let's talk '18

[Spaceman Spiff]

any info on the current Barrett visit today?

High of 91 in Tucson, so it doesn't feel awful but campus will definitely be looking good.

It was actually nice out in the morning. For Tucson, it could be way more oppressive, and it's still warm enough that summer wear is good.

[ChooChooCat]

If we get either Bol or Shittu, I feel really good about where we are at in terms of our post rotation next year. Fingers crossed.

What if we get both? I think we're pretty much in the position where we land Bol and Shittu or Bol and Little.

Choo, what would be your preference between shittu and little? I feel like little is more versatile w/ better O? Are both OAD or is either more likely to stay a second year?

Both intend to be OAD that's for sure. I like Ira and Reef, but I was still most uneasy about the 4 spot for next season, so landing Shittu gives you a nearly guaranteed double double at that spot. I think he's a perfect compliment to Bol in the post as well. Plus we should have Akot manning the 3 next season and I always felt that hurt our chances with Little as he really wants to be one and done.

You can't go wrong with either is my opinion overall, but as we sit today it looks like a Shittu/Bol combo is more likely than a Little/Bol combo. It's recruiting though, so who knows?

[ChooChooCat]

any info on the current Barrett visit today?

I'm sure he'll have a great time.

[YoDeFoe]

This '18 class, man...it's looking Caliparian.

You know what would really set it off? If the '18 class's arrival on campus is preceded by a national title. The program would soar to new heights.

Sploosh

[CalStateTempe]

This '18 class, man...it's looking Caliparian.

You know what would really set it off? If the '18 class's arrival on campus is preceded by a national title. The program would soar to new heights.

Sploosh

That would be awesome.

[baycat93]

If we get either Bol or Shittu, I feel really good about where we are at in terms of our post rotation next year. Fingers crossed.

What if we get both? I think we're pretty much in the position where we land Bol and Shittu or Bol and Little.

Choo, what would be your preference between shittu and little? I feel like little is more versatile w/ better O? Are both OAD or is either more likely to stay a second year?

Both intend to be OAD that's for sure. I like Ira and Reef, but I was still most uneasy about the 4 spot for next season, so landing Shittu gives you a nearly guaranteed double double at that spot. I think he's a perfect compliment to Bol in the post as well. Plus we should have Akot manning the 3 next season and I always felt that hurt our chances with Little as he really wants to be one and done.

You can't go wrong with either is my opinion overall, but as we sit today it looks like a Shittu/Bol combo is more likely than a Little/Bol combo. It's recruiting though, so who knows?

Thanks Choo. I was not aware how OAD Little is. Was hoping he was a 2 year player.

Still Bol/Shittu is an amazing combo. Thank god for CSM.

[Spaceman Spiff]

If we get either Bol or Shittu, I feel really good about where we are at in terms of our post rotation next year. Fingers crossed.

What if we get both? I think we're pretty much in the position where we land Bol and Shittu or Bol and Little.

Choo, what would be your preference between shittu and little? I feel like little is more versatile w/ better O? Are both OAD or is either more likely to stay a second year?

Both intend to be OAD that's for sure. I like Ira and Reef, but I was still most uneasy about the 4 spot for next season, so landing Shittu gives you a nearly guaranteed double double at that spot. I think he's a perfect compliment to Bol in the post as well. Plus we should have Akot manning the 3 next season and I always felt that hurt our chances with Little as he really wants to be one and done.

You can't go wrong with either is my opinion overall, but as we sit today it looks like a Shittu/Bol combo is more likely than a Little/Bol combo. It's recruiting though, so who knows?

I wasn't super freaked out because I figure we could start Bol/Jeter to go big and Bol or Jeter with Akot at the 4 against smaller, quicker 4's if Shareef or Lee isn't ready. Just having Bol alone would give us a standout and mean we only need a solid guy flanking him.

The only issue with Shittu/Bol is the logjam at the 4. I'm not sold on Shareef or Lee at the 3, and there would only be room for one at the 4.

[YoDeFoe]

The only issue with Shittu/Bol is the logjam at the 4. I'm not sold on Shareef or Lee at the 3, and there would only be room for one at the 4.

