Arizona Head Coach Brent Brennan

[dmjcat]

DMJ you have a valid point but this team is not only losing, we're getting blown off the field by bad teams.

This offense has a bad scheme and is not being coached well. Brennan has failed by any reasonable measure.

That being said, we probably need to keep Brent, contingent on him firing Babers at seasons end at the latest.

I can't argue that. But then one can't argue that, including injuries, nearly 70% of last years team is now gone. Expecting
the same results as last year is insanity.

I am just as frustrated as all of the other UA fans. I am a season ticket holder and have been attending games since I was in the 4th grade.

Shooting a new coach before the end of his first season, however, would be foolish.

What kind of potential UA coach would want to play for a school that:

1) Fires a new coach before he has even one recruiting class under his belt
2) Has no large pool of local HS football talent
3) Has no long term record of success
4) Is not in a power conference
5) Has a very poor fanbase that doesn't show up, even when you are winning
6) Has limited $NIL$

I doubt that the future cream of the coaching crop will be attracted to that

#6 on my list is particularly troubling. We have always had to deal with 1-5, but #6 is a recent phenomena . If a coach doesn't have the $$$ to buy players he's not going to be successful...........anywhere. Thats not going to make the UA a destination of choice for up and coming coaches.

[ChooChooCat]

Expecting the same results as last year is insanity.

Ahhh so here's the disconnect. Anybody here expect us to for sure be a 10 win team this year guys? Anybody? Bueller? Or did most of you just expect to look like a competent football team that won more games than we lost?

Yeah....

You're arguing against something that doesn't exist within this fanbase and are confused as to why we're upset obviously.

What kind of potential UA coach would want to play for a school that:

1) Fires a new coach before he has even one recruiting class under his belt
2) Has no large pool of local HS football talent
3) Has no long term record of success
4) Is not in a power conference
5) Has a very poor fanbase that doesn't show up, even when you are winning
6) Has limited $NIL$

Ok outside of #1, which is a null and void situation because the AD that hired their new coach isn't here anymore, so no coach would give a shit about that, what you're saying is that Arizona shouldn't even try? Cool. I now take your opinion on the state of our football program that much less serious. By all means though you should protest on campus to eliminate the football program. I wish you well in your endeavors.

[Chicat]

Shooting a new coach before the end of his first season, however, would be foolish.

No one is calling for putting him down like a lame horse… yet…

[RawleArenas]

DMJ you have a valid point but this team is not only losing, we're getting blown off the field by bad teams.

This offense has a bad scheme and is not being coached well. Brennan has failed by any reasonable measure.

That being said, we probably need to keep Brent, contingent on him firing Babers at seasons end at the latest.

I can't argue that. But then one can't argue that, including injuries, nearly 70% of last years team is now gone. Expecting
the same results as last year is insanity.

I am just as frustrated as all of the other UA fans. I am a season ticket holder and have been attending games since I was in the 4th grade.

Shooting a new coach before the end of his first season, however, would be foolish.

What kind of potential UA coach would want to play for a school that:

1) Fires a new coach before he has even one recruiting class under his belt
2) Has no large pool of local HS football talent
3) Has no long term record of success
4) Is not in a power conference
5) Has a very poor fanbase that doesn't show up, even when you are winning
6) Has limited $NIL$

I doubt that the future cream of the coaching crop will be attracted to that

#6 on my list is particularly troubling. We have always had to deal with 1-5, but #6 is a recent phenomena . If a coach doesn't have the $$$ to buy players he's not going to be successful...........anywhere. Thats not going to make the UA a destination of choice for up and coming coaches.

It's why I love this board...it never disappoints.

i agree with most in that the situation surrounding the hiring of our present coach was reckless. You don't pass out 15 million dollar contracts like its Halloween candy. And that's pretty much what we did. We have a history of hiring fast, and firing slow. Basically, the death blow for any successful business or enterprise. Fixing that is not easy, which is why we have DRF.

