative words, and you basically have his columns.

He seems like a turd.

So does Hansen write an article now saying every college basketball program is going to be the OSU Beavers?

He just writes things to get attention

Now, ironically, it could be OSU's time to shine when all the actual good programs go down.

[NYCat]

Wow

[NYCat]

lol all the righteous Utah fans

[NYCat]

[Spaceman Spiff]

https://sports.yahoo.com/exclusive-fede ... 38484.html" target="_blank

Here's the article and list. No Arizona, so maybe finally some good news.

[NYCat]

[Alieberman]

That article mentions almost every big program except Arizona... I’ll take that as very good news

[Sean Olson]

So if Trier has to sit for throwing a couple grains of sand in a swimming pool what happens to the current players mentioned in this article? They should have to sit immediately right?

[Spaceman Spiff]

So if Trier has to sit for throwing a couple grains of sand in a swimming pool what happens to the current players mentioned in this article? They should have to sit immediately right?

"The documents tie some of the biggest names and programs in the sport to activity that appears to violate the NCAA’s amateurism rules. This could end up casting a pall over the NCAA tournament because of eligibility issues. (NCAA officials declined a request for comment.) There’s potential impermissible benefits and preferential treatment for players and families of players at Duke, North Carolina, Texas, Kentucky, Michigan State, USC, Alabama and a host of other schools. The documents link some of the sport’s biggest current stars – Michigan State’s Miles Bridges, Alabama’s Collin Sexton and Duke’s Wendell Carter – to specific potential extra benefits for either the athletes or their family members. The amounts tied to players in the case range from basic meals to tens of thousands of dollars."

As mad as the NCAA is going to be with Duke, I would be scared to death to be Elon's women's tennis team right now.

[EVCat]

No mention of Arizona except for background on Book’s arrest. Lot of our rivals mentioned though...

And what are the chances they don't mention one of the "original 4" if there is something about us?

4/5ths of the Phat 5 are in that.

We are not.

Jesus...that is kind of big, no? Tells me either Book spent the money on his own stuff, or if money went to Quinerly, we didn't let him come here and fired Book, so...no ineligibility questions.

I would find it shocking that we would not be part of that info drop given our association with the whole probe.

I don't know whether to do a restrained happy dance right now, or worry about the future of the game.

[SteveKerrsStroke]

Loooooooolllllllll Utah fans and Kyle Kuzma

[SteveKerrsStroke]

I also love that more people are suddenly now allowing themselves to separate the actions of the runners and players from the school.

[EVCat]

#FreeZo

#FreeSeanMiller

[Longhorned]

It’s good news, period.

But if the NCAA doesn’t have a Zo appeal on its schedule today, I do worry about the media’s and NCAA distraction from focusing on that injustice. No longer a big story.

[Spaceman Spiff]

You know how big this is?

Of the last 10 years of NCAA champions, UConn and Nova are the only schools not on this list.

[Main Event]

You have NO idea how happy I am to see Utah listed on there

[Longhorned]

Nova is documented with that record about its coaches.

[NYCat]

Quinerly to NC State

[Spaceman Spiff]

Nova is documented with that record about its coaches.

Oops, just UConn, then. And in fairness, UConn committed other documented violations during this period.

With Carter and Duke, the crazy irony of this is after Book took the FBI hit, our tourney chances may have massively improved just now.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Quinerly to NC State

DSJ got $43,500. The Pack have their own issues.

[Irish27]

Will we hear from Basnight now?

[DrWildcat]

I'm glad some names actually came out. Before this it was just a few schools, including us, and a bunch of speculation. Now these other, holier than thou programs have to answer.

[Spaceman Spiff]

every top 50 program for the last 25 years has paid for the vast majority of their top players.

the top, top programs pay for a much higher percentage due to the fact that they get a higher percentage of top players -- its been a know practice and somewhat accepted for as long as i can remember, and yes, Arizona is right there with the best of them.

the programs with the pedigree, resources, and willingness to "do what it takes" have had the clear advantage in landing the top stars.

where this falls on Adidas is that they have long been cornered with direct benefits to the teams they sponsor, whereas other programs like Arizona have had a deft process and tight secrecy.

Book exposed Arizona thru a channel it has never used, Adidas, for his own personal greed and gain -- not to mention 5k...and therein lies where all Arizona fans should be infuriated, fucking Book Richardson did this for 5k, 5 fucking k, and did so by going outside of the model that was so effective and un-penetrable up to this point.

so, its not about if the teams cheat, its how they cheat, and Arizona did it as good or better than anyone.

and one last thing, how do you guys think i know all the inside information i know? is it because you think i talk to Sean Miller everyday? or that Greg Byrne and Jim Livengood used to call me and tell me that Stanley Johnson was going to commit, or Aaron Gordon was coming to Arizona or that Chase Budinger was going to stay for his Jr year or that Sean Miller met with our main booster in Santa Fe or that John Calipari convinced Miller to come to AZ?

no, its because the web of involvement of people not directly affiliated with the program are intertwined in the mix, they are the ones who pull the strings and cover the man holes, and its like that at every school that handles their business effectively at this level.

its the darkest kept secret of of a 1000 or so people around the country at various universities who are not employees or staff members who are vital to the culture of college basketball today, and that culture is a culture of greed and billions and billions of dollars on the line.... from CBS and FOX to ESPN and Adidas and NIKE and Under Armor and Foot Locker and McDonalds and on and on and on.....

This is why I can't buy Longhorned's argument about restoring the game. Wooden's dynasty was built on payment in the 60's and 70's.

For what it's worth, I've posted about walking on to a D1 program. This was very much my experience in HS in the 90's and college in the early 2000's. Relationships are everything, and the relationships are inherently dirty. The entire process is basically speculative investment in 15-18 year olds.

Everyone is using the system for something, and it's been like that constantly.

I feel like I can claim victory about my cynicism today.

[btfd16]

My biggest take from today: who cares? For these schools, for us, for everybody. Don’t suspend anyone and change the rules