I hate the logjam and how it forces guys to think about individual goals more than the team. Hoping that Lee sees himself as a three or more likely four year player and understands that he can earn starts by those years - again, Lee has said that he expects to get recruited over.

O'Neal is more worrisome for me, just given the pressure and expectations that his name carries. He doesn't look like a OAD candidate. He doesn't look like a two and done. His AAU stats from this past summer (12 games) are underwhelming... 15pts, 6rebs, 0.4blks in 23m/g with a shooting line of .46 / .63 / .28.

Bol Bol is putting up 24pts, 9rebs, 4blks per game in 28min/g shooting .66/ .83 /.49.

O'Neal wants to play on the perimeter but he probably doesn't have the lateral quickness to defend there nor the shooting touch the score from there.

Shittu btw... 20pts, 10rebs, 1.5blks in 20min/g shooting .59 / .56 / .38

If O'Neal doesn't improve quickly he's going to be a cheerleader next year, despite his number of Twitter followers.

(Bol Bol and O'Neal vs Shittu this July... One view... Second view)

[NYCat]

2018-2019

1. Quinerly: Barcello, Williams
2. Randolph: Williams, Smith
3. Akot: 'reef (he sees himself as a wing, and with no other SF on roster, why not let him backup Akot)
4. Shittu: 'reef, Lee
5. Bol²: Jeter

In other news, the '19 class is extremely weak on the west coast. Cassius Stanley, Josh Green (who moved to FL), PJ Fuller (not really recruiting him), Lamelo (who won't play in college), are the only players in the top 50.

[Spaceman Spiff]

The only issue with Shittu/Bol is the logjam at the 4. I'm not sold on Shareef or Lee at the 3, and there would only be room for one at the 4.

I hate the logjam and how it forces guys to think about individual goals more than the team. Hoping that Lee sees himself as a three or more likely four year player and understands that he can earn starts by those years - again, Lee has said that he expects to get recruited over.

O'Neal is more worrisome for me, just given the pressure and expectations that his name carries. He doesn't look like a OAD candidate. He doesn't look like a two and done. His AAU stats from this past summer (12 games) are underwhelming... 15pts, 6rebs, 0.4blks in 23m/g with a shooting line of .46 / .63 / .28.

Bol Bol is putting up 24pts, 9rebs, 4blks per game in 28min/g shooting .66/ .83 /.49.

O'Neal wants to play on the perimeter but he probably doesn't have the lateral quickness to defend there nor the shooting touch the score from there.

Shittu btw... 20pts, 10rebs, 1.5blks in 20min/g shooting .59 / .56 / .38

If O'Neal doesn't improve quickly he's going to be a cheerleader next year, despite his number of Twitter followers.

(Bol Bol and O'Neal vs Shittu this July... One view... Second view)

I don't know. I get that Shareef has the name, but a lot of what Shaq has said is actually pretty respectful of a developmental process. That's how I see Shareef too. Shittu and Bol are top ten guys and Shareef isn't. Around 30 is more like it for him. That's the sort of rank where someone has the raw tools to step in and surprise by being a starter and a one and done. That said, you expect they're more likely to need a few years to mold their tools when someone's 20-30-40 range.

Yes, Shareef is an O'Neal, but Shaq has always (at least publicly) seemed realistic in terms of what he has told Shareef about developing. Shaq also was pre-OAD and probably knows spending 3 years in college isn't the end of the world.

[ChooChooCat]

Lee isn't a 3 guys.

[YoDeFoe]

Lee isn't a 3 guys.

I don't think anyone called him a 3...? Three year player (with more likely four) is what I meant. I think Spiff said he wasn't convinced Lee could get minutes at the 3 spot so would have to be okay getting no minutes next year (unless he beats out O'Neal for backup four, which I think he could do).

[ChooChooCat]

Truthfully I'd give Shittu and Randolph all the back up 3 minutes. Lee and Reef Duke it out for back up 4 man minutes. The talent plays.

[Alieberman]

Our 2018 class is going to be huge.... I Shittu not.

