Why can't ASU or U of A recruit the state of Arizona well

[Newportcat]

In my opinion, one of the biggest challenges both programs face if either one wants consistent long term success is recruiting in state talent. Unfortunately the state does not produce a ton of talent every year like Southern California or Texas, Florida etc. However with the continued growth in the state population wise that should change and I would expect the state to produce better talent. I think if either program was able to keep more of that talent in state, it would definitely help them on a long term basis. But neither programs seems to be able to. I feel we have never been able to recruit the state well on a consistent basis and ASU used to but not lately.

Think about this, there are more players from the state of Louisiana committed to the sun devils and wildcats then the state of Arizona. That is crazy to me.

I don't live in Arizona so it is tough for me to comment on this as I am not close to high school football in the state of Arizona. Certainitely it obvious both programs have to recruit California well which I think actually do a great job of. But why can't either program recruit Arizona well. Most be very frustrating for coaches on both sides as there is good talent that seems to leave every year. Is it facilities, or trying to escape the heat, or what because you can't say this year it's because both programs aren't good.

Thoughts or comments?

[azcat49]

Too me its choices. In AZ you have 2, any other state you might have several. Also in AZ you only have BCS level schools or a FCS schoolso alot of the tweener candidates get looked over IMO.

[Newportcat]

I can understand about the tweener comment for sure as it seems we will take a tweener from California way before we take a tweener from AZ but not sure on the only two bcs level schools comment. Seems like a lot of states have that and don't see why that would hurt our ability to recruit in state players.

Do you think the fact that not many of the potential players are from Arizona or at least they might be but there parents aren't plays a factor ie since so many people are transplants to as they don't care if they go to school somewhere else.

Just seems like we have a way better shot at a four star kid from California then we do Arizona most years. I find it more weird given ASU is having a hard time again too. And both of us are top 20 schools this year. You think we would dominate in state recruiting this year especially given both coaches have been around a while now.

What's funny is I think about basketball and if you are a top 100 player I see little to no chance you live the state especially if Sean miller wants you.

[UofACat23]

Isn't the more important question "who are we losing the top talent to?"

I would imagine it's mainly to premiere programs. It seems fairly rare that we actually beat out a top school for a recruit, regardless of where they are from.

EDIT: Per Scout:

This year the 4 stars have committed to: Texas A&M, Arizona
Last year the 4 stars from AZ went to: Texas A&M (2), Stanford, Oregon, Oklahoma, Arizona, ASU
The year before that they went to: UCLA (2), Oregon, ASU, Notre Dame, Wazzu
The year before that they went to: Stanford, ASU, Notre Dame, Texas, Oregon, Oklahoma State


Other than Wazzu, it's hard to claim that any of those schools aren't more prestigious than Arizona/ASU.

Totals:
3: ASU, Texas A&M, Oregon
2: Arizona, Stanford, UCLA, Notre Dame (although Neal transferred to AZ)
1: Oklahoma/OK St/Wazzu/Texas

[ASUHATER!]

Texas a&m, Stanford and Oregon own Arizona recruiting

[Newportcat]

True but if we were ever going to have an advantage over a premiere school it would seem it would be due to proximity to home for in state recruits. However that rarely ever happens with us or with asu

Nebraska and UCLA also recruit Phoenix well it has seemed

I don't get Texas a & m, they are not a premier program. Oregon is and stanford was but also has the academics.

Just sad and has got to be frustrating to rich rod as every year the top talent just leaves it seems. Rich rod benefited from it when he was at Michigan too but could almost bet he finds it harder to recruit the top talent from Arizona to u of a then it was to Michigan.

If we ever solve this I think it could have a great impact on our program. If ASU solves it I would think the same. I don't know if there is another state in the country where people are able to poach the top recruits from the local schools on a consistent basis.

[Machina]

To me, Arizona and ASSU are not as sexy as these other programs and Arizona and ASSU do not have the history in both football success and generations of fans and alumni that these other schools have as well.

If you are a football player in HS in Ohio, you think about Ohio State or Michigan 24/7. I do not think that is the same for UA or ASSU because of the reasons above. In a few generations it will be I believe. Same for the pro sports teams in Arizona for a fan's alliance.

