Bear Down Wildcats

chiefzona wrote:

ramcat wrote:Dudek going to Michigan is a no brainer. I'd be more inclined to agree with your framing of abandoning ship, if he left for an equal to lesser program.

So, you think that a job on staff at Arizona is a stable one right now?

Do you think if it were stable, Dudek would turn down Michigan?
I dont.

ramcat wrote:

chiefzona wrote:

ramcat wrote:Dudek going to Michigan is a no brainer. I'd be more inclined to agree with your framing of abandoning ship, if he left for an equal to lesser program.

So, you think that a job on staff at Arizona is a stable one right now?

Do you think if it were stable, Dudek would turn down Michigan?
I dont.

But he's an OKG! OKGs don't take officials while committed to the University of Arizona football program! They also don't commit to another program while committed to this one! OKG is and will always be a gimmick.....just like I've always said.

chiefzona wrote:

ramcat wrote:

chiefzona wrote:

ramcat wrote:Dudek going to Michigan is a no brainer. I'd be more inclined to agree with your framing of abandoning ship, if he left for an equal to lesser program.

So, you think that a job on staff at Arizona is a stable one right now?

Do you think if it were stable, Dudek would turn down Michigan?
I dont.

But he's an OKG! OKGs don't take officials while committed to the University of Arizona football program! They also don't commit to another program while committed to this one! OKG is and will always be a gimmick.....just like I've always said.

Silly question: Is the inventor of OKG, RR, an OKG? Review his history before answering. Clue: Carolina.

MrMeow wrote: Silly question: Is the inventor of OKG, RR, an OKG? Review his history before answering. Clue: Carolina.

Thought it was Chris Petersen while at BSU.

Merkin wrote:

MrMeow wrote: Silly question: Is the inventor of OKG, RR, an OKG? Review his history before answering. Clue: Carolina.

Thought it was Chris Petersen while at BSU.

This.

Dudek unless he and his family want to be in Tucson forever would be silly not to take a promotion to Michigan. Doesn't signal an issue with the staff in any way. If he did this at this time to Boston College or Wake Forest then it likely would.

With that said we all know that this is likely the last season of the RichRod era in Arizona.

chiefzona wrote:Dudek apparently isn't the only loss this week. I heard there might be a transfer. I told you about the abandon ship siren. Most of of the media and myself was told about Dudek weeks ago. Everyone was told to be silent because we were all awaiting word from Michigan.

Heard there might also be some roster additions coming as well

azcat49 wrote:

chiefzona wrote:Dudek apparently isn't the only loss this week. I heard there might be a transfer. I told you about the abandon ship siren. Most of of the media and myself was told about Dudek weeks ago. Everyone was told to be silent because we were all awaiting word from Michigan.

Heard there might also be some roster additions coming as well

Yeah....the walkons who were so carefully evaluated.

PHXCATS wrote:

RazorsEdgeAZ wrote:Maybe not a popular opinion but I have wondered about Dudeks' value for last couple years now. At least can be up to debate on his value to UA staff. Recruiting is not any better than under Stoops era, maybe collectively worse (I'll call it a tie).
Dudek has never been a coach
On the record he doesn't want to be a coach
Assume he is not an expert in player evals or development
Was initially hired to be on-campus recruiting coordinator and Pitch-man for recruiting news
UA hired a former Michigan player/recruiting coordinator to fill Dudek's position
Dudek promoted
Don't hear much from him or his pitches last year plus.

Results in recruiting and achievements have been mediocre to poor. That can stir a debate about value imo.

I see where you are coming from. To me Dudek was the guy to close him in when they visiting or making final decisions. If you don't bring him good guys, he cant do much.

Dudek is THE CLOSER? No. That would be the head coach's job... at every school that actually recruits effectively.

I think Dudek has been the most overhyped member of this staff, and do not see this as any significant loss. If it is, then our staff is even worse than I think (and my opinion is quite low to begin with).

He is a master self promoter who has a lot of energy and draws a lot of attention to himself. He seems pretty funny but he has a big f***ing mouth, and says some unbelievably juvenile and stupid shit. Ever follow him on Twitter?