[catgrad97]

This class of Miller's will be so huge, we'll Shittu Bols.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Lee isn't a 3 guys.

I don't think anyone called him a 3...? Three year player (with more likely four) is what I meant. I think Spiff said he wasn't convinced Lee could get minutes at the 3 spot so would have to be okay getting no minutes next year (unless he beats out O'Neal for backup four, which I think he could do).

I think Lee is small for a PF and would increase his value if he could play the 3. In an ideal world, he and Shareef could expand their roles by stealing minutes at the 3. That is a wish, not what I think is likely.

If Shittu/Bol happens, we are just jammed minutes wise at the 4/5. The only real hope to alleviate it is that someone leaves, someone sits or someone can swing to the 3. I would rather not see the first thing, the second is always tough with prospects so I can hope for the third. Yes, it may not happen, but let me dream.

By the way, this is the third year in a row we've said that this may be Miller's best class ever. Doesn't that feel nice?

[CalStateTempe]

Who will be our point?

[Spaceman Spiff]

Who will be our point?

Quinerly and Williams. Both freshmen, both legit talents.

[YoDeFoe]

I think Lee is small for a PF and would increase his value if he could play the 3. In an ideal world, he and Shareef could expand their roles by stealing minutes at the 3. That is a wish, not what I think is likely.

If Shittu/Bol happens, we are just jammed minutes wise at the 4/5. The only real hope to alleviate it is that someone leaves, someone sits or someone can swing to the 3. I would rather not see the first thing, the second is always tough with prospects so I can hope for the third. Yes, it may not happen, but let me dream.

By the way, this is the third year in a row we've said that this may be Miller's best class ever. Doesn't that feel nice?

Great post Spiff.

[ChooChooCat]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

[Bangkok Wildcat]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

Goose Bumps! Can't friggin' wait

[Bangkok Wildcat]

This class of Miller's will be so huge, we'll Shittu Bols.

lol.....and will also be happy to be doing that

[threenumberones]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

Sorry, but calling someone a starter 12mo before they have a single practice in Tucson is absolutely absurd. Did we learn nothing from Josiah? It would not shock me at all if Barcello had a surprising year this year and established himself, or if BW outplays Q the following. There is nothing but conjecture at this point, and even that is just hot air.

[YoDeFoe]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

Sorry, but calling someone a starter 12mo before they have a single practice in Tucson is absolutely absurd. Did we learn nothing from Josiah? It would not shock me at all if Barcello had a surprising year this year and established himself, or if BW outplays Q the following. There is nothing but conjecture at this point, and even that is just hot air.

Triple C is speculating, like we all do. Quinerly does seem special though yes anything is possible.

[ChooChooCat]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

Sorry, but calling someone a starter 12mo before they have a single practice in Tucson is absolutely absurd. Did we learn nothing from Josiah? It would not shock me at all if Barcello had a surprising year this year and established himself, or if BW outplays Q the following. There is nothing but conjecture at this point, and even that is just hot air.

I mean anything can happen and all, but Q will be the best point guard on roster next year and he won't have any issues with drugs like the one guy you're making your primary basis of argument from. Barcello and Williams will certainly push him, but I'd be shocked if it's not Q.

[Bangkok Wildcat]

Hey Choo,

1. any gut feeling on the next domino to fall? Bol?

2. And as for Shareef, you would think with how smart Shaq is, having spent 3 years in college when he could have easily been a OAD (or was it not possible back then? can't recall.....i do recall watching him grab a rebound at LSU and taking it coast to coast for a dunk against us! ).....you would think that Shaq would be in favor of getting the most development possible for Shareef in college before going pro. Thoughts?

Thanks as usual. BD Choo.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

Sorry, but calling someone a starter 12mo before they have a single practice in Tucson is absolutely absurd. Did we learn nothing from Josiah? It would not shock me at all if Barcello had a surprising year this year and established himself, or if BW outplays Q the following. There is nothing but conjecture at this point, and even that is just hot air.

Cst asked who will run point. Of course an answer this far ahead is speculation, but the '18 thread is pretty much the home for speculation about '18.