I will say this, anyone who compares Fisch's start here to any first year coach's will appear to be disingenuous, to say the least. I heard one of the posters ask that how do we sustain success as a program? I don't have a definitive answer, but I do have suggestions. When you have limited resources and a not so strong tradition in a money sport, you have to think outside the box. Before we hired Sumlin, I advocated for Lane Kiffin. It's rare that you have the timing to get someone of that caliber to coach your team. If you want to win you have to find guys who are a little tainted but winners who know how to coach and program build. And now that Kiffin has rebuilt Ole Miss, he has a head coaching gig with the Saints.

That could have been us. Of course, Fisch would be still looking for a head coaching gig, but that's neither here nor there. The goal is to get guys who have a little dirt on them or get a retread that was fired for not winning enough. Basically UT retreads like Mack Brown, Shaka Smart and Rick Barnes. All of those coaches were pushed out prematurely and were able to reboot successfully at other schools. Coaches that are given a second chance are far more loyal than your average coach. That's why you never hear of Kelvin Sampson, Rick Barnes, Bruce Pearl and other coaches leaving for greener pastures. Just something to throw out there, although if we want to get anywhere near what we had last year, we need to hire someone from the NFL again.

[Merkin]

It's rare that you have the timing to get someone of that caliber to coach your team. If you want to win you have to find guys who are a little tainted but winners who know how to coach and program build.

The Pirate comes to mind. A lot of us were yelling to get him when he was available. WSU snatched him up and look what happened to their program.

Even Mike Price took WSU to 2 Rose Bowls.

If WSU can win in The Palouse, the UA can win in Tucson.

Safe boring uninspiring coaches will not do it.

[TheCatInTheHat]

I think there can be some opportunity in looking at "soiled dove" coaches, but with a pretty big caveat. RichRod would fit that description, and he arguably worked out (except for recruiting tailing off, the "what happens here stays here" book and accusations, and actively courting jobs at Va Tech and South Carolina.) Recognize that Mackovic and Sumlin would also fit the second chance club profile. So, I think you have to be pretty careful about specific criteria of what you should accept versus reject. And part of the problem is the judgment and available resources of the people making the decisions. One of the biggest mistakes I've seen in Arizona football coaching hires is to overreact to specific criticisms about the previous coach and bring in the opposite. The last coach ran a boring offense, so let's go to a wild and wooly pass-happy scheme. The last coach was embarrassingly crazy on the sideline, so let's go with somebody more dignified. Absolutely no. You need the best fit with the best chance to win at an Arizona (right away, no 3-5 year plans), not to mollify some money bags booster's uninformed whims.

[84Cat]

@jasonscheer·
10m
There’s a lot of rumors regarding Brent Brennan’s job status. Friday’s game could be big for various reasons if those rumors are true.

[PHXCATS]

DMJ you have a valid point but this team is not only losing, we're getting blown off the field by bad teams.

This offense has a bad scheme and is not being coached well. Brennan has failed by any reasonable measure.

That being said, we probably need to keep Brent, contingent on him firing Babers at seasons end at the latest.

Congrats on having other people pay for what you want

[UAdevil]

Personally, I don't want it enough to contribute any more than I currently do, which is go to a home game or two a year, watch most of the games, and pony up about $700/year to host and maintain this site. If the expectation is to pony up $$$, nah, I'm good.

[RawleArenas]

I think there can be some opportunity in looking at "soiled dove" coaches, but with a pretty big caveat. RichRod would fit that description, and he arguably worked out (except for recruiting tailing off, the "what happens here stays here" book and accusations, and actively courting jobs at Va Tech and South Carolina.) Recognize that Mackovic and Sumlin would also fit the second chance club profile. So, I think you have to be pretty careful about specific criteria of what you should accept versus reject. And part of the problem is the judgment and available resources of the people making the decisions. One of the biggest mistakes I've seen in Arizona football coaching hires is to overreact to specific criticisms about the previous coach and bring in the opposite. The last coach ran a boring offense, so let's go to a wild and wooly pass-happy scheme. The last coach was embarrassingly crazy on the sideline, so let's go with somebody more dignified. Absolutely no. You need the best fit with the best chance to win at an Arizona (right away, no 3-5 year plans), not to mollify some money bags booster's uninformed whims.