As for our recruiting, it is FAR worse under this regime than it was under Stoops, by any measure I can find. It may not be all on Dudek, but if he was half as good as he has convinced many of his fans he is - our recruiting could not possibly suck as bad a as it has. He has the ego of a surgeon with none of the talent.

Good luck to him... but IMO he's a gimmick. We need steak before we worry about sizzle.

Now I have to go watch that GOT UA FB video again,

chiefzona wrote:Dudek apparently isn't the only loss this week. I heard there might be a transfer. I told you about the abandon ship siren. Most of of the media and myself was told about Dudek weeks ago. Everyone was told to be silent because we were all awaiting word from Michigan.

Dudek is not a loss. It is the first time you have referred to him in a positive light, but that is only because it suits your narrative. You were right before.

As for the part in bold...

ChiefZona living the starring role of the self-titled film "The Secret Life of Walter Mitty" #LifeImitatesArt

Aside from the delusion that you are some of important insider, the idea that you could keep your mouth shut about anything for two weeks is a stretch did not even Gumby would make.

Ultimately Dudek leaving now is meaningless considering that we're very likely going to have an entire new coaching staff come January/February and that would include his position obviously. Any recruit that he would've even helped us possibly land would be null and void considering once RR is likely let go then most committed recruits who are worthwhile will open their recruitments up anyways.

Harvey Specter wrote:

chiefzona wrote:Dudek apparently isn't the only loss this week. I heard there might be a transfer. I told you about the abandon ship siren. Most of of the media and myself was told about Dudek weeks ago. Everyone was told to be silent because we were all awaiting word from Michigan.

Dudek is not a loss. It is the first time you have referred to him in a positive light, but that is only because it suits your narrative. You were right before.

As for the part in bold...

ChiefZona living the starring role of the self-titled film "The Secret Life of Walter Mitty" #LifeImitatesArt

Aside from the delusion that you are some of important insider, the idea that you could keep your mouth shut about anything for two weeks is a stretch did not even Gumby would make.

Stay with me bud.....loss from the the program as in takeaway or leaving. Dudek is not a loss as in they'll miss him. He did very little.

Don't get the Walter Mitty reference but thanks.

I'm not an important insider. I'm a poster just like you. I'm an outsider looking in. I hope you're enjoying you summer. Cheers.

If he didn't do anything why did a top 5 coach in the game hire him?

Stating the obvious... UA is not Michigan. Dudek will be fine at Michigan. Michigan's staff much larger than UA's. In Title, seems Dudek took a step down to take Michigan job. Michigan's recruiting staff alone larger than UA's. Michigan can afford to specialize their roles and apply more depth and focus. Dudek was hired at Michigan to help them with relationships and build up more West Coast recruiting.

Big difference attracting top recruits to Michigan as opposed to Arizona. Many more flaws can be forgiven over there.

NCAA rules limit the number of coaches and number of coaches who can go on the road and recruit, but it doesn't limit the number of recruiting coordinators a team can have. Schools like UM have whole staffs whose sole job is to look at tapes and so on, so recruiters don't have too.

UA FB brings in $41.3M while has expenses of $21.4M.

UM FB brings in $97.1M while has expenses of $36.6M.

UA has a slightly higher undergrad population of 29K to 27K for UM.

I don't see this as a step down in title or reasonsibity for Dudek. Good move for him. Bet he gets paid much better also. This is what happens when your fans are so fair weather.

PHXCATS wrote:If he didn't do anything why did a top 5 coach in the game hire him?

That's a common misconception. Dudek got replaced by Singletary as "Recruiting Coordinator" once Singletary got on campus. They made him "General Manager/Director of Player Personnel" which was a nice title for...Singletary basically took your job but we will keep you on staff even though you are our Dancing Bear who screams OKG when a walkon signs a NLI. Dudek was once the face of recruiting though he didn't recruit. Singletary runs his show though and has since he stepped on campus.

Walter Mitty, as portrayed most recently by Ben Stiller, was the most famous creation of the late humorist James Thurber. He was a cuckolded husband thoroughly addicted to his daydreams--more delusions of grandeur--that he was a great man.

