Bribery Scandal - FBI Probe - Book Richardson Involved

[threenumberones]

The problem is the NCAA is hellbent on maintaining the essence of amateurism. I don't think they care about how significant their sports programs are in the greater world of athletics. It would be a 'get back to basics' mission, with focus on the educational foundation of the university. The role that the NCAA plays in being the developmental league for pro/olympic sports could be replaced by a glorified/unaffiliated club system...or more likely minor leagues for football/basketball. I don't think it's likely, but it also would not surprise me one bit either if they blew it up.

The NCAA has a tv contract for 1.1 billion a year for broadcast rights to March Madness. They won't be jeopardizing that any time soon. A back to basics system takes billions out of their pockets too. Pretending the NCAA doesn't have a huge monetary stake in this...

Yea, but where does that money go? It goes back to the schools to support the students and the programs. It's not like the NCAA itself has huge operating expenses. Besides, if you scale the whole thing down and return the athletes to being students first and foremost, you don't need a 1.1 billion dollar TV contract. Their hypocrisy is being called out and they are going to have to choose. Everyone is assuming that they will just start paying players and all I'm saying is that it's possible they go the other direction.

[jsbowl16]

Ryen Russillo just had a former head coach on and he asked him how many colleges have a "Book" on their squad. He said about 100

Percent?

No he said 100 out of over 300 schools. It was Dan Dakich.

[Spaceman Spiff]

The problem is the NCAA is hellbent on maintaining the essence of amateurism. I don't think they care about how significant their sports programs are in the greater world of athletics. It would be a 'get back to basics' mission, with focus on the educational foundation of the university. The role that the NCAA plays in being the developmental league for pro/olympic sports could be replaced by a glorified/unaffiliated club system...or more likely minor leagues for football/basketball. I don't think it's likely, but it also would not surprise me one bit either if they blew it up.

The NCAA has a tv contract for 1.1 billion a year for broadcast rights to March Madness. They won't be jeopardizing that any time soon. A back to basics system takes billions out of their pockets too. Pretending the NCAA doesn't have a huge monetary stake in this...

Yea, but where does that money go? It goes back to the schools to support the students and the programs. It's not like the NCAA itself has huge operating expenses. Besides, if you scale the whole thing down and return the athletes to being students first and foremost, you don't need a 1.1 billion dollar TV contract. Their hypocrisy is being called out and they are going to have to choose. Everyone is assuming that they will just start paying players and all I'm saying is that it's possible they go the other direction.

They have 38 million dollars in yearly administrative expenses. We can differ on the extent of huge. I would say that is 38 million reasons they don't want this all to come down. There are 500 employees just at the home office.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Ryen Russillo just had a former head coach on and he asked him how many colleges have a "Book" on their squad. He said about 100

Percent?

No he said 100 out of over 300 schools. It was Dan Dakich.

I was just getting in a little bit of dark humor.

[gumby]

I always laugh at people who have a problem with performance enhancing drugs. Where do you stop is the question? According to Malcolm Gladwell, over 50% of the students at ivy league schools & employees at silicon valley firms use PEDs. Should we prosecute them like we do athletes?

You have a competition. You have rules. Those who play by the rules should be put at a disadvantage? Those who don't want to harm themselves for life for short-term gain should just skip sports?

"Sorry, this is what you have to do to compete."
"But I don't want a head like a watermelon, severe acne, shriveled up gonads and cancer later in life."
"Sorry, but if you want to compete ..."

Is it against the rules to use PEDs in the Gladwell scenario? No.

If you want to change the rules in sports, OK. In the meantime, it's cheating. Just as spying on another team's practice is cheating. Or spitting on the ball is cheating.

Want to make all of that legal? OK. Level playing field. But ... ugh. Would you want to play? Or have one of your kids play?

'Where do you stop" is a response to a lot of issues. You stop where you think -- as a society -- it makes some sense.

"If we ban heroin and cocaine, where do we stop?" (Therefore, make it all legal?)
"If we ban grenades, where do we stop?" (Zero arms control?)

[Chicat]

i think its more about the 5k, and most assistants and coaches arent pocketing the money -- almost always that gets passed thru

so yes, what Book did for an extra 5k is retarded.

That's what stunned me the most. That Book did all this for what is basically pocket change. Other schools are angling for six figures, and he's scamming for a few thousand here or there for himself.

And that's why I say Fuck Book. This could have been a whole bunch of schools not named Arizona but he needed some scratch for a bottle of Popov.