[catinfl]

In-State recruiting is a topic that's brought up a lot. Not all kids want to stay in-state. A lot of them want to leave it and it's hard to convince them to stay sometimes. It happens to us when we pull a top recruit from SoCal with an offer from UCLA or USC these kids want to leave the state and often do so when they have the chance. Not to mention there are some schools in Arizona that will never have a recruit go to UofA because of the staff there. (Hamilton & Saguaro) There are schools that will never have a recruit go to asu. (Salpointe) There's a lot more to in-state recruiting then meets the eyes.

[dmjcat]

In-State recruiting is a topic that's brought up a lot. Not all kids want to stay in-state. A lot of them want to leave it and it's hard to convince them to stay sometimes. It happens to us when we pull a top recruit from SoCal with an offer from UCLA or USC these kids want to leave the state and often do so when they have the chance. Not to mention there are some schools in Arizona that will never have a recruit go to UofA because of the staff there. (Hamilton & Saguaro) There are schools that will never have a recruit go to asu. (Salpointe) There's a lot more to in-state recruiting then meets the eyes.

CatinFl hits the nail on the head. That said the used-car-salesman of a coach up north is tearing it up on the recruiting trail. RRod needs to raise his game or we risk falling behind.

http://247sports.com/Article/The-holida ... l-34143924

No program had a better holiday on the recruiting trail than Arizona State.

The Sun Devils moved up three spots to No. 22 in the nation in the 247Sports Recruiting Rankings after landing a Christmas Eve verbal from Under Armour All-American running back Paul Lucas, and then securing a verbal from four-star offensive guard Zach Robertson on Dec. 26.

With Lucas and Robertson in the fold, Arizona State is closing on Oregon for the No. 3 class in the Pac 12. The Ducks current haul ranks No. 20 nationally.

Lucas is ranked by 247Sports as the nation's No. 9 all-purpose back, and the Phoenix (Ariz.) Mountain Pointe standout ranks as the No. 3 player in the state.

Out of Bellflower (Calif.) St. John Bosco, the 6-foot-5, 322-pound Robertson is ranked as the country's No. 12 offensive guard. He is the sixth prospect to hold four-star status for Todd Graham and his staff in this recruiting class, joining JUCO linebacker Davon Durant, the nation’s No. 1 inside linebacker who is already signed along with prep standouts in U.S. Army All-Americans in quarterback Brady White and athlete Jaason Lewis as well as linebackers Khaylan Thomas and Malik Lawal.

Graham and company are not done yet. They hope to add a few more big names.

High-profile recruits considering Arizona State down the stretch includes U.S. Army All American five-star defensive tackle Rasheem Green, five-star outside linebacker John Houston, Top50 receiver Damarkus Lodge, five-star linebacker Porter Gustin, U.S. Army All-American Top100 linebacker Osa Masina, U.S. Army All-American receiver and White’s teammate in Trent Irwin, U.S. Army All-American receiver Stanley Norman, Alabama soft commit Daylon Charlot, Top247 receiver Cordell Broadus and four-star running back Tyreik Gray.

[CalStateTempe]

In-State recruiting is a topic that's brought up a lot. Not all kids want to stay in-state. A lot of them want to leave it and it's hard to convince them to stay sometimes. It happens to us when we pull a top recruit from SoCal with an offer from UCLA or USC these kids want to leave the state and often do so when they have the chance. Not to mention there are some schools in Arizona that will never have a recruit go to UofA because of the staff there. (Hamilton & Saguaro) There are schools that will never have a recruit go to asu. (Salpointe) There's a lot more to in-state recruiting then meets the eyes.

That is so fucking lame, you'd think you'd want your players to success and gain visibility where they can. Whats the story/history there, PE teachers flunked out of UofA or are just d-bag ASU homers?

[UAEebs86]

In-State recruiting is a topic that's brought up a lot. Not all kids want to stay in-state. A lot of them want to leave it and it's hard to convince them to stay sometimes. It happens to us when we pull a top recruit from SoCal with an offer from UCLA or USC these kids want to leave the state and often do so when they have the chance. Not to mention there are some schools in Arizona that will never have a recruit go to UofA because of the staff there. (Hamilton & Saguaro) There are schools that will never have a recruit go to asu. (Salpointe) There's a lot more to in-state recruiting then meets the eyes.