All of us, in some form or other, really do lead small lives. But most of us are content with that. We don't need to portray ourselves as someone that we're not, as Mitty did.

chiefzona wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:If he didn't do anything why did a top 5 coach in the game hire him?

That's a common misconception. Dudek got replaced by Singletary as "Recruiting Coordinator" once Singletary got on campus. They made him "General Manager/Director of Player Personnel" which was a nice title for...Singletary basically took your job but we will keep you on staff even though you are our Dancing Bear who screams OKG when a walkon signs a NLI. Dudek was once the face of recruiting though he didn't recruit. Singletary runs his show though and has since he stepped on campus.

So if that is all he does Harbaugh still hired him when he could have anyone not on Alabama Ohio State or Clemsons staff?

PHXCATS wrote:I don't see this as a step down in title or reasonsibity for Dudek. Good move for him. Bet he gets paid much better also. This is what happens when your fans are so fair weather.

Wrong. This is what happens when your head coach is so fair weather.

PHXCATS wrote:

chiefzona wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:If he didn't do anything why did a top 5 coach in the game hire him?

That's a common misconception. Dudek got replaced by Singletary as "Recruiting Coordinator" once Singletary got on campus. They made him "General Manager/Director of Player Personnel" which was a nice title for...Singletary basically took your job but we will keep you on staff even though you are our Dancing Bear who screams OKG when a walkon signs a NLI. Dudek was once the face of recruiting though he didn't recruit. Singletary runs his show though and has since he stepped on campus.

So if that is all he does Harbaugh still hired him when he could have anyone not on Alabama Ohio State or Clemsons staff?

I'm inclined to think that Harbaugh thinks Dudek knows a little about west coast recruiting but we all know that Arizona recruiting is garbage and Dudek once was the face of that though he wasn't an actual recruiter. He's a letter slinger. Only thing that changes is his zip code.

You are so full of it. If you are correct Harbaugh fired him by Sept 1 2018. Want to make abet he doesn't?


And you think our fan support is okay? Why don't we have an indoor practice facility and can't pay for good assistants then? Give me an answer besides RR because if that's true he will most likely be gone by December so these things should be fine by Sept 1 2018 as well.

PHXCATS wrote:You are so full of it. If you are correct Harbaugh fired him by Sept 1 2018. Want to make abet he doesn't?


And you think our fan support is okay? Why don't we have an indoor practice facility and can't pay for good assistants then? Give me an answer besides RR because if that's true he will most likely be gone by December so these things should be fine by Sept 1 2018 as well.

Sorry, but I'm completely confused by your question. Want to make a bet he doesn't what exactly?

Fan support is ok. What's not ok is the state of the football program. Boosters need to help spring for the indoor practice facility. That is a Heeke job there and that poor guy will have a tough job raising money right now as long as RR is HC. I can only give you an answer of RR. You don't really need an OC when you are calling the plays, right? He also hired some guys who couldn't coach at the HS level.

You say Dudek doesn't do anything.

If that is true Harbaugh won't keep him around as Michigan can have just about anyone they want.

I think you are full of it and just talk to talk.

Giving you a chance to man up and back your talk up.

So put up and back your talk up or shut up and tak3 your shit back.

PHXCATS wrote:You say Dudek doesn't do anything.

If that is true Harbaugh won't keep him around as Michigan can have just about anyone they want.

I think you are full of it and just talk to talk.

Giving you a chance to man up and back your talk up.

So put up and back your talk up or shut up and tak3 your shit back.

I don't understand why you are so worked up. Dudek does very little and now that he joins a bigger staff....probably a lot less. Sarkisian got hired by Saban and I never heard anyone say that Sark must be good because Saban hired him. Quite the contrary. Winning programs win from recruiting, mostly. I've always said what I think, know, and feel. I called Casteel out when he was hired and fought people on the message board till the day he was fired. Guess what? Not one of those posters ever said anything after that and most of them are MIA. I've called out RR from day one and taken a lot of flak but guess what? Just recently some people are finally getting it and playing along. So, I'll continue to be me and you continue to be you and the world will still turn.

chiefzona wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:You say Dudek doesn't do anything.

If that is true Harbaugh won't keep him around as Michigan can have just about anyone they want.

