Bear Down Wildcats

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Rep if I could.

Morning after perspective...

As bad as last night's loss was, it does not prevent this from still being a terrific season. My wife and I attended a friend's annual party last night and I purposely avoided any view of a TV so I could watch the game on DVR when I got home. And I did, until almost 2AM.

This loss bothered me much more than the USC one; I really expected a win, and at worst - a hard fought, close loss. As awful as that was (and it was awful), it will not define our season UNLESS we allow it to impact our play moving forward. To start the year, I wanted a winning conference record and 8 wins to start the year; that would be progress - and looks well within our grasp. It's hard to maintain perspective when the team was in a position to do something really special.

Just so long as it does not coincide with ASU winning the conference. Yes... that is ridiculous and irrational - I am guilty as charged. My happiness with this team should have nothing to do with their success or failure - but it does.

This is the best coaching staff we've ever had, and we are very lucky to have them - Casteel has proven to me just how valuable he is. Just about every team has a game over the course of the season where they lay an egg. Much like our scheme matches up well with Oregon, it seems our scheme struggles when matched up against UCLA.

If we end the regular season with 9 wins that include a victory over ASU, I will be one very happy fan. I hope that's in the cards...

Only thing I care about is beating ASU, that's it. UA already has a lower tier bowl locked up, so even if they go 1-4 to finish out the season if the 1 is ASU I call the season a success in my world.

Merkin wrote:Only thing I care about is beating ASU, that's it. UA already has a lower tier bowl locked up, so even if they go 1-4 to finish out the season if the 1 is ASU I call the season a success in my world.

We went 4-8 my Freshman year, the last Stoops year. Whenever I wanted to think about football I just played the highlights of us beating the Scum in their house on fucking ridiculous WR screen plays. Brightened my days for months, especially because we had a down year in basketball too...

So bowls...

1st place • Oregon playoff game or a Fiesta/Cotton etc.

2nd place • Alamo Bowl -- ASU, they have Oregon St, Wazzu (w/o Halliday), & Arizona. Or they could challenge for a Fiesta/Cotton if they beat the rest of the conference schedule & Notre Dame.

3rd Place • Holiday Bowl -- USC or UCLA, both have tiebreakers over Arizona.

4th place • Fight Hunger Bowl (?) -- the loser of the LA schools, Utah has tiebreakers over both schools. Utah a possibility but they have Oregon, Arizona, Furd - tough.

5th place • Sun Bowl (el Paso?!) -- Either an LA school (if they lose more then Utah) Utah, Arizona, - Furd or udub maybe

6th place -- Las Vegas -- loser of Utah, Arizona

7th place -- Cactus Bowl -- Udub, Cal, Furd

8th Place -- at large bowls, ugh

______

Rest of the schedules

Oregon • Utah, Colorado, Oegon st - should roll into the conference championship.

ASU • (ND, non conference), Oregon St, Wazzu, UofA

USC • Cal, UCLA, (ND, non conference)

UCLA • Washington, USC, Stanford

Arizona • Rado, Udub, fuck Asu

Utah • Oregon, Stanford, Arizona, Colorado

Stanford • Utah, Cal, UCLA

Cal • USC, Stanford, (BYU, non conference)

Washington • Oregon St, Arizona, Wazzu

What happened to the Vegas bowl? I would think that one is a prime target this year as the bball team plays UNLV the 23rd and the tourism community will think our fans might stay 3 or 4 nights pre holiday

NYCat wrote:3rd Place • Holiday Bowl -- USC or UCLA, both have tiebreakers over Arizona.

4th place • Fight Hunger Bowl (?) -- the loser of the LA schools, Utah has tiebreakers over both schools. Utah a possibility but they have Oregon, Arizona, Furd - tough.

Unless something has changed in the last year, there is no such thing as "tiebreakers" when it comes to the PAC-12 affiliated bowls.

When it comes time for each bowl to choose, they can pick the next team available or any other team that is within one game in the conference standings. (Overall record means nothing in deciding who they can pick.)

At that point, it comes down to who travels well, matchups, previous years participants, behind the scene maneuvering, etc.

Some of you need to get a new team to cheer for.

Signed Dave Brandon

I've officially moved on to the "beat asu" half of the season. If I were coach, I'd have an assistant whose only job would be to scout asu all season long. By the time we played them we'd know all their hand signals, what the line are for breakfast, who tends to have untied shoelaces, everything. I'd drill the team on their looks and how to take advantage of it. Monday would be for our stuff, Tuesday for this weeks opponent, Wednesday asu, Thursday us/this weeks opponent again.