Good points, you made me think about this one. You could make the argument that if RichRod came back and improved his recruiting a couple of notches (by hiring some ace assistants), he would be pretty much what we're looking for if you want long term success. Although you would have to give up culture a little bit, elite NFL prospects, and the PR prowess that our former coach had. But in terms of steadiness, doesn't get much better than that.

That said, not all retreads are created equal. You don't want guys that came off a losing record before they got fired (Mackovic), For lack of a better example, you want guys like Sean Miller and Kiffin that can coach and recruit no matter the circumstances or environment. Guys that were let go for reasons not related to coaching abilities. Those guys are the bread and butter for programs like us that want relevance and stability. I mean you mention the word Houston in college basketball, and you immediately take them seriously. Absent of NFL guys coaching here, we need leadership like that.

[Chicat]

Congrats on having other people pay for what you want

You keep saying this like you’re making a good point instead of what you’re actually doing which is making an ass of yourself, so I encourage you to continue.

[azcat49]

So it sounds like a loss Friday brings an end to the Brennan era.

[pc in NM]

@jasonscheer·
10m
There’s a lot of rumors regarding Brent Brennan’s job status. Friday’s game could be big for various reasons if those rumors are true.

I hate guys who allude to inside information, but then, keep it to themselves. Especially so-called "reporters"!

[ChooChooCat]

@jasonscheer·
10m
There’s a lot of rumors regarding Brent Brennan’s job status. Friday’s game could be big for various reasons if those rumors are true.

I hate guys who allude to inside information, but then, keep it to themselves. Especially so-called "reporters"!

Does this clear it up a bit for you?

[pc in NM]

@jasonscheer·
10m
There’s a lot of rumors regarding Brent Brennan’s job status. Friday’s game could be big for various reasons if those rumors are true.

I hate guys who allude to inside information, but then, keep it to themselves. Especially so-called "reporters"!

Does this clear it up a bit for you?

Well, no - he's doing exactly what I said I hated. (But thanks for sharing it.)

BTW, I left Twitter - I don't care about the fascist-adjacet posters that remain there!

[ChooChooCat]

@jasonscheer·
10m
There’s a lot of rumors regarding Brent Brennan’s job status. Friday’s game could be big for various reasons if those rumors are true.

I hate guys who allude to inside information, but then, keep it to themselves. Especially so-called "reporters"!

Does this clear it up a bit for you?

I left Twitter - I don't care about the fascist-adjacet posters that remain there!

Ok, so the answer is no, got it.

[dmjcat]

Personally, I don't want it enough to contribute any more than I currently do, which is go to a home game or two a year, watch most of the games, and pony up about $700/year to host and maintain this site. If the expectation is to pony up $$$, nah, I'm good.

Unfortunately, thats part of the problem. People don't want to pony up money to the program either through direct donations or through seasons tickets. Unfortunately, College football is now a professional sports league.

BTW, its total horseshit that you should have to pony up all of the money for this site I would suggest setting up a GoFundMe
page for the BDW site. If the most frequent users pony up $10-20 each it would easily pay for the cost to run the site. I would contribute immediately.

[UAEebs86]

Personally, I don't want it enough to contribute any more than I currently do, which is go to a home game or two a year, watch most of the games, and pony up about $700/year to host and maintain this site. If the expectation is to pony up $$$, nah, I'm good.

Unfortunately, thats part of the problem. People don't want to pony up money to the program either through direct donations or through seasons tickets. Unfortunately, College football is now a professional sports league.

BTW, its total horseshit that you should have to pony up all of the money for this site I would suggest setting up a GoFundMe
page for the BDW site. If the most frequent users pony up $10-20 each it would easily pay for the cost to run the site. I would contribute immediately.

http://www.beardownwildcats.com/viewtop ... =26&t=6363

[UAdevil]

Personally, I don't want it enough to contribute any more than I currently do, which is go to a home game or two a year, watch most of the games, and pony up about $700/year to host and maintain this site. If the expectation is to pony up $$$, nah, I'm good.