I think you are full of it and just talk to talk.

Giving you a chance to man up and back your talk up.

So put up and back your talk up or shut up and tak3 your shit back.

I don't understand why you are so worked up. Dudek does very little and now that he joins a bigger staff....probably a lot less. Sarkisian got hired by Saban and I never heard anyone say that Sark must be good because Saban hired him. Quite the contrary. Winning programs win from recruiting, mostly. I've always said what I think, know, and feel. I called Casteel out when he was hired and fought people on the message board till the day he was fired. Guess what? Not one of those posters ever said anything after that and most of them are MIA. I've called out RR from day one and taken a lot of flak but guess what? Just recently some people are finally getting it and playing along. So, I'll continue to be me and you continue to be you and the world will still turn.

Dudek doesn't pick who to recruit the coaches do. He just does the planinng talking to them, setting up visits, and shows them around campus while they were here and he was very good at what he does. I like Singletary a lot though and I love Matty D and he will do great in Michigan, but he isn't the difference between having an amazing class and a mediocre one.

catinfl wrote:

chiefzona wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:You say Dudek doesn't do anything.

If that is true Harbaugh won't keep him around as Michigan can have just about anyone they want.

I think you are full of it and just talk to talk.

Giving you a chance to man up and back your talk up.

So put up and back your talk up or shut up and tak3 your shit back.

I don't understand why you are so worked up. Dudek does very little and now that he joins a bigger staff....probably a lot less. Sarkisian got hired by Saban and I never heard anyone say that Sark must be good because Saban hired him. Quite the contrary. Winning programs win from recruiting, mostly. I've always said what I think, know, and feel. I called Casteel out when he was hired and fought people on the message board till the day he was fired. Guess what? Not one of those posters ever said anything after that and most of them are MIA. I've called out RR from day one and taken a lot of flak but guess what? Just recently some people are finally getting it and playing along. So, I'll continue to be me and you continue to be you and the world will still turn.

Dudek doesn't pick who to recruit the coaches do. He just does the planinng talking to them, setting up visits, and shows them around campus while they were here and he was very good at what he does. I like Singletary a lot though and I love Matty D and he will do great in Michigan, but he isn't the difference between having an amazing class and a mediocre one.

Did I ever say he picked who to recruit? Like someone very close to the program told me....Dudek is a dancing bear. That about sums up his tenure. He was not that good at what he did and Singletary's hiring and Dudek's reclassification shows that pretty well. I had a couple of guys who I got looks from the program through Dudek and he was very cordial and cool. No one ever said Dudek is the difference between an amazing class and a mediocre one. No one ever said he picked who to recruit. He's a cheerleader. Plus, when did Arizona ever have an amazing recruiting class under RR? They've danced around mediocre and that was never on Dudek....that's on RR number one and staff number two.

IF HE ISNT GOOD WHY IS THE 4TH BEST COACH IN THE NATION HIRING HIM?

Be a man and put up or shut up.

PHXCATS wrote:IF HE ISNT GOOD WHY IS THE 4TH BEST COACH IN THE NATION HIRING HIM?

Be a man and put up or shut up.

Michigan hired RR and he wasn't good. Harbaugh has his reasons for everything as does all the good coaches do in CFB but not all decisions are good. Basing your opinion on that reasoning is dangerous or damaging at best. My opinion is that Dudek isn't good at what he does. He' was the face of Arizona recruiting and the dancing bear. I wish him and his family the best and I know he'll probably do better with Michigan than he did for Arizona. Better resources and Michigan basically recruits itself. Even RR had a top 10 recruiting class at Michigan.

So are you saying that Dudek will become a better dancer due to being at Michigan?

Although, he is how working now at Michigan, this hire is all Harbaugh. So not sure why the reference to Michigan and RR hire? Completely different hiring process and decision makers. Was it in reply to Harbaugh being 4th best coach in nation and that being because of his ranking with Michigan? Harbaugh clearly is looked at as being one of the best out there and his results speak for themselves.

Harbaugh hired him purely for his potential contribution to the program, and everything I've read about Harbaugh is that he is a perfectionist and is ridiculously competitve, and wouldn't imagine he'd be making fluffy hires, such as "dancing bears".

