Justin Simon gone
Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:29 am
No surprise here.
He's going to be sooooooo good. I just don't think Arizona is going to be the place for quality multi-year wings and point guards anymore. Those positions will reload continually with top talent.Main Event wrote:I think he's gonna be a stud in a few years. Sucks
Is it assumed Trier is gone at this point?NYCat wrote:He was a composite 4* ranked #34, Scout over ranked him as he was always a mid to high 4* with a potential to be a 5*.
I can't help but read into having to compete with 2 more talented wings that have yet to commit.
Anyway we likely lost Simon & Trier, hindsight is 20/20 but would've love to have Dorsey as OAD.
With the new rules, I don't think anyone would be surprised if he declares, with an option of coming back. He would be quite foolish to sign with an agent unless he gets a guarantee. Or if he just hates school.billk78 wrote: Is it assumed Trier is gone at this point?
Given his current draft projections, I don't know why it would be unless he just is not interested in a soph year period.billk78 wrote:Is it assumed Trier is gone at this point?NYCat wrote:He was a composite 4* ranked #34, Scout over ranked him as he was always a mid to high 4* with a potential to be a 5*.
I can't help but read into having to compete with 2 more talented wings that have yet to commit.
Anyway we likely lost Simon & Trier, hindsight is 20/20 but would've love to have Dorsey as OAD.
Not sure why he would, we aren't short on scholarships and could see a lot of guys leave after next season at which point a player going into his third year with the program would be a huge help.cpt wrote:Any chance Sean let him go? Not that he was pushed out but that no real effort was made to keep him?
CSM putting Simon out there with the walk ons in blow outs is probably a good indicator that it was mutual. Hazzard played more than Simon did in the blowout of Stanford.cpt wrote:Any chance Sean let him go? Not that he was pushed out but that no real effort was made to keep him?
By Stanford, I'd assume the decision was pretty much made. It's hard to imagine the tipping point being after that.Merkin wrote:CSM putting Simon out there with the walk ons in blow outs is probably a good indicator that it was mutual. Hazzard played more than Simon did in the blowout of Stanford.cpt wrote:Any chance Sean let him go? Not that he was pushed out but that no real effort was made to keep him?
We will never hear about the end of season one on one with CSM but don't think Miller encouraged him to stay all that much.
Tough because that was senior night. Five seniors needed great minutes on their big night. Though there was plenty of points before that where I was thinking, lets see Simon. Who knows though, could be some behind the scenes stuff we will never know about.Merkin wrote:CSM putting Simon out there with the walk ons in blow outs is probably a good indicator that it was mutual. Hazzard played more than Simon did in the blowout of Stanford.cpt wrote:Any chance Sean let him go? Not that he was pushed out but that no real effort was made to keep him?
We will never hear about the end of season one on one with CSM but don't think Miller encouraged him to stay all that much.
Yup. We probably need to look at that idea with centers too (for this Chance is great). 2/3/4s (combo 4s) we seem to be able to bring in high level talent whenever we want.catgrad97 wrote:We need to recruit a three- to four-star scrappy point guard who will be here for the program to develop.
You mean like PJC?catgrad97 wrote:We need to recruit a three- to four-star scrappy point guard who will be here for the program to develop.
If I had to pick a destination for Simon, I'd go with Texas. He's made for a Havoc system like Shaka's, and we don't have to face them.Olsondogg wrote:By all accounts a good kid. Sure, shooting (both by jumper and by the line) was an issue, but Hansen's takes are well...Hansen's...take em for what they are worth.
Playing time is playing time. It's always an issue, even when you are told that it isn't. Players want to be in the game, and then once they are in the game, they want the ball.
Good luck to Justin, he'll do well somewhere on the west coast.
It's gotta be more west IMO. LIke a Mountain West/WCC school. SDSU, Zags or UNLV or something like that.Spaceman Spiff wrote:If I had to pick a destination for Simon, I'd go with Texas. He's made for a Havoc system like Shaka's, and we don't have to face them.Olsondogg wrote:By all accounts a good kid. Sure, shooting (both by jumper and by the line) was an issue, but Hansen's takes are well...Hansen's...take em for what they are worth.
