lets talk '16

Puerco · Post by **Puerco** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 2:14 am

Catgrad seems to be down on a lot of stuff these days. You okay, buddy?

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 8:05 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:3 star, 192nd ranked player in his class? Am I missing something?
He hasn't been properly evaluated. Anthony Davis was a 3 star entering his senior year of HS play until he popped onto the AAU scene and dominated every one. This kid was very very good the entire EYBL (averaged 18ppg). He won't be a 3 star/192nd ranked player after updates to rankings and he's not any more of a project than our current 5* guard Justin Simon.

Rankings fluctuate guys. 3 star players don't play like he did and they certainly don't garner a bunch of offers mid-summer for no reason either. Markelle Fultz played Junior Varsity a year before he became a 5 star player. Players develop and get better at different rates than other guys.

Lol, that would fall under, "Am I missing something here." I figured there was something I wasn't seeing, so thanks for explaining. I understand things change and stock can drastically rise, but the Davis and Fultz stories aren't the norm

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 8:45 am

rgdeuce wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:3 star, 192nd ranked player in his class? Am I missing something?
He hasn't been properly evaluated. Anthony Davis was a 3 star entering his senior year of HS play until he popped onto the AAU scene and dominated every one. This kid was very very good the entire EYBL (averaged 18ppg). He won't be a 3 star/192nd ranked player after updates to rankings and he's not any more of a project than our current 5* guard Justin Simon.

Rankings fluctuate guys. 3 star players don't play like he did and they certainly don't garner a bunch of offers mid-summer for no reason either. Markelle Fultz played Junior Varsity a year before he became a 5 star player. Players develop and get better at different rates than other guys.
Lol, that would fall under, "Am I missing something here." I figured there was something I wasn't seeing, so thanks for explaining. I understand things change and stock can drastically rise, but the Davis and Fultz stories aren't the norm

It's way more common than you give it credit for. Entering AAU ball prior to their upcoming senior seasons Justin Simon certainly wasn't rated what he is and neither was Allonzo Trier.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:28 am

Did they go from 3 star 192nd in class to 5 star top 40 in class that quickly though?

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 9:48 am

rgdeuce wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:3 star, 192nd ranked player in his class? Am I missing something?
He hasn't been properly evaluated. Anthony Davis was a 3 star entering his senior year of HS play until he popped onto the AAU scene and dominated every one. This kid was very very good the entire EYBL (averaged 18ppg). He won't be a 3 star/192nd ranked player after updates to rankings and he's not any more of a project than our current 5* guard Justin Simon.

Rankings fluctuate guys. 3 star players don't play like he did and they certainly don't garner a bunch of offers mid-summer for no reason either. Markelle Fultz played Junior Varsity a year before he became a 5 star player. Players develop and get better at different rates than other guys.
Lol, that would fall under, "Am I missing something here." I figured there was something I wasn't seeing, so thanks for explaining. I understand things change and stock can drastically rise, but the Davis and Fultz stories aren't the norm

Davis grew 10 inches in HS. If Andrew grows to 7'2, jackpot!

There are talented under the radar guys. When I say he's a developmental prospect, I mean it in a decent way. He looks athletic and aggressive. You want those raw materials in a developmental guy.

Puerco · Post by **Puerco** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 3:37 am

Thon Maker seems like one to avoid...

http://zagsblog.com/articles/arizona-st ... hon-maker/

Seems to have Overly-Involved Evil Guardian syndrome:

“I don’t really like too much badgering,” Smith told the Courier-Journal. “I don’t need to be recruited like that. When it comes closer to the time, then we need to start. I don’t need you to call me every day and tell me how much you love me and this and that. Once he starts getting closer to what he wants to do, everybody will jump in the race and then it’ll get really serious.

I can imagine this guy with dollar signs in place of eyeballs.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 3:09 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:3 star, 192nd ranked player in his class? Am I missing something?
He hasn't been properly evaluated. Anthony Davis was a 3 star entering his senior year of HS play until he popped onto the AAU scene and dominated every one. This kid was very very good the entire EYBL (averaged 18ppg). He won't be a 3 star/192nd ranked player after updates to rankings and he's not any more of a project than our current 5* guard Justin Simon.