I would say Quinerly is clearly the favorite. Of course Barcello or Williams could beat him out. That's speculation too at this point. We'll see, but Quinerly is where he is for a reason.

[threenumberones]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

Sorry, but calling someone a starter 12mo before they have a single practice in Tucson is absolutely absurd. Did we learn nothing from Josiah? It would not shock me at all if Barcello had a surprising year this year and established himself, or if BW outplays Q the following. There is nothing but conjecture at this point, and even that is just hot air.

Cst asked who will run point. Of course an answer this far ahead is speculation, but the '18 thread is pretty much the home for speculation about '18.

I would say Quinerly is clearly the favorite. Of course Barcello or Williams could beat him out. That's speculation too at this point. We'll see, but Quinerly is where he is for a reason.

For sure, which is why making definitive statements like that doesn't make any sense. If it was any other poster I wouldn't have said anything. But Choo brings the real scoop and is probably the most credible poster here that's active. Sorry Choo, you have a different standard

[Spaceman Spiff]

Q will be the starter.

Sorry, but calling someone a starter 12mo before they have a single practice in Tucson is absolutely absurd. Did we learn nothing from Josiah? It would not shock me at all if Barcello had a surprising year this year and established himself, or if BW outplays Q the following. There is nothing but conjecture at this point, and even that is just hot air.

Cst asked who will run point. Of course an answer this far ahead is speculation, but the '18 thread is pretty much the home for speculation about '18.

I would say Quinerly is clearly the favorite. Of course Barcello or Williams could beat him out. That's speculation too at this point. We'll see, but Quinerly is where he is for a reason.

For sure, which is why making definitive statements like that doesn't make any sense. If it was any other poster I wouldn't have said anything. But Choo brings the real scoop and is probably the most credible poster here that's active. Sorry Choo, you have a different standard

If I remember right, Choo is also a BIG Quinerly fan. I think he might also be more sold than most on JQ's ability. In fairness, there's a lot to like. Quinerly is the sort of kid that I think is made to excel in the college game, even moreso than being a prospect who is highly ranked because of his physical upside.

[ChooChooCat]

Hey Choo,

1. any gut feeling on the next domino to fall? Bol?

2. And as for Shareef, you would think with how smart Shaq is, having spent 3 years in college when he could have easily been a OAD (or was it not possible back then? can't recall.....i do recall watching him grab a rebound at LSU and taking it coast to coast for a dunk against us! ).....you would think that Shaq would be in favor of getting the most development possible for Shareef in college before going pro. Thoughts?

Thanks as usual. BD Choo.

No gut feelings at the moment. Bol could decide tomorrow and it wouldn't surprise me, He's had a more fluid recruitment than most, but with one constant, which has been us. Gotta make sure he gets on campus, but I think we're good in the end.

The O'Neals chose Arizona to further develop Reef''s game. I'm sure he'd love to be one and done, but I imagine the family understands what they're getting themselves into here. Reef needs a better post game and needs to turn the effort up. Hopefully the competition he's in for will bring the best out of him.

[ChooChooCat]

Who will be our point?

Q will be the starter.

Sorry, but calling someone a starter 12mo before they have a single practice in Tucson is absolutely absurd. Did we learn nothing from Josiah? It would not shock me at all if Barcello had a surprising year this year and established himself, or if BW outplays Q the following. There is nothing but conjecture at this point, and even that is just hot air.

Cst asked who will run point. Of course an answer this far ahead is speculation, but the '18 thread is pretty much the home for speculation about '18.

I would say Quinerly is clearly the favorite. Of course Barcello or Williams could beat him out. That's speculation too at this point. We'll see, but Quinerly is where he is for a reason.

For sure, which is why making definitive statements like that doesn't make any sense. If it was any other poster I wouldn't have said anything. But Choo brings the real scoop and is probably the most credible poster here that's active. Sorry Choo, you have a different standard

Well let's look at the 3 main guys:

1. Barcello, great shooter who has always naturally been more of a facilitator with the ball than a true point guard. He has a lot of Gabe York in him (the good Gabe qualities) with a better handle. If Miller thought he was the long term answer or the overall answer at the 1 then Arizona probably doesn't recruit 2 point guards in this class. I'm a big fan, but this is the guy I want taking open 3s in rhythm all game and not the one I want setting up every thing for my other guys.

