Re: Tommy Lloyd
Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:58 am
Move the goalposts much lol.TheCat wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:40 pm I guess when boosters say foreign player heavy rosters have not been shown as effective I would question that and the intelligence of those that said that. Ballo (foreigner) and Pelle (euro)are both starters on a team that was number 1 in the country. Mathurin was a foreign player. The leading scorer and rebounder last year Tubelis was a Euro. So arguably 4 our top players over the last 3 years have been Euro's or foreign guys.
Most first year coaches don't go to a sweet 16. Last year we were injured but underachieved in the tourney. We lost over 80% of our scoring this year and are back in the sweet 16. That is not done by a sub par coach.
Some people though Lute should have been fired for "under achieving" in the Tourney. Most judge him as a hall of famer.
I guess that is a bit disingenuous since most teams don't have a majority of Euro's (but you knew that right) but I would say Gonzaga multiple times is close but what the hell have they accomplished. No one is moving the goal post. Just pointing out boosters that don't think that foreigner are major contributors are idiots.Winger wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:57 pmMove the goalposts much lol.TheCat wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:40 pm I guess when boosters say foreign player heavy rosters have not been shown as effective I would question that and the intelligence of those that said that. Ballo (foreigner) and Pelle (euro)are both starters on a team that was number 1 in the country. Mathurin was a foreign player. The leading scorer and rebounder last year Tubelis was a Euro. So arguably 4 our top players over the last 3 years have been Euro's or foreign guys.
Most first year coaches don't go to a sweet 16. Last year we were injured but underachieved in the tourney. We lost over 80% of our scoring this year and are back in the sweet 16. That is not done by a sub par coach.
Some people though Lute should have been fired for "under achieving" in the Tourney. Most judge him as a hall of famer.
How many Euro, or even foreign-but-not-Euro, heavy rosters that have made Final Fours or won championships can you show me?
Guessing that number is: zero.
Gonzagas 2016-17 squad (which made it to the Championship game) had a boatload of EurosTheCat wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 6:53 pmI guess that is a bit disingenuous since most teams don't have a majority of Euro's (but you knew that right) but I would say Gonzaga multiple times is close but what the hell have they accomplished. No one is moving the goal post. Just pointing out boosters that don't think that foreigner are major contributors are idiots.Winger wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:57 pmMove the goalposts much lol.TheCat wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 5:40 pm I guess when boosters say foreign player heavy rosters have not been shown as effective I would question that and the intelligence of those that said that. Ballo (foreigner) and Pelle (euro)are both starters on a team that was number 1 in the country. Mathurin was a foreign player. The leading scorer and rebounder last year Tubelis was a Euro. So arguably 4 our top players over the last 3 years have been Euro's or foreign guys.
Most first year coaches don't go to a sweet 16. Last year we were injured but underachieved in the tourney. We lost over 80% of our scoring this year and are back in the sweet 16. That is not done by a sub par coach.
Some people though Lute should have been fired for "under achieving" in the Tourney. Most judge him as a hall of famer.
How many Euro, or even foreign-but-not-Euro, heavy rosters that have made Final Fours or won championships can you show me?
Guessing that number is: zero.
Oh and one team off the top of my head that comes close is Oregon final four team in 2016.
F 24 Dillon Brooks 6 ft 7 in (2.01 m) 225 lb (102 kg) Jr Findlay Prep Mississauga, Ontario
F 25 Chris Boucher (C) 6 ft 10 in (2.08 m) 200 lb (91 kg) Sr Northwest College Montreal, Quebec
G 31 Dylan Ennis 6 ft 2 in (1.88 m) 195 lb (88 kg) GS Villanova Brampton, Ontario
F 41 Roman Sorkin 6 ft 10 in (2.08 m) 225 lb (102 kg) Jr Hof HaSharon HS Ashdod, Isr
So how am I moving the goal post? I just showed you a team that made the final four that started 3 foreign players and one key reserve. You're the one that made the point that foreign players being an "unconventional roster composition" was an issue. Gonzaga when they had Rui was a team that had foreign contributors that made a final four.Winger wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:09 pm You’re moving the goalposts again. The issue isn’t “contributors”. The issue is: lack of ncaa tournament performance coupled the very unconventional roster composition when it comes to teams that have made F4s and won natties. When the AD is looking for folks to commit to $25,000 a year times 10 years this is something I have heard.
