The off season thread

azgreg · Post by **azgreg** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:31 pm

Let the speculation begin.

WildcatStunner · Post by **WildcatStunner** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:32 pm

Please fire Yates. Tired of his sorry ass.

tgrumpy2 · Post by **tgrumpy2** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:47 pm

WildcatStunner wrote:Please fire Yates. Tired of his sorry ass.

Well send Mazzone with him. It looked to me like it was him that went in the bag during the fourth quarter. They didn't stop us all night and we suddenly go in the bag.

cordera89 · Post by **cordera89** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:53 pm

How about the entire Staff instead just two name. Everything has to change.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:54 pm

We'd better recruit.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:58 pm

Tate gone. Yates gone. Tons of other players gone.

IrishAzCat · Post by **IrishAzCat** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:59 pm

We are not even going to make it to the Cheez-It Bowl - that won't help recruiting...

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 5:59 pm

tgrumpy2 wrote:
WildcatStunner wrote:Please fire Yates. Tired of his sorry ass.
Well send Mazzone with him. It looked to me like it was him that went in the bag during the fourth quarter. They didn't stop us all night and we suddenly go in the bag.

If Mazzone called those plays to play prevent ball who is it on to tell him to knock that shit off? Do you think he called 8 straight runs on purpose or was he following orders from his superior?

DrWildcat · Post by **DrWildcat** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:05 pm

ChooChooCat wrote:Tate gone. Yates gone. Tons of other players gone.

Not necessarily mad about any of this.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:07 pm

Attendance will absolutely tank next year

Longhorned · Post by **Longhorned** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:14 pm

At least we lost on account of game management that was so bad, we'll never forget. Helps to soothe the pain of choking a huge lead, unfathomably awful QB decisions, watching ASU fans celebrate in Tucson, and constipation.

catgrad97 · Post by **catgrad97** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:19 pm

It would, J, except I am terribly pessimistic about our fanbase outside of this board.

Too many people just don't get mad and just roll over for mediocrity and passivity until it is far too late.

It used to be a given that Arizona was smarter than ASU, even on the football field, and that gave our school an edge. No more. We may all have to cut ties with this lack of standards if tolerated. Dogcrap.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:23 pm

DrWildcat wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:Tate gone. Yates gone. Tons of other players gone.
Not necessarily mad about any of this.

Not sure why anyone would be.

Too bad RhettRod doesn't have the wheels and arm of Tate, or Tate the football IQ of RhettRod, but then again, they wouldn't play in Arizona if they did.

dovecanyoncat · Post by **dovecanyoncat** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:26 pm

Longhorned wrote:At least we lost on account of game management that was so bad, we'll never forget. Helps to soothe the pain of choking a huge lead, unfathomably awful QB decisions, watching ASU fans celebrate in Tucson, and constipation.

It was an impactful loss, but after all the puking there's no way I could be constipated.

Gladiator Cat · Post by **Gladiator Cat** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:41 pm

All I can say is you better hope like hell that the school can hold onto Gilbert (OL) and Iona (DL). They are hands down the cream of the crop of this coaching staff.

Those two may have done some of the best coaching as I've ever seen at Arizona in the last twenty years. Those two coaches turned water into wine. An absolutely amazing job with little to nothing to work with.

Mazzone to his credit is an excellent QB coach and play caller. He was just stuck with a collection of dumb, out of position and unqualified D-1 Qb options to work with. Its that simple. He couldn't over come the dichotomy of football stupidity and lack of talent.

I would also give high marks to the running back coach Mckenny. The rest of the shit show should be updating resumes for future employment. If Yates is here next year then Sumlin is even more unqualified to coach than I've ever thought possible about any HC at Arizona.

Overall, this team is stunningly undisciplined and unfocused. Sumlin in my view is a very average coach at best. His rep is/was far too elevated in reality. He as it turns out is way below my initial thoughts of premier skill-set and talent and it turns out my expectations were wildly over optimistic and not warranted. Probably the same as most others in hindsight.

Arizona football remains at a forever crossroads never appearing to leave that dark underachieving shadow of mediocrity for a brighter and more positive future.

KillerKlown · Post by **KillerKlown** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:52 pm

Gladiator Cat wrote:All I can say is you better hope like hell that the school can hold onto Gilbert (OL) and Iona (DL). They are hands down the cream of the crop of this coaching staff.

