Bear Down Wildcats

6 straight losses in an awful PAC12. Tons of warts on the program and school. 3 assistant coach in trouble (although we know Phelps has only been deemed to have committed a minor violation to date and Pasternak is hearsay). No final fours. Poor execution for several week. 3 awful NCAA tournaments in a row.

I know we maybe stuck with Miller and I have been a Miller supporter since this FBI stuff came out bit man this is difficult.

Is the class coming in worth all this?

Yes. No question.

Well we are going to find out.

Dosia wrote:Well we are going to find out.

I get it. We are kinda stuck with Miller and things could be a lot worse than that, this is just unbelievable how down things are right now on and off the court

If everything is still intact in November *big IF* it will be another case of Miller swapping a Maclaren engine into his Buick LeSabre Bennett-ball system and racing it in Formula 1. Win a couple games, win the P12 but have a lot more trouble than they should, and then melt in the tournament at the first sight of a zone defense.

I think Miller is gone in April anyway when the shyte hits the proverbial fan at Dawkins trial

Miller worked his butt off to put this class together. He should get a chance to see it through and then we can part ways, hopefully on a good note.

I know this year has been far worse than expected, but I believe Miller has earned one more year to show what he can do.

PHXCATS wrote:6 straight losses in an awful PAC12. Tons of warts on the program and school. 3 assistant coach in trouble (although we know Phelps has only been deemed to have committed a minor violation to date and Pasternak is hearsay). No final fours. Poor execution for several week. 3 awful NCAA tournaments in a row.

I know we maybe stuck with Miller and I have been a Miller supporter since this FBI stuff came out bit man this is difficult.

Is the class coming in worth all this?

Your standpoint has been that this year's team will make the tourney. Going back to December, you assertively turned to posters who saw this team for what is and branded them as putting forth "loser talk." That sets up nicely your first sentence here, correlating six straight losses to the coach. As for warts on the program and the school, I'm not sure what these are, other than your admission in your next sentence about Phelps and Pasternak not having been shown to commit serious violations. If there are such warts, then why is the incoming class what it is? How can there be a question about whether that class is worth it? Worth what? Worth all your nonsensical takes about Sean Miller?

Yes. Just Nico and Green alone are worth it.

KillerKlown wrote:Yes. Just Nico and Green alone are worth it.

Cool. Well hopefully things can pick up a little bit for this year in Vegas and build some momentum for next year

Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

Loser talk

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

I didn't did I? Not at all. I have been very supportive of Miller. I am just really concerned about all this. You can explain a lot of it away but it is still concerning. And six losses is really bad. UA still has talent and the PAC12 is so bad.

I am still supporting this team and Miller. Will be in Vegas cheering my heart out. But there are things going on that are very concerning

Injuries to our best two players. Recruiting gutted by ESPIN. I am all in on Miller getting his shot next year. I will be renewing my season tickets to basketball, unlike football. Probably should focus there

PHXCATS wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

I didn't did I? Not at all. I have been very supportive of Miller. I am just really concerned about all this. You can explain a lot of it away but it is still concerning. And six losses is really bad. UA still has talent and the PAC12 is so bad.

I am still supporting this team and Miller. Will be in Vegas cheering my heart out. But there are things going on that are very concerning

What does concerned get you? I would rather we win, but I don't get concerned when we lose. It's losing games. It doesn't secretly hint at the fact my wife is cheating on me or that God doesn't exist.

It's just losing. Either you think it's worth considering getting rid of Miller over or you don't. Short of that, what's the point of being concerned? It just means we didn't score as many points as another team in 40 minutes. There's not much deeper meaning.

Is the 2019 class worth enduring Machina’s deep thoughts and concern trolling?

Debatable...

MIAGFP

I am really tired of the statistics used to make each loss into some new failure of coach and program, when it is clear THIS team is flawed. So they lose 6. Or 7. Or 10.

We KNOW why. But using each successive loss, which should have been expected last night, to take this situation from a flowing event that will continue for this year to INDIVIDUAL. FAILURES. THAT. NEED. RECOUNTED. EACH. TIME. is simply a tactic to rile up the base.