[Hank of sb]

every top 50 program for the last 25 years has paid for the vast majority of their top players.

the top, top programs pay for a much higher percentage due to the fact that they get a higher percentage of top players -- its been a know practice and somewhat accepted for as long as i can remember, and yes, Arizona is right there with the best of them.

the programs with the pedigree, resources, and willingness to "do what it takes" have had the clear advantage in landing the top stars.

where this falls on Adidas is that they have long been cornered with direct benefits to the teams they sponsor, whereas other programs like Arizona have had a deft process and tight secrecy.

Book exposed Arizona thru a channel it has never used, Adidas, for his own personal greed and gain -- not to mention 5k...and therein lies where all Arizona fans should be infuriated, fucking Book Richardson did this for 5k, 5 fucking k, and did so by going outside of the model that was so effective and un-penetrable up to this point.

so, its not about if the teams cheat, its how they cheat, and Arizona did it as good or better than anyone.

and one last thing, how do you guys think i know all the inside information i know? is it because you think i talk to Sean Miller everyday? or that Greg Byrne and Jim Livengood used to call me and tell me that Stanley Johnson was going to commit, or Aaron Gordon was coming to Arizona or that Chase Budinger was going to stay for his Jr year or that Sean Miller met with our main booster in Santa Fe or that John Calipari convinced Miller to come to AZ?

no, its because the web of involvement of people not directly affiliated with the program are intertwined in the mix, they are the ones who pull the strings and cover the man holes, and its like that at every school that handles their business effectively at this level.

its the darkest kept secret of of a 1000 or so people around the country at various universities who are not employees or staff members who are vital to the culture of college basketball today, and that culture is a culture of greed and billions and billions of dollars on the line.... from CBS and FOX to ESPN and Adidas and NIKE and Under Armor and Foot Locker and McDonalds and on and on and on.....

I'm not sure why the bluster of last night holds true now--you know Miller was ahead of things. It doesn't seem he was ahead of anything.

If anything, since the whole truth will (has?) gotten out, the best thing to do is fire Miller, impose 2 years of sanctions along with 2 scholarships and encourage the NCAA to add more if they think its necessary, and ASAP. The sooner we get on with things the sooner we can feel better about this....and ourselves.

Further, we now know there is a current team player who has a relative in receipt of money. What's the hold up there? That player should already be off the team.

I agree with those here who ask what's the point?

For me, I can't see one anymore.

Why fire Miller when pretty much every successful college basketball coach does the exact same thing. Clearly paying athletes and all this other shady shit became a necessity to have success and keep your job. Who would u replace him with when theres probably a plethora of shady coaches below the collegiate level and most of the D1 coaches are involved in the same stuff? You also gotta believe Arizona would be stupid to even offer imposing self sanctions until the dust settles - is the NCAA really going to put every top 50 program on probation and do tournament bans?

It seems we need to come to terms with the fact that everyone is getting dragged into this. There will be no winners, and hopefully it leads to things getting cleaned up, until they find another way, rinse, repeat.

As for Miller being ahead of things, purely speculation on my part, but say the FBI came around w questions bc of Book (or even before then), would it not bode well if Miller, with his knowledge and candor, said look, FBI, here is the deal, and laid the entire blueprints and inner workings of what really goes down? You help the FBI take down the big guys, they take care of you. The more you help and if it leads to convictions, the better

First, everyone won't be dragged into this. This (hope) is a pipe dream. If anything, we have already seen every program that will be "caught." The fact that the FBI is subpoenaing Nike and UA means little, IMO. Why? Arizona got caught on tape, red-handed. That's akin to Marion Barry getting caught in a hotel room paying cash for cocaine. Yes, Arizona looks that lame and will be one of 5/6/7 programs put front-and-center as an example.

As for Miller and the excuse he was doing what everyone does, see above. Everyone does it, yes, but everyone doesn't get caught. As for the excuse, Book went rogue. Yes, Book went rogue but at this point, so what? Bottom line: we got caught because of Miller's staff; we are now paying for that and the cost will only grow if Miller stays. He's permanently tainted.

Self governing oneself shows the university is embarrassed. As I am. We should do some things just on principle. Here they are:

(1) Apologize first.
(2) The player whose relative took money.... gone.
(3) Miller gone.
($) Romar in
(5) No NCAA's this year (This will be impressive because even w/o Ayton we could be a FF team, still.)
(6) 2 scholies gone for 2 years
(7) 1 scholie gone for 2 additional years

Do this and I'm still a fan--partially at least.

Why should we put ourselves through the wait. We are already being punished NOW, with no end in sight.

[Spaceman Spiff]

I always laugh at people who have a problem with performance enhancing drugs. Where do you stop is the question? According to Malcolm Gladwell, over 50% of the students at ivy league schools & employees at silicon valley firms use PEDs. Should we prosecute them like we do athletes?

