Bear Down Wildcats

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 2:38 pm Wasn’t most of Snowden’s team from the Detroit area?

Pretty sure Snowden coached high school ball in the Detroit area.

Looks like he was 1-1 v. Detroit Mercy

https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/pl ... =date_game

Clearly Vitale has his allegiances, and tows the ESPN company line with certain programs and coaches that ESPN is in business with, but I don't think he ever targeted Arizona in previous decades. He respected Lute, even though Lute referred to him as "Dukie V" -- IIRC, Vitale even acknowledged that he had to work the Duke angle based on his assignments, and didn't take it personally. That said, I don't think he was a big supporter of Arizona, but over the years until the second half of Miller's stint as head coach, Vitale was generally complimentary of the Arizona program. Clearly it was personal with Miller, and it may have been partially based on what he had heard from his inner-circle, people at ESPN and other coaches who did not like Miller, and who were threatened by Miller. Schlabach and Vitale, as well as Bilas and others, really did a number on Miller -- and it lasted for years. There is no question that they further tarnished Miller's reputation and standing, much more so than his alleged complicity in the lack of institutional control surrounding the program. Bill Self, Rick Pitino, Will Wade, etc. all have had far more incriminating and problematic NCAA issues to deal with from the same set of circumstances, and their names rarely come up. And that is how the media plays it, in both sports and politics. Two people can be engaged in very similar conduct, but one will be destroyed day after day by the press, while the other is essentially protected. Arizona fans saw this play out with Miller. Miller's firing may have been inevitable, but Vitale and his ESPN cohorts certainly played their part.

Damn, that’s too bad. But you can’t fire a coach and keep a recruiting class. That just doesn’t happen.

Chicat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:02 pm Damn, that’s too bad. But you can’t fire a coach and keep a recruiting class. That just doesn’t happen.

Especially when the new coach has other guys that are more a part of his plans.

gronk4heisman wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:11 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:02 pm Damn, that’s too bad. But you can’t fire a coach and keep a recruiting class. That just doesn’t happen.

Especially when the new coach has other guys that are more a part of his plans.

It's best judged at the end. I liked Simpson and Dezonie and we look shallow at guard, but obviously there's time for Lloyd to offset that.

This offseason, more patience than usual is going to be needed.

Crazy. I thought Choo had said earlier that Dezonie was pretty solidly committed.

Our roster situation is fickle af.

gronk4heisman wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:11 pm

Chicat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:02 pm Damn, that’s too bad. But you can’t fire a coach and keep a recruiting class. That just doesn’t happen.

Especially when the new coach has other guys that are more a part of his plans.

No doubt.

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:24 pm Crazy. I thought Choo had said earlier that Dezonie was pretty solidly committed.

Our roster situation is fickle af.

I said Dezonie would walk to Tucson and that’s still true, but that doesn’t mean that Tommy Lloyd wanted him to.

Never sounded like a good fit under Lloyd. Maybe under Miller, but...

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:51 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:24 pm Crazy. I thought Choo had said earlier that Dezonie was pretty solidly committed.

Our roster situation is fickle af.

I said Dezonie would walk to Tucson and that’s still true, but that doesn’t mean that Tommy Lloyd wanted him to.

Disappointing unless Lloyd has a better plan to replace. I thought Dezonie was a solid 4 year guy who might not play as a frosh but could be glue for the next 3 years.

BeardownZonaZona wrote: ↑Mon Apr 26, 2021 7:57 am I think there may be more roster movement. Wouldn't surprise me to see Gorener transfer out or Dezonie not coming. Couple options. Could see us going after Arthur Kaluma, he's a guy who could be a 3 or 4 year starter and is right up the road. Roster will probably be in flux for a while I'm guessing

Well. I'm 2/2

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:05 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:51 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:24 pm Crazy. I thought Choo had said earlier that Dezonie was pretty solidly committed.

Our roster situation is fickle af.

I said Dezonie would walk to Tucson and that’s still true, but that doesn’t mean that Tommy Lloyd wanted him to.

Disappointing unless Lloyd has a better plan to replace. I thought Dezonie was a solid 4 year guy who might not play as a frosh but could be glue for the next 3 years.

I wouldn't think Tommy would tell him to find another place to play unless he had a plan in place.... This isn't a certain University President we're talking about

Alieberman wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:14 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 5:05 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:51 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:24 pm Crazy. I thought Choo had said earlier that Dezonie was pretty solidly committed.

Our roster situation is fickle af.

I said Dezonie would walk to Tucson and that’s still true, but that doesn’t mean that Tommy Lloyd wanted him to.