Oh, no...this has never happened in history since 1983. Yup. And why did it happen then? And why is it happening now? We know the answers. Treating each game like it is a new sign of continuing failure of staff and program, and not the same flawed team missing maybe its best player and a recruiting class and 90-whatever percent of scoring from last year is simply a way for people to cause anger. We could lose the rest of them this year. We could. Maybe not Cal, but it could happen.

Counting each one and going "OMG...THIS IS NUMBER 7!!!....OMG...THIS IS NUMBER 8!!!" and making each one into a new event, like it isn't part of the same issue as #2 and #4, has no purpose. We cannot acquire players or trade before the deadline. This is our 2019 reality. But some whiny fans and local media/national media cannot help but milestone the hell out of this unique and singular event. Ben Lindsey didn't lose his entire starting 5 and have a bullshit story kill recruiting and an overeager AD fire an assistant coach, all while having past success AND the best class in the country coming in the next season. So comparing the digits of 1983 to 2019 is agenda-driven, and creates false conclusions about the state of the program.

Would it be great to see our team bust out of this? Yeah. Did we see moments where we could see how it could happen vs Utah? Definitely. Did we get new players to play this game? No. Is each successive loss with this squad indicative of Miller's past or future? No.

Then take it for what it is...a bad season, with one hell of a backstory as to how we got here. And quit throwing a fit each time some bad season milestone is passed, like this isn't all part of the same event. Some of our fan base and the media are exploiting the events within a single season to make false-conclusion milestones that need to be pointed out as we hit them. It is noteworthy to say we haven’t lost 6 in a row since 1983, but it creates a false lead to conclusion to then talk about “and that was Ben Lindsey, who only coached one season and was fired and Lute saved the world…”

We certainly didn't hear this when Duke had the season K exited with "back trouble". It was understood to be what it was...a blip.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

I didn't did I? Not at all. I have been very supportive of Miller. I am just really concerned about all this. You can explain a lot of it away but it is still concerning. And six losses is really bad. UA still has talent and the PAC12 is so bad.

I am still supporting this team and Miller. Will be in Vegas cheering my heart out. But there are things going on that are very concerning

What does concerned get you? I would rather we win, but I don't get concerned when we lose. It's losing games. It doesn't secretly hint at the fact my wife is cheating on me or that God doesn't exist.

It's just losing. Either you think it's worth considering getting rid of Miller over or you don't. Short of that, what's the point of being concerned? It just means we didn't score as many points as another team in 40 minutes. There's not much deeper meaning.

I am concerned because the Cats have been stuck in the mud mentally for the last few seasons. I get it, this team has had to do deal with a lot. With losing coaches, to the FBI questions, to injuries, etc but even with Jeter not 100% and Williams being out this team still has a lot of talent and should not be losing 6 games in a row in a crappy very down PAC-12. I am concerned because of the mental makeup of the team and the ability for the coach to reach them. Yes this team can fold up the tents, but they can also say you know what, fuck the outside noise and the shit internally (Much like Jason Heyward and the Cubs during the rain delay in the 2016 WS) and win. I did not watch last night due to Valentine's Day but I have watched every other game this year and the only game I was proud of the effort the entire time for during this losing streak was the asu game. That is the reason for my original post, there is obviously a lot going on, some Arizona's fault, some not, but will this recruiting class be worth it to deal with all this bs and be able to overcome it and change the piss pour attitude our team has had the last few years? That is the question I was asking.

Longhorned wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:6 straight losses in an awful PAC12. Tons of warts on the program and school. 3 assistant coach in trouble (although we know Phelps has only been deemed to have committed a minor violation to date and Pasternak is hearsay). No final fours. Poor execution for several week. 3 awful NCAA tournaments in a row.

I know we maybe stuck with Miller and I have been a Miller supporter since this FBI stuff came out bit man this is difficult.

Is the class coming in worth all this?