Again, getting past week 1 was helpful in this regard, imo, I think.
It seems like IF they had flamed out on Thursday SOME booster were going to be concerned.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:25 pm Again, how does 1 tournament appearance in the first 3 years for Miller warrant 9 more years but 3 in 3 years mean Tommy is on a hot seat?
The best way to increase your odds of winning is to make the tournament in the first place.
What surefire coach are you gonna get to replace him? These boosters sound like myopic tools, no offense.
Miller players his 1st year: Terry, Mathurin, Koloko, Kriisa, tubelis, Nowell who didn't playPostmaster wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 8:37 pmIt seems like IF they had flamed out on Thursday SOME booster were going to be concerned.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:25 pm Again, how does 1 tournament appearance in the first 3 years for Miller warrant 9 more years but 3 in 3 years mean Tommy is on a hot seat?
The best way to increase your odds of winning is to make the tournament in the first place.
What surefire coach are you gonna get to replace him? These boosters sound like myopic tools, no offense.
Year one, with CSM’s players, they struggle vs TCU and get worked by HOU.
Year two, still with a lot of CSM’s guys, they lose first game to an IVY league school.
I can see how some people might be a little worried. CTL had never been a HC and his focus has been on Euro recruiting. Multiple times I’ve heard that some of the Euros say that tournaments aren’t a big deal because they play a lot of tournaments in Europe every season.
I don’t think the boosters were on the verge of trying to dump him. He did get his contract before this weekend.
Aren’t the Stevens firmly in his corner.
People get frustrated and anxious. Especially if you factor in the other sports here. They vent, they calm down, they write a check.
Did Heeke have anything to do with hiring CTL?
Edit: I don’t consider Canadians the same as Euros, at least regarding U18 basketball.
That’s the point. When CTL only had a couple of CSM’s players he lost in first round.RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 9:05 pmMiller players his 1st year: Terry, Mathurin, Koloko, Kriisa, tubelis, Nowell who didn't playPostmaster wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 8:37 pmIt seems like IF they had flamed out on Thursday SOME booster were going to be concerned.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:25 pm Again, how does 1 tournament appearance in the first 3 years for Miller warrant 9 more years but 3 in 3 years mean Tommy is on a hot seat?
The best way to increase your odds of winning is to make the tournament in the first place.
What surefire coach are you gonna get to replace him? These boosters sound like myopic tools, no offense.
Year one, with CSM’s players, they struggle vs TCU and get worked by HOU.
Year two, still with a lot of CSM’s guys, they lose first game to an IVY league school.
I can see how some people might be a little worried. CTL had never been a HC and his focus has been on Euro recruiting. Multiple times I’ve heard that some of the Euros say that tournaments aren’t a big deal because they play a lot of tournaments in Europe every season.
I don’t think the boosters were on the verge of trying to dump him. He did get his contract before this weekend.
Aren’t the Stevens firmly in his corner.
People get frustrated and anxious. Especially if you factor in the other sports here. They vent, they calm down, they write a check.
Did Heeke have anything to do with hiring CTL?
Edit: I don’t consider Canadians the same as Euros, at least regarding U18 basketball.
Mathurin, Terry, Koloko all were far better in Lloyd's system than Miller's. I mean just go at what they looked like before. Look at what Miller did with 3 similar NBA players on his roster with Mannion (yes he got some NBA mins), Green, Nnaji.
Miller players in his 2nd year: Tubelis, Kerr - that's not a lot of Miller players.