2. Williams, fantastic talent who can score in bunches and pass very well. Guy who can slide over from the 1 to the 2 seamlessly. His primary issue of course is his leg injury that kept him away from the game for a year, which took a crucial development year away from him. He'll be fine in the end, but Quinerly will just likely be ahead of him.

3. Quinerly, the consummate point guard. Has the vision, the passing, and a good enough jimperial to keep defenses honest. Of the 3 he's the best suited as the 1 in any lineup. Honestly if he were on the court with either of the other 2 he'd be your primary ballhandler.

Like I said anything can certainly happen. Barcello could prove to be too good to keep off the court. Williams could return from his injury and absolutely annihilate every one. Quinerly could take a step back in his game and be surpassed by the other 2. At this moment however it's hard for me to see anyone, but Q starting at the 1. I'm not a betting man though Three, so we'll just have to see how it plays out.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Hey Choo,

1. any gut feeling on the next domino to fall? Bol?

2. And as for Shareef, you would think with how smart Shaq is, having spent 3 years in college when he could have easily been a OAD (or was it not possible back then? can't recall.....i do recall watching him grab a rebound at LSU and taking it coast to coast for a dunk against us! ).....you would think that Shaq would be in favor of getting the most development possible for Shareef in college before going pro. Thoughts?

Thanks as usual. BD Choo.

No gut feelings at the moment. Bol could decide tomorrow and it wouldn't surprise me, He's had a more fluid recruitment than most, but with one constant, which has been us. Gotta make sure he gets on campus, but I think we're good in the end.

The O'Neals chose Arizona to further develop Reef''s game. I'm sure he'd love to be one and done, but I imagine the family understands what they're getting themselves into here. Reef needs a better post game and needs to turn the effort up. Hopefully the competition he's in for will bring the best out of him.

That is interesting. I've heard similar, that Shareef being Shaq's son will be an asset. I've heard Shaq is good about heing realistic that Shareef needs to be challenged and work to develop. Instead of an attitude about being Shaq's kid, here's hoping we get someone who knows what it takes to succeed because his father saw it firsthand.

[Puerco]

What's a 'jimperial'?

[YoDeFoe]

What's a 'jimperial'?

The nicest hesi pull-up jimbo you've ever seen.

But seriously, he's got the offensive skill to make the defense pay both from a mid-range jumper and from getting to the rim and finishing. Along with his handles, he should be able to penetrate, get his defender on his back, and use his vision and touch to find open guys from inside the action... or get the bucket if the help defense doesn't commit.

[ChooChooCat]

What's a 'jimperial'?

Lol good lord smart text.

[Spaceman Spiff]

What's a 'jimperial'?

It's a more regal Jimmer.

[YoDeFoe]

Jahvon Quinerly in 13 AAU games this season...

* 18.8 pts / 3.3 rebs / 5.1 asts / 0.8 stls in 27 min/g.
* Shooting 55.8% from the field, 44.2% from three, and 82.5% from the line.
* Only 2.2 TOs/g is a 2.4 A:TO ratio.
* Second on the circuit in A:TO ratio. He's third on the circuit in scoring, second in assists per game.
* Led his team in scoring all but two games (where he was second), started all games at SG.

Quinerly, like Shittu, dominated his position on the AAU circuit this summer (Q did the same last year too). He is head and shoulders the best guard in the Under Armor AAU circuit - outplaying Anfernee Simmons (#12 ranked, Louisville), Devon Dotson (#24 ranked, uncommitted), Isaiah Wong (#56 ranked, uncommitted), Prentiss Hubb (#66 ranked, Notre Dame), and Eric Ayala (#75 ranked, uncommitted) among others.

DraftExpress blurb here, noting his circuit leading 2.6 estimated win shares and leading 141 ORtg.