You have a competition. You have rules. Those who play by the rules should be put at a disadvantage? Those who don't want to harm themselves for life for short-term gain should just skip sports?

"Sorry, this is what you have to do to compete."
"But I don't want a head like a watermelon, severe acne, shriveled up gonads and cancer later in life."
"Sorry, but if you want to compete ..."

Is it against the rules to use PEDs in the Gladwell scenario? No.

If you want to change the rules in sports, OK. In the meantime, it's cheating. Just as spying on another team's practice is cheating. Or spitting on the ball is cheating.

Want to make all of that legal? OK. Level playing field. But ... ugh. Would you want to play? Or have one of your kids play?

'Where do you stop" is a response to a lot of issues. You stop where you think -- as a society -- it makes some sense.

"If we ban heroin and cocaine, where do we stop?" (Therefore, make it all legal?)
"If we ban grenades, where do we stop?" (Zero arms control?)

If I was in this scenario as a parent, would I want my kid to get $150,000 for being a top basketball recruit with no threat of ineligibility? Yeah, maybe I would.

PED's have a separate aspect and debate about the validity of studies and whether they can be used safely. I won't go heavy on that, but dealing with the issue of money in college sports, I would say that there is a very valid argument that were it accepted for players to get these benefits, it would actually be a net positive.

[gumby]

every top 50 program for the last 25 years has paid for the vast majority of their top players.

the top, top programs pay for a much higher percentage due to the fact that they get a higher percentage of top players -- its been a know practice and somewhat accepted for as long as i can remember, and yes, Arizona is right there with the best of them.

the programs with the pedigree, resources, and willingness to "do what it takes" have had the clear advantage in landing the top stars.

where this falls on Adidas is that they have long been cornered with direct benefits to the teams they sponsor, whereas other programs like Arizona have had a deft process and tight secrecy.

Book exposed Arizona thru a channel it has never used, Adidas, for his own personal greed and gain -- not to mention 5k...and therein lies where all Arizona fans should be infuriated, fucking Book Richardson did this for 5k, 5 fucking k, and did so by going outside of the model that was so effective and un-penetrable up to this point.

so, its not about if the teams cheat, its how they cheat, and Arizona did it as good or better than anyone.

and one last thing, how do you guys think i know all the inside information i know? is it because you think i talk to Sean Miller everyday? or that Greg Byrne and Jim Livengood used to call me and tell me that Stanley Johnson was going to commit, or Aaron Gordon was coming to Arizona or that Chase Budinger was going to stay for his Jr year or that Sean Miller met with our main booster in Santa Fe or that John Calipari convinced Miller to come to AZ?

no, its because the web of involvement of people not directly affiliated with the program are intertwined in the mix, they are the ones who pull the strings and cover the man holes, and its like that at every school that handles their business effectively at this level.

its the darkest kept secret of of a 1000 or so people around the country at various universities who are not employees or staff members who are vital to the culture of college basketball today, and that culture is a culture of greed and billions and billions of dollars on the line.... from CBS and FOX to ESPN and Adidas and NIKE and Under Armor and Foot Locker and McDonalds and on and on and on.....

So then why are you such a fan? Why should anyone be a fan outside of the people who directly benefit? This is what I've never understood. People talk about the corruption and refs fixing games, and conferences playing favorites with teams and on and on, and I'm like, this is something you devote yourself to?

So best-case scenario is our coach is corrupt, but feds really want Adidas. So don't sweat it.

Seems to be me best-case scenario is that ALL of this gets blown up.

Gumby, why are you a fan? Like, there are lines that I wouldn't like crossed. I don't want people bribed, hurt, or cheated in some way in order to help Arizona/hurt opponents. So, I don't want Arizona assistants making shady deals with shady agents and shady shoe companies...

But there's billions of dollars wrapped up in the collegiate game, and massive resources spent on collegiate athletes.

From state-of-the-art arenas that cost millions, to special academic advisors, to charter flights to-and-from games, to vacations to Spain, to the shoes, shirts, backpacks, laptops, and all other associated "swag" that comes with being a high-level college athlete. Not to mention the social access, from parties in frathouses to networking opportunities with booster bigwigs.

It may be "legal", and it's not as bold-faced as directly giving money under the table, but you have to at least acknowledge that the entire sport has always revolved around enticing young athletes to come to your school. And, when it's a situation regarding a high-level athlete, the questions are "How good is this kid, and can we get him to come to our school?", not "How good are his grades, do you think he's an intelligent person who will enrich the academic profile of this school?".