Not fighting with you here ftr, just discussing. Postmaster hits on a bunch of it above and you have to understand that I was offering speculation about how the money would have reacted to not making it out of this past weekend - murmurs not pitchforks.TheCat wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 8:32 pmSo how am I moving the goal post? I just showed you a team that made the final four that started 3 foreign players and one key reserve. You're the one that made the point that foreign players being an "unconventional roster composition" was an issue. Gonzaga when they had Rui was a team that had foreign contributors that made a final four.Winger wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:09 pm You’re moving the goalposts again. The issue isn’t “contributors”. The issue is: lack of ncaa tournament performance coupled the very unconventional roster composition when it comes to teams that have made F4s and won natties. When the AD is looking for folks to commit to $25,000 a year times 10 years this is something I have heard.
Again, getting past week 1 was helpful in this regard, imo, I think.
Since it is important getting past the first weekend isn't 2/3 of the time Lloyd has been there good enough? Why do you think they thought that was critical to Tommy when donors loved Sean Miller even when his reputation took a hit job and we didn't get to participate in the tourney?
In my experience donors contribute because they have a connection or love for the university or the community. If that wasn't true we would not have a single contributor to the football team before last year and as you know we had major contributors (Coles for one) when we were shit. If they are only asking for $25K/year for major donors I want my $10K back for a bench 15 years ago.
Fact: Gonzaga (guess who was the assistant) andy Houston (four) entered this NCAA tournament with an active streak of two or more Sweet 16s in a row. Tommy has made it two out of 3. The game is not the same as it was 4 years ago.Winger wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:23 amNot fighting with you here ftr, just discussing. Postmaster hits on a bunch of it above and you have to understand that I was offering speculation about how the money would have reacted to not making it out of this past weekend - murmurs not pitchforks.TheCat wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 8:32 pmSo how am I moving the goal post? I just showed you a team that made the final four that started 3 foreign players and one key reserve. You're the one that made the point that foreign players being an "unconventional roster composition" was an issue. Gonzaga when they had Rui was a team that had foreign contributors that made a final four.Winger wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:09 pm You’re moving the goalposts again. The issue isn’t “contributors”. The issue is: lack of ncaa tournament performance coupled the very unconventional roster composition when it comes to teams that have made F4s and won natties. When the AD is looking for folks to commit to $25,000 a year times 10 years this is something I have heard.
Again, getting past week 1 was helpful in this regard, imo, I think.
Since it is important getting past the first weekend isn't 2/3 of the time Lloyd has been there good enough? Why do you think they thought that was critical to Tommy when donors loved Sean Miller even when his reputation took a hit job and we didn't get to participate in the tourney?
In my experience donors contribute because they have a connection or love for the university or the community. If that wasn't true we would not have a single contributor to the football team before last year and as you know we had major contributors (Coles for one) when we were shit. If they are only asking for $25K/year for major donors I want my $10K back for a bench 15 years ago.
You move the posts by taking a very specific factor — lack of NCAA tournament success — which, when coupled with another specific factor — the unconventional roster of 8 or more foreign born players — and respond with a bunch of things that are not related to either topic. You double down on that by noting that 1 team has been successful one time (that Gonzaga NC team did not have a bunch of Euros, they had 1, Premek, and another guy who played 10 minutes).
From the standpoint of the opposite side of the fence from you, Lloyd got extremely lucky to get past TCU and then his #1 seeded team got completely worked and out toughed (an issue for Euros) by Houston in a game they were never in and then as a 2-seed got blasted by Princeton in the first round.
If Arizona had not made it out of the 1st round this year as a 2-seed again I believe folks would have started murmuring more than they have been behind the scenes.
That is why I posted above that I thought it was pretty big for Lloyd to have made it past that.
There’s a foreignness factor with Euros too. With a language/accent barrier I would bet there are some older people with deep pockets who love to hobnob with the team who might be thinking “damn kids can’t get out of the first round and on top of that I can’t understand half what they’re saying” and it may contribute to their dim-witted narrow-minded view of Tommy and the team and what it takes to put a winning squad on the court.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:26 am I think it just depends on the players you get when it comes to Euros. You can say most aren't built for the physicality of the American game but Pelle sure as hell is built like a tank.