Can't imagine at all that Harbaugh, would be hiring Dudek, without thorough analysis and knowledge of what he did here and his contribution. But, what do I know maybe he feels Michigan needs a "Dancing Bear" to get to the top.

ramcat wrote:So are you saying that Dudek will become a better dancer due to being at Michigan?

Harbaugh hired him purely for his potential contribution to the program, and everything I've read about Harbaugh is that he is a perfectionist and is ridiculously competitve, and wouldn't imagine he'd be making fluffy hires, such as "dancing bears".

Can't imagine at all that Harbaugh, would be hiring Dudek, without thorough knowledge of what he did here and his contribution. But, what do I know maybe he feels Michigan needs a "Dancing Bear" to get to the top.

I think that Dudek will be a better dancer at Michigan. He'll love the winters cause they'll remind him of back home. We'll see if RR opens up his position or just lets Singletary dance.

chiefzona wrote:

ramcat wrote:So are you saying that Dudek will become a better dancer due to being at Michigan?

Harbaugh hired him purely for his potential contribution to the program, and everything I've read about Harbaugh is that he is a perfectionist and is ridiculously competitve, and wouldn't imagine he'd be making fluffy hires, such as "dancing bears".

Can't imagine at all that Harbaugh, would be hiring Dudek, without thorough knowledge of what he did here and his contribution. But, what do I know maybe he feels Michigan needs a "Dancing Bear" to get to the top.

I think that Dudek will be a better dancer at Michigan. He'll love the winters cause they'll remind him of back home. We'll see if RR opens up his position or just lets Singletary dance.

So Harbaugh hired someone who is not very good at what they do, and largely won't do anything for his program but a face with no substance? Seriously?
Chris Singletary came from Michigan, so interesting that the programs essentially swapped out recruiting coordinators.

It seems that Harbaugh in replacing Singletary, did so in part because the guys hired to replace him had some ties to top recruits. So maybe Dudek has a couple of top guys he'll get to Michigan and then be relished to be the "dancing bear". Ha!

ramcat wrote:

chiefzona wrote:

ramcat wrote:So are you saying that Dudek will become a better dancer due to being at Michigan?

Harbaugh hired him purely for his potential contribution to the program, and everything I've read about Harbaugh is that he is a perfectionist and is ridiculously competitve, and wouldn't imagine he'd be making fluffy hires, such as "dancing bears".

Can't imagine at all that Harbaugh, would be hiring Dudek, without thorough knowledge of what he did here and his contribution. But, what do I know maybe he feels Michigan needs a "Dancing Bear" to get to the top.

I think that Dudek will be a better dancer at Michigan. He'll love the winters cause they'll remind him of back home. We'll see if RR opens up his position or just lets Singletary dance.

So Harbaugh hired someone who is not very good at what they do, and largely won't do anything for his program but a face with no substance? Seriously?
Chris Singletary came from Michigan, so interesting that the programs essentially swapped out recruiting coordinators.

He was the recruiting coordinator at Michigan while RR was there. For RR at Arizona he is in charge of setting up visits, recruiting trips for coaches, and coordinating everything for recruiting. Dudek did all this up till the time Singletary was hired. Then Dudek took a secondary role while Singletary a primary one with regards to recruiting. There was speculation that Singletary was hired because RR wasn't happy with Dudek. Who knows.

in his eyes

Chief > Harbaugh + Dudek combined

Think I read that Singletary was there thru Harbaugh's and Michigan's 2015 recruiting class.

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports ... /27387381/" target="_blank

Says he was let go shortly before their spring game in April 2015.

Chris Singletary was hired on by RR at Michigan. Singletary stayed on with Brady Hoke and Hoke expanded Singletary's role. Singletary stayed on with Harbaugh after he was hired through a transition period but was let go just before Harbaugh's 1st Spring Game at Michigan (early April. Harbaugh hired end of December prior). Singletary also won a Championship as a player with Michigan 1997

Lot of typing going on about a guy who wasn't worth a whole lot (according to some people who keeping furiously typing about him).