I don't want University of Arizona representatives to break the rules. I don't want University of Arizona representatives to sweet-talk kids into shady deals. I'd like the University of Arizona to graduate as many players as possible. But outside of that, I want the school to try to win.

Fair question. I wrestle with it all the time. Love the games, but when I think about ... ugh. My passion has dissipated over the years, and I have been critical of all of the above. And I've been critical of all the changes driven by $$$.

Now that this has been dragged into the spotlight, I don't want it to be like cockroaches scurrying back behind the floorboards and then pretending they're not there.

Get the fucking exterminator.

If this had happened years ago, I would've been devastated. Now I hope it's a springboard for reform.

P.S. -- I don't buy the stuff about refs being corrupt and Arizona being the victim of various conspiracies (from media to conference heads to Selection Sunday to whatever). My point there is, "wow, you think outcomes are ordained but you still cheer for victories."

[SCCats]

every top 50 program for the last 25 years has paid for the vast majority of their top players.

the top, top programs pay for a much higher percentage due to the fact that they get a higher percentage of top players -- its been a know practice and somewhat accepted for as long as i can remember, and yes, Arizona is right there with the best of them.

the programs with the pedigree, resources, and willingness to "do what it takes" have had the clear advantage in landing the top stars.

where this falls on Adidas is that they have long been cornered with direct benefits to the teams they sponsor, whereas other programs like Arizona have had a deft process and tight secrecy.

Book exposed Arizona thru a channel it has never used, Adidas, for his own personal greed and gain -- not to mention 5k...and therein lies where all Arizona fans should be infuriated, fucking Book Richardson did this for 5k, 5 fucking k, and did so by going outside of the model that was so effective and un-penetrable up to this point.

so, its not about if the teams cheat, its how they cheat, and Arizona did it as good or better than anyone.

and one last thing, how do you guys think i know all the inside information i know? is it because you think i talk to Sean Miller everyday? or that Greg Byrne and Jim Livengood used to call me and tell me that Stanley Johnson was going to commit, or Aaron Gordon was coming to Arizona or that Chase Budinger was going to stay for his Jr year or that Sean Miller met with our main booster in Santa Fe or that John Calipari convinced Miller to come to AZ?

no, its because the web of involvement of people not directly affiliated with the program are intertwined in the mix, they are the ones who pull the strings and cover the man holes, and its like that at every school that handles their business effectively at this level.

its the darkest kept secret of of a 1000 or so people around the country at various universities who are not employees or staff members who are vital to the culture of college basketball today, and that culture is a culture of greed and billions and billions of dollars on the line.... from CBS and FOX to ESPN and Adidas and NIKE and Under Armor and Foot Locker and McDonalds and on and on and on.....

I'm not sure why the bluster of last night holds true now--you know Miller was ahead of things. It doesn't seem he was ahead of anything.

If anything, since the whole truth will (has?) gotten out, the best thing to do is fire Miller, impose 2 years of sanctions along with 2 scholarships and encourage the NCAA to add more if they think its necessary, and ASAP. The sooner we get on with things the sooner we can feel better about this....and ourselves.

Further, we now know there is a current team player who has a relative in receipt of money. What's the hold up there? That player should already be off the team.

I agree with those here who ask what's the point?

For me, I can't see one anymore.

Why fire Miller when pretty much every successful college basketball coach does the exact same thing. Clearly paying athletes and all this other shady shit became a necessity to have success and keep your job. Who would u replace him with when theres probably a plethora of shady coaches below the collegiate level and most of the D1 coaches are involved in the same stuff? You also gotta believe Arizona would be stupid to even offer imposing self sanctions until the dust settles - is the NCAA really going to put every top 50 program on probation and do tournament bans?

It seems we need to come to terms with the fact that everyone is getting dragged into this. There will be no winners, and hopefully it leads to things getting cleaned up, until they find another way, rinse, repeat.

As for Miller being ahead of things, purely speculation on my part, but say the FBI came around w questions bc of Book (or even before then), would it not bode well if Miller, with his knowledge and candor, said look, FBI, here is the deal, and laid the entire blueprints and inner workings of what really goes down? You help the FBI take down the big guys, they take care of you. The more you help and if it leads to convictions, the better

First, everyone won't be dragged into this. This (hope) is a pipe dream. If anything, we have already seen every program that will be "caught." The fact that the FBI is subpoenaing Nike and UA means little, IMO. Why? Arizona got caught on tape, red-handed. That's akin to Marion Barry getting caught in a hotel room paying cash for cocaine. Yes, Arizona looks that lame and will be one of 5/6/7 programs put front-and-center as an example.