Your standpoint has been that this year's team will make the tourney. Going back to December, you assertively turned to posters who saw this team for what is and branded them as putting forth "loser talk." That sets up nicely your first sentence here, correlating six straight losses to the coach. As for warts on the program and the school, I'm not sure what these are, other than your admission in your next sentence about Phelps and Pasternak not having been shown to commit serious violations. If there are such warts, then why is the incoming class what it is? How can there be a question about whether that class is worth it? Worth what? Worth all your nonsensical takes about Sean Miller?

LH is right, PHX. You could help yourself by at least owning how wrong you were about this team.

PHXCATS wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

I didn't did I? Not at all. I have been very supportive of Miller. I am just really concerned about all this. You can explain a lot of it away but it is still concerning. And six losses is really bad. UA still has talent and the PAC12 is so bad.

I am still supporting this team and Miller. Will be in Vegas cheering my heart out. But there are things going on that are very concerning

What does concerned get you? I would rather we win, but I don't get concerned when we lose. It's losing games. It doesn't secretly hint at the fact my wife is cheating on me or that God doesn't exist.

It's just losing. Either you think it's worth considering getting rid of Miller over or you don't. Short of that, what's the point of being concerned? It just means we didn't score as many points as another team in 40 minutes. There's not much deeper meaning.

I am concerned because the Cats have been stuck in the mud mentally for the last few seasons. I get it, this team has had to do deal with a lot. With losing coaches, to the FBI questions, to injuries, etc but even with Jeter not 100% and Williams being out this team still has a lot of talent and should not be losing 6 games in a row in a crappy very down PAC-12. I am concerned because of the mental makeup of the team and the ability for the coach to reach them. Yes this team can fold up the tents, but they can also say you know what, fuck the outside noise and the shit internally (Much like Jason Heyward and the Cubs during the rain delay in the 2016 WS) and win. I did not watch last night due to Valentine's Day but I have watched every other game this year and the only game I was proud of the effort the entire time for during this losing streak was the asu game. That is the reason for my original post, there is obviously a lot going on, some Arizona's fault, some not, but will this recruiting class be worth it to deal with all this bs and be able to overcome it and change the piss pour attitude our team has had the last few years? That is the question I was asking.

Maybe they get their bad attitude because they don't appreciate alumni events enough?

Stop. I'll be real, I don't appreciate BS takes like bad attitude by people who don't know **** except watching games on TV. Acting like you (or I) know much about the mental makeup of people and teams is fundamentally a lie.

We weren't weak in 16-17. I understand criticisms of last year more. This year, hell, we're just not that great. We're not talented, and sooner or later departures, injuries and fired assistant coaches take a toll.

But yeah, you're an expert on athletic mindset and how to bounce back from adversity. I'd be more persuaded you were a model of bulletproof mindset if you hadn't been nursing a grudge against Miller for years. That stuff doesn't even matter and you're telling players and coaches to get over more important stuff? Bruh.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: We weren't weak in 16-17.

yeah...we were up 8 with 3:45 left in the Sweet 16, despite shooting below 40% for the prior 32 minutes and having maybe our best Miller-era pro just disappear. A period almost as remarkable as the 15 point surrender in 2005 happened, where we did not score a single point in that last 3:45 while surrendering 9, caused a S16 exit.

It was one incredibly bad stretch. But I don't see Sweet 16 losses where you run head first into 4 minutes of a hot team against your ice cold team in a one-and-done format as being a "weak" team.

Unless you are a 1 seed, once you get to week 2, every team is capable of beating you and no loss is a shock or an indicator of your entire season.

Beachcat97 wrote:

Longhorned wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:6 straight losses in an awful PAC12. Tons of warts on the program and school. 3 assistant coach in trouble (although we know Phelps has only been deemed to have committed a minor violation to date and Pasternak is hearsay). No final fours. Poor execution for several week. 3 awful NCAA tournaments in a row.

I know we maybe stuck with Miller and I have been a Miller supporter since this FBI stuff came out bit man this is difficult.

Is the class coming in worth all this?

Your standpoint has been that this year's team will make the tourney. Going back to December, you assertively turned to posters who saw this team for what is and branded them as putting forth "loser talk." That sets up nicely your first sentence here, correlating six straight losses to the coach. As for warts on the program and the school, I'm not sure what these are, other than your admission in your next sentence about Phelps and Pasternak not having been shown to commit serious violations. If there are such warts, then why is the incoming class what it is? How can there be a question about whether that class is worth it? Worth what? Worth all your nonsensical takes about Sean Miller?