Rankings fluctuate guys. 3 star players don't play like he did and they certainly don't garner a bunch of offers mid-summer for no reason either. Markelle Fultz played Junior Varsity a year before he became a 5 star player. Players develop and get better at different rates than other guys.
Lol, that would fall under, "Am I missing something here." I figured there was something I wasn't seeing, so thanks for explaining. I understand things change and stock can drastically rise, but the Davis and Fultz stories aren't the norm
Davis grew 10 inches in HS. If Andrew grows to 7'2, jackpot!

There are talented under the radar guys. When I say he's a developmental prospect, I mean it in a decent way. He looks athletic and aggressive. You want those raw materials in a developmental guy.

Apparently he had a pretty bad injury that set him back. He's fully recovered now. 7'2 Andrew Jones here we come! So many "developmental prospects" that played very well their freshman years wouldn't you say? Either way not a 3 star prospect. 3 star prospects don't get the offers and notoriety that he's getting now.

EOCT · Post by **EOCT** » Fri Jul 24, 2015 2:50 pm

What's up with the Lightfoot chase? http://tucson.com/sports/blogs/pascoe/a ... ce8dd.html

Any connection to our shots at JJ!, Ferguson, Simmons? Just a general back-up given Ferguson and Simmons are probably taken?

I love Jackson and the terrific fit, but if we were to miss and he choses Kansas(big mistake) I hope we'd go hard after Ferguson. A clear CSM-type player. I love the guy's D and versatility.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Fri Jul 24, 2015 2:52 pm

EOCT wrote:What's up with the Lightfoot chase? http://tucson.com/sports/blogs/pascoe/a ... ce8dd.html

A Matt Korcheck replacement.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Fri Jul 24, 2015 5:00 pm

Bruce Pascoe Arizona Daily Star

LAS VEGAS – After playing well at an Under Armour camp earlier this month in Charlotte, N.C., former Ironwood Ridge forward Mitch Lightfoot picked up interest from East Coast schools such as Florida and St. John's.

And those schools in the West paid even more attention. Like the one in Tucson.

“Coach (Sean) Miller hadn’t seen me play for a while,” Lightfoot said Thursday, after his Arizona Power Black club played in the Las Vegas Classic. “He saw me in Charlotte and they’re all in. He said they’d do whatever it takes to get me.”

Arizona might get the 6-7 power forward after all. But the Wildcats will have to fend off schools such as Utah, Stanford, Cal and now Arizona State.

http://tucson.com/sports/blogs/pascoe/a ... ce8dd.html

http://247sports.com/Player/Mitch-Lightfoot-38712

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Sun Jul 26, 2015 4:32 pm

Wildcats zeroing in on former I-Ridge star

23 hours ago • By Bruce Pascoe

“Controlled chaos,” says John Ortega, coach of the Arizona Power Black team that the 2016 UA recruiting target from Tucson and Gilbert is playing on this summer.

“I told him that from day one. I said,‘You’re controlled chaos.’ He is. We feed off of him. You’ll see most of our runs come off a big three from Mitch or a dunk, a big block or something like that. We really feed off him.”

“Ever since he opened up his recruitment, he’s been a top name,” said David Thomas, coach of the Arizona Power’s Tucson team and one of Lightfoot’s mentors. “They refer to him as one of the country’s top garbagemen because he does all the dirty work. He’s just your blue-collar guy, and the coaches want a guy like that.”

No doubt that approach is partly why Arizona coach Sean Miller and his staff have been following Lightfoot for about three years, zeroing in with renewed interest when he decommitted.

In Lightfoot’s recruitment, his motor was never the question. It was just whether his frame, at about 6 feet 7 inches and 200 pounds, could be effective against high-level Division I competition at the power forward spot.

Some questions about that still remain. Lightfoot isn’t ranked among the top 100 players in the class of 2016 by either ESPN or Scout, and 24/7 Sports has him at 146.

http://tucson.com/sports/basketball/col ... 845c7.html

UAEebs86 · Post by **UAEebs86** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:48 pm

http://www.scout.com/player/7624104n-schnider-herard

EOCT · Post by **EOCT** » Tue Jul 28, 2015 9:52 am

UAEebs86 wrote:http://www.scout.com/player/7624104n-schnider-herard

Very interesting. The short vids say tough. Like his follows-on-misses----taps, two handed put-ins. Not intimidated by defenders, but this is AAU ball.