Disappointing unless Lloyd has a better plan to replace. I thought Dezonie was a solid 4 year guy who might not play as a frosh but could be glue for the next 3 years.

I wouldn't think Tommy would tell him to find another place to play unless he had a plan in place.... This isn't a certain University President we're talking about

Like I said above, I think you judge this offseason at the end.

zonagrad wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 1:28 pm

KaibabKat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 12:47 pm Duckie V's problem with Arizona started before Miller and before Olson. It dates to when he was coach at Detroit and Fred Snowden took the Wildcats back there to play them. Lots of bad blood ever since.

Tell me more.

About 1976 Detroit coached by Dick Vitale came to McKale and the Wildcats ran them out of the gym - winning by 30 points or so. It wasn't that close and Fred played his deep bench a lot of minutes. That didn't sit too well with Duckie V. The next year the Wildcats returned the trip. The Cats were ranked in the top 20 and Detroit was unranked. There was not a big change in the cast of characters from the year before - except for the clock operator (probably ended up in Albuquerque a few years later) and the refs (probably borrowed from Duke for which Vitale has been eternally grateful). The Detroit team won by two. They never met again.

We expecting the same with Shane Nowell?

If Tommy can somehow manage to get this as a starting lineup, I would be salivating at our potential.

Tyty
Kerr
Benn
Kaluma (UNLV decommit)
Tubelis

Bench- Koloko, Brown, Terry, Nowell, transfer guard

NickyBCats wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:08 pm We expecting the same with Shane Nowell?

Doubtful - he's tight with Jason Terry

Anyone know if the Kaluma stuff actually has base to it or is it just wishful thinking?

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:23 pm

NickyBCats wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:08 pm We expecting the same with Shane Nowell?

Doubtful - he's tight with Jason Terry

Still a matter if Lloyd wants him. I think he will, but don’t hold me to that.

BeardownZonaZona wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:37 pm Anyone know if the Kaluma stuff actually has base to it or is it just wishful thinking?

We have a strong in there, he’s a top 40 recruit, and we don’t have a post capable of defending athletic 4s. We’d be stupid not to pursue him.

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:55 pm

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:23 pm

NickyBCats wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:08 pm We expecting the same with Shane Nowell?

Doubtful - he's tight with Jason Terry

Still a matter if Lloyd wants him. I think he will, but don’t hold me to that.

He'd better. This current roster is structured like there's a 6'6 sign outside McKale saying you must be this tall to play here.

I'm not whining and I've said multiple times today that the test is at the end of the offseason, but for people giving Miller crap for falling in love with size, our current roster needs to find some balance. It is very post heavy and not particularly flexible at this point.

Was on a zoom call with JF, Adia and TL. Lloyd was asked about recruiting and says he was working with the thought that he would have some scholarship reductions.

He also said he was a big fan of size and dumping in in the post. Talked about wanting his post guys to force the refs to call 3 second violations

azcat49 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:46 pm Was on a zoom call with JF, Adia and TL. Lloyd was asked about recruiting and says he was working with the thought that he would have some scholarship reductions.

He also said he was a big fan of size and dumping in in the post. Talked about wanting his post guys to force the refs to call 3 second violations

TBH, between this, a ball screen based offense and the packline his colleague implemented at Illinois, I'm beginning to think 90% of the offense and defense will be the same as last year.

Then why Romar Dezonie?

IndianaZonaFan wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:16 pm If Tommy can somehow manage to get this as a starting lineup, I would be salivating at our potential.

Tyty
Kerr
Benn
Kaluma (UNLV decommit)
Tubelis

Bench- Koloko, Brown, Terry, Nowell, transfer guard

How many of the bench guys leave at that point?

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 8:11 pm

azcat49 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:46 pm Was on a zoom call with JF, Adia and TL. Lloyd was asked about recruiting and says he was working with the thought that he would have some scholarship reductions.

He also said he was a big fan of size and dumping in in the post. Talked about wanting his post guys to force the refs to call 3 second violations

TBH, between this, a ball screen based offense and the packline his colleague implemented at Illinois, I'm beginning to think 90% of the offense and defense will be the same as last year.

I thought we’d be seeing a more Gonzaga-esque version of the ball screen offense. Where is this dump in the post offense coming from?

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 9:56 pm

IndianaZonaFan wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:16 pm If Tommy can somehow manage to get this as a starting lineup, I would be salivating at our potential.

Tyty
Kerr
Benn
Kaluma (UNLV decommit)
Tubelis

Bench- Koloko, Brown, Terry, Nowell, transfer guard

How many of the bench guys leave at that point?