LH is right, PHX. You could help yourself by at least owning how wrong you were about this team.

I dont read LH's posts at all, but I assume you mean about UA making the tournament? Yes I was wrong about that. I own that. I really thought that things were heading that way but once Jeter got hurt it all fell apart. But yes I was probably wrong about that. Still have a chance to win in Vegas but for now it appears I was really wrong about it.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

I didn't did I? Not at all. I have been very supportive of Miller. I am just really concerned about all this. You can explain a lot of it away but it is still concerning. And six losses is really bad. UA still has talent and the PAC12 is so bad.

I am still supporting this team and Miller. Will be in Vegas cheering my heart out. But there are things going on that are very concerning

What does concerned get you? I would rather we win, but I don't get concerned when we lose. It's losing games. It doesn't secretly hint at the fact my wife is cheating on me or that God doesn't exist.

It's just losing. Either you think it's worth considering getting rid of Miller over or you don't. Short of that, what's the point of being concerned? It just means we didn't score as many points as another team in 40 minutes. There's not much deeper meaning.

I am concerned because the Cats have been stuck in the mud mentally for the last few seasons. I get it, this team has had to do deal with a lot. With losing coaches, to the FBI questions, to injuries, etc but even with Jeter not 100% and Williams being out this team still has a lot of talent and should not be losing 6 games in a row in a crappy very down PAC-12. I am concerned because of the mental makeup of the team and the ability for the coach to reach them. Yes this team can fold up the tents, but they can also say you know what, fuck the outside noise and the shit internally (Much like Jason Heyward and the Cubs during the rain delay in the 2016 WS) and win. I did not watch last night due to Valentine's Day but I have watched every other game this year and the only game I was proud of the effort the entire time for during this losing streak was the asu game. That is the reason for my original post, there is obviously a lot going on, some Arizona's fault, some not, but will this recruiting class be worth it to deal with all this bs and be able to overcome it and change the piss pour attitude our team has had the last few years? That is the question I was asking.

Maybe they get their bad attitude because they don't appreciate alumni events enough?

Stop. I'll be real, I don't appreciate BS takes like bad attitude by people who don't know **** except watching games on TV. Acting like you (or I) know much about the mental makeup of people and teams is fundamentally a lie.

We weren't weak in 16-17. I understand criticisms of last year more. This year, hell, we're just not that great. We're not talented, and sooner or later departures, injuries and fired assistant coaches take a toll.

But yeah, you're an expert on athletic mindset and how to bounce back from adversity. I'd be more persuaded you were a model of bulletproof mindset if you hadn't been nursing a grudge against Miller for years. That stuff doesn't even matter and you're telling players and coaches to get over more important stuff? Bruh.

Who has a grudge against Miller? I certainly dont. Have you seen do anything beyond be incredibly supportive of Miller the last two years?

This team has talent still, that is clear as can be. But why are they losing then? Bad luck shouldnt go over six games when (even with injuries) still have the talent and coaching edge on all but maybe one of those games. It has to be something with the mental makeup. I am not saying I am an expert but it can be nothing else

PHXCATS wrote:Who has a grudge against Miller? I certainly dont. Have you seen do anything beyond be incredibly supportive of Miller the last two years?

From this past November:

PHXCATS wrote:

Newportcat wrote:Am I totally clueless, is Miller actually a massive dick?

He did blame a loss at asu on U of A fans

Machina is so supportive of Miller that he keeps trotting out this massive fucking LIE he made up to make him look like a shitty person.

With supporters like Machina, who needs opposing fans?

or Tad Boyle?

97cats wrote:or Tad Boyle?

I like turtles

I like to type

Loser talk

None of you like punctuation.

I can count to potato

PHXCATS wrote: I dont read LH's posts at all

This is a very telling statement.

There are some days I come to this site hoping to only read LH posts.

