Bear Down Wildcats

Sentencing moved to June 6 now

Anyone else see any irony that Michigan just hired Juwan Howard?
I mean the violations of the fab five cost MI 2 seasons of vacating, IIRC.
Now all the talking heads think it’s great that he will be the head coach.

Postmaster wrote:Anyone else see any irony that Michigan just hired Juwan Howard?
I mean the violations of the fab five cost MI 2 seasons of vacating, IIRC.
Now all the talking heads think it’s great that he will be the head coach.

Yeah, so he can navigate the murky Waters of running a "competitive" program.

Maybe they hope he's the next Penny hardaway.

Postmaster wrote:Anyone else see any irony that Michigan just hired Juwan Howard?
I mean the violations of the fab five cost MI 2 seasons of vacating, IIRC.
Now all the talking heads think it’s great that he will be the head coach.

Big fan of Howard (grew up a Michigan fan, lived in AA for a bit), know the Fab Five story front to back, obviously I'm deeply in on the current NCAA scandals.... and this didn't even cross my mind.

My brain is short circuiting trying to make sense of how Michigan was able to roll this out ("We replaced the cleanest coach in CBB with one of the players from our most famous scandal.") without the internet/media just catching fire... but like ChiCat said, its all about perceived villainy and not what actual has happened. Same reason Sean Miller is the most notorious coach in CBB and Bruce Pearl is just such a swell guy (despite Pearl habitually violating NCAA regulations and lying to their face about it).

Has Miller been arrested yet?

azgreg wrote:Has Miller been arrested yet?

The Sergeant at Arms is on his way now, I hear.

YoDeFoe wrote:

azgreg wrote:Has Miller been arrested yet?

The Sergeant at Arms is on his way now, I hear.

He was just spotted on the U of A "Mall" headed towards Mckale. Looked pretty determined and angry. Someone was able to take a couple of pics shown here...

Iirc, Howard is from Chicago, the whole fab 5 scandal involved a booster from detroint that was helping out local kids with promise. Weber was the one that was most tied to the ordeal. I'm not sure juwan was much involved. But I could be wrong.

U.P. Zona Fan wrote:Iirc, Howard is from Chicago, the whole fab 5 scandal involved a booster from detroint that was helping out local kids with promise. Weber was the one that was most tied to the ordeal. I'm not sure juwan was much involved. But I could be wrong.

You remember correctly: Howard was never implicated.

AZ files victim impact statement with the government

https://247sports.com/college/arizona/A ... 132505089/" target="_blank

MUST READ: https://247sports.com/college/arizona/A ... 132505089/" target="_blank

Arizona’s letter to the DOJ regarding Book Richardson’s conduct, its impact for Arizona (including “false” reporting!!), and some notes in support of leniency for Book.

Must read for all fans looking for more more public comments by Arizona in our defense. I very much approve of the tone and contents of the letter and hope that once sentencing is completed, we can be more forward with these kinds of statements.

If the NCAA determines that none of the funding provided to Book Richardson went to any player (and it sure sounds like none did), why should any penalty be substantial? But we are talking about the NCAA so who knows.

The Jack Murphy makes me question what might happen to Arizona here. You would like to think that Murphy would demand that he get the whole story from Miller before he resigned a head coaching job to become an assistant. Makes me think that hardly anything if not nothing is going to happen to Arizona here.

azgreg wrote:The Jack Murphy makes me question what might happen to Arizona here. You would like to think that Murphy would demand that he get the whole story from Miller before he resigned a head coaching job to become an assistant. Makes me think that hardly anything if not nothing is going to happen to Arizona here.

Murph was on thin ice at NAU. He'd had three or four really bad seasons in a row and even though the team is trending in the right direction, another sub-par year might have gotten him fired. I think he's being smart and proactive with his situation at NAU as opposed to this saying a lot about our prospects for getting our asses gaped by the NCAA.

YoDeFoe wrote:MUST READ: https://247sports.com/college/arizona/A ... 132505089/" target="_blank

Arizona’s letter to the DOJ regarding Book Richardson’s conduct, its impact for Arizona (including “false” reporting!!), and some notes in support of leniency for Book.

Must read for all fans looking for more more public comments by Arizona in our defense. I very much approve of the tone and contents of the letter and hope that once sentencing is completed, we can be more forward with these kinds of statements.