That is so fucking lame, you'd think you'd want your players to success and gain visibility where they can. Whats the story/history there, PE teachers flunked out of UofA or are just d-bag ASU homers?

I don't know what the Saguaro coach's background is, but Belles the HC at Hamilton went to high school in Phoenix (St. Mary's) and played QB for Notre Dame. I'm not sure why he's such an ASU guy now. I would think you would want your kids to go to wherever they had the best chance for success.

[gronk4heisman]

Asus recruiting success is even more disappointing then our lack of success in paper.

[Newportcat]

From twitter today

RichRod on recruiting in AZ: "It’s frustrating sometimes b/c there’s some players in-state that won’t even give us a visit."

Seriously what is the deal, you never see this with basketball at all (though the talent level for basketball in AZ is pretty meager)

4 years in, lots of on the field success, new facilities, and we still can't recruit Phoenix well. Can not even get guys to take visits

[scumdevils86]

some schools just aren't going to get guys to UofA. Hamilton, Chandler or what not. Just don't know if that will ever happen.

[CalStateTempe]

some schools just aren't going to get guys to UofA. Hamilton, Chandler or what not. Just don't know if that will ever happen.

Thats so stupid.

So glad I left that glorified high school town of Phoenix metro area.

[dmjcat]

some schools just aren't going to get guys to UofA. Hamilton, Chandler or what not. Just don't know if that will ever happen.

asu will always have a leg up on recruiting in their own backyard.

I personally don't expect RichRod or any UA football coach to ever out-recruit (or match) the LA schools in recruiting but I don't believe it is unreasonable for the UA to at least come close to matching asu in recruiting. Hopefully this years success will begin to pay off next year with visits/commits. If we are still signing up large numbers of 2 star recruits next fall while Toady Graham is picking off 4 stars then I will become concerned. No matter how good a coach/developer of talent one is........the coach still has to sign the talent. And at the moment asu is opening up the talent gap.

[Newportcat]

Man it is so nice being back with this group where you can have honest reasonable conversations about u of a football where concerns can be addressed and not every response to recruiting is remember scobby wright or teddy bruschi or chuck Cecil.

I love Matt dudek as he seems like a great guy but have to admit that right now this class does underwhelm me especially from the state of AZ recruits. Not so much the star rankings but where guys were offered which to me means more. If a guy is a two star recruit but has major offers then fine by me. If he wasn't offered many places in the PAC 12 then that's not a great sign. I just would have thought with the new football facility and our record this year we would have a top 25 class for sure. Reminds me of stoops fourth year class that also underwhelmed after having increased success three years in a row.

Maybe it's because we really can't sell playing time as much since we have a lot of guys coming back? Maybe we took too many guys too early in the process? I know rich rod himself said after last year they might wait longer to take recruits?

Who knows and really sad AZ recruits won't look at our program more. To me, AZ recruits are great because they are less likely to get home sick which I know from being a student at U of A is an issue for a lot of out of state students. If your playing football and things aren't going well having family close can help.

I am rambling now and obviously the on field success has been great but would have thought for many reasons is class would have been better then last years on paper. Maybe it still will be but kind of feels like it is mostly over as not hearing about a ton of upcoming visits, etc.

[Chicat]

I love Matt dudek as he seems like a great guy but have to admit that right now this class does underwhelm me especially from the state of AZ recruits. Not so much the star rankings but where guys were offered which to me means more. If a guy is a two star recruit but has major offers then fine by me. If he wasn't offered many places in the PAC 12 then that's not a great sign. I just would have thought with the new football facility and our record this year we would have a top 25 class for sure. Reminds me of stoops fourth year class that also underwhelmed after having increased success three years in a row.

I really feel like any uptick in recruiting based on this year's success will show up with the 2016 class. While some 2015 kids may have taken a second look at us because of the on-field success, the relationships they already established with other schools/staffs when they first saw us as a fairly mediocre program will probably take precedence. If we're still only getting 2 and 3 stars next year, then there's an issue with our recruiting. With Stoops it was laziness and disinterest. I don't see that being an issue with this staff.