Alieberman wrote:

PHXCATS wrote: I dont read LH's posts at all

This is a very telling statement.

There are some days I come to this site hoping to only read LH posts.

And other days you binge watch Dr. Pimple Popper. One should cultivate an appreciation for both high and low culture. I sometimes wear a cravat while I fire up the YouTube search engine.

I only go to YouTube to read the comments.

Yes

Alieberman wrote:

PHXCATS wrote: I dont read LH's posts at all

This is a very telling statement.

There are some days I come to this site hoping to only read LH posts.

I''m glad I kept reading because I was going to quote and post this, almost word for word.

I'm all for disagreements. Hell, there are a lot of great members here who are thinking the Miller era is/should be over. So that makes me an apologist to a degree. BUT...phxachina - you can't talk out both sides of your mouth and then post you don't even read the posts of one of the greats. I like to think you aren't this hard to deal with in real life & it's just a false bravado internet persona.

ByJoveByJingle wrote:I sometimes wear a cravat while I fire up the YouTube search engine.

That's like turning on a Wildcats game, killing the video and just listening to Bill Walton.

Chicat wrote:I only go to YouTube to read the comments.

Look, I know this losing streak is bad, but you're punishing yourself in ways no one deserves.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:Hansen speculated we'd go 0-18 after the ESPN story. Now people want Miller fired because we're slightly under .500.

He isn't a miracle worker. This was going to be a rough year and we ask to fire him because it is a rough year?

No kidding.

serious question for the Miller die hards. Suppose we lose out and the streak goes to 14 which would match ‘59 and ‘83 for the all time worst streak in school history. Does Miller still get a pass with an upcoming potential subpoena at Dawkins trial in April, or nah?

Yes, next...

If Heeke surprisingly became smart and could lock up Luke and fire Miller for cause, yes I would fire Miller. Regents would support it though Cole & Jeannie Davis would not. I seriously doubt Heeke's intelligence to do this.

If this is not possible, ride with Miller and see what he does.

In the end though I do not see this working out well with Miller and Arizona in terms of him either turning us around, clearing his name and then he will immediately leave for the East Coast or we fire him. I think the option of him turning us around and staying for the long term is fools gold especially at this point. Heeke and him hate each other and I do not see a scenario where Robbins can fire Heeke anytime soon as it will look awful because Heeke will claim "I was fired for trying to follow NCAA rules"

Honestly this could be a reason why Heeke moved so quickly to fire Phelps the more I think about it. He is protecting his job by doing so by saying he runs a tight ship on rules. It is the one way for him to protect himself best as again Robbins would look terrible given all the shit going on for him to fire an AD for trying to follow the rules. Just a guess. It seems like too smart a strategy though for Heeke to have come up with

Here’s another way to think about this thread’s question:

Which is more appealing? Firing Miller after this season and having a 2019-20 team that makes the current one look like UCLA in the 70s, or giving him the benefit of the doubt for now and having the best freshman class in America this fall?

Not really seeing an argument for the former unless — and this is a huge, almost chimerical “unless” — we can hire a better coach immediately. And since rolling the dice on a new hire could backfire so spectacularly, doing untold long term damage to the program, I’m gonna say we keep our guy.

If he lied at that press conference, though, it changes things.

Newportcat wrote:If Heeke surprisingly became smart and could lock up Luke and fire Miller for cause, yes I would fire Miller. Regents would support it though Cole & Jeannie Davis would not. I seriously doubt Heeke's intelligence to do this.

If this is not possible, ride with Miller and see what he does.

In the end though I do not see this working out well with Miller and Arizona in terms of him either turning us around, clearing his name and then he will immediately leave for the East Coast or we fire him. I think the option of him turning us around and staying for the long term is fools gold especially at this point. Heeke and him hate each other and I do not see a scenario where Robbins can fire Heeke anytime soon as it will look awful because Heeke will claim "I was fired for trying to follow NCAA rules"

Honestly this could be a reason why Heeke moved so quickly to fire Phelps the more I think about it. He is protecting his job by doing so by saying he runs a tight ship on rules. It is the one way for him to protect himself best as again Robbins would look terrible given all the shit going on for him to fire an AD for trying to follow the rules. Just a guess. It seems like too smart a strategy though for Heeke to have come up with

You're assuming Heeke has a clue of what he's doing here. That's where you would be wrong.