Rich Rod is a great coach and I am starting to think he's going to make things happen here. But he needs to beat ASU.

Damn, we are a missed field goal and a Halloween candy coma away from being in the discussion for national playoffs and so I get his attitude of ASU is just another team and we need to think bigger than making ASU our Superbowl. And yet, here we are again. ASU is the super bowl. And last year ...

azpatnca wrote:I've officially moved on to the "beat asu" half of the season. If I were coach, I'd have an assistant whose only job would be to scout asu all season long. By the time we played them we'd know all their hand signals, what the line are for breakfast, who tends to have untied shoelaces, everything. I'd drill the team on their looks and how to take advantage of it. Monday would be for our stuff, Tuesday for this weeks opponent, Wednesday asu, Thursday us/this weeks opponent again.

Rich Rod is a great coach and I am starting to think he's going to make things happen here. But he needs to beat ASU.

Damn, we are a missed field goal and a Halloween candy coma away from being in the discussion for national playoffs and so I get his attitude of ASU is just another team and we need to think bigger than making ASU our Superbowl. And yet, here we are again. ASU is the super bowl. And last year ...

I understand your point but if we actually dedicated a day during the week taking focus away from that week's opponent, I think the 18-21 year old kids would lose focus of that opponent. And by doing that, we would drop games that we shouldn't (Buffs and Uderp) and then REALLY have to make asu our super bowl.

I wanted nothing more than to turn around and beat SC and beat UCLA but alas, we did it again. With that said, I still understand that the talent on both of those teams is much more than what we have on our roster. We just didn't come to play against UCLA.

The problem with trying not to be disappointed with a 6-2 record at this point is we started the season with different expectations, when we beat Oregon on the road that changes the perception of this team greatly and what could become possible. Expectations change, thus the let down feeling after losing to SC and UCLA. We still have a chance to go into @Utah being 8-2 and going into the asu game at 9-2. I'd say that is legitimate progress.

Since he's been here, the team has always responded well after a loss. In 2012 they took Stanford to OT on the road after getting blown out in Autzen. After the UCLA shellacking that year they then won the next two, including on the road at Utah. Last year after Washington they shook off the rust after the first half at USC and were a third down tackle away from getting a chance to tie; they then beat Utah a week after Utah beat 'Furd. After the Wazzu debacle they came out and destroyed Oregon. After the USC loss they came out strong against a Wazzu team that a lot of people here thought were going to beat the Cats.

This is the freshman game we expected out of Solomon sometime this year. They get Colorado and then UW, a tough team but one that's struggling. If they beat UW and their front seven it'll be because of what Anu learned against UCLA. If they beat these two comfortably then I feel good about their chances in SLC - tough game, but it's winnable. CU is a good opponent for him to come back against.

I don't think Vegas would take action on a dead man attempting a driving test.

azpenguin wrote:Since he's been here, the team has always responded well after a loss. In 2012 they took Stanford to OT on the road after getting blown out in Autzen. After the UCLA shellacking that year they then won the next two, including on the road at Utah. Last year after Washington they shook off the rust after the first half at USC and were a third down tackle away from getting a chance to tie; they then beat Utah a week after Utah beat 'Furd. After the Wazzu debacle they came out and destroyed Oregon. After the USC loss they came out strong against a Wazzu team that a lot of people here thought were going to beat the Cats.

This is the freshman game we expected out of Solomon sometime this year. They get Colorado and then UW, a tough team but one that's struggling. If they beat UW and their front seven it'll be because of what Anu learned against UCLA. If they beat these two comfortably then I feel good about their chances in SLC - tough game, but it's winnable. CU is a good opponent for him to come back against.

So basically there's no consistency?

I agree, complete, ubdeniable progress. We're in every game, and I could argue that we should be undefeated with a fairly straight face. I think we should have beat USC and I think we could have beat UCLA. I'm pretty happy with the program. I just don't know how fans will respond if we lose to asu again. If we're pac12 south champs and lost to asu for the third (or is it 4th) year in a row...well whatever, beat Oregon or Stanford. ASU isn't important. But if we lose to UCLA and USC and now asu is important. Not only for the pac12 south, buy also because it's the consolation game. Losing a bunch in a row is not cool.