None of them should honestly EXPECT to start. And I’m not an expert, but that lineup is awesome. Even if it’s not the starting lineup...it would be good to see for a big chunk of the game.

Postmaster wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 9:55 pm Then why Romar Dezonie?

1. He didn't recruit the guy so he didn't "Romar" him.
2. This quote right here: "says he was working with the thought that he would have some scholarship reductions." If you think you can land somebody better in the 2022 class you want to make sure you have room for him.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:35 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:55 pm

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:23 pm

NickyBCats wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:08 pm We expecting the same with Shane Nowell?

Doubtful - he's tight with Jason Terry

Still a matter if Lloyd wants him. I think he will, but don’t hold me to that.

He'd better. This current roster is structured like there's a 6'6 sign outside McKale saying you must be this tall to play here.

I'm not whining and I've said multiple times today that the test is at the end of the offseason, but for people giving Miller crap for falling in love with size, our current roster needs to find some balance. It is very post heavy and not particularly flexible at this point.

Shane Nowell seems to me like the kind of player you'd want on any team, regardless of system or current roster. Nice size, length, athleticism for a college wing, solidly skilled with an NBA family pedigree.

azcat49 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:46 pm Was on a zoom call with JF, Adia and TL. Lloyd was asked about recruiting and says he was working with the thought that he would have some scholarship reductions.

He also said he was a big fan of size and dumping in in the post. Talked about wanting his post guys to force the refs to call 3 second violations

RIP my hopes and dreams, 2021-2021

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:24 am

azcat49 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:46 pm Was on a zoom call with JF, Adia and TL. Lloyd was asked about recruiting and says he was working with the thought that he would have some scholarship reductions.

He also said he was a big fan of size and dumping in in the post. Talked about wanting his post guys to force the refs to call 3 second violations

RIP my hopes and dreams, 2021-2021

For real, shot through the heart.

Hope it's a lost in translation situation.

It was recorded so it has to be out there soon. He said they would be efficient and run and have lots of ball and player movement and mentioned a by product of that was Gonzaga leading the nation in scoring for three years in a row.

He talked about our three bigs (not by name but I figured Koloko, Tubelis and Brown) and that us when he made his comment of dumping it low and wanting his guys to force three second calls

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:23 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 7:35 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:55 pm

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:23 pm

NickyBCats wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 6:08 pm We expecting the same with Shane Nowell?

Doubtful - he's tight with Jason Terry

Still a matter if Lloyd wants him. I think he will, but don’t hold me to that.

He'd better. This current roster is structured like there's a 6'6 sign outside McKale saying you must be this tall to play here.

I'm not whining and I've said multiple times today that the test is at the end of the offseason, but for people giving Miller crap for falling in love with size, our current roster needs to find some balance. It is very post heavy and not particularly flexible at this point.

Shane Nowell seems to me like the kind of player you'd want on any team, regardless of system or current roster. Nice size, length, athleticism for a college wing, solidly skilled with an NBA family pedigree.

I liked the upside he brings. I was always high on him and Simpson.

That said, I see Nowell as too similar to Terry and Mathurin to really help build flexibility next year. I think he'd be dynamite as a soph and jr to replace Mathurin, but right now, he's very similar and can't be a primary ballhandler, so he's a 3...maybe a 2, but never a 1.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:22 am

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:23 am Shane Nowell seems to me like the kind of player you'd want on any team, regardless of system or current roster. Nice size, length, athleticism for a college wing, solidly skilled with an NBA family pedigree.

I liked the upside he brings. I was always high on him and Simpson.

That said, I see Nowell as too similar to Terry and Mathurin to really help build flexibility next year. I think he'd be dynamite as a soph and jr to replace Mathurin, but right now, he's very similar and can't be a primary ballhandler, so he's a 3...maybe a 2, but never a 1.

Yeah that's my hope as well - he develops and provides wing depth this season, but can take a step into meaningful minutes as a 2 / 3 next season. For sure wouldn't solve our ball handling needs this season.

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:36 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 11:22 am

YoDeFoe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 10:23 am Shane Nowell seems to me like the kind of player you'd want on any team, regardless of system or current roster. Nice size, length, athleticism for a college wing, solidly skilled with an NBA family pedigree.

I liked the upside he brings. I was always high on him and Simpson.

That said, I see Nowell as too similar to Terry and Mathurin to really help build flexibility next year. I think he'd be dynamite as a soph and jr to replace Mathurin, but right now, he's very similar and can't be a primary ballhandler, so he's a 3...maybe a 2, but never a 1.