Either way is the 2019 class worth it? They'll sure as hell be fun to watch on the court next season and it'll be fun to root for and watch Nico and Green in the NBA. As far as the future goes, who knows?

Yes yes yes to retaining Miller and seeing what that class could do. No no no on Luke Walton or any alum taking over unless it was Kerr

ChooChooCat wrote:

Newportcat wrote:If Heeke surprisingly became smart and could lock up Luke and fire Miller for cause, yes I would fire Miller. Regents would support it though Cole & Jeannie Davis would not. I seriously doubt Heeke's intelligence to do this.

If this is not possible, ride with Miller and see what he does.

In the end though I do not see this working out well with Miller and Arizona in terms of him either turning us around, clearing his name and then he will immediately leave for the East Coast or we fire him. I think the option of him turning us around and staying for the long term is fools gold especially at this point. Heeke and him hate each other and I do not see a scenario where Robbins can fire Heeke anytime soon as it will look awful because Heeke will claim "I was fired for trying to follow NCAA rules"

Honestly this could be a reason why Heeke moved so quickly to fire Phelps the more I think about it. He is protecting his job by doing so by saying he runs a tight ship on rules. It is the one way for him to protect himself best as again Robbins would look terrible given all the shit going on for him to fire an AD for trying to follow the rules. Just a guess. It seems like too smart a strategy though for Heeke to have come up with

You're assuming Heeke has a clue of what he's doing here. That's where you would be wrong.

Either way is the 2019 class worth it? They'll sure as hell be fun to watch on the court next season and it'll be fun to root for and watch Nico and Green in the NBA. As far as the future goes, who knows?

Agreed and that’s why I couched everything I said with big IF’s in regards to Heeke. I am not sure I could trust him to order me toilet paper on Amazon

azcat49 wrote:Yes yes yes to retaining Miller and seeing what that class could do. No no no on Luke Walton or any alum taking over unless it was Kerr

I am not sure I understand this dislike for Luke as a potential coach for us. Sure if I said Miles Simon or Damon or Jason gardner I understand that.

But Luke has a big name, was known as a very smart player, did a good job with the Lakers from year 1-2 and candidly year 3 before lebron got hurt. I mean to me he is in no way a no no no candidate. Miles would be but I think Luke has great potential as a coach especially in a college setting. He has young kids and his wife is from Tucson so we would maybe get loyalty too that if he did have success he wouldn’t be looking to leave right away.

One thing I have been wrong on is why ever coach in college over the NBA. The thing with college is the coaches are the stars and you can become a god in a city or college. Zero chance you do that in the NBA anymore. Coaches are a dime a dozen in professional sport especially NBA. I could not name more then 10 active head coaches and I am a big fan of the NBA. Here today gone today. Players have all the power

No clue who coaches the suns or Portland or Utah or Memphis or Toronto or knicks or kings etc. it’s the opposite in college where I can’t name one person on Tennessee or Kentucky or any top team outside of Zion at Duke. But I know rick Barnes coaches Rocky top and Gregg Marshall is at Wichita state etc

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

Chicat wrote:I only go to YouTube to read the comments.

Look, I know this losing streak is bad, but you're punishing yourself in ways no one deserves.

That sounds like Lizard People talk.

Newportcat wrote:

azcat49 wrote:Yes yes yes to retaining Miller and seeing what that class could do. No no no on Luke Walton or any alum taking over unless it was Kerr

I am not sure I understand this dislike for Luke as a potential coach for us. Sure if I said Miles Simon or Damon or Jason gardner I understand that.

But Luke has a big name, was known as a very smart player, did a good job with the Lakers from year 1-2 and candidly year 3 before lebron got hurt. I mean to me he is in no way a no no no candidate. Miles would be but I think Luke has great potential as a coach especially in a college setting. He has young kids and his wife is from Tucson so we would maybe get loyalty too that if he did have success he wouldn’t be looking to leave right away.