Unfortunately, thats part of the problem. People don't want to pony up money to the program either through direct donations or through seasons tickets. Unfortunately, College football is now a professional sports league.

BTW, its total horseshit that you should have to pony up all of the money for this site I would suggest setting up a GoFundMe
page for the BDW site. If the most frequent users pony up $10-20 each it would easily pay for the cost to run the site. I would contribute immediately.

Sadly yeah, it has become a pro league, and like a pro franchise they'll need to depend on ticket, merch, concessions like pro teams. I don't know any fans that pony up cash donations for say, the Cowboys or Steelers to make ends meet.

[Winger]

Or did most of you just expect to look like a competent football team that won more games than we lost?

This is the rub for me.

It started with BB hiring his coordinator crew which depressed me beyond belief. I was nearly out the door with the Babers announcement on its own (Mike Luke favorite there ftr ... Babers ... sigh ...). That was the first signal that something wasn't right.

No. That's wrong.

First signal was when I knew Jason hated the hire. Which was before the hire.

Then you have what we've got here.

Which is to say a complete coaching meltdown. Like D/D- or worse performance in every facet of coaching/playing since the jump, Utah aside (and Utah isn't any good this season).

Brennan did lose some guys and caught some bad breaks. And I didn't think Arizona would hit it's over of 8.0-8.5 (in fact I hammered the piss out of the under).

It is, rather, that it has been so bad in so many facets that ...

It's over.

[tgrumpy2]

Something I've wondered all along, was the idea of hiring legacy coaches like Babers his idea or was he nudged into it? I don't think firing BB after one year would show up very well for us but changing offensive coordinators and changing systems would. This year is a loss and we have to deal with it. Akina has done a decent job but when you have injuries like he's had it does not bode well for you. To some extent we need to go look at what other successful Arizona coaches did and that would be Jedd Fisch. Jedd prioritized recruiting. He hired young aggressive smart assistants that could recruit and he sold two things, playing time and we're going to coach you into the next level. We're going to have plenty of open positions next year so BB needs to start selling the idea of playing time and every analyst and assistant coach in this program needs a pep talk about recruiting and if they can't recruit, they aren't staying. I would say he also needs a sit down with donors like Umberto Lopez and Jim Click and talk about NIL money. We already know Arizona can be successful.

[RawleArenas]

I wish it was that easy, but Brennan is just not that guy. You can't just hire a couple of assistants and retool a few things and !Voila! your Jedd 2.0.
To do so is underselling Jedd's natural talents and his understanding of program building and recruiting. There's a reason why the term 'ceiling' exists. It appears that there are a lot of people who think Brennan's stay here is salvageable. To your point, Herm Edwards tried the CEO thing at ASU and it didn't work out. With actually better personnel than Fisch had (Billick, Marvin Lewis). You have to be pretty savvy and skilled to pull it off, and he doesn't have it.

Personally, I think we need to clean house and get a guy who has a fresh vision. If they want to retain Akina and he's open to being a position coach, then I'm ok with that.

As an aside, I was one of the yellers for Leach when he became available years ago. Unfortunately, we have a history of picking the wrong guy and end up picking the right guys by accident.

[ChooChooCat]

Let’s keep bragging about that recruiting class guys. This is just the beginning by the way.

[84Cat]

Let’s keep bragging about that recruiting class guys. This is just the beginning by the way.

Scheer says there will be more

[tgrumpy2]

I wish it was that easy, but Brennan is just not that guy. You can't just hire a couple of assistants and retool a few things and !Voila! your Jedd 2.0.
To do so is underselling Jedd's natural talents and his understanding of program building and recruiting. There's a reason why the term 'ceiling' exists. It appears that there are a lot of people who think Brennan's stay here is salvageable. To your point, Herm Edwards tried the CEO thing at ASU and it didn't work out. With actually better personnel than Fisch had (Billick, Marvin Lewis). You have to be pretty savvy and skilled to pull it off, and he doesn't have it.