Those two may have done some of the best coaching as I've ever seen at Arizona in the last twenty years. Those two coaches turned water into wine. An absolutely amazing job with little to nothing to work with.

Mazzone to his credit is an excellent QB coach and play caller. He was just stuck with a collection of dumb, out of position and unqualified D-1 Qb options to work with. Its that simple. He couldn't over come the dichotomy of football stupidity and lack of talent.

I would also give high marks to the running back coach Mckenny. The rest of the shit show should be updating resumes for future employment. If yates is here next year then Sumlin is even more unqualified to coach than I've ever thought about any HC at Arizona.

Overall, this team is stunningly undisciplined and unfocused. Sumlin in my view is a very average coach at best. His rep is/was far too elevated in reality. Way below my initial thoughts and expectations coming in.

Arizona football remains at a crossroads never appearing to leave that dark underachieving shadow of mediocrity for a brighter and more positive future.

If there's anybody that knows stupidity and lack of talent it's Mazzone. Uninspiring, unoriginal, and unimaginative of an OC.

OSUCat · Post by **OSUCat** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 8:46 pm

It’s a big off season for Sumlin.

Keep Gilbert.

MrBug708 · Post by **MrBug708** » Sat Nov 24, 2018 9:25 pm

KillerKlown wrote:
Gladiator Cat wrote:All I can say is you better hope like hell that the school can hold onto Gilbert (OL) and Iona (DL). They are hands down the cream of the crop of this coaching staff.

Those two may have done some of the best coaching as I've ever seen at Arizona in the last twenty years. Those two coaches turned water into wine. An absolutely amazing job with little to nothing to work with.

Mazzone to his credit is an excellent QB coach and play caller. He was just stuck with a collection of dumb, out of position and unqualified D-1 Qb options to work with. Its that simple. He couldn't over come the dichotomy of football stupidity and lack of talent.

I would also give high marks to the running back coach Mckenny. The rest of the shit show should be updating resumes for future employment. If yates is here next year then Sumlin is even more unqualified to coach than I've ever thought about any HC at Arizona.

Overall, this team is stunningly undisciplined and unfocused. Sumlin in my view is a very average coach at best. His rep is/was far too elevated in reality. Way below my initial thoughts and expectations coming in.

Arizona football remains at a crossroads never appearing to leave that dark underachieving shadow of mediocrity for a brighter and more positive future.
If there's anybody that knows stupidity and lack of talent it's Mazzone. Uninspiring, unoriginal, and unimaginative of an OC.

Mazzone is garbage as a play caller. He has a great system and can work with And, but someone else needs to call plays

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 10:53 am

Gladiator Cat wrote:All I can say is you better hope like hell that the school can hold onto Gilbert (OL) and Iona (DL). They are hands down the cream of the crop of this coaching staff.

Those two may have done some of the best coaching as I've ever seen at Arizona in the last twenty years. Those two coaches turned water into wine. An absolutely amazing job with little to nothing to work with.

Mazzone to his credit is an excellent QB coach and play caller. He was just stuck with a collection of dumb, out of position and unqualified D-1 Qb options to work with. Its that simple. He couldn't over come the dichotomy of football stupidity and lack of talent.

I would also give high marks to the running back coach Mckenny. The rest of the shit show should be updating resumes for future employment. If Yates is here next year then Sumlin is even more unqualified to coach than I've ever thought possible about any HC at Arizona.

Overall, this team is stunningly undisciplined and unfocused. Sumlin in my view is a very average coach at best. His rep is/was far too elevated in reality. He as it turns out is way below my initial thoughts of premier skill-set and talent and it turns out my expectations were wildly over optimistic and not warranted. Probably the same as most others in hindsight.

Arizona football remains at a forever crossroads never appearing to leave that dark underachieving shadow of mediocrity for a brighter and more positive future.

Mazzone spent a season trying to force a square peg into a round hole. The whole world knows Tate is best as a runner and he spent a full year basically eliminating that from the equation.

At what point do we expect him to coach to the players he has? Tate was regarded as a Heisman contender and we've flipped into labeling him untalented.

ByJoveByJingle · Post by **ByJoveByJingle** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:02 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Mazzone spent a season trying to force a square peg into a round hole. The whole world knows Tate is best as a runner and he spent a full year basically eliminating that from the equation.