Now I think I'd rather be 8-3 with losses to asu than 4-7 with a win over asu. I think. So i appreciate the big-picture thinking. Like having a nice house and shitty car, versus 21" wheels on a pinto in a sketchy apartment. It's the right approach long term. But as fans, it's hard to not fall back into - well so much for post-season, just (at least) beat ASU mentality.

cats101 wrote:

azpenguin wrote:Since he's been here, the team has always responded well after a loss. In 2012 they took Stanford to OT on the road after getting blown out in Autzen. After the UCLA shellacking that year they then won the next two, including on the road at Utah. Last year after Washington they shook off the rust after the first half at USC and were a third down tackle away from getting a chance to tie; they then beat Utah a week after Utah beat 'Furd. After the Wazzu debacle they came out and destroyed Oregon. After the USC loss they came out strong against a Wazzu team that a lot of people here thought were going to beat the Cats.

This is the freshman game we expected out of Solomon sometime this year. They get Colorado and then UW, a tough team but one that's struggling. If they beat UW and their front seven it'll be because of what Anu learned against UCLA. If they beat these two comfortably then I feel good about their chances in SLC - tough game, but it's winnable. CU is a good opponent for him to come back against.

So basically there's no consistency?

Well, it sure beats the hell out of the consistency from the first several years of the past decade. Losing consistently is something I'm not ready to go back to.

Yeah, all depends on your frame of reference. Coaches should thank their lucky stars for Mackovic. Hard to stoop lower than that. Just never occurred to me that I'd still be pining for Larry Smith.

How many schools have a former Head Football Coach and a former Head Basketball Coach in their respective Halls of Fame?

At Arizona one is mentioned in reverent, hushed tones while most people don't even know the name of the other.

Curious.

Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

Well... we played like crap yesterday so I expect us to play well on the road and a big win vs Utah. The scenario of us being able to win Pac 12 south with a win vs ASU seems like a perfect opportunity for us to self destruct.

Alieberman wrote:

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

Well... we played like crap yesterday so I expect us to play well on the road and a big win vs Utah. The scenario of us being able to win Pac 12 south with a win vs ASU seems like a perfect opportunity for us to self destruct.

I think it seems perfect for a RichRod redemption. But that's just me.

Olsondogg wrote:

Alieberman wrote:

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

Well... we played like crap yesterday so I expect us to play well on the road and a big win vs Utah. The scenario of us being able to win Pac 12 south with a win vs ASU seems like a perfect opportunity for us to self destruct.

I think it seems perfect for a RichRod redemption. But that's just me.

I think RR wants coach wristband on a platter this year!

Arizona beats Utah
UCLA beats USC
Arizona beats that school up north
.
.
.
.
And UCLA beats Stanford on some sort of last second miracle finish.

Every. Damn. Time.

gumby wrote:Just never occurred to me that I'd still be pining for Larry Smith.

I was just watching this earlier today thinking about the good old days.

Good times hey Merk. Larry got alot of rides on the shoulders of his players at AZ.

That scene at the airport made me think, was that the original wildcat walk and was that when AZ was a football school

Good For You wrote:Arizona beats Utah
UCLA beats USC
Arizona beats that school up north
.
.
.
.
And UCLA beats Stanford on some sort of last second miracle finish.

Every. Damn. Time.

I could live with this much better than other alternative scenarios. 10-2 with a win over the Scummies? Yeah I'll take it.

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

I don't know. If ucla beast usc, then that keeps our pac12 title hopes alive....so if we laid an egg against utah it could be a typical moment where we don't show up when something is on the line.

However, it does seem like the ASsU game sets up as the true E.D.T. game.

azthrillhouse wrote: 10-2 with a win over the Scummies? Yeah I'll take it.

I have no hope about the south title, less than zero, and the only thing I care about is beating ASSU. That's it.

Shut those STD laden douchebags up.

This team, with a freshman QB and RB and multiple returning players in 2015, wins 9 or 10 games?

How about just properly being amazed at that instead of whining that our every football dream didn't come true?

When I think of E. D. T. I think of 98, 03, 05, 12 and 14. We haven't had enough consistent success in football to think this IMO.

Hopefully the frustration EDT goes away in both sports very soon

PieceOfMeat wrote:

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

I don't know. If ucla beast usc, then that keeps our pac12 title hopes alive....so if we laid an egg against utah it could be a typical moment where we don't show up when something is on the line.

However, it does seem like the ASsU game sets up as the true E.D.T. game.

So if they don't go undefeated then fuck the season? Gotcha!

3goggles wrote:

PieceOfMeat wrote:

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

I don't know. If ucla beast usc, then that keeps our pac12 title hopes alive....so if we laid an egg against utah it could be a typical moment where we don't show up when something is on the line.

