The Question

[pc in NM]

IMNSHO, this team collapsed into uninspired and inconsistent play in the last month, or so, of the season.

Without a doubt, players' passion waned, usually described by the concept "lack of effort" - but, in every instance of "lack of effort", there were certainly periods of great comebacks - often, too little, too late.

And any attempts to address CSM's responibility for, and/or role in, this pattern have been strenuously, often hostilly, rejected - almost as if to even raise the question were the ultimate ignorance and disloyalty.

Yet, that is "The Question"

The coach makes the big bucks. The coach gets the credit for the successes. The coach (in college) has as much control as almost anyone in any sport.

Responsibility has to be a two-way street. Something went sour here. CSM has to have some responsibility in that, and there's no (good) reason to totally deflect honest, and fair, appraisal.Absolutely, NOT condemnation or rejection, but reflection....

I'd love to see some of that pursued on this site...

[Alieberman]

This team lacked a leader on the floor the entire year. There was no one willing to step up and take TJs place.

[rgdeuce]

Nothing went sour. This team wasnt that good and finally started to play good teams. You cant get away with what we did all year against good teams.

[NYCat]

He's responsible on who he brings in and how he assembles a team.

Sean Miller needs to build a better team to get over the hump. Top recruiting talent but no attitude or leadership. Next year? I don't see who fills that role besides Rawle but just on the attitude/intensity part. Need players who hate to lose, a lot of blue chippers don't have that chip on their shoulders attitude.

The team has no NBA next level talent, so they're not going to win on flat out talent because it isn't head and shoulders above everyone. They're definitely not going to out work, out husfle the opposition either.

Teams have been bigger, slower and more slower pace and methodical offense. When guards win in March consistently, that's detrimental. I really think that slow pace is a huge detriment in the tournament. It keeps games too close and attempting to catch up at that pace is nearly impossible.

Bill Simmons' new website had an article about this

Want to Win the NCAA Tournament? Your Coach Had Better Be a Good General Manager
By Jonathan Tjarks

The most important thing a college coach can do to help his team win the NCAA tournament isn’t to draw up killer plays or give inspiring halftime speeches — it’s to build a perfect roster.

Sure, luck plays a huge part of winning during March Madness. But it ultimately comes down to matching the skill sets of your best players with the rest of your roster. The tournament is when you find out whether the sum of your team is better or worse than its parts. Recruiting McDonald’s All Americans is great, but just like a GM at the next level, you need to surround those blue-chippers with complementary pieces.

Consider John Calipari and some of his recent Kentucky teams. Given the kind of individual talent he recruited, Calipari probably should have three national titles. The DeMarcus Cousins team in 2010, the Anthony Davis team in 2012, and the Karl-Anthony Towns team in 2015 all featured Naismith Award–worthy (or winning, in Davis’s case) players. But Calipari has built a roster capable of winning the big dance only once, with Davis in ’12.

Accumulating future lottery picks is great, but winning a national title is more about finding the right mix of players. In something of a mirror image of this season’s Thunder failing to complement Kevin Durant and Russell Westbrook with adequate outside shooting, Kentucky’s inconsistent big men have let down their playmakers. And this isn’t the first time that Cal has gone into March with an imbalanced squad.

Calipari had Boogie, John Wall, and Eric Bledsoe in 2010, but no shooting around them. When that Kentucky team faced West Virginia in the Elite Eight, Bob Huggins dared the Wildcats to shoot, and they couldn’t, going 4-for-32 from 3-point range. When Cal did have knockdown shooters — Doron Lamb, Darius Miller, and Kyle Wiltjer — around Davis in 2012, Kentucky rolled to a title. In 2015, the Wildcats again had shooters — Tyler Ulis and Devin Booker — to go with a big man in Towns, but Calipari decided he wanted to die on the Harrison twins hill, and Aaron and Andrew took only two 3s in the Final Four loss to Wisconsin.

This season’s Kentucky team has playmaking and shooting, but finding the right balance of scoring and defense from some combination of Skal Labissiere, Marcus Lee, Alex Poythress, and Derek Willis might be impossible.