Crushed the NBA Top 100 Camp as well: "averaged 16 points, 4.2 rebounds, 4.2 assists and 1.9 steals. His points, assists and steals register in the top five at the camp, and his rebounds per game is tops for point guards."

6'1" with a near 6'6" wingspan, exceptional at finishing at the basket with those long arms and his ability to score off the glass (Jelly!). Plays like he's seen it all before.

This dude is not fucking around. We're incredibly lucky to get a commitment from a playmaking PG of his quality. He's a full blown five star and arguably the best PG in the class.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Jahvon Quinerly in 13 AAU games this season...


* 18.8 pts / 3.3 rebs / 5.1 asts
* Shooting 55.8% from the field, 44.2% from three, and 82.5% from the line
* Only 2.2 TOs/g is a 2.4 A:TO ratio
* Second on the circuit in A:TO ratio. He's third on the circuit in scoring, second in assists per game
* Led his team in scoring all but two games (where he was second), started all games at SG

The good A/TO ratio and great shooting % jump out at me the most. My biggest compliment to JQ would be the maturity and skill in his game and those numbers drive it home.

[YoDeFoe]

Spiff caught me mid edit. I posted once and kept diving deeper... I had to go back and post some more

One last one:

"I’m not sure there was a better guard from start to finish than that of Jahvon Quinerly. The New Jersey native was a terrific mixture of scoring, passing, rebounding, defense, play-making and leadership. He seemed to get better as the camp progressed while other players seemed to hit their wall."

From this year's NBA Top 100 camp, same camp that Alex Barcello stormed through last year.

This year's competition included Ayo Dosunmu, Immanuel Quickley, Devon Dotson, Courtney Ramey, Anferne Simons and Elijah Weaver. Four and five star players.

Two years now he's been killing it. As a junior he posted 20 points, five assists, three rebounds and two steals for Hudson Catholic HS en route to being named New Jersey’s Gatorade Player of the Year. 20/5/3 is his go-to stat line.

This kid is going to be a breath of fresh air in McKale. I can see why Choo is so confident in him. I share that confidence now.

A backcourt of Quinerly, Barcello, and Williams is almost unfair.

[prh]

Even better since that trio is just to handle the point. I think most of us are high on Brandon Randolph, but don't see him being gone anytime soon.

[Bangkok Wildcat]

Wow, thanks so much YoDeFoe for the quality breakdown, links and personal analysis on Jahvon and his performance on the AAU Circuit....well done and very interesting/ exciting to read.

Damn, assuming Brandon Williams returns to form and nothing unexpected happens, our '18 backcourt looks unbelievably impressive! Will be fascinating to see how CSM manages / develops the talent and what kind of combinations he comes up with.

So we have arguably the Preseason #1 Team for '17 and CSM & Co. are building another monster for '18.......life is good

[Beachcat97]

http://scout.com/college/basketball/rec ... -107822964" target="_blank

[ChooChooCat]

Well ThreeNumberOnes, I did say anything can happen. I certainly didn't think this was one of them. You win though, Quinerly will never be the starting point guard at Arizona.

[CalStateTempe]

Choo are you hearing anything out of mckale?

[ChooChooCat]

Choo are you hearing anything out of mckale?

Silence. All I know is every one is blindsided.

[CalStateTempe]

Choo are you hearing anything out of mckale?

Silence. All I know is every one is blindsided.

That "could" be a good thing from the UofA's perspective.

[threenumberones]

Well ThreeNumberOnes, I did say anything can happen. I certainly didn't think this was one of them. You win though, Quinerly will never be the starting point guard at Arizona.

Holy shit man. Holy fucking shit. Yea, go me. Kill me with a chainsaw.

[threenumberones]

Choo are you hearing anything out of mckale?

Silence. All I know is every one is blindsided.

That "could" be a good thing from the UofA's perspective.

Yea. I really want Sean to be clean. More than anything. I can accept the punishment if he's clean. My fandom will take a big hit if this corruption ends up being a department-level deception.

[Puerco]

Mine too bud.

[YoDeFoe]

My timing hopping on the Quinerly train was impeccable.

Goddamnit.