[Newportcat]

I agree that next years class should reflect this years success but it's not like we were bad in 2013, we won a bowl game, built a new fancy facility, etc.

I am no expert at evaluating talent since I am a former water polo player who never played football. However after following u of a recruiting for about 15 years I can tell you that we have never recruited the state well and for every scobby wright two star stud there are about 5-10 no names who never do anything who are two or three star recruits. Now a lot of four stars will also not produce as recruiting is a tough science but guys like Kadeem, gronk, Briggs etc have flourished here and were four star recruits. I agree that we should never be able to beat the LA schools in recruiting constantly but there is no reason why schools like ASU or Washington or other should beat us in recruiting IMHO

[ASUHATER!]

Keep in mind we had almost the whole class committed before the season even started so it was hard for the season to have a big impact

[dmjcat]

I believe a not-so-hidden factor in asu's recruiting successes the past two years comes from being featured on the PAC12 Network show "The Drive". Cracker even mentioned being on the show was "like gold" for exposing the program to recruits/parents and helped them get their foot in the door on a lot of recruits they normally couldn't.

RRod should be politicking heavily to have the UA be the featured team on the show next year.

[rickyk]

RichRod would be a welcome change from the two self-absorbed dorks they have had on the drive so far with Toad and Mora.

[Irish27]

I believe a not-so-hidden factor in asu's recruiting successes the past two years comes from being featured on the PAC12 Network show "The Drive". Cracker even mentioned being on the show was "like gold" for exposing the program to recruits/parents and helped them get their foot in the door on a lot of recruits they normally couldn't.

RRod should be politicking heavily to have the UA be the featured team on the show next year.

Greg Byrne mentioned that could be in the works.

[Chicat]

I believe a not-so-hidden factor in asu's recruiting successes the past two years comes from being featured on the PAC12 Network show "The Drive". Cracker even mentioned being on the show was "like gold" for exposing the program to recruits/parents and helped them get their foot in the door on a lot of recruits they normally couldn't.

RRod should be politicking heavily to have the UA be the featured team on the show next year.

Greg Byrne mentioned that could be in the works.

That would be awesome. RR is perfect for that show. They should want us just as badly as we should want to do it.

[Newportcat]

Whats strange to me is Rich Rod stated they were going to wait on more recruits this year rather then filling up the class early and then the opposite happened. Given the year we had, you would expect it to really help us this year but maybe the coaches started focusing on 2016 knowing we had little to no scholies to fill

Our staff would be AMAZING on the drive. Rich Rod is a natural and hopefully Dudek would get air time as he is a natural too. Our D-Line coach would be amazing too, guy is as salty as they come

[UAdevil]

Whats strange to me is Rich Rod stated they were going to wait on more recruits this year rather then filling up the class early and then the opposite happened. Given the year we had, you would expect it to really help us this year but maybe the coaches started focusing on 2016 knowing we had little to no scholies to fill

Our staff would be AMAZING on the drive. Rich Rod is a natural and hopefully Dudek would get air time as he is a natural too. Our D-Line coach would be amazing too, guy is as salty as they come

He moonlights as a mall cop?

[catgrad97]

Tempe and east Mesa HSs are bad with the blatant anti-U of A bashing the kids are brainwashed with starting very young. Sometimes it's the only way I think Sendek recruits at all in-state.

No excuses on the Chandler schools. Belles is Uncle Rico who got a coaching job--he doesn't give a crap about what's really best for his players' football futures because he never had much of one after HS.

Who's their poster boy there: Terrell Suggs? That's the best example of pro football talent the whole city can produce?

Look what RichRod did with a two-star out of Texas with no D-I offers. Shove that example in the face of Belles and the rest of the ignorant ASU East Valley homers the next time they try to block Arizona recruiters.

[Scummy Dick Douglas]

Tempe and east Mesa HSs are bad with the blatant anti-U of A bashing the kids are brainwashed with starting very young. Sometimes it's the only way I think Sendek recruits at all in-state.