RazorsEdgeAZ wrote:Chris Singletary was hired on by RR at Michigan. Singletary stayed on with Brady Hoke and Hoke expanded Singletary's role. Singletary stayed on with Harbaugh after he was hired through a transition period but was let go just before Harbaugh's 1st Spring Game at Michigan (early April. Harbaugh hired end of December prior). Singletary also won a Championship as a player with Michigan 1997

No. He was not hired by RR. He was hired by Lloyd Carr in 2006 and stayed on with RR, Hoke, and then Harbaugh.

chiefzona wrote:

RazorsEdgeAZ wrote:Chris Singletary was hired on by RR at Michigan. Singletary stayed on with Brady Hoke and Hoke expanded Singletary's role. Singletary stayed on with Harbaugh after he was hired through a transition period but was let go just before Harbaugh's 1st Spring Game at Michigan (early April. Harbaugh hired end of December prior). Singletary also won a Championship as a player with Michigan 1997

No. He was not hired by RR. He was hired by Lloyd Carr in 2006 and stayed on with RR, Hoke, and then Harbaugh.

True

The guy is out of here, who the fuck cares? Jesus, this debate is as stimulating a read as the hoops/football comparison nonsense. Anything good happening out in Tucson, football related?

Just to confirm what everybody here already knew (and nobody seems to care), Dudek is #ontothenextone

http://scout.com/college/michigan/Artic ... -105355029

Chicat wrote:Lot of typing going on about a guy who wasn't worth a whole lot (according to some people who keeping furiously typing about him).

Apparently 2 posts must qualify as typing furiously. I have always been of the impression that you are partial to your "ultimate OKG". Hopefully you have come to terms with his departure.

I know he got the minions fired up with his social media bravado and grand proclamations. That usually goes over big in a testosteronefest.

It boils down to this for me: he had a loud bark & a soft bite, and I've been quite consistent in my view. That does not mean I am right, but it files directly in the face of any assertions that my reaction is the result of 'coping with despair' over his departure, he made the right career decision for Himself.

For the duration of his time with significant responsibilities for recruiting here, our recruiting has SUCKED. Talk a lot, deliver little. The Josh Partner model, for most of his career.

I do agree that Harbaugh is a damn good & smart coach... but I've seen plenty a smart guy make a dogshit hire. The "interview well & deliver nothing" model is very effective for self-promoters.

From the view of some, I expect Marty D is a super-salesman... he must be, because he sold his track record (or lack thereof) to an elite coach & program. I'd call that being full of shit,

Harvey Specter wrote:

Chicat wrote:Lot of typing going on about a guy who wasn't worth a whole lot (according to some people who keeping furiously typing about him).

Apparently 2 posts must qualify as typing furiously.

I wasn't referring to you in particular, but welcome to the party Harv...

Harvey Specter wrote:

Chicat wrote:Lot of typing going on about a guy who wasn't worth a whole lot (according to some people who keeping furiously typing about him).

Apparently 2 posts must qualify as typing furiously. I have always been of the impression that you are partial to your "ultimate OKG". Hopefully you have come to terms with his departure.

I know he got the minions fired up with his social media bravado and grand proclamations. That usually goes over big in a testosteronefest.

It boils down to this for me: he had a loud bark & a soft bite, and I've been quite consistent in my view. That does not mean I am right, but it files directly in the face of any assertions that my reaction is the result of 'coping with despair' over his departure, he made the right career decision for Himself.

For the duration of his time with significant responsibilities for recruiting here, our recruiting has SUCKED. Talk a lot, deliver little. The Josh Partner model, for most of his career.

I do agree that Harbaugh is a damn good & smart coach... but I've seen plenty a smart guy make a dogshit hire. The "interview well & deliver nothing" model is very effective for self-promoters.

From the view of some, I expect Marty D is a super-salesman... he must be, because he sold his track record (or lack thereof) to an elite coach & program. I'd call that being full of shit,

Spot on, Harvey.

Dudek did end up getting a bit of a pay raise going to Michigan.

Was making $130,000 Arizona. Hired at Michigan at $145,000

Matt Dudek, Michigan's newly-hired recruiting director, will make an annual salary of $145,000, the university said in a public-records request.