As for Miller and the excuse he was doing what everyone does, see above. Everyone does it, yes, but everyone doesn't get caught. As for the excuse, Book went rogue. Yes, Book went rogue but at this point, so what? Bottom line: we got caught because of Miller's staff; we are now paying for that and the cost will only grow if Miller stays. He's permanently tainted.

Self governing oneself shows the university is embarrassed. As I am. We should do some things just on principle. Here they are:

(1) Apologize first.
(2) The player whose relative took money.... gone.
(3) Miller gone.
($) Romar in
(5) No NCAA's this year (This will be impressive because even w/o Ayton we could be a FF team, still.)
(6) 2 scholies gone for 2 years
(7) 1 scholie gone for 2 additional years

Do this and I'm still a fan--partially at least.

Why should we put ourselves through the wait. We are already being punished NOW, with no end in sight.

FUCK THAT!

We have the playbook. Play nice initially. Delay hearings/decisions. Delay again. Delay again. Oh hearing is set for April 15th? Great. Take slap on the wrist punishment. Once that's handed down, sue in court.

But lol that shit you said, FUCK THAT NOISE.

[threenumberones]

The problem is the NCAA is hellbent on maintaining the essence of amateurism. I don't think they care about how significant their sports programs are in the greater world of athletics. It would be a 'get back to basics' mission, with focus on the educational foundation of the university. The role that the NCAA plays in being the developmental league for pro/olympic sports could be replaced by a glorified/unaffiliated club system...or more likely minor leagues for football/basketball. I don't think it's likely, but it also would not surprise me one bit either if they blew it up.

The NCAA has a tv contract for 1.1 billion a year for broadcast rights to March Madness. They won't be jeopardizing that any time soon. A back to basics system takes billions out of their pockets too. Pretending the NCAA doesn't have a huge monetary stake in this...

Yea, but where does that money go? It goes back to the schools to support the students and the programs. It's not like the NCAA itself has huge operating expenses. Besides, if you scale the whole thing down and return the athletes to being students first and foremost, you don't need a 1.1 billion dollar TV contract. Their hypocrisy is being called out and they are going to have to choose. Everyone is assuming that they will just start paying players and all I'm saying is that it's possible they go the other direction.

They have 38 million dollars in yearly administrative expenses. We can differ on the extent of huge. I would say that is 38 million reasons they don't want this all to come down. There are 500 employees just at the home office.

That's fine and certainly not chump change. Going skinny on the whole thing would also assume they wouldn't need nearly the overhead for governance, accounting, etc etc but your point is taken.

[gumby]

I always laugh at people who have a problem with performance enhancing drugs. Where do you stop is the question? According to Malcolm Gladwell, over 50% of the students at ivy league schools & employees at silicon valley firms use PEDs. Should we prosecute them like we do athletes?

You have a competition. You have rules. Those who play by the rules should be put at a disadvantage? Those who don't want to harm themselves for life for short-term gain should just skip sports?

"Sorry, this is what you have to do to compete."
"But I don't want a head like a watermelon, severe acne, shriveled up gonads and cancer later in life."
"Sorry, but if you want to compete ..."

Is it against the rules to use PEDs in the Gladwell scenario? No.

If you want to change the rules in sports, OK. In the meantime, it's cheating. Just as spying on another team's practice is cheating. Or spitting on the ball is cheating.

Want to make all of that legal? OK. Level playing field. But ... ugh. Would you want to play? Or have one of your kids play?

'Where do you stop" is a response to a lot of issues. You stop where you think -- as a society -- it makes some sense.

"If we ban heroin and cocaine, where do we stop?" (Therefore, make it all legal?)
"If we ban grenades, where do we stop?" (Zero arms control?)

If I was in this scenario as a parent, would I want my kid to get $150,000 for being a top basketball recruit with no threat of ineligibility? Yeah, maybe I would.

PED's have a separate aspect and debate about the validity of studies and whether they can be used safely. I won't go heavy on that, but dealing with the issue of money in college sports, I would say that there is a very valid argument that were it accepted for players to get these benefits, it would actually be a net positive.

We've been down this road. At some point it would raise the question of why this occurs in conjunction with higher learning (aka -- the mission of the institution) as opposed to a club sport, where they could also get paid and make mom and dad happy.

[YoDeFoe]

(3) Miller gone.
($) Romar in
(5) No NCAA's this year (This will be impressive because even w/o Ayton we could be a FF team, still.)
(6) 2 scholies gone for 2 years
(7) 1 scholie gone for 2 additional years

Do this and I'm still a fan--partially at least.

Why should we put ourselves through the wait. We are already being punished NOW, with no end in sight.

lol ok

Wish this thread stuck to actual news and not what we want to maybe partially justify our fandom.

[ASUHATER!]