So if losing to a lower seed is the issue then Coach K and Self would be fired. If Gonzaga plays into the narrative then I guess we don't want to play in a lot of championship games. It is a bad narrative to have and the only idiots that can make it live in the bluegrass state.Winger wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:52 am It may be helpful for you to understand that until very recently, Gonzaga’s/Few’s/Lloyd’s LACK of NCAA tournament success was an issue for those that care about these kinds of things. Losing ahead of seed-expectation, losing almost every NCAA tournament game it played to a highly seeded opponent, never making a Final Four, etc. In that regard, Gonzaga plays into this issue for Lloyd at Arizona negatively.
I am going to exit here, as we are discussing something that is 1) speculation and 2) a negative and 3) didn’t happen lol, and I feel like I am littering.
Those guys have rings, unfortunately.TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 10:04 amSo if losing to a lower seed is the issue then Coach K and Self would be fired. If Gonzaga plays into the narrative then I guess we don't want to play in a lot of championship games. It is a bad narrative to have and the only idiots that can make it live in the bluegrass state.Winger wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:52 am It may be helpful for you to understand that until very recently, Gonzaga’s/Few’s/Lloyd’s LACK of NCAA tournament success was an issue for those that care about these kinds of things. Losing ahead of seed-expectation, losing almost every NCAA tournament game it played to a highly seeded opponent, never making a Final Four, etc. In that regard, Gonzaga plays into this issue for Lloyd at Arizona negatively.
I am going to exit here, as we are discussing something that is 1) speculation and 2) a negative and 3) didn’t happen lol, and I feel like I am littering.
For Few and Gonzaga, what is fairly recently for you?Winger wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:52 am It may be helpful for you to understand that until very recently, Gonzaga’s/Few’s/Lloyd’s LACK of NCAA tournament success was an issue for those that care about these kinds of things. Losing ahead of seed-expectation, losing almost every NCAA tournament game it played to a highly seeded opponent, never making a Final Four, etc. In that regard, Gonzaga plays into this issue for Lloyd at Arizona negatively.
I am going to exit here, as we are discussing something that is 1) speculation and 2) a negative and 3) didn’t happen lol, and I feel like I am littering.
Also,Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 7:07 amThere’s a foreignness factor with Euros too. With a language/accent barrier I would bet there are some older people with deep pockets who love to hobnob with the team who might be thinking “damn kids can’t get out of the first round and on top of that I can’t understand half what they’re saying” and it may contribute to their dim-witted narrow-minded view of Tommy and the team and what it takes to put a winning squad on the court.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:26 am I think it just depends on the players you get when it comes to Euros. You can say most aren't built for the physicality of the American game but Pelle sure as hell is built like a tank.
Winning cures all that bullshit though as Winger points out. Get us to a Final Four and no one will care if these kids are big green men from Mars.
The thing with Tommy is that he casts too wide a net with his international recruiting. It's his crutch, his security blanket. Case in point, I can't think of anyone on this board who consistently complained about Dusan, Lauri and Tubelis (tournament notwithstanding). You have to be selective in who you pick because recruiting misses can set you back for years. There's too big a gap with the level of physicality, aggressiveness and athleticism in American hoops.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:26 am I think it just depends on the players you get when it comes to Euros. You can say most aren't built for the physicality of the American game but Pelle sure as hell is built like a tank.