I think it’s unclear, at best, who is most responsible for this travesty. The player, the hangers-on, the offensive coordinator, the head coach? Could be any or all.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:09 am

ByJoveByJingle wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Mazzone spent a season trying to force a square peg into a round hole. The whole world knows Tate is best as a runner and he spent a full year basically eliminating that from the equation.
I think it’s unclear, at best, who is most responsible for this travesty. The player, the hangers-on, the offensive coordinator, the head coach? Could be any or all.

I see it as the responsibility of the HC and OC to manage the player. They have to get Tate running what benefits us. If he doesn't want to do it, they either have to persuade him to do it or sit him.

If Sumlin and Mazzone have so little control that Tate is responsible for the failings of the plan, that's also their fault. This is college and Tate isn't Peyton Manning, who you sort of have to give leeway to.

ByJoveByJingle · Post by **ByJoveByJingle** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 11:30 am

True, but not absolutely true. They did sit him. It was a disaster. So they brought him back. Sure, the newspapers will tell you it’s because Tate was injured. I didn’t see any evidence of there being any greater or lesser level of mobility before or after he was benched.

tgrumpy2 · Post by **tgrumpy2** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:14 pm

Gladiator Cat wrote:All I can say is you better hope like hell that the school can hold onto Gilbert (OL) and Iona (DL). They are hands down the cream of the crop of this coaching staff.

Those two may have done some of the best coaching as I've ever seen at Arizona in the last twenty years. Those two coaches turned water into wine. An absolutely amazing job with little to nothing to work with.

Mazzone to his credit is an excellent QB coach and play caller. He was just stuck with a collection of dumb, out of position and unqualified D-1 Qb options to work with. Its that simple. He couldn't over come the dichotomy of football stupidity and lack of talent.

I would also give high marks to the running back coach Mckenny. The rest of the shit show should be updating resumes for future employment. If Yates is here next year then Sumlin is even more unqualified to coach than I've ever thought possible about any HC at Arizona.

Overall, this team is stunningly undisciplined and unfocused. Sumlin in my view is a very average coach at best. His rep is/was far too elevated in reality. He as it turns out is way below my initial thoughts of premier skill-set and talent and it turns out my expectations were wildly over optimistic and not warranted. Probably the same as most others in hindsight.

Arizona football remains at a forever crossroads never appearing to leave that dark underachieving shadow of mediocrity for a brighter and more positive future.

For 3 quarters we were basically kicking ASU's butt. I thought Az looked very focused. It was coaches that put them in a prevent defense for an entire quarter and expected some kind of positive result. It was coaches that put the offense in the bag and we went three and out three times in a row. You're right on the OL and DL coaches. I like those guys. Mr Bug is correct, Mazzone is a terrible play caller. I'm sorry but I blame Mazzone for cutting off Tate's legs. We can blame who we want but in the end its the Head Coach's job. He could have told Mazzone to run the offense and quit being conservative and he could have told Yates to get out of that prevent defense. After all he is the head coach.

blackjacker · Post by **blackjacker** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 1:51 pm

ByJoveByJingle wrote:True, but not absolutely true. They did sit him. It was a disaster. So they brought him back. Sure, the newspapers will tell you it’s because Tate was injured. I didn’t see any evidence of there being any greater or lesser level of mobility before or after he was benched.

Lack of Tate didn't lose that game.

They simply changed Tate too much. They could have had him pass more than last year. They didn't need to have him pass almost exclusively.

BYUs coach said that there were plenty of plays where Tate was supposed to run but didn't.

No matter what, it's Sumlin's fault for allowing it to happen.

Irish27 · Post by **Irish27** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 4:35 pm

Hire Joe Salave’a to replace Yates.

OSUCat · Post by **OSUCat** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 4:52 pm

Sumlin needs to let Kliff K. Know that Arizonas third game next year is against Texas Tech.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 4:59 pm

Irish27 wrote:Hire Joe Salave’a to replace Yates.

You do that and you're pretty much firing Iona.

prh · Post by **prh** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 5:57 pm

OSUCat wrote:Sumlin needs to let Kliff K. Know that Arizonas third game next year is against Texas Tech.

Would love to bring Kingsbury in

Carcassdragger · Post by **Carcassdragger** » Sun Nov 25, 2018 6:04 pm

Get Cecil more involved!

PieceOfMeat · Post by **PieceOfMeat** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:50 am

MrBug708 wrote: Mazzone is garbage as a play caller. He has a great system and can work with And, but someone else needs to call plays

While I was not a fan of mazzone's play calling this year (and certainly not in the late 3rd/entire 4th quarter of the game vs ASsU) I'd say that his play calling issues were made worse by our having a QB that is, to put it nicely, not very good at doing what QB's need to do (like progress through his reads, keep his eyes open for more WR's than the 1 running deep, or make the right read on an option play).