Miller and Arizona will, and should do, absolutely nothing different until this plays out. The spotlight will not be on UA forever as it’s already shifting.

If the landscape of the entire sport is blowing up, it would be foolish to do something now. Unless you need an excuse to get rid of a coach. Especially one with a penchant for hookers, infidelity and lying

Exactly. If it's as big and widespread as we think during Miller now would seem to be strange. If every program is involved in this then nearly every coach is as well. It's not like the top 100 programs in the sport are all going to be given the death penalty or banned.

[Beachcat97]

I'm taking some comfort in the fact that we're really first-time offenders here, right? Did Lute ever face any sort of NCAA sanctions? I can't remember. But he went to the tournament for 2+ straight decades, so anything he did was either not caught or not serious. Louisville, on the other hand, they've had it coming.

[CatFanOneMil]

I don't ever recall a person staying silent who was innocent. The program is getting hammered, mocked and abused. Will be forever know as #apayersprogram. (That slogan is a victim, for sure).

Miller needs to say something. Saying nothing looks like calculation. Like he's wondering who knows what and who might flip and who might be loyal and on and on. Like he's weighing his options.

That's what it looks like. If he wants to change that, he needs to act.

IIRC Millers silence in previous stuff was wisdom and somewhat mandated by the rules...

Silence now might actually be prudent as well as required by his contractual commitment to the Administration...he is probably only responding as he is being told to respond...if there are players on board who received money AND scholarships then it is a criminal investigation and he would be required to stay silent.

What previous criminal stuff are you referring to where he was implicated? This is different. His contract states he can't profess innocence of lack of knowledge about criminal matters?

Like to hear more about that.

I'm referring to the way he handled the trier situation last year, there are still rules in place for private information regarding college students, privacy of an under 21 year old is a serious matter and there are very strict laws in place at every institution from banks to hospitals to universities, Miller cannot LEGALLY talk about any issue surrounding an under 21 year olds personal information without direction from the institution he works for, which just so happens to be the State of Arizona if anyone thinks Miller can just waltz out and say anything he wants you don't understand how government works, Miller by definition is a State employee I guarantee there are gag rules in place regarding minors and privacy.

[Spaceman Spiff]

The problem is the NCAA is hellbent on maintaining the essence of amateurism. I don't think they care about how significant their sports programs are in the greater world of athletics. It would be a 'get back to basics' mission, with focus on the educational foundation of the university. The role that the NCAA plays in being the developmental league for pro/olympic sports could be replaced by a glorified/unaffiliated club system...or more likely minor leagues for football/basketball. I don't think it's likely, but it also would not surprise me one bit either if they blew it up.

The NCAA has a tv contract for 1.1 billion a year for broadcast rights to March Madness. They won't be jeopardizing that any time soon. A back to basics system takes billions out of their pockets too. Pretending the NCAA doesn't have a huge monetary stake in this...

Yea, but where does that money go? It goes back to the schools to support the students and the programs. It's not like the NCAA itself has huge operating expenses. Besides, if you scale the whole thing down and return the athletes to being students first and foremost, you don't need a 1.1 billion dollar TV contract. Their hypocrisy is being called out and they are going to have to choose. Everyone is assuming that they will just start paying players and all I'm saying is that it's possible they go the other direction.

They have 38 million dollars in yearly administrative expenses. We can differ on the extent of huge. I would say that is 38 million reasons they don't want this all to come down. There are 500 employees just at the home office.

That's fine and certainly not chump change. Going skinny on the whole thing would also assume they wouldn't need nearly the overhead for governance, accounting, etc etc but your point is taken.

I wasn't trying to be a jerk to you, sorry if that was a short response. My only point is that the people who will investigate violations and the direction of the NCAA have their own careers riding on this. If it turns into the sort of small, collegial thing it was in the 30's, those people are looking for work.

I've always felt the NCAA has a vested interest in maximizing the appearance of purity while allowing enough leeway that they can charge a ton for TV rights to the product. If they turn the level of comeptition back to HS level...well, I can't find the contract amount ESPN paid for the Dick's tourney, but it ain't 1.1 billion.

[YoDeFoe]

I'm taking some comfort in the fact that we're really first-time offenders here, right? Did Lute ever face any sort of NCAA sanctions? I can't remember. But he went to the tournament for 2+ straight decades, so anything he did was either not caught or not serious. Louisville, on the other hand, they've had it coming.

We had those 19 vacated wins at the end of his career. I think that's our only violation, ever.