The most complete team in this year’s bracket is probably Michigan State. Even when they don’t have a lot of high-level talent, Tom Izzo’s teams generally play well in March because they don’t have a lot of defined weaknesses. With two future NBA players in Denzel Valentine and Deyonta Davis and a balanced team around them, Sparty is going to be a tough out.

Winning the tournament is about answering a series of personnel questions. The stats and résumé are important, but it’s just as important for a coach to get the personnel balance right. You have to ask yourself questions like: Does this team have a great 1-on-1 scorer? Does it have a guy who gets everyone else involved? What about a guard who can control tempo? Can the team get offense from multiple options? Does it have enough shooting to complement its best players? What about rim protection and rebounding? Can the team guard all five positions?

If a coach has done his job as and he can say “yes” to enough of those queries? That’s when you get to celebrate while “One Shining Moment” plays.

He's not directly responsible for how the team plays, but he is responsible IMO. Much like a CEO/chairman is held accountable no matter what happens under his leadership.

He's the GM

[NYCat]

Plus I think over coaches like alot of college basketball coaches tend to do. They always play scared and tight. Chol did say iirc that he was scared of

Free throws being consistently bad

Scoring droughts of 5+

Not being able to play two complete halves

[TheGreatCatsby]

Also, when's the last good point guard Miller recruited as a freshman? 0. Guard play wins in the tournament, and seems Miller is stuck with a recruiting philosophy getting bigs that work well during the season but can't get over the hump in the big dance because he is limited by guard play.

[NYCat]

Also, when's the last good point guard Miller recruited as a freshman? 0. Guard play wins in the tournament, and seems Miller is stuck with a recruiting philosophy getting bigs that work well during the season but can't get over the hump in the big dance because he is limited by guard play.

Guards win in March. Will never not be true.

[Harvey Specter]

IMNSHO, this team collapsed into uninspired and inconsistent play in the last month, or so, of the season.

Without a doubt, players' passion waned, usually described by the concept "lack of effort" - but, in every instance of "lack of effort", there were certainly periods of great comebacks - often, too little, too late.

And any attempts to address CSM's responibility for, and/or role in, this pattern have been strenuously, often hostilly, rejected - almost as if to even raise the question were the ultimate ignorance and disloyalty.

Yet, that is "The Question"

The coach makes the big bucks. The coach gets the credit for the successes. The coach (in college) has as much control as almost anyone in any sport.

Responsibility has to be a two-way street. Something went sour here. CSM has to have some responsibility in that, and there's no (good) reason to totally deflect honest, and fair, appraisal.Absolutely, NOT condemnation or rejection, but reflection....

I'd love to see some of that pursued on this site...

This point is not debatable. Miller gets credit and blame for anything good or bad that happens in the program. The buck stops there.

But things need to be taken in the perspective of his accomplishment during his tenure - which has been stellar. There is always some good and bad. We've had a LOT more of the former, so he gets some credit from me on the latter.

I do not 'blame' him for the Elite 8 losses. I do not condemn him for this past season, which was a down one - every team has them, and our personnel was not stellar. Impossible to avoid that occasionally with the number of early defections each year.

I will say that tonight the team did not come ready to play - and that is on him. Disappointing certainly, but not an unforgivable offense unless it becomes a trend. I do not expect that it will.

[DaddyO'Cat]

Yeah. Most of this year falls on the team itself, but .... one thing that has bugged me since the first year he came here, is something that I'm going to quote from Sean himself, which was in the article about his weight loss... "I've always been one dimensional in my thinking"... Straight from the horses mouth. He's one dimensional. He doesn't adapt to his personnel, and he doesn't adapt to the style of teams they're playing against. His style on offense ... not that great. The D is alright but kind of frustrating 'cuz it seems to limit fast break opportunities and steals. A number of Wichita's points tonight came on fast breaks. It's fine to want to be great at one particular thing, but if you can't adapt... I'll leave it at that.