Don't understand the obsession with recruiting anymore. Recruits matter less and less every year as upperclassmen have been dominating the tournament over these last few years. Look at Kentucky. Tommy has a pretty good class coming, all American kids, but don't get too excited about it because the likelihood of instant high impact is very small.RawleArenas wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:20 amThe thing with Tommy is that he casts too wide a net with his international recruiting. It's his crutch, his security blanket. Case in point, I can't think of anyone on this board who consistently complained about Dusan, Lauri and Tubelis (tournament notwithstanding). You have to be selective in who you pick because recruiting misses can set you back for years. There's too big a gap with the level of physicality, aggressiveness and athleticism in American hoops.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:26 am I think it just depends on the players you get when it comes to Euros. You can say most aren't built for the physicality of the American game but Pelle sure as hell is built like a tank.
I would say that there are only a handful of international players every year (maybe less) that can make the transition on day one. Lauri was one of them. Lloyd's gonna have to retool his model because he won't be able to use his farm system in the Big 12.
Not with NIL, kids are staying longer. Look at Love, he would've already entered the NBA draft and not gotten drafted and been in the G league or something.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:44 am Yeah except once all those covid kids are out of the system it'll probably go back to how it was in regards to team makeup
This is true. UNC’s average age is basically the same as the OKC Thunder’s (around 22.5 years old).RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:37 amDon't understand the obsession with recruiting anymore. Recruits matter less and less every year as upperclassmen have been dominating the tournament over these last few years. Look at Kentucky. Tommy has a pretty good class coming, all American kids, but don't get too excited about it because the likelihood of instant high impact is very small.RawleArenas wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:20 amThe thing with Tommy is that he casts too wide a net with his international recruiting. It's his crutch, his security blanket. Case in point, I can't think of anyone on this board who consistently complained about Dusan, Lauri and Tubelis (tournament notwithstanding). You have to be selective in who you pick because recruiting misses can set you back for years. There's too big a gap with the level of physicality, aggressiveness and athleticism in American hoops.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:26 am I think it just depends on the players you get when it comes to Euros. You can say most aren't built for the physicality of the American game but Pelle sure as hell is built like a tank.
I would say that there are only a handful of international players every year (maybe less) that can make the transition on day one. Lauri was one of them. Lloyd's gonna have to retool his model because he won't be able to use his farm system in the Big 12.
It's all about grad transfers now. Grown men are dominating these past few years. We should actually be less reliant on recruiting from now on.
If we do face them, this could be significant considering out starting PG is barely old enough for his bar mitzvah.Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 12:28 pmThis is true. UNC’s average age is basically the same as the OKC Thunder’s (around 22.5 years old).RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:37 amDon't understand the obsession with recruiting anymore. Recruits matter less and less every year as upperclassmen have been dominating the tournament over these last few years. Look at Kentucky. Tommy has a pretty good class coming, all American kids, but don't get too excited about it because the likelihood of instant high impact is very small.RawleArenas wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:20 amThe thing with Tommy is that he casts too wide a net with his international recruiting. It's his crutch, his security blanket. Case in point, I can't think of anyone on this board who consistently complained about Dusan, Lauri and Tubelis (tournament notwithstanding). You have to be selective in who you pick because recruiting misses can set you back for years. There's too big a gap with the level of physicality, aggressiveness and athleticism in American hoops.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:26 am I think it just depends on the players you get when it comes to Euros. You can say most aren't built for the physicality of the American game but Pelle sure as hell is built like a tank.
I would say that there are only a handful of international players every year (maybe less) that can make the transition on day one. Lauri was one of them. Lloyd's gonna have to retool his model because he won't be able to use his farm system in the Big 12.
It's all about grad transfers now. Grown men are dominating these past few years. We should actually be less reliant on recruiting from now on.
Feel like this is virtually a rhetorical question, but Keshad. No question.RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:56 am Would you guys rather have Cody Williams, top 5-10 recruit, Kwame Evans, top 20 recruit, or Keshad Johnson for one year? (Both of these kids turned Tommy down last year)
Not according to the fake ID he showed that Vegas pit boss.Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 12:37 pm If we do face them, this could be significant considering out starting PG is barely old enough for his bar mitzvah.