No excuses on the Chandler schools. Belles is Uncle Rico who got a coaching job--he doesn't give a crap about what's really best for his players' football futures because he never had much of one after HS.

Who's their poster boy there: Terrell Suggs? That's the best example of pro football talent the whole city can produce?

Look what RichRod did with a two-star out of Texas with no D-I offers. Shove that example in the face of Belles and the rest of the ignorant ASU East Valley homers the next time they try to block Arizona recruiters.

You are insane if you don't see Suggs as a solid example of AZ football talent. Dude has had a long, very successful pro career (DPOY, SB champ, lots of $).

The AZ universities face a real up-hill battle in keeping local talent. High school kids in AZ seem to have little-to-no loyalty to the state in comparison to kids from other parts of the country. Maybe something to do with the transient nature of much of the PHX population?

[splitsecond]

Tempe and east Mesa HSs are bad with the blatant anti-U of A bashing the kids are brainwashed with starting very young. Sometimes it's the only way I think Sendek recruits at all in-state.

No excuses on the Chandler schools. Belles is Uncle Rico who got a coaching job--he doesn't give a crap about what's really best for his players' football futures because he never had much of one after HS.

Who's their poster boy there: Terrell Suggs? That's the best example of pro football talent the whole city can produce?

Look what RichRod did with a two-star out of Texas with no D-I offers. Shove that example in the face of Belles and the rest of the ignorant ASU East Valley homers the next time they try to block Arizona recruiters.

Hard to compete with the east valley homers because (1) most of them are ASU alumni because (2) they either didn't get in anywhere else or couldn't afford out of state tuition back when in state tuition was almost free and (3) they were not smart or talented enough to ever leave the valley.

There is a reason why, at least from what I observed when I was there, that Arizona students from the valley tend to be from more successful or harder working families than not, and alumni end up in more affluent areas of the valley than Mesa, Tempe or Chandler.

These jagaloons in the east valley have tiny dick little brother syndrome in the WORST possible way. Their message boards are just a small taste of what their fanbase is like and how little so many of them know about football.

The short version: the Chandler/Mesa kids are being raised by retarded wolves, and unless by some miracle some non-ASSU folks get into those programs and schools it is going to be tough to pull kids out. May as well focus on Scottsdale, Phoenix and the private schools.

[dmjcat]

A WR has decommitted from Oregon State and lists AZ as a school he is interested in........no idea if we are interested in him or have enough scholies left. He was one of OSU's higher ranked commits:

https://footballrecruiting.rivals.com/c ... ID=1720535

[catinfl]

A WR has decommitted from Oregon State and lists AZ as a school he is interested in........no idea if we are interested in him or have enough scholies left. He was one of OSU's higher ranked commits:

https://footballrecruiting.rivals.com/c ... ID=1720535

No.

Anyways, to those who follow the recruiting thread most know I'm a stargazer. I love when we pickup the higher rated guys, but I'm only a stargazer to an extent. RR has proven time and time again he knows what he is doing. While I know that if you get a class full of 2*'s you're not going to be successful, but RR can get a class full of solid 3* guys and do well with them. They can develop talent. It's evident with the players that are contributing. Who ever thought Cody Ippilitto would ever step on the field? I sure didn't. So getting back to the point. Would I love some 4 and 5 star guys mixed in with RR's guys. Yes, of course, but RR likes to fill up his classes early and if you watch some of the guys that committed over the Summer's senior highlight tape you understand why they recruited him.

Kendal Franklin 2* OLB from Louisiana.
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1518637/hig ... /185794376
Shun Brown 3* WR
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/524029/highlights/186568375
Antonio Parks 3* DB
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/2263525/hig ... /214555389
Cedric Peterson 3* WR
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/1814155/highlights/67854376
Alex Kosinski 2* OT/DL (if you don't watch any of these tapes watch this one.)
http://www.hudl.com/athlete/517448/highlights/163578386

All of these kids I was a little skeptical on, but I see why they got these kids.

[Newportcat]

Wow that Kosinski guy was straight dominating

He comes in early too, he looked very mobile for a guy his size

No idea on the competition but looked good