That letter is very well done. With the $ we spent on legal representation, it's nice to see we got our money's worth. It strikes the right tone and begins charting our course with the NCAA.

Chicat wrote:

azgreg wrote:The Jack Murphy makes me question what might happen to Arizona here. You would like to think that Murphy would demand that he get the whole story from Miller before he resigned a head coaching job to become an assistant. Makes me think that hardly anything if not nothing is going to happen to Arizona here.

Murph was on thin ice at NAU. He'd had three or four really bad seasons in a row and even though the team is trending in the right direction, another sub-par year might have gotten him fired. I think he's being smart and proactive with his situation at NAU as opposed to this saying a lot about our prospects for getting our asses gaped by the NCAA.

Don't rain on my rainbow man.

azgreg wrote:

Chicat wrote:

azgreg wrote:The Jack Murphy makes me question what might happen to Arizona here. You would like to think that Murphy would demand that he get the whole story from Miller before he resigned a head coaching job to become an assistant. Makes me think that hardly anything if not nothing is going to happen to Arizona here.

Murph was on thin ice at NAU. He'd had three or four really bad seasons in a row and even though the team is trending in the right direction, another sub-par year might have gotten him fired. I think he's being smart and proactive with his situation at NAU as opposed to this saying a lot about our prospects for getting our asses gaped by the NCAA.

Don't rain on my rainbow man.

Would you rather I pee on your leg and tell you it's raining?

The Murphy hire makes a lot of sense. He'll either do a couple years with us and then put his name out there for HC openings, or he'll stick with us and be in a good position for our own HC job should things go south with Miller.

RJ was on social media over the weekend praising the move. It's usually a good sign when former players are excited about a coaching hire.

Beachcat97 wrote:The Murphy hire makes a lot of sense. He'll either do a couple years with us and then put his name out there for HC openings, or he'll stick with us and be in a good position for our own HC job should things go south with Miller.

RJ was on social media over the weekend praising the move. It's usually a good sign when former players are excited about a coaching hire.

Luke Walton LOVES the hire.

Chicat wrote:

azgreg wrote:

Chicat wrote:

azgreg wrote:The Jack Murphy makes me question what might happen to Arizona here. You would like to think that Murphy would demand that he get the whole story from Miller before he resigned a head coaching job to become an assistant. Makes me think that hardly anything if not nothing is going to happen to Arizona here.

Murph was on thin ice at NAU. He'd had three or four really bad seasons in a row and even though the team is trending in the right direction, another sub-par year might have gotten him fired. I think he's being smart and proactive with his situation at NAU as opposed to this saying a lot about our prospects for getting our asses gaped by the NCAA.

Don't rain on my rainbow man.

Would you rather I pee on your leg and tell you it's raining?

I'm not falling for that again.

Worth underscoring that with this hire, the entire assistant coaching staff is A) clean of any of the allegations of impropriety, B) "high character" guys, first and foremost, and C) former Arizona guys + a former Miller player.

As we're presenting our case to the NCAA, I'm sure (A) will be emphasized and (B) will give the us confidence that we can toe the line successfully moving forward.

I also heard NAU has a new AD so even higher likelihood of Murphy getting the Axe.

Irish27 wrote:

Oh my gosh! Will he ever stop? He just can’t admit how bias he has become. Hope we play well enough this year that ESPN has no choice to come visit McKale on one of those Saturday mornings - by public demand. Maybe by then Arizona will be cleared as the nation watches ESPN have to kiss our ass....

What a public disgrace. Innocent until proven guilty? Right. Not according to Vital...

But Bruce Pearl should be SEC coach of year.

Chicat wrote:

azgreg wrote:The Jack Murphy makes me question what might happen to Arizona here. You would like to think that Murphy would demand that he get the whole story from Miller before he resigned a head coaching job to become an assistant. Makes me think that hardly anything if not nothing is going to happen to Arizona here.

Murph was on thin ice at NAU. He'd had three or four really bad seasons in a row and even though the team is trending in the right direction, another sub-par year might have gotten him fired. I think he's being smart and proactive with his situation at NAU as opposed to this saying a lot about our prospects for getting our asses gaped by the NCAA.