Yeah that's my hope as well - he develops and provides wing depth this season, but can take a step into meaningful minutes as a 2 / 3 next season. For sure wouldn't solve our ball handling needs this season.

Agreed. In the before times, I saw him and Simpson like this.

21-22, Akinjo and Mathurin are the main guys, Kriisa and Terry the supporters, Nowell and Simpson getting their feet wet.

22-23, Kriisa and Terry become the main guys, with Simpson and Nowell sliding in as supporters and the next freshman class getting their feet wet.

Now, obviously a lot of that is in flux, but I still think the Mathurin-Terry-Nowell line of succession can hold.

Did I catch somewhere that Tyty's decision would be made before the end of April?

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:54 pm Did I catch somewhere that Tyty's decision would be made before the end of April?

He said in several interviews that he hopes for a decision at the end of the month.

Wasn't really a hard date but since we need a PG and waiting longer could cost is in the transfer market for one, hopefully he decides soon.

RondaeShimmy wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 1:04 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 12:54 pm Did I catch somewhere that Tyty's decision would be made before the end of April?

He said in several interviews that he hopes for a decision at the end of the month.

Wasn't really a hard date but since we need a PG and waiting longer could cost is in the transfer market for one, hopefully he decides soon.

Thanks, RS.

Here's hoping we get some good news this week.

Booked my room for Vegas next year. So far away but rates are cheap.

Dosia wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:20 pm Booked my room for Vegas next year. So far away but rates are cheap.

That's a fantastic idea, Dosia. Gonna do the same soon.

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:51 pmI said Dezonie would walk to Tucson and that’s still true, but that doesn’t mean that Tommy Lloyd wanted him to.

How does that conversation go down? The kid got his dream school to offer, he signed an NLI and Lloyd asked him to de-commit? He must be so pissed and you can hear it in his tweet: "but It hurts to say I must find a new home"

Jefe wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:34 pm

ChooChooCat wrote: ↑Tue Apr 27, 2021 4:51 pmI said Dezonie would walk to Tucson and that’s still true, but that doesn’t mean that Tommy Lloyd wanted him to.

How does that conversation go down? The kid got his dream school to offer, he signed an NLI and Lloyd asked him to de-commit? He must be so pissed and you can hear it in his tweet: "but It hurts to say I must find a new home"

Lloyd was just honest with him. He didn’t have to ask him to decommit when all he has to do is paint a picture for Dezonie that isn’t pretty for his future at Arizona.

Just read his blurb on 24/7.
Seems like the prototypical Gonzaga player.
3-4 year player, size, athletic, good skills, good shooter.

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:28 pm

Dosia wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:20 pm Booked my room for Vegas next year. So far away but rates are cheap.

That's a fantastic idea, Dosia. Gonna do the same soon.

You guys get game tickets yet? Guessing you are talking about the MGM early season tourney.

U.P. Zona Fan wrote: ↑Thu Apr 29, 2021 2:02 am

Beachcat97 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:28 pm

Dosia wrote: ↑Wed Apr 28, 2021 3:20 pm Booked my room for Vegas next year. So far away but rates are cheap.

That's a fantastic idea, Dosia. Gonna do the same soon.

You guys get game tickets yet? Guessing you are talking about the MGM early season tourney.

No tickets yet, and no I booked for the p12 tournament next March.

On Dezonie, wasn’t he a top 100 guy? Is his game limited in some way? Couldn’t he come in and work and find a role?

I get he could be recruited over and he may never start but hard to think in four years he couldn’t contribute at his dream school.

The zags had mostly 4 year guys. Is CTL now thinking high level OAD’s?

azcat49 wrote: ↑Thu Apr 29, 2021 6:51 am On Dezonie, wasn’t he a top 100 guy? Is his game limited in some way? Couldn’t he come in and work and find a role?

I get he could be recruited over and he may never start but hard to think in four years he couldn’t contribute at his dream school.

The zags had mostly 4 year guys. Is CTL now thinking high level OAD’s?

He's not a shooter and Lloyd wants that.

My guess is he wants his guys unless they're really good like the returning core.

Similarly, one of Koloko or Brown could very well leave if Lloyd lands Kaluma.

I saw one recruiting analyst put it pretty well. He's not the most athletic, but he's athletic enough. Not an elite ball handler, but he's good enough. Not an elite shooter, but he's good enough. Not an elite defender, but he's good enough. For him to contribute he's going to have to develop one of his skills a lot

Seems like a guy you’d want on this team