However, it does seem like the ASsU game sets up as the true E.D.T. game.

So if they don't go undefeated then fuck the season? Gotcha!

That's why I am shaking my head. If this team, with a freshman QB and returning starters in 2015 galore, only wins 9 games, we are supposed to be upset? This EDT idea could be negatively applied to damn near every team in football if applied to this season. Unrealistic expectations are just that. This team has already equaled or surpassed any reasonable expectation.

Do I want us to beat ASu? Almost more that is reasonable for an adult to wish for. I live in the East Valley, work (when in the office) in Tempe, and have the perspective of being a lifelong U of A fan in Arizona that the So Cal 4 year drop in cannot possibly share. But separating my desire from reality...if this team beats Utah, loses to ASu, and finishes 9-3, it is still a total success based on personnel and league. Saying it isn't because my feelings are hurt or my Thursday in the office after Thanksgiving will suck is just my own hangup

3goggles wrote:

PieceOfMeat wrote:

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

I don't know. If ucla beast usc, then that keeps our pac12 title hopes alive....so if we laid an egg against utah it could be a typical moment where we don't show up when something is on the line.

However, it does seem like the ASsU game sets up as the true E.D.T. game.

So if they don't go undefeated then fuck the season? Gotcha!

So you have absolutely zero reading comprehension? Gotcha!

EVCat wrote:

3goggles wrote:

PieceOfMeat wrote:

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

I don't know. If ucla beast usc, then that keeps our pac12 title hopes alive....so if we laid an egg against utah it could be a typical moment where we don't show up when something is on the line.

However, it does seem like the ASsU game sets up as the true E.D.T. game.

So if they don't go undefeated then fuck the season? Gotcha!

That's why I am shaking my head. If this team, with a freshman QB and returning starters in 2015 galore, only wins 9 games, we are supposed to be upset? This EDT idea could be negatively applied to damn near every team in football if applied to this season. Unrealistic expectations are just that. This team has already equaled or surpassed any reasonable expectation.

Do I want us to beat ASu? Almost more that is reasonable for an adult to wish for. I live in the East Valley, work (when in the office) in Tempe, and have the perspective of being a lifelong U of A fan in Arizona that the So Cal 4 year drop in cannot possibly share. But separating my desire from reality...if this team beats Utah, loses to ASu, and finishes 9-3, it is still a total success based on personnel and league. Saying it isn't because my feelings are hurt or my Thursday in the office after Thanksgiving will suck is just my own hangup

I had Arizona 9-3 going into this season, so the Cats are right on schedule. Beat ASU to get there or better and we're cool.

But the Cats haven't put together a good football game since Wazzu, and I don't know how people can argue that. The same shortcomings (line matchups, receiver speed, Anu's inability to call his own number on zone reads) are apparent to every opponent to game-plan.

Yeah, we may be precocious, but our level of play has indisputably regressed since Oregon. And the refrain is, "Well, we played like crap this week, so we should be much better next week!" only to be disappointed.

So, as a fan, you want to see progress in matchups from year to year. You don't want to see the Cats give UCLA more of a game last season than this one. You get sick to death of ASU jumping all over your team in embarrassing first halves the last two seasons.

Bottom line is, young or experienced, this program continues not to be able to overcome conference games against physical teams with size advantages along the lines. Until that changes, pessimism and discouragement will be a recurring attitude among at least a vocal minority of the fanbase.

It seems to me like cherry picking reasons to be pissed. Yeah, we improved in the overall record to a level not seen since 1998, but we really didn't play well while winning. We have improved our position exponentially since the day Mike Stoops left the desert, and our coach might be big program hunting because of the tremendous turnaround, but remember the first 30 minutes against ASU for two years.

Pessimism and discouragement in the face of improvement are due to individual character traits, not evaluation. I hold nothing that happened the first year or two against a new coach...the fact that we were able to get to competitive with the remainder of a failed program is pretty noteworthy. That we are progressing to the periphery of contending in year three is encouraging. We aren't going to get 4 and 5 star recruits regularly...probably not even if we win a couple of conference titles. So we will always be doing more with "lesser players" like Scooby. But we can improve to the point of getting regular 4 stars, occasional 5 stars, and developing the hell out of a 3 star base, which is where we are progressing to based on the results of recruiting. With winning comes open doors. And we are winning, even if it isn't accompanied by a ton of style points.