Playing time is playing time. It's always an issue, even when you are told that it isn't. Players want to be in the game, and then once they are in the game, they want the ball.
Good luck to Justin, he'll do well somewhere on the west coast.
Not that I have any knowledge of where he's considering.
This is part of the game that others have mentioned and that irks me too. I don't want to be too specific about the school, but it's ok to go to the Zags or SDSU and develop but it's not cool to stay at Arizona and develop.Olsondogg wrote:It's gotta be more west IMO. LIke a Mountain West/WCC school. SDSU, Zags or UNLV or something like that.
When you can't beat out Tollefsen for a spot, and you look at what Miller is going to bring in year in and out, you look at the minutes. I get it. I can't really knock a kid for wanting more playing time.SCCats wrote:This is part of the game that others have mentioned and that irks me too. I don't want to be too specific about the school, but it's ok to go to the Zags or SDSU and develop but it's not cool to stay at Arizona and develop.Olsondogg wrote:It's gotta be more west IMO. LIke a Mountain West/WCC school. SDSU, Zags or UNLV or something like that.
Caveat: Unless the player thinks he'll never be a starter here.
The problem with that theory is that PJC wasn't the "project" Miller was shooting for from the beginning and only emerged late once his posse pushed him to the forefront. We had other options who didn't have a six-foot ceiling and wouldn't necessarily get blown by.Spaceman Spiff wrote:You mean like PJC?catgrad97 wrote:We need to recruit a three- to four-star scrappy point guard who will be here for the program to develop.
Sorry, not meaning this about you, it's just that the developmental PG who gives us four years is exactly what we were shooting for in PJC, and he is an example of how there is no guarantee on guys like that.
If it means anything, if I had a time machine and control over minutes, I would go back in time and give Simon all of Tollefsen's minutes.Olsondogg wrote:When you can't beat out Tollefsen for a spot, and you look at what Miller is going to bring in year in and out, you look at the minutes. I get it. I can't really knock a kid for wanting more playing time.SCCats wrote:This is part of the game that others have mentioned and that irks me too. I don't want to be too specific about the school, but it's ok to go to the Zags or SDSU and develop but it's not cool to stay at Arizona and develop.Olsondogg wrote:It's gotta be more west IMO. LIke a Mountain West/WCC school. SDSU, Zags or UNLV or something like that.
Caveat: Unless the player thinks he'll never be a starter here.
This ain't someone taking the advice of someone telling them that Arizona was a pit stop to glory, leaving Arizona behind the 8 ball...
Yes, but why was Fogg the exception? Because he wanted to win at the highest level of college, he was willing to work hard for his place on the team and never approached the college game like a free agent who folded like a deck chair under adversity.NYCat wrote:Laval Lucas-Perry
Garland Judkins
Kyle Fogg
Jordin Mayes
Daniel Dillon
Momo (more suited for Iona type program)
I mean more often than not these players are low ranked for legitimate reasons.
For the most part, I agree with you.NYCat wrote: Your not going find a TJ and be able to anticipate he'll develop into a power conference capable player. They'll most likely end up riding the end of the bench.
An Aaron Craft type is the best we can hope for, he was a 4 star -- stayed 3 years and played unbelievably. Unless Miller can show he can develop guards at an elite Lute-esque level, we're better off with the highly talented kids.
I don't bear any ill will towards Tollefsen, but Tollefsen's hallmark here was not doing anything. Not many TO's, not many points, not many stops, not many assists, just existing on the floor for a while.Merkin wrote:Simon had 14 turnovers in 180 minutes and 6 assists.
Tollefsen had 19 TOs in 744 minutes and 44 assists.
Simon:
“I enjoyed my year at the University of Arizona,” Simon said in a statement. “I would like to thank my coaching staff, teammates and the incredible fans here for all they did for me. My decision to transfer is centered on playing time. I would like a bigger role as a basketball player. Hopefully, I will be able to find this at my next program.”