Personally, I think we need to clean house and get a guy who has a fresh vision. If they want to retain Akina and he's open to being a position coach, then I'm ok with that.

As an aside, I was one of the yellers for Leach when he became available years ago. Unfortunately, we have a history of picking the wrong guy and end up picking the right guys by accident.

Oh I don't think anything I talked about doing was going to be easy and if he can't manage it he does have to go. The house cleaning starts with Babers going and he can take the offensive line coach and reciever coach with him. Bringing in a young hard charger and competant assistants won't be easy. BB has to make the hard decisions whether he wants to or not. That's what head coaches do. BB certainly has a different style than Fisch but he isn't without talents. He talked some pretty good players into staying. He's going to need help from the big donors for the NIL.

[Merkin]

Let’s keep bragging about that recruiting class guys. This is just the beginning by the way.

My shocked face.

Believe CBB's only 4 star.

If you follow "T5" on Twitter he has been posting about going to a Texas Tech game in October. Probably end up there, a lot closer to home.

[PHXCATS]

The toxicity doesn't help things

[Merkin]

The toxicity doesn't help things

Well, he did retweet one of your posts, one of the few UA ones.

[TheCat]

Congrats on having other people pay for what you want

You keep saying this like you’re making a good point instead of what you’re actually doing which is making an ass of yourself, so I encourage you to continue.

I'm not advocating for this coach or his staff. But as a fanbase we have been wrong a few times about our coaches. Jedd was crucified when he was hired and especially after the lost to NAU. This is what you wrote Chicat.
"Well....

You've never been a head coach at any level beyond a 2 game stint as an interim.
Never put together a staff.
Never recruited at a high level.
Never exhibited any of the qualities anyone would want in a P5 head coach.
Your resume reads like someone trying to get out of paying alimony and child support to 4 ex-wives.

And you're running into a buzz saw combination of an AD with no power, an alumni base that hates the AD and the guy that hired you, and a bunch of fans who just witnessed the longest losing streak in program history, wanted anyone else BUT YOU, and immediately hate everything about your hire."

After losing to NAU there were many calls for this job in a season that ended with one victory over a school that could barely field a team. I would say there was at least two other teams we should have beat.

The dissatisfaction with CBB largely is based on where we ended last year. We thought rightly or wrongly we had finally turned the corner. This has a uncanny resemblance to the year we were highly ranked and lost to Penn State by 50. Tomey was on a slow death march after that game. CBB appears we haven't changed much except to quicken the march.

If you look at the Tommy Lloyd thread I did the same thing. Glad I was proven wrong.

[RawleArenas]

I beg of you, please please don't compare CBB to Lloyd or Fisch. People will not take your argument seriously. I was harsh to Lloyd when we initially hired him, not so much Fisch in the beginning. The dissatisfaction with our current coach is based on his performance and aptitude period. Lloyd proved his worth very quickly within the first few games, Jedd in the first offseason when he started to upgrade the roster and with the development of our offense.

The team we have right now resembles the Munsters. There's no way to dress it up.

Our current team is the ugly baby of a shotgun wedding of which we are sprinting down to the local courthouse to get a divorce.

[Chicat]

Congrats on having other people pay for what you want

You keep saying this like you’re making a good point instead of what you’re actually doing which is making an ass of yourself, so I encourage you to continue.

I'm not advocating for this coach or his staff. But as a fanbase we have been wrong a few times about our coaches. Jedd was crucified when he was hired and especially after the lost to NAU. This is what you wrote Chicat.
"Well....

You've never been a head coach at any level beyond a 2 game stint as an interim.
Never put together a staff.
Never recruited at a high level.
Never exhibited any of the qualities anyone would want in a P5 head coach.
Your resume reads like someone trying to get out of paying alimony and child support to 4 ex-wives.

And you're running into a buzz saw combination of an AD with no power, an alumni base that hates the AD and the guy that hired you, and a bunch of fans who just witnessed the longest losing streak in program history, wanted anyone else BUT YOU, and immediately hate everything about your hire."