Calipari's time has passed. He's gotten increasingly peevish and ineffective recently, and I gotta think that's taking some wind out of his team's sails here and there. Certainly in March. He should be fishing and golfing, not humiliating 19 year olds.Catintheheat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:55 am The best coaches were always going after the top rated talent, but that hasn't been working, as John Calipari is starting to realize. The transfer portal is important, but recruiting players who want to follow the process is important too.
Chicat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 12:43 pmNot according to the fake ID he showed that Vegas pit boss.Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 12:37 pm If we do face them, this could be significant considering out starting PG is barely old enough for his bar mitzvah.
Slight correction not all Tommy's recruits are American. One is from NBA Africa I think. I agree that portal players are much more productive than freshman. There was a comparison of top freshman to portal guys on who is scoring more than 10 points a game. By far it was the portal guys. I think it will always be a mixture but the portal allows you to rebuild a team overnight. Just look at us. I think the results of our current portal guys will make us attractive to others and I think that is important.RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:37 amDon't understand the obsession with recruiting anymore. Recruits matter less and less every year as upperclassmen have been dominating the tournament over these last few years. Look at Kentucky. Tommy has a pretty good class coming, all American kids, but don't get too excited about it because the likelihood of instant high impact is very small.RawleArenas wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:20 amThe thing with Tommy is that he casts too wide a net with his international recruiting. It's his crutch, his security blanket. Case in point, I can't think of anyone on this board who consistently complained about Dusan, Lauri and Tubelis (tournament notwithstanding). You have to be selective in who you pick because recruiting misses can set you back for years. There's too big a gap with the level of physicality, aggressiveness and athleticism in American hoops.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:26 am I think it just depends on the players you get when it comes to Euros. You can say most aren't built for the physicality of the American game but Pelle sure as hell is built like a tank.
I would say that there are only a handful of international players every year (maybe less) that can make the transition on day one. Lauri was one of them. Lloyd's gonna have to retool his model because he won't be able to use his farm system in the Big 12.
It's all about grad transfers now. Grown men are dominating these past few years. We should actually be less reliant on recruiting from now on.
Well the G league is gone after this year so there might be more for the pickings.RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:52 amNot with NIL, kids are staying longer. Look at Love, he would've already entered the NBA draft and not gotten drafted and been in the G league or something.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:44 am Yeah except once all those covid kids are out of the system it'll probably go back to how it was in regards to team makeup
I don't think it's the whole league, just that one team. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:30 pmWell the G league is gone after this year so there might be more for the pickings.RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:52 amNot with NIL, kids are staying longer. Look at Love, he would've already entered the NBA draft and not gotten drafted and been in the G league or something.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:44 am Yeah except once all those covid kids are out of the system it'll probably go back to how it was in regards to team makeup
"The NBA announced on Thursday that it is shutting down the G League Ignite program after only four seasons. It's been more than a disappointing showing in the 2023-24 season with the Ignite currently 4-28."
I wonder if that kid (guard) we were chasing from NBA Africa that decide to go to the G league Ignite is back on the burner. Can't remember his name.
Yep, just IgniteUAEebs86 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:35 pmI don't think it's the whole league, just that one team. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:30 pmWell the G league is gone after this year so there might be more for the pickings.RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:52 amNot with NIL, kids are staying longer. Look at Love, he would've already entered the NBA draft and not gotten drafted and been in the G league or something.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:44 am Yeah except once all those covid kids are out of the system it'll probably go back to how it was in regards to team makeup
"The NBA announced on Thursday that it is shutting down the G League Ignite program after only four seasons. It's been more than a disappointing showing in the 2023-24 season with the Ignite currently 4-28."
I wonder if that kid (guard) we were chasing from NBA Africa that decide to go to the G league Ignite is back on the burner. Can't remember his name.