The list of developmental players staying is a lot longer than the list of them leaving after one year. So maybe you wrote this too quickly? You know, before the thought could develop.ChooChooCat wrote:North Carolina and Kansas can keep their guys around for 4 years. Arizona can't keep their developmental players around more than 1. God dammit man.
I am not overly upset about Simon leaving, but I definitely wish we had stuck with Dorsey instead of going with Trier/Simon.NYCat wrote:He was a composite 4* ranked #34, Scout over ranked him as he was always a mid to high 4* with a potential to be a 5*.
I can't help but read into having to compete with 2 more talented wings that have yet to commit.
Anyway we likely lost Simon & Trier, hindsight is 20/20 but would've love to have Dorsey as OAD.
Perfect example of stats without context. So I'm to believe they are equivalent shooters?KaibabKat wrote: So, the knock on the kid is he can't shoot?
Justin Simon: 2015-16 points/field goal attempt = 1.22.
Gabe York: 2015-16 points/field goal attempt = 1.22.
Okey Dokey Greg.
I don't see it this way. Trier was at least Dorsey's equal.az91 wrote:I am not overly upset about Simon leaving, but I definitely wish we had stuck with Dorsey instead of going with Trier/Simon.NYCat wrote:He was a composite 4* ranked #34, Scout over ranked him as he was always a mid to high 4* with a potential to be a 5*.
I can't help but read into having to compete with 2 more talented wings that have yet to commit.
Anyway we likely lost Simon & Trier, hindsight is 20/20 but would've love to have Dorsey as OAD.
SCC bringing it strong today.SCCats wrote:This is part of the game that others have mentioned and that irks me too. I don't want to be too specific about the school, but it's ok to go to the Zags or SDSU and develop but it's not cool to stay at Arizona and develop.Olsondogg wrote:It's gotta be more west IMO. LIke a Mountain West/WCC school. SDSU, Zags or UNLV or something like that.
Caveat: Unless the player thinks he'll never be a starter here.
Both, I would think. It's hard not to see getting Alkins and possibly Ferguson or JJ and not see that resigning him to very little playing time next year.midnightx wrote:Is this about the lack of playing time during the season, or concerns about getting any substantive playing time in the future? His athleticism was evident when he did get on the court; he seemed to have potential, but needed time to develop. Hope it works out for him in another program.
Kaibab, you're about 0 for 3000 on bothering to respond to objections to your posts. Do you just throw arguments out there without agreeing with them yourself, and then when we respond say, "Ha! I knew he couldn't resist pointing out the obvious!"gumby wrote:Perfect example of stats without context. So I'm to believe they are equivalent shooters?KaibabKat wrote: So, the knock on the kid is he can't shoot?
Justin Simon: 2015-16 points/field goal attempt = 1.22.
Gabe York: 2015-16 points/field goal attempt = 1.22.
Okey Dokey Greg.
Damn that Miller for not running down screens for Justin Simon, so he could pop out and drain threes.
Agree. Not a big deal that we got Trier instead of Dorsey. Trier a better slasher. The team's only slasher. Only guy who could create his own shot. Filled a big role. Can't predict an injury, of course.Spaceman Spiff wrote:I don't see it this way. Trier was at least Dorsey's equal.az91 wrote:I am not overly upset about Simon leaving, but I definitely wish we had stuck with Dorsey instead of going with Trier/Simon.NYCat wrote:He was a composite 4* ranked #34, Scout over ranked him as he was always a mid to high 4* with a potential to be a 5*.
I can't help but read into having to compete with 2 more talented wings that have yet to commit.
Anyway we likely lost Simon & Trier, hindsight is 20/20 but would've love to have Dorsey as OAD.
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Trier was more efficient as a scorer by a good bit and Dorsey had him by a bit in assists and rebounding.
Add in Smith and we made the right choice. It doesn't feel like it bc Oregon was better than us this year.