[Main Event]

Nothing went sour. This team wasnt that good and finally started to play good teams. You cant get away with what we did all year against good teams.

This.

[rgdeuce]

NYCAT i agree to a point, but really, how much can u blame Miller when u lose four starters. The fifth that returned was basically option number 5 his whole career here too. How many teams can do that and be great the next year? Kentucky? They struggled often this year and are a four seed, and they get pretty much everyone they want. How pretty are they looking if they play in the Pac 12 and not the SEC? And to make matters worse, you lose probably your best freshman for the season. Beggars cant be choosers, plus we missed out on Lee.

Looking back now on this season after a few drinks, Sean Miller did an amazing job piecing together a team that could win 25 games in the toughest the pac 12 has been in forever. And then actually winning 25 games, with only one embarrassing (10 point) loss all year. Utterly amazing job all around if u take a step back. every loss this year could have changed with one bounce except two.

[elriop20]

Yeah. Most of this year falls on the team itself, but .... one thing that has bugged me since the first year he came here, is something that I'm going to quote from Sean himself, which was in the article about his weight loss... "I've always been one dimensional in my thinking"... Straight from the horses mouth. He's one dimensional. He doesn't adapt to his personnel, and he doesn't adapt to the style of teams they're playing against. His style on offense ... not that great. The D is alright but kind of frustrating 'cuz it seems to limit fast break opportunities and steals. A number of Wichita's points tonight came on fast breaks. It's fine to want to be great at one particular thing, but if you can't adapt... I'll leave it at that.

Yeah our style doesn't seem to be great in the tourney.

[Puerco]

Miller is the CEO. He is responsible for everything that happens, good or bad. But if you've ever led a team of people you'll know that it's impossible to have a great team with the ideal mixture of talent, experience and leadership every single year. People come and go on the team, and even if you get to hire each one of them, sometimes you make a mistake. Your best employees move on for bigger and better jobs. The replacements sometimes do better and sometimes do worse. At the end, it's your team and you're responsible for it's performance, but no one's going to fire a consistently high performing leader just because he or she has a sub-par year once out of every four or five. Perspective is the big thing when you credit or blame Miller for a particular year's success. And with perspective I think most of us will agree that he's doing an incredibly good job.

I'd certainly hire the guy again.

[Merkin]

Cats missed 7 shots in the first half that were wide open. Not sure how you can blame that on CSM.

What do the former players think?

[catgrad97]

Yep. Maybe Miller can be a better situational or possession coach, but I think he'll be very happy to flush some bad attitudes out of the program and start fresh next season.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Yeah. Most of this year falls on the team itself, but .... one thing that has bugged me since the first year he came here, is something that I'm going to quote from Sean himself, which was in the article about his weight loss... "I've always been one dimensional in my thinking"... Straight from the horses mouth. He's one dimensional. He doesn't adapt to his personnel, and he doesn't adapt to the style of teams they're playing against. His style on offense ... not that great. The D is alright but kind of frustrating 'cuz it seems to limit fast break opportunities and steals. A number of Wichita's points tonight came on fast breaks. It's fine to want to be great at one particular thing, but if you can't adapt... I'll leave it at that.

Yeah our style doesn't seem to be great in the tourney.

I disagree with that. First off, Elite Eights are good results. This is the first year I think you can legitimately say we underperformed in the tourney.

In 2011, we were a one man team that ran into a hotter one man team and missed two threes to win as time ran out. In 2014, we were a lights out defensive team that lost because we had a major injury that forced us to play 2 nonshooters together. We lost that game because we could not make enough shots in regulation. In 2015, no scheme was going to stop Wisky's second half shooting. Even in 2013, we took a very good OSU team that was favored to beat us to the buzzer.

There's no perfect scheme. Lute, for all he did for Arizona, frequently underperformed in the tourney with a faster style that emphasized TO's and fast break points.