[Beachcat97]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... 3Br6pTVbSQ

[rgdeuce]

and one last thing, how do you guys think i know all the inside information i know? is it because you think i talk to Sean Miller everyday? or that Greg Byrne and Jim Livengood used to call me and tell me that Stanley Johnson was going to commit, or Aaron Gordon was coming to Arizona or that Chase Budinger was going to stay for his Jr year or that Sean Miller met with our main booster in Santa Fe or that John Calipari convinced Miller to come to AZ?

no

Dammit, thanks for shattering my worldview

It may never fully come into the public light, but this shit pales in comparison to how things are really run in the political world, hollywood, wall street, etc., and how long it has been going on for. Most countries too. The entire world would melt down and there would be mass chaos and war if the commonfolk really knew what the powerful people do.

Eh, I'm not sure how shocking it really would be, at least to me. Buying influence with talented people is old as time.

I just spoke about this with a friend. A kid like De'Andre Ayton is a few years from a 150 million plus contract. Everyone knows it. If a management agency gets a cut of that one contract for that one kid, the owner is set for life.

You can't have that amount of money at stake and not have people trying to buy influence. It just isn't possible. Getting in on the ground floor of a top HS prospect is an investment with a crazy rate of return.

No my dude. I'm talking WAY more illicit and deviant. Child trafficking, murder, controlling and oppressing the masses, mind control, etc. Huge names from both parties

[Hank of sb]

FUCK THAT!

We have the playbook. Play nice initially. Delay hearings/decisions. Delay again. Delay again. Oh hearing is set for April 15th? Great. Take slap on the wrist punishment. Once that's handed down, sue in court.

But lol that shit you said, FUCK THAT NOISE.

Just my opinion. This--the above-- is why Arizona continues to be 150th best university in the US. Or worse.

We had a great bb program 30 hours ago. But things changed overnight. It won't be fun till we fess up. Sanctioning ourselves, along the lines I suggested (with zero guarantees additonal sanctions won't come) seems like a great idea.

But perhaps only to me.

[CatFanOneMil]

Honestly I'm not drinking the cool-aid, I seriously doubt EVERY school does this and I seriously doubt ALL shoe companies do this, yes some do, but I think it's always an rogue individual involved...Book threw away his life for a few thousand bucks, that is simply stupid on PED's, I basically think most people are good, most people are not greedy to the point of trashing other people and major institutions may have problems but it is not everyone doing this shit...Mark Few of Gonzaga comes to mind.

[azpenguin]

At some point it would raise the question of why this occurs in conjunction with higher learning (aka -- the mission of the institution) as opposed to a club sport, where they could also get paid and make mom and dad happy.

It's just the evolution of things for over 100 years. Colleges have always had a bunch of young, bored, athletic guys who want to play sports. Football was the first major college sport. With the way the rules were back then, college campuses were about the only place you'd find enough guys crazy enough to want to play the game. The game evolved but the model never did, and as more and more money got involved, there was no way they were ever going to separate the sports from the institutions. I don't know what the end result will be with all of this, but with all of the money being made in college athletics, change will not be quick.

[Spaceman Spiff]

At some point it would raise the question of why this occurs in conjunction with higher learning (aka -- the mission of the institution) as opposed to a club sport, where they could also get paid and make mom and dad happy.

It's just the evolution of things for over 100 years. Colleges have always had a bunch of young, bored, athletic guys who want to play sports. Football was the first major college sport. With the way the rules were back then, college campuses were about the only place you'd find enough guys crazy enough to want to play the game. The game evolved but the model never did, and as more and more money got involved, there was no way they were ever going to separate the sports from the institutions. I don't know what the end result will be with all of this, but with all of the money being made in college athletics, change will not be quick.

There are thousands of university employees (if not hundreds of thousands) whose livelihoods are dependent on the modern system of NCAA athletics. There are many people with a vested interest in seeing the system stay alive at schools, the NCAA, etc.

This isn't just rooting out corruption in the outside sources. It's a meal ticket for people at every level inside and outside of educational institutions, none of whom really want any "change" to result in them losing employment.

We are on the verge of a tipping point. It's like Indiana Jones. We're not just passing through history, this is history.

[rgdeuce]

every top 50 program for the last 25 years has paid for the vast majority of their top players.

the top, top programs pay for a much higher percentage due to the fact that they get a higher percentage of top players -- its been a know practice and somewhat accepted for as long as i can remember, and yes, Arizona is right there with the best of them.

the programs with the pedigree, resources, and willingness to "do what it takes" have had the clear advantage in landing the top stars.

where this falls on Adidas is that they have long been cornered with direct benefits to the teams they sponsor, whereas other programs like Arizona have had a deft process and tight secrecy.