I'm not in a rush to fire the guy, with it being his first year here and all, but if next season is as poorly called as this one was (in regards to talent on the field vs talent he wishes was on the field to execute his calls) then I'm all for letting him go after next year.
I also wouldn't cry if he was gone now either.

prh · Post by **prh** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:37 am

Hey let's not forget, Kliff recruited and coached an NFL MVP candidate, and recently too (compared to most of Sumlin's QB successes). That is certainly something you could sell recruits on.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:52 am

PieceOfMeat wrote:While I was not a fan of mazzone's play calling this year (and certainly not in the late 3rd/entire 4th quarter of the game vs ASsU)

Something I have been wondering about, since both Mazzone and Yates went into prevent the same time end of the 3rd quarter, I wonder if it came from straight Sumlin to take the air out of the ball on offense, and bend and don't break on defense.

Like Sumlin said in the post game presser, the play calling was not the cause of the loss, it was the interception by Tate and the fumble by JJ. Not sure why he would throw his players under the bus, instead of the coordinators, which he should take all blame himself anyway.

PieceOfMeat · Post by **PieceOfMeat** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 12:51 pm

Merkin wrote:
PieceOfMeat wrote:While I was not a fan of mazzone's play calling this year (and certainly not in the late 3rd/entire 4th quarter of the game vs ASsU)
Something I have been wondering about, since both Mazzone and Yates went into prevent the same time end of the 3rd quarter, I wonder if it came from straight Sumlin to take the air out of the ball on offense, and bend and don't break on defense.

Something I've also been wondering.

Sumlin's lost a lot of good will already, and made his already tough job all the more difficult.

blackjacker · Post by **blackjacker** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 1:05 pm

PieceOfMeat wrote:
Merkin wrote:
PieceOfMeat wrote:While I was not a fan of mazzone's play calling this year (and certainly not in the late 3rd/entire 4th quarter of the game vs ASsU)
Something I have been wondering about, since both Mazzone and Yates went into prevent the same time end of the 3rd quarter, I wonder if it came from straight Sumlin to take the air out of the ball on offense, and bend and don't break on defense.

Something I've also been wondering.

Sumlin's lost a lot of good will already, and made his already tough job all the more difficult.

Whole town doesn't appreciate that he put leg irons on the guy that was bringing so much national interest to this team.

tgrumpy2 · Post by **tgrumpy2** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:30 pm

Irish27 wrote:Hire Joe Salave’a to replace Yates.

Joe has a really good gig where he is and he isn't coming. And he makes 650K

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:34 pm

catgrad97 wrote:It would, J, except I am terribly pessimistic about our fanbase outside of this board.

Too many people just don't get mad and just roll over for mediocrity and passivity until it is far too late.

It used to be a given that Arizona was smarter than ASU, even on the football field, and that gave our school an edge. No more. We may all have to cut ties with this lack of standards if tolerated. Dogcrap.

I don't get this, what are fans supposed to do? They have already left in droves. The "mad" tweets and blog posts aplenty. I don't get how getting "madder" helps. Do we need to picket the athletic department? Maybe sabotage?

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:44 pm

So Tate dictates who we hire with his tweets. Then he doesn't run hurting his team for whatever reason. Then he doesn't like how he was used? Now he is going to transfer. Who is in control of that QB room? My gosh, the inmates are running the asylum.

I doubt I will ever get over Saturdsy. We had a chance you hang 60 on them and we pussed out. Sumlin going for Two twice when we had the lead was beyond maddening. Not getting that last FG closer was just a microcosm of the whole game/season.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:50 pm

azcat49 wrote:So Tate dictates who we hire with his tweets. Then he goes by run hurting his team for whatever reason. Then he doesn't like how he was used? Now tebus going to transfer. Who is in control of that QB room? My gosh, the inmates are running the asylum.

I doubt I will ever get over Saturdsy. We had a chance you hang 60 on them and we pussed out. Sumlin going Two twice when we had the lead was beyond maddening. Not getting that last FG closer was just a microcosm of the whole game.