Everyone has the right to be miserable if they want. See gloom and doom in the sunny sky. I just tire of being told those who don't are drinking some magical kool aid for being happy with incremental improvement...

EVCat wrote:It seems to me like cherry picking reasons to be pissed. Yeah, we improved in the overall record to a level not seen since 1998, but we really didn't play well while winning. We have improved our position exponentially since the day Mike Stoops left the desert, and our coach might be big program hunting because of the tremendous turnaround, but remember the first 30 minutes against ASU for two years.

Pessimism and discouragement in the face of improvement are due to individual character traits, not evaluation. I hold nothing that happened the first year or two against a new coach...the fact that we were able to get to competitive with the remainder of a failed program is pretty noteworthy. That we are progressing to the periphery of contending in year three is encouraging. We aren't going to get 4 and 5 star recruits regularly...probably not even if we win a couple of conference titles. So we will always be doing more with "lesser players" like Scooby. But we can improve to the point of getting regular 4 stars, occasional 5 stars, and developing the hell out of a 3 star base, which is where we are progressing to based on the results of recruiting. With winning comes open doors. And we are winning, even if it isn't accompanied by a ton of style points.

Everyone has the right to be miserable if they want. See gloom and doom in the sunny sky. I just tire of being told those who don't are drinking some magical kool aid for being happy with incremental improvement...

Even though we don't have the button for that anymore, consider that repped.

With regards to RichRod's 1st assu game, we gave up 14 points in the 2nd quarter and were down 14-9 at the half. Hardly an embarrassing 1st half. We dominated the third quarter and with about 9 minutes left in the game had a 27-20 lead and a first down deep in assu territory.
Unfortunately Matt Scott melted down after that and we stole defeat from the jaws of victory. Shit happens sometimes.

Good For You wrote:With regards to RichRod's 1st assu game, we gave up 14 points in the 2nd quarter and were down 14-9 at the half. Hardly an embarrassing 1st half. We dominated the third quarter and with about 9 minutes left in the game had a 27-20 lead and a first down deep in assu territory.
Unfortunately Matt Scott melted down after that and we stole defeat from the jaws of victory. Shit happens sometimes.

And Ka'Deem got hurt in the first half and was not the same in the second.

Longhorned wrote:Which would be the next real candidate for an E.D.T. (Every.Damn.Time.)? I don't think it's Utah. I think it's either at ASU if a win would give us the the PAC-12 South, or if UCLA and Stanford don't put us in a position to do that, the big game on the national stage that follows.

It would be a first to have a game that if we win it, we win a title (in real time, not retrospectively). To me, what EDT means is that we always lose the game that precludes this set-up.

bump:

Penn St '99
Oregon '09

so many others, but I can't remember right now.

Just freaking bear down and give a game...ugh. looks like shit right now.

To say that I'm disappointed in that first half would be an understatement (not in the D though, just the O and special teams)

To say that I'm shocked at that first half would be a lie.

Sigh.

CalStateTempe wrote:bump:

Penn St '99
Oregon '09

so many others, but I can't remember right now.

Just freaking bear down and give a game...ugh. looks like shit right now.

Holiday Bowl beatdown vs. Nebraska, the only time there was a shutout in that bowl game.

Penn St 99
Holiday bowls vs Nebraska
That Alamo bowl game.

EVERY DAMN TIME>

It sucks. Risk the Fiesta for the Rose and now a lower bowl. Risk having low motivation....ill yell out loud now and flip on last weeks game. D played great though.

With this flop we'll probably drop a good 10 spots in the rankings and end up in the holiday or Alamo bowl

PieceOfMeat wrote:To say that I'm disappointed in that first half would be an understatement (not in the D though, just the O and special teams)

To say that I'm shocked at that first half would be a lie.

Sigh.

Not surprised. I am surprised at just how bad the offense is. I can't remember when we played that bad. The offense couldn't even get to the line of scrimmage, let alone close to first downs.

Is it ok if I cry? Or pluck out my eyes?

JMarkJohns wrote:Is it ok if I cry? Or pluck out my eyes?

It's ok to cry, but given your profession, I'd recommend keeping the eyes

PieceOfMeat wrote:

JMarkJohns wrote:Is it ok if I cry? Or pluck out my eyes?

It's ok to cry, but given your profession, I'd recommend keeping the eyes

Good call.

At least we weren't on national TV throwing a football granny style only to be beat by a girl half your size throwing a football granny style.

Holy shit what an abomination. More so than the game.

Dude wanted to be a Firefighter... Hahahaha... No crew will ever let him live this down.