He had been given a one year "win or else" command from the AD up there.

And it is really, really, really tough to win at NAU. Flagstaff is not a great place to recruit basketball players to, and the Dome facilities were outdated about 20 years ago. The open basketball court on a football floor thing is silly...they never curtained it off. Idaho State has a similar structure, and they used heavy curtains to create an arena feel.

Howland had success with a type of play that is now the standard..."recruit to shoot" with big men stepping out and hitting deep. He targeted dead eye shooters from all over the US and Canada, and found the gems. Plus, he could coach. Mike Adras buzzed off of that for a while as the assistant that remained in town and took the program over, but his success waned over time. Murph may not have been ready to be a head coach, but he also picked the absolute toughest program to rebuild. NAU would be better off playing home games at the Rolle Activity center, like they do when there is a football conflict...a little gym, but packed with 2000 people and some atmosphere.

Murph's clear failure up there was going for the out of state kid when there was a reasonable in-state option. He never built a connection to the program. He recruited pretty well early, but kids just transferred out after a year or two in Flag. If he could have kept his best players over the last 3 years, he would have a pretty amazing team. But Flag is Flag...a great Cross Country town, but not exactly a fertile ground for basketball. Add that Flagstaff, as a populous, has grown to resent the hell out of NAU as the school has grown way too fast and busted the seams of a town that barely had the infrastructure to carry its own residents. The City has worked with the school to condemn and gentrify the very little affordable housing in West Flag to build Hubs/dorms. So Flag residents don't have warm fuzzies about their home team. At all.

For NAU to compete in basketball again, the new coach needs to look in-state more, definitely take any player from the Flag area that might be able to play (especially a Rez player), and NAU has to build some kind of arena...something small, but the Dome is not working. That will never happen under Rita Cheung as president...

EvCat, I don't know as much as you do about NAU basketball, but Howland was/is an exceptional coach, and NAU has one of the many programs across This Great Land of Ours that very few coaches could ever dig their way out of to not be fired, let alone to a head coaching job at Pitt. The rise of GCU has only made it worse. I can't imagine how anyone could see Murphy's time there as a mark against him.

I've played a few games at NAU in the dome in the late 90's. It's a really weird experience. They have the court and stands set up, but it's just yawning open space after them. The sound dissipates, and it feels like you're playing on a court that got dropped on the surface of the moon. You're surrounded by so much dead space where nothing is happening and it seems like all the energy just gets sucked into the nothing.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:I've played a few games at NAU in the dome in the late 90's. It's a really weird experience. They have the court and stands set up, but it's just yawning open space after them. The sound dissipates, and it feels like you're playing on a court that got dropped on the surface of the moon. You're surrounded by so much dead space where nothing is happening and it seems like all the energy just gets sucked into the nothing.

And is it still just the same today? What you describe is what it was like when I was a kid in the 80s. Some friends and I once left our seats and watched the game laying on the astroturf behind the basket, like kids laying on the carpet in front of the TV. Nobody asked us to move or anything.

Postmaster wrote:But Bruce Pearl should be SEC coach of year.

I just want to emphasize how fucking absurd the handling of Pearl vs Miller has been (which the above is winking at).

Miller has never, ever, been found in violation of NCAA regulations. He's been a head coach since 2004.

Bruce Pearl's career has been a long road of scandal and backstabbing. Article here.

Longhorned wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:I've played a few games at NAU in the dome in the late 90's. It's a really weird experience. They have the court and stands set up, but it's just yawning open space after them. The sound dissipates, and it feels like you're playing on a court that got dropped on the surface of the moon. You're surrounded by so much dead space where nothing is happening and it seems like all the energy just gets sucked into the nothing.

And is it still just the same today? What you describe is what it was like when I was a kid in the 80s. Some friends and I once left our seats and watched the game laying on the astroturf behind the basket, like kids laying on the carpet in front of the TV. Nobody asked us to move or anything.

From the NAU games I've seen, it looks the same. The issue with their dome is they don't have corners. Domes like Syracuse can create a more intimate environment by using the corner to create a smaller area for the court and curtaining off the rest.

NAU has to lay the court out parallel to the football sideline so there are basically 50 yards of space behind each basket, and another 50 or so across to the other football bleacher.