Low torso heft says he needs our weight program.

Scout>Analysis>Weaknesses>"Values Structure"? Someone know what this jargon means?

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 4:52 am

Seems to like Sean Miller's coaching style.

Terrance Ferguson

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/baske ... e-ferguson

Arizona basketball: 'Good guy' Miller impresses recruit

http://tucson.com/sports/college/wildca ... a%20sports

EOCT · Post by **EOCT** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:11 pm

HiCat wrote:Seems to like Sean Miller's coaching style.

Terrance Ferguson

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/baske ... e-ferguson

Arizona basketball: 'Good guy' Miller impresses recruit

http://tucson.com/sports/college/wildca ... a%20sports

As always, thanks for your generosity, Hi!

I know I should shut up about Ferguson because Kansas might own him, but the guy is mentioning Coach Miller a lot. And for good reason.

So I won't shut up yet. Ferguson has size for the two, is an excellent perimeter shooter, explodes downcourt on breaks, and has extraordinary quicks. Best of all----I haven't got it all out yet----D is actually the most notable part of his game. A CSM dream who is versatile to 2 maybe 3 positions and loves D. I believe he'll end up as an undersized 3 because he's already demo'd his ability to score over taller players.

And how often do we run into a guy half the country is chasing who says "I would really love to play college ball for Sean Miller". That's genuine Bear Down stuff, huh?

UAEebs86 · Post by **UAEebs86** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 7:15 pm

luteformayor2 · Post by **luteformayor2** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 2:28 pm

Damn.

if we land Jackson and one of these centers/PFs, this is a big boy class for sure. Similar to the Ashley, Grant, Kaleb class in a way.

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Mon Aug 03, 2015 9:39 pm

Jackson
Leaf
Fultz
Davis

Please, God... Please

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:44 am

dcZONAfan wrote:Jackson
Leaf
Fultz
Davis

Please, God... Please

I think the Finnish kid is a better fit than Davis honestly.

The Goat · Post by **The Goat** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 10:11 pm

ChooChooCat wrote:
dcZONAfan wrote:Jackson
Leaf
Fultz
Davis

Please, God... Please
I think the Finnish kid is a better fit than Davis honestly.

Yeah, give me Markkanen over any of the center prospects and really I am not sure if I would take any others or just move on to trying to close McCoy in 17. Rather take an extra wing like Jones.

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Wed Aug 05, 2015 7:42 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
dcZONAfan wrote:Jackson
Leaf
Fultz
Davis

Please, God... Please
I think the Finnish kid is a better fit than Davis honestly.

Ahh, I must have missed the articles and chatter on this kid, hadn't heard of him until right now. Watched Davis the other day and he is a beast but clearly has a long way to go to contribute. Maybe the Finn fits us better, I don't know. Either way, that fourth guy is a bonus no matter what if we can get Fultz and JJ.

dmjcat · Post by **dmjcat** » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:18 pm

Arizona to get visit from Finnish big man:

http://www.scout.com/college/basketball ... isit-dates

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:59 am

dmjcat wrote:Arizona to get visit from Finnish big man:

http://www.scout.com/college/basketball ... isit-dates

nice, he's visiting for Red-Blue. Great time to host a recruit, hopefully he can't get enough of the crowd and CSM can get him to commit on the spot. Love that we get the last chance to make an impression

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:09 am

down to 3 schools.
Shooter, 6'10 or 6'11" not a bad thing

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Lau ... ign=buffer

Markkanen, whose father played under Roy Williams at Kansas, was the breakout performer of the Basketball Without Borders Global Camp. Tall and mobile, with an excellent frame that should fill out nicely in time, he impressed with his extremely high skill-level and basketball IQ throughout the weekend.

While he needs to get tougher and stronger, and become a much better rebounder and defender down the road, he looks like he has plenty of room to continue to develop in the next few years. He showed nice footwork, a solid feel for the game, and proved to be more than just a one-dimensional shooter at the Camp, putting the ball on the floor at times and make some smart passes.