Tate had ZERO to do with the hire.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:54 pm

azcat49 wrote:So Tate dictates who we hire with his tweets. Then he goes by run hurting his team for whatever reason. Then he doesn't like how he was used? Now tebus going to transfer. Who is in control of that QB room? My gosh, the inmates are running the asylum.

I doubt I will ever get over Saturdsy. We had a chance you hang 60 on them and we pussed out. Sumlin going Two twice when we had the lead was beyond maddening. Not getting that last FG closer was just a microcosm of the whole game.

We were a couple over thrown Tate passes away from winning like 55-35.

blackjacker · Post by **blackjacker** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:21 pm

ASUHATER! wrote:
azcat49 wrote:So Tate dictates who we hire with his tweets. Then he goes by run hurting his team for whatever reason. Then he doesn't like how he was used? Now tebus going to transfer. Who is in control of that QB room? My gosh, the inmates are running the asylum.

I doubt I will ever get over Saturdsy. We had a chance you hang 60 on them and we pussed out. Sumlin going Two twice when we had the lead was beyond maddening. Not getting that last FG closer was just a microcosm of the whole game.
We were a couple over thrown Tate passes away from winning like 55-35.

We were also one easy QB run away from a game winning chipshot.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:10 pm

blackjacker wrote:
ASUHATER! wrote:
azcat49 wrote:So Tate dictates who we hire with his tweets. Then he goes by run hurting his team for whatever reason. Then he doesn't like how he was used? Now tebus going to transfer. Who is in control of that QB room? My gosh, the inmates are running the asylum.

I doubt I will ever get over Saturdsy. We had a chance you hang 60 on them and we pussed out. Sumlin going Two twice when we had the lead was beyond maddening. Not getting that last FG closer was just a microcosm of the whole game.
We were a couple over thrown Tate passes away from winning like 55-35.
We were also one easy QB run away from a game winning chipshot.

When the announcers even comment on the open lanes, that’s your clue. Not rocket science, he didn’t want to run. Sure as Hell tried to impress with the long ball though, huh?

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:11 pm

In the offseason, hope springs eternal.....

Haha, just kidding. We will suck forever.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:14 pm

Well, the offseason's off to as good a start as the season had. Disastrous.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:38 pm

Chicat wrote:In the offseason, hope springs eternal.....

Haha, just kidding. We will suck forever.

Yep. Well actually we'll be mediocre forever. We have had some truly bad seasons (2002-2005, 2011, 2016) but historically we're as mediocre as it gets. Basically a perpetual .500 team.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 8:56 pm

We do however have a kid coming in that broke a couple of impressive records in the state of Texas.

Kid might be a bust, or maybe the curse that haunts us all miraculously gets lifted?

I’m optimistic!

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:56 pm

blackjacker wrote:
ASUHATER! wrote:
azcat49 wrote:So Tate dictates who we hire with his tweets. Then he goes by run hurting his team for whatever reason. Then he doesn't like how he was used? Now tebus going to transfer. Who is in control of that QB room? My gosh, the inmates are running the asylum.

I doubt I will ever get over Saturdsy. We had a chance you hang 60 on them and we pussed out. Sumlin going Two twice when we had the lead was beyond maddening. Not getting that last FG closer was just a microcosm of the whole game.
We were a couple over thrown Tate passes away from winning like 55-35.
We were also one easy QB run away from a game winning chipshot.

Michael Lev also had a screen shot of some receiver wide open under coverage. Yet Tate, like always, tried to throw it deeper downfield into coverage. Not going to rewatch the game, but I imagine in many plays Tate ignored the open man 10 yards downfield.

blackjacker · Post by **blackjacker** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:58 pm

Sid wrote:We do however have a kid coming in that broke a couple of impressive records in the state of Texas.

Kid might be a bust, or maybe the curse that haunts us all miraculously gets lifted?

I’m optimistic!

If Sumlin doesn't fuck it up. He seems to have a problem keeping QBs.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:15 pm

How can he. He already promised Gunnel the starting job

blackjacker · Post by **blackjacker** » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:30 pm

azcat49 wrote:How can he. He already promised Gunnel the starting job

I hope he doesn't try to make him run the wishbone.

Sid · Post by **Sid** » Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:23 am

azcat49 wrote:How can he. He already promised Gunnel the starting job

Wouldn’t be surprised. Not too many people would’ve predicted Tate would be out of the Heisman race very early on in 2018. Most thought he would have a very good season and be off to the NFL. Maybe he will get his name called on the very last day by the Raiders. They love taking risks....

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