They can't really drop the curtain, so 3 directions have yawning space behind them. Even the direction with football stands, the stands go so far and so high without fans that stuff gets lost. On TV, it looks like the same setup without curtains.

I'm not even sure curtains would help. It would give a weird enclosed dimension with an incredibly high roof. Domes like Syracuse sort of work because the layout can flow with 3 sides of normal stands. NAU has one side of normal stands, max.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

Longhorned wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:I've played a few games at NAU in the dome in the late 90's. It's a really weird experience. They have the court and stands set up, but it's just yawning open space after them. The sound dissipates, and it feels like you're playing on a court that got dropped on the surface of the moon. You're surrounded by so much dead space where nothing is happening and it seems like all the energy just gets sucked into the nothing.

And is it still just the same today? What you describe is what it was like when I was a kid in the 80s. Some friends and I once left our seats and watched the game laying on the astroturf behind the basket, like kids laying on the carpet in front of the TV. Nobody asked us to move or anything.

From the NAU games I've seen, it looks the same. The issue with their dome is they don't have corners. Domes like Syracuse can create a more intimate environment by using the corner to create a smaller area for the court and curtaining off the rest.

NAU has to lay the court out parallel to the football sideline so there are basically 50 yards of space behind each basket, and another 50 or so across to the other football bleacher.

They can't really drop the curtain, so 3 directions have yawning space behind them. Even the direction with football stands, the stands go so far and so high without fans that stuff gets lost. On TV, it looks like the same setup without curtains.

I'm not even sure curtains would help. It would give a weird enclosed dimension with an incredibly high roof. Domes like Syracuse sort of work because the layout can flow with 3 sides of normal stands. NAU has one side of normal stands, max.

It all goes back to being so dated. In the 1970s, domed stadiums were thought of as modern all-purpose sports venues. Seattle was so excited when the Sonics moved into the King Dome. Same with the Spurs to the Alamodome in the early 1990s. Everyone eventually realized they had to get back into arenas.

The exception is the Final Four, where the experience is awful for the fans in the stadium and even the TV viewers feel the loss of energy, but at least you can fill the place to a basketball limit, if not a football limit.

Domes only work for blending in football as part of a multi-use facility. Everything other than football and baseball can be covered in a basketball sized multi-use facility. Concerts, other sports, your standard basketball size is preferable.

With domes, people figured out it was a crappy fan experience for anything but football. Even baseball, the Kingdome, Metrodome, etc experience was bad. I do think current indoor football stadiums do a much better job integrating fans into things that aren't football.

NAU just still has a retro dome, and a crappy one. The way the stands are set up, it's big without a lot of people. I've never been to a football game there, but on TV, it looks like the atmosphere sucks.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: NAU just still has a retro dome, and a crappy one. The way the stands are set up, it's big without a lot of people. I've never been to a football game there, but on TV, it looks like the atmosphere sucks.

My sister went to NAU. I only went to one football game there when she was a Freshman. I think it was family weekend and despite it being pretty lively outside the stadium, from the start the atmosphere inside was super dull. Definitely didn't help that it was a blowout, probably the least exciting game I have ever seen in person.

The only noteworthy thing I remember was getting one of these pretty nice T-shirts. Probably the #1 perk of having a dome.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I'm not even sure curtains would help. It would give a weird enclosed dimension with an incredibly high roof. Domes like Syracuse sort of work because the layout can flow with 3 sides of normal stands. NAU has one side of normal stands, max.

It is Idaho, not Idaho State. I goofed that. Here is a youtube video of the transformation



I found this write up on their school AD site with some specs

https://govandals.com/facilities/?id=2

The dome there is similar to NAU...two sides, square. They just curtain the crap out of it

EVCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote: I'm not even sure curtains would help. It would give a weird enclosed dimension with an incredibly high roof. Domes like Syracuse sort of work because the layout can flow with 3 sides of normal stands. NAU has one side of normal stands, max.

It is Idaho, not Idaho State. I goofed that. Here is a youtube video of the transformation



I found this write up on their school AD site with some specs

https://govandals.com/facilities/?id=2

The dome there is similar to NAU...two sides, square. They just curtain the crap out of it

"Facility Facts:
-575 linear feet of curtains, which contain 2,878 yards of fabric covering more than 27,000 square feet"

Yeah, that's what NAU would have to do. Massive curtains. It felt weird playing in the walkup skydome. You expected tumbleweeds to blow through or something.