One thing I have been wrong on is why ever coach in college over the NBA. The thing with college is the coaches are the stars and you can become a god in a city or college. Zero chance you do that in the NBA anymore. Coaches are a dime a dozen in professional sport especially NBA. I could not name more then 10 active head coaches and I am a big fan of the NBA. Here today gone today. Players have all the power

No clue who coaches the suns or Portland or Utah or Memphis or Toronto or knicks or kings etc. it’s the opposite in college where I can’t name one person on Tennessee or Kentucky or any top team outside of Zion at Duke. But I know rick Barnes coaches Rocky top and Gregg Marshall is at Wichita state etc

It's more than name recognition although I'd argue Luke's father is more recognizable than he is. Coaching in college means busting your ass and wooing 16-17 year old kids and their families like a maniac. We know how CSM does in that phase of the college job. Who knows how effective Luke would be in recruiting or if he even has the desire to do it?

There is no way even if Walton was interested - which we have no idea at this point - would I trade him for Miller straight up assuming nothing earth-shattering occurs with all of this current Phelps/FBI bullshit.

EastCoastCat wrote:

Newportcat wrote:

azcat49 wrote:Yes yes yes to retaining Miller and seeing what that class could do. No no no on Luke Walton or any alum taking over unless it was Kerr

I am not sure I understand this dislike for Luke as a potential coach for us. Sure if I said Miles Simon or Damon or Jason gardner I understand that.

But Luke has a big name, was known as a very smart player, did a good job with the Lakers from year 1-2 and candidly year 3 before lebron got hurt. I mean to me he is in no way a no no no candidate. Miles would be but I think Luke has great potential as a coach especially in a college setting. He has young kids and his wife is from Tucson so we would maybe get loyalty too that if he did have success he wouldn’t be looking to leave right away.

One thing I have been wrong on is why ever coach in college over the NBA. The thing with college is the coaches are the stars and you can become a god in a city or college. Zero chance you do that in the NBA anymore. Coaches are a dime a dozen in professional sport especially NBA. I could not name more then 10 active head coaches and I am a big fan of the NBA. Here today gone today. Players have all the power

No clue who coaches the suns or Portland or Utah or Memphis or Toronto or knicks or kings etc. it’s the opposite in college where I can’t name one person on Tennessee or Kentucky or any top team outside of Zion at Duke. But I know rick Barnes coaches Rocky top and Gregg Marshall is at Wichita state etc

It's more than name recognition although I'd argue Luke's father is more recognizable than he is. Coaching in college means busting your ass and wooing 16-17 year old kids and their families like a maniac. We know how CSM does in that phase of the college job. Who knows how effective Luke would be in recruiting or if he even has the desire to do it?

There is no way even if Walton was interested - which we have no idea at this point - would I trade him for Miller straight up assuming nothing earth-shattering occurs with all of this current Phelps/FBI bullshit.

Recruiting is hard but you make it seem like at a program like Arizona it’s extremely difficult. Recruitng for Arizona football is really hard but basketball is not nearly as difficult. Now I don’t think Arizona recruits itself but we have everything going for us outside of being in a shitty conference. We have facilities, fan support, tradition, proven track record to get to the NBA, we will play the game offering money, jobs, cars etc meaning we have the friends of the program to get shit done. Also, Luke is seeing first hand how much coaching in the NBA can suck. In college, you get to choose who is on your team not some GM and then if they suck, let them transfer and you move on. My guess is he might say recruiting doesnt sound so bad. Luke would also have a good pitch as the guy took decent talent and turned it into a long term career in the NBA. Guys want to get to the league first and foremost so he would have a good pitch.

Again I have no idea if Luke is interested but if he was I would make that trade in a heart beat. Miller ain’t staying here long term. Any notion anyone has of Miller using next years class to slay the dragon and be our next Lute needs to go. Either he gets fired or turns things around and leaves. I see no way he is staying long term. The relationship is beyond broken at this point. That’s the biggest thing that concerns me, sure next year could be awesome but I would like a long term option as our coach. and whenever Miller leaves given how College basketball works, the cupboard will be bare.