From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/#ixzz3i2nG30WG
http://www.draftexpress.com

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 9:10 am

With his Swede moves and ability to Finnish at the rim, Norway we should miss out on this kid.

I'm Hungary. Time for a Danish.

EOCT · Post by **EOCT** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 9:47 am

Ouh, oh-----just remembered I forgot to Flemish the toilet.

EOCT · Post by **EOCT** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 10:00 am

Hey, I had some Danish too. Think I'll have Samoa.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 10:34 am

I'm russian right now to czech his youtube videos out. Kenya send me some links?

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 1:19 pm

Irish I could, but while Perusing the Internet, I looked down and noticed the watch I bought from this dude on the street stopped working. Egypted me!

Oh well. Here today, Ghana tomorrow.

I have Togo. Abyssinia!

Hobbes · Post by **Hobbes** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:58 pm

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:38 pm

Well done, gentlemen

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 5:55 pm

We just lost our only commitment for this class.

The Goat · Post by **The Goat** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:04 pm

Recruiting news has been a mess for 16/17/18. Getting our ass kicked out on the recruiting trail right now ever since the end of the Rabb recruitment.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:07 pm

The Goat wrote:Recruiting news has been a mess for 16/17/18. Getting our ass kicked out on the recruiting trail right now ever since the end of the Rabb recruitment.

Maybe if we hired an assistant with influence with the west coast AAU programs like UCLA did hiring David Grace (Compton magic). Guess what AAU team TJ Leaf is solely devoted to? Would not be surprised to see him in Westwood.

Also if it is the Compton Magic influence then we're wasting our damn time bringing Jaylen Hands to campus tomorrow. Just pouring salt in the wound and wasting energy. Sean Miller getting killed absolutely killed by Cuonzo and Alford.

The Goat · Post by **The Goat** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:17 pm

I don't know a legit elite prospect in 16/17/18 you can point to and say Arizona should feel good with them. That is fucking depressing.

Main Event · Post by **Main Event** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:40 pm

This one's on Sean

SCCats · Post by **SCCats** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:42 pm

84Cat · Post by **84Cat** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:43 pm

Main Event wrote:This one's on Sean

Explain please. I haven't been keeping up on recruiting so I don't know why this is happening.

3goggles · Post by **3goggles** » Thu Aug 06, 2015 8:31 pm

Wow you think somebody would've died judging by the response! Guys world is not coming to an end here. I wouldn't say any of the coaches in the pac are out recruiting CSM yet. If we land JJ, Fultz, Davis and the Finn that's a solid class. That's a better class then Stanley's or Aaron Gordon's Class! Let's take a deep breath and relax. oh boy we better watch out for Hurley and ASSU too! All Martin landed was 2 good players that are gone in 1 year. UCLA is still UCLA even though there coach is horrible they will still pull talent.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 10:03 am

Not a perfect fit.

catgrad97 · Post by **catgrad97** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 10:09 am

I just don't get what changed Leaf's mind besides some AAU bullsh*t Miller has no control over.

I am seeing a future, though, of Arizona filling up with solid character prospects nobody can really complain about on paper and can kick some World Games/Olympic butt, but losing out on the five-stars that end up shutting this program out of a Final Four.

College basketball has changed, and not necessarily by the rules. I'll stick by Miller and just shake my head at the insecure recruits who should know better.

baycat93 · Post by **baycat93** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 10:12 am

Main Event wrote:This one's on Sean

Everything is. He is the head coach and it is all his responsibility.

I have to wonder if this is in part that Sean is spread very thin right now. More than he has ever been. The team USA stuff has really taken a lot of his time and focus. On top of that he has had to replace a key member of his coaching staff almost every year the past couple few years. All of that has to take a toll.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 10:20 am

Fire Miller!

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 10:28 am

Hard not to be bothered by this, especially with no other '16 commits.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:04 am

catgrad97 wrote:I just don't get what changed Leaf's mind besides some AAU bullsh*t Miller has no control over.