[NYCat]

Yeah. Most of this year falls on the team itself, but .... one thing that has bugged me since the first year he came here, is something that I'm going to quote from Sean himself, which was in the article about his weight loss... "I've always been one dimensional in my thinking"... Straight from the horses mouth. He's one dimensional. He doesn't adapt to his personnel, and he doesn't adapt to the style of teams they're playing against. His style on offense ... not that great. The D is alright but kind of frustrating 'cuz it seems to limit fast break opportunities and steals. A number of Wichita's points tonight came on fast breaks. It's fine to want to be great at one particular thing, but if you can't adapt... I'll leave it at that.

Yeah our style doesn't seem to be great in the tourney.

I disagree with that. First off, Elite Eights are good results. This is the first year I think you can legitimately say we underperformed in the tourney.

In 2011, we were a one man team that ran into a hotter one man team and missed two threes to win as time ran out. In 2014, we were a lights out defensive team that lost because we had a major injury that forced us to play 2 nonshooters together. We lost that game because we could not make enough shots in regulation. In 2015, no scheme was going to stop Wisky's second half shooting. Even in 2013, we took a very good OSU team that was favored to beat us to the buzzer.

There's no perfect scheme. Lute, for all he did for Arizona, frequently underperformed in the tourney with a faster style that emphasized TO's and fast break points.

You don't have to look at it so black & white. It's not either or; the current style (which keeps game slow and games close) or lute's, there's a lot of middle ground there. Izzo, K, Calipari, Roy, Self, Pitino etc are all in that various shade of gray.

[legallykenny]

Yeah. Most of this year falls on the team itself, but .... one thing that has bugged me since the first year he came here, is something that I'm going to quote from Sean himself, which was in the article about his weight loss... "I've always been one dimensional in my thinking"... Straight from the horses mouth. He's one dimensional. He doesn't adapt to his personnel, and he doesn't adapt to the style of teams they're playing against. His style on offense ... not that great. The D is alright but kind of frustrating 'cuz it seems to limit fast break opportunities and steals. A number of Wichita's points tonight came on fast breaks. It's fine to want to be great at one particular thing, but if you can't adapt... I'll leave it at that.

Yeah our style doesn't seem to be great in the tourney.

I disagree with that. First off, Elite Eights are good results. This is the first year I think you can legitimately say we underperformed in the tourney.

In 2011, we were a one man team that ran into a hotter one man team and missed two threes to win as time ran out. In 2014, we were a lights out defensive team that lost because we had a major injury that forced us to play 2 nonshooters together. We lost that game because we could not make enough shots in regulation. In 2015, no scheme was going to stop Wisky's second half shooting. Even in 2013, we took a very good OSU team that was favored to beat us to the buzzer.

There's no perfect scheme. Lute, for all he did for Arizona, frequently underperformed in the tourney with a faster style that emphasized TO's and fast break points.

You don't have to look at it so black & white. It's not either or; the current style (which keeps game slow and games close) or lute's, there's a lot of middle ground there. Izzo, K, Calipari, Roy, Self, Pitino etc are all in that various shade of gray.

Roy plays pretty close to Lute ball.

Does get me to thinking though about how important it is to recruit the right style of players. The pieces we had this year would have better fit Lute's style than Miller's (I think in particular York and Allen are both better players with a couple of years of Lute than a couple of years of Miller). Whereas Miller was a much better fit than Lute for our 2014 roster.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Yeah. Most of this year falls on the team itself, but .... one thing that has bugged me since the first year he came here, is something that I'm going to quote from Sean himself, which was in the article about his weight loss... "I've always been one dimensional in my thinking"... Straight from the horses mouth. He's one dimensional. He doesn't adapt to his personnel, and he doesn't adapt to the style of teams they're playing against. His style on offense ... not that great. The D is alright but kind of frustrating 'cuz it seems to limit fast break opportunities and steals. A number of Wichita's points tonight came on fast breaks. It's fine to want to be great at one particular thing, but if you can't adapt... I'll leave it at that.

Yeah our style doesn't seem to be great in the tourney.

I disagree with that. First off, Elite Eights are good results. This is the first year I think you can legitimately say we underperformed in the tourney.