After losing to NAU there were many calls for this job in a season that ended with one victory over a school that could barely field a team. I would say there was at least two other teams we should have beat.

The dissatisfaction with CBB largely is based on where we ended last year. We thought rightly or wrongly we had finally turned the corner. This has a uncanny resemblance to the year we were highly ranked and lost to Penn State by 50. Tomey was on a slow death march after that game. CBB appears we haven't changed much except to quicken the march.

If you look at the Tommy Lloyd thread I did the same thing. Glad I was proven wrong.

What’s fascinating is that I called Heeke a hated, powerless AD when talking about the hiring of Fisch and yet he was allowed to hire Brennan three years later exactly one week before he himself was fired. If that doesn’t scream leadership clusterfuck I don’t know what does.

I honestly don’t remember if I wanted Fisch run out of town his first year. I doubt it, just because Sumlin left us so utterly devoid of talent that I didn’t think any coach could have won with our team. This year feels different. I feel like a halfway competent coach could have gotten us to some shitty bowl game with 6 or 7 wins even with the defections and injuries. I’ve seen nothing that has led me to believe that Brent Brennan could get this team to fight its way out of a wet paper bag. He is just not the guy. Don’t compound Heeke’s shitty decision by giving CBB more time to run us further into the ground.

[dmjcat]

Let’s keep bragging about that recruiting class guys. This is just the beginning by the way.

Are you that clueless???

You do realize he's decommitting to a Power 2 conference school (SEC) with about 10x the NIL$$$$$$$$ we have????

This kid was going to decommit the moment A&M showed him the money.....REGARDLESS of who the UA coach was or will be.

We are living in a different world, College football is now Semi-Pro leagues. If you have the money you can compete for talent. If you don't you wind up with MWC talent.

[ChooChooCat]

Let’s keep bragging about that recruiting class guys. This is just the beginning by the way.

Are you that clueless???

You do realize he's decommitting to a Power 2 conference school (SEC) with about 10x the NIL$$$$$$$$ we have????

This kid was going to decommit the moment A&M showed him the money.....REGARDLESS of who the UA coach was or will be.

We are living in a different world, College football is now Semi-Pro leagues. If you have the money you can compete for talent. If you don't you wind up with MWC talent.

Yes I’m the clueless one, when you were the one bragging about Brennan’s recruiting class, you nailed it. Shelton is just the first to drop. There’s a bundle more decommitments coming and they’re not all leaving us for rich SEC schools.

[AZCatGirl]

If you can't get to a bowl game with Fifita + TMac, what hope is there when we have Brennan's guys in here? A crappy bowl game was literally the bare minimum for this season and it's not going to happen.

They're already begging fans to show up with the promise of half a basketball game. Things will only get worse next year if you don't pull the plug after this season.

[Siempre Verde]

Let’s keep bragging about that recruiting class guys. This is just the beginning by the way.

Smart kid.

[TheCatInTheHat]

There are some excellent thoughts in this thread.

One is about Fisch. He was almost unique at an Arizona as an analyst/play-caller/QB whisperer who could make quick in-game adjustments. Maybe Homer Smith is second place and RichRod third, but it's a short list, and that's what you need in this day and age in college football. (And note that Smith was only here for 2 of Tomey's 14 years.) Control the ball with short and intermediate passing and be able to win a shootout. It's almost the opposite of what Tomey did with a (sometimes) dominating defense and running the clock down on offense. And Exhibit A about Brennan is that he didn't have the expertise on his staff to pick up the reins and continue it. And that's the X factor an Arizona needs to really compete in football.

Another thought is that T-Mac is a generational talent and matchup nightmare that you need to exploit while you've got him. But we only managed to fully take advantage of his talents for one year.

As to Shelton's de-commit, well of course he went to the higher bidder. But when you're in a tailspin like we are, people jump and pull the rip cord. So, we'll get de-commits, and transfers out, and they'll be replaced by new commits and transfers in, but the talent level drops off to meet the coaching level until it looks a lot like San Jose St.