Not sure what Gonzaga team that Premek was on but the one I was talking about had Rui Hachimura, Przemeh Karnowshi (should recognize his name), Killian Tille and Dustin Triano. So not sure how that is doubling down when I said the majority of teams don't have many foreign players. I have named two off the top of my head that had many Euro's/foreign players that went to the final four. Not just on the team but some that were significant players. I think the boosters you are talking to want the old Indiana Team with Ken Benson. Euro are dominating the mock NBA early picks and you might have heard of the one that is currently with the Spurs (although no college team).Winger wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:23 amTheCat wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 8:32 pmSo how am I moving the goal post? I just showed you a team that made the final four that started 3 foreign players and one key reserve. You're the one that made the point that foreign players being an "unconventional roster composition" was an issue. Gonzaga when they had Rui was a team that had foreign contributors that made a final four.Winger wrote: ↑Sun Mar 24, 2024 7:09 pm You’re moving the goalposts again. The issue isn’t “contributors”. The issue is: lack of ncaa tournament performance coupled the very unconventional roster composition when it comes to teams that have made F4s and won natties. When the AD is looking for folks to commit to $25,000 a year times 10 years this is something I have heard.
Again, getting past week 1 was helpful in this regard, imo, I think.
Since it is important getting past the first weekend isn't 2/3 of the time Lloyd has been there good enough? Why do you think they thought that was critical to Tommy when donors loved Sean Miller even when his reputation took a hit job and we didn't get to participate in the tourney?
In my experience donors contribute because they have a connection or love for the university or the community. If that wasn't true we would not have a single contributor to the football team before last year and as you know we had major contributors (Coles for one) when we were shit. If they are only asking for $25K/year for major donors I want my $10K back for a bench 15 years ago.
You move the posts by taking a very specific factor — lack of NCAA tournament success — which, when coupled with another specific factor — the unconventional roster of 8 or more foreign born players — and respond with a bunch of things that are not related to either topic. You double down on that by noting that 1 team has been successful one time (that Gonzaga NC team did not have a bunch of Euros, they had 1, Premek, and another guy who played 10 minutes).
I believe this is the guy you are referring to???TheCat wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 4:30 pmWell the G league is gone after this year so there might be more for the pickings.RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:52 amNot with NIL, kids are staying longer. Look at Love, he would've already entered the NBA draft and not gotten drafted and been in the G league or something.Fishclamps wrote: ↑Mon Mar 25, 2024 11:44 am Yeah except once all those covid kids are out of the system it'll probably go back to how it was in regards to team makeup
"The NBA announced on Thursday that it is shutting down the G League Ignite program after only four seasons. It's been more than a disappointing showing in the 2023-24 season with the Ignite currently 4-28."
I wonder if that kid (guard) we were chasing from NBA Africa that decide to go to the G league Ignite is back on the burner. Can't remember his name.
Thanks for the link.
WTF!!! Robins & Heeke...Winger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 28, 2024 9:33 amThanks for the link.
It wasn’t all of their own doing, and I respect their angst at the time and their standing to voice that; but the Arizona greats hadn’t been around the program in a while, and never understood that none of them had the chops required to be Arizona’s head coach.
I felt Robbins’ interviews of the Arizona greats also were for show, and a bad idea, but it wasn’t Rooney Rule, it was Olson Rule. Not as bad an idea as interviewing Mussleman but a bad idea none the less.
Lloyd checked every box aside from the head coaching experience one. West coast coach. Principal member of a staff with well more than a decade of elite performance. Recruiting resume that was elite and included American as well as foreign players. Was going to run the kind of system that Arizona fans would enjoy. No skeletons. Good in front of the microphone. Would honor the tradition and rebuild the family atmosphere that had been lacking for about 15 years. Young enough to withstand any hostile NCAA penalties (an important factor for Robbins).
Obviously no one could have predicted the number of wins and the immediate and sustained success but you give a guy like Lloyd a program like Arizona and you’re going to succeed far more often that not.
Which is something the Arizona greats either never understood or set aside as they lobbied for one of their own.
Imo coaching searches are a scoreboard game and you need to leave all of the “process was screwed up”, “they lucked in to him/her”, “how could you consider/interview Coach Nochops?”, etc.