In 2011, we were a one man team that ran into a hotter one man team and missed two threes to win as time ran out. In 2014, we were a lights out defensive team that lost because we had a major injury that forced us to play 2 nonshooters together. We lost that game because we could not make enough shots in regulation. In 2015, no scheme was going to stop Wisky's second half shooting. Even in 2013, we took a very good OSU team that was favored to beat us to the buzzer.

There's no perfect scheme. Lute, for all he did for Arizona, frequently underperformed in the tourney with a faster style that emphasized TO's and fast break points.

You don't have to look at it so black & white. It's not either or; the current style (which keeps game slow and games close) or lute's, there's a lot of middle ground there. Izzo, K, Calipari, Roy, Self, Pitino etc are all in that various shade of gray.

This year was a tough challenge. We have a weird mix of players. Dusan is not made to function in an uptempo system. Zeus and Anderson could, but don't excel as much as they do in a pounding half court system. Trier is the only one who could really play either style. PJC can only be really productive in the open floor.

Basically, our perimeter guys are made for the fast pace and our inside people are made for the slow pounding. When we lost Smith and Pitts, we lost a lot of ability to flex in either way.

[dmjcat]

IMNSHO, this team collapsed into uninspired and inconsistent play in the last month, or so, of the season.

Without a doubt, players' passion waned, usually described by the concept "lack of effort" - but, in every instance of "lack of effort", there were certainly periods of great comebacks - often, too little, too late.

And any attempts to address CSM's responibility for, and/or role in, this pattern have been strenuously, often hostilly, rejected - almost as if to even raise the question were the ultimate ignorance and disloyalty.

Yet, that is "The Question"

The coach makes the big bucks. The coach gets the credit for the successes. The coach (in college) has as much control as almost anyone in any sport.

Responsibility has to be a two-way street. Something went sour here. CSM has to have some responsibility in that, and there's no (good) reason to totally deflect honest, and fair, appraisal.Absolutely, NOT condemnation or rejection, but reflection....

I'd love to see some of that pursued on this site...

The answer to your question is yes, CSM is responsible.

Having said that I still think that Miller has done an outstanding job. In the current era of one and done players its going to be
next to impossible to maintain a constant level of excellence.........even Kentucky has issues. No coach can lose 4 starters (3 of them early to the league) and then lose a top freshmen (RS) before the season even tips off and be successful at a high level.

I might also make the point that if Ray Smith doesn't screw up his knee there is a better than 50% chance that we win 2 of 3 of the UCLA/USC/Cal games. That would have gotten us to 2nd place in the conference and a 3 seed........and we might very well be sitting here talking about the 6th seed we are playing in round 2.

[rgdeuce]

With Smith, Im not sure we lose more than two games. He fills in for Trier during his injury. When Zeus is down, he can slide to the 4, Ryan can slide to the 5 and we go small and quick or have Dusan at the 5 if we wanted more size. Those lengthy athletes we had problems with, guess who helps w that on D? When Ryan isnt doing his job, we have a star who can take over while he learns his lesson on the bench. Trier doesnt want to defend, we have a star to take his place while he learns on the bench. You think Gabes the same player if Smith is good enough to start at the 3 and Zo can take minutes/shots from him at the 2? Tollefsen is NOT a rotation guy once he got out there and showed everyone how bad he was with a healthy Smith. How many close games did we lose when Tolly was easy money to score on and there was nuthin we could do?

Ultimately the coach is going to be responsible but its hard when guys know u dont have any teeth. Just the depth alone, aside from Smiths skill would have been huge. Its hard to sit guys who dont want to play when u dont have even a body to replace him with,and this was a huge issue during the injuries. . Simon wasnt ready, a nice upperclassman body (pause) who worked hard is sitting on the bench in street clothes (almost let the personal issue slip). Tollefsen was getting 30 minutes a game out there some nights for crying out loud. Miller was dealt a jack, a 2, a 4, an 8, and a 9 and he turned it into a straight. That serves you well most of the time, but you are going to run into flushes, full houses and four of a kinds at times and come up short.