I am seeing a future, though, of Arizona filling up with solid character prospects nobody can really complain about on paper and can kick some World Games/Olympic butt, but losing out on the five-stars that end up shutting this program out of a Final Four.

College basketball has changed, and not necessarily by the rules. I'll stick by Miller and just shake my head at the insecure recruits who should know better.

I'm seeing a world where we go back in time and UCLA lands all the elite California prospects that it wants and Arizona takes the 4 stars that can be developed into great players a la the Lute Olson vs. Ben Howland/Steve Lavin years.

3goggles · Post by **3goggles** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:19 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
catgrad97 wrote:I just don't get what changed Leaf's mind besides some AAU bullsh*t Miller has no control over.

I am seeing a future, though, of Arizona filling up with solid character prospects nobody can really complain about on paper and can kick some World Games/Olympic butt, but losing out on the five-stars that end up shutting this program out of a Final Four.

College basketball has changed, and not necessarily by the rules. I'll stick by Miller and just shake my head at the insecure recruits who should know better.
I'm seeing a world where we go back in time and UCLA lands all the elite California prospects that it wants and Arizona takes the 4 stars that can be developed into great players a la the Lute Olson vs. Ben Howland/Steve Lavin years.

I wouldn't go that far. We landed Gordon and SJ back to back years and lost out on Rabb last year. JJ will not be playing at UCLA. Leaf is darn good player but not the caliber as the 4 I just mentioned. To answer your other question about fringe Arizona guys going to UCLA they were all back up plans. I am not arguing that it sucks that we lost TJ because it does but its not saying that UCLA will run the west again. UCLA will be the UCLA Magic. Tell me how a whole AAU team will do in D-1 im guessing not very well.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:31 am

3goggles wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
catgrad97 wrote:I just don't get what changed Leaf's mind besides some AAU bullsh*t Miller has no control over.

I am seeing a future, though, of Arizona filling up with solid character prospects nobody can really complain about on paper and can kick some World Games/Olympic butt, but losing out on the five-stars that end up shutting this program out of a Final Four.

College basketball has changed, and not necessarily by the rules. I'll stick by Miller and just shake my head at the insecure recruits who should know better.
I'm seeing a world where we go back in time and UCLA lands all the elite California prospects that it wants and Arizona takes the 4 stars that can be developed into great players a la the Lute Olson vs. Ben Howland/Steve Lavin years.
I wouldn't go that far. We landed Gordon and SJ back to back years and lost out on Rabb last year. JJ will not be playing at UCLA. Leaf is darn good player but not the caliber as the 4 I just mentioned. To answer your other question about fringe Arizona guys going to UCLA they were all back up plans. I am not arguing that it sucks that we lost TJ because it does but its not saying that UCLA will run the west again. UCLA will be the UCLA Magic. Tell me how a whole AAU team will do in D-1 im guessing not very well.

In what world was Ike Anigbogu and Jalen Hill back up plans for Arizona? You act as if we really wanted other guys more. Who are these other guys? We just started recruiting the Finnish kid and De'Ron Davis hard and that was after Anigbogu popped for UCLA. Hill and McCoy were always the 1A and 1B post targets for 2017 so once again there was nobody else. You're sugarcoating a mountain of turds right now for whatever reason.

We landed Gordon and SJ in back to back years where Mike Montgomery's corpse was coaching California & Alford just got into town. Now that Cuonzo is in town and Alford has things going I wouldn't exactly count on Arizona always landing the top player from California year in and year out any more. You have a point about UCLA dominating solely the Magic right now, but with success let's see if they can extend their reach (they're UCLA, they have the brand to do so).

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:31 am

Beachcat97 wrote:Hard not to be bothered by this, especially with no other '16 commits.

Less than half of the Top 100 recruits have signed. Plenty of time

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:39 am

Remember that one year Lute signed only Dion Broome?

Never saw a minute of playing time.

Not even remotely concerned.

UAEebs86 · Post by **UAEebs86** » Fri Aug 07, 2015 11:56 am

Jefe wrote:
Beachcat97 wrote:Hard not to be bothered by this, especially with no other '16 commits.
Less than half of the Top 100 recruits have signed. Plenty of time

None of the 2016 commits have signed. All verbals at this point.

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