The non-conference portion for NAU is usually played in the Rolle Activity Gym until football ends and the Dome gets setup. Last year they play 8/9 of their first games on the road; they went 1-8.

StickItInTheyFace wrote:

This is an all time great t-shirt.

YoDeFoe wrote:

StickItInTheyFace wrote:

This is an all time great t-shirt.

Especially if, somehow, you could wear it with a hat in the exact shape of that dome.

Or maybe just:

Quinerly headed to Alabama

Gilbertcat wrote:The non-conference portion for NAU is usually played in the Rolle Activity Gym until football ends and the Dome gets setup. Last year they play 8/9 of their first games on the road; they went 1-8.

And those Rolle games are so much more alive.

The Dome is a part of my growing up. More for high school football and NAU hockey, but I spent my fair share of time in it. There is nostalgia for me.

But it is a shithole.

Jefe wrote:Quinerly headed to Alabama

Some U of A was eventually going to get him.

Turns out it was the football one...

I can't forgive Book for the spot he put us in but I hope he gets a similar sentence. I would rather our former assistant coach avoid jail time if at all possible. I can't think anyone can give any reason as to why this whole investigation wasn't a huge waste of time and resources.

So was Quinerly a recruiting “swing and miss” that AZ avoided?

EVCat wrote:

Jefe wrote:Quinerly headed to Alabama

Some U of A was eventually going to get him.

Turns out it was the football one...

He got to be a wildcat too

StickItInTheyFace wrote:

I can't forgive Book for the spot he put us in but I hope he gets a similar sentence. I would rather our former assistant coach avoid jail time if at all possible. I can't think anyone can give any reason as to why this whole investigation wasn't a huge waste of time and resources.

I'd be surprised if his sentence wasn't fairly similar to Bland. The underlying conduct among the assistants was pretty similar.

If he does get a similar sentence, I'm ready for Vitale's tweet about how federal judges are in cahoots with Sean Miller.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

StickItInTheyFace wrote:

I can't forgive Book for the spot he put us in but I hope he gets a similar sentence. I would rather our former assistant coach avoid jail time if at all possible. I can't think anyone can give any reason as to why this whole investigation wasn't a huge waste of time and resources.

I'd be surprised if his sentence wasn't fairly similar to Bland. The underlying conduct among the assistants was pretty similar.

If he does get a similar sentence, I'm ready for Vitale's tweet about how federal judges are in cahoots with Sean Miller.

The difference is Book took a lot more money than Bland did, which is why he's likely to get more than Bland did.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

StickItInTheyFace wrote:

I can't forgive Book for the spot he put us in but I hope he gets a similar sentence. I would rather our former assistant coach avoid jail time if at all possible. I can't think anyone can give any reason as to why this whole investigation wasn't a huge waste of time and resources.

I'd be surprised if his sentence wasn't fairly similar to Bland. The underlying conduct among the assistants was pretty similar.

If he does get a similar sentence, I'm ready for Vitale's tweet about how federal judges are in cahoots with Sean Miller.

The difference is Book took a lot more money than Bland did, which is why he's likely to get more than Bland did.

You think that jail time is still a possibility? I did before, but after Bland's weak sentence I figured Book would be in the clear regarding jail time.

ChooChooCat wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

StickItInTheyFace wrote:

I can't forgive Book for the spot he put us in but I hope he gets a similar sentence. I would rather our former assistant coach avoid jail time if at all possible. I can't think anyone can give any reason as to why this whole investigation wasn't a huge waste of time and resources.

I'd be surprised if his sentence wasn't fairly similar to Bland. The underlying conduct among the assistants was pretty similar.

If he does get a similar sentence, I'm ready for Vitale's tweet about how federal judges are in cahoots with Sean Miller.

The difference is Book took a lot more money than Bland did, which is why he's likely to get more than Bland did.

I don't know, but $15,000 vs $4,100 doesn't seem that dramatic a difference to me. They're both pocket change given the stakes and how much money was flying around.

Agreed that we should expect similar for Book. No real difference in cash. Arizona's statement suggested a preference for leniency as well.