Book exposed Arizona thru a channel it has never used, Adidas, for his own personal greed and gain -- not to mention 5k...and therein lies where all Arizona fans should be infuriated, fucking Book Richardson did this for 5k, 5 fucking k, and did so by going outside of the model that was so effective and un-penetrable up to this point.

so, its not about if the teams cheat, its how they cheat, and Arizona did it as good or better than anyone.

and one last thing, how do you guys think i know all the inside information i know? is it because you think i talk to Sean Miller everyday? or that Greg Byrne and Jim Livengood used to call me and tell me that Stanley Johnson was going to commit, or Aaron Gordon was coming to Arizona or that Chase Budinger was going to stay for his Jr year or that Sean Miller met with our main booster in Santa Fe or that John Calipari convinced Miller to come to AZ?

no, its because the web of involvement of people not directly affiliated with the program are intertwined in the mix, they are the ones who pull the strings and cover the man holes, and its like that at every school that handles their business effectively at this level.

its the darkest kept secret of of a 1000 or so people around the country at various universities who are not employees or staff members who are vital to the culture of college basketball today, and that culture is a culture of greed and billions and billions of dollars on the line.... from CBS and FOX to ESPN and Adidas and NIKE and Under Armor and Foot Locker and McDonalds and on and on and on.....

I'm not sure why the bluster of last night holds true now--you know Miller was ahead of things. It doesn't seem he was ahead of anything.

If anything, since the whole truth will (has?) gotten out, the best thing to do is fire Miller, impose 2 years of sanctions along with 2 scholarships and encourage the NCAA to add more if they think its necessary, and ASAP. The sooner we get on with things the sooner we can feel better about this....and ourselves.

Further, we now know there is a current team player who has a relative in receipt of money. What's the hold up there? That player should already be off the team.

I agree with those here who ask what's the point?

For me, I can't see one anymore.

Why fire Miller when pretty much every successful college basketball coach does the exact same thing. Clearly paying athletes and all this other shady shit became a necessity to have success and keep your job. Who would u replace him with when theres probably a plethora of shady coaches below the collegiate level and most of the D1 coaches are involved in the same stuff? You also gotta believe Arizona would be stupid to even offer imposing self sanctions until the dust settles - is the NCAA really going to put every top 50 program on probation and do tournament bans?

It seems we need to come to terms with the fact that everyone is getting dragged into this. There will be no winners, and hopefully it leads to things getting cleaned up, until they find another way, rinse, repeat.

As for Miller being ahead of things, purely speculation on my part, but say the FBI came around w questions bc of Book (or even before then), would it not bode well if Miller, with his knowledge and candor, said look, FBI, here is the deal, and laid the entire blueprints and inner workings of what really goes down? You help the FBI take down the big guys, they take care of you. The more you help and if it leads to convictions, the better

First, everyone won't be dragged into this. This (hope) is a pipe dream. If anything, we have already seen every program that will be "caught." The fact that the FBI is subpoenaing Nike and UA means little, IMO. Why? Arizona got caught on tape, red-handed. That's akin to Marion Barry getting caught in a hotel room paying cash for cocaine. Yes, Arizona looks that lame and will be one of 5/6/7 programs put front-and-center as an example.

As for Miller and the excuse he was doing what everyone does, see above. Everyone does it, yes, but everyone doesn't get caught. As for the excuse, Book went rogue. Yes, Book went rogue but at this point, so what? Bottom line: we got caught because of Miller's staff; we are now paying for that and the cost will only grow if Miller stays. He's permanently tainted.

Self governing oneself shows the university is embarrassed. As I am. We should do some things just on principle. Here they are:

(1) Apologize first.
(2) The player whose relative took money.... gone.
(3) Miller gone.
($) Romar in
(5) No NCAA's this year (This will be impressive because even w/o Ayton we could be a FF team, still.)
(6) 2 scholies gone for 2 years
(7) 1 scholie gone for 2 additional years

Do this and I'm still a fan--partially at least.

Why should we put ourselves through the wait. We are already being punished NOW, with no end in sight.

Based on our super reliable source here, and plenty of super reliable sources on social media, no, not every program will be directly dragged in, but enough will to at least show the world this isnt 7, 15 or even 30 schools.

We and these schools mean nothing to the FBI outside of evidence, possible cooperation and testimony in court. Thats it. That means we and other schools and coaches, as seen yesterday, will have names pop up in indictments. 7 got dragged into it for Adidas so far, guess what happens when Nike and Under Armour get their lids blown off? Wont be the same 7. All Book and everyone else is is low hanging fruit you need to put pressure on to bring down the big fish. You put pressure on them by prosecuting. There will be plenty more.

Lets face it dude, college basketball as u know it was completely turned upside down. What you believed was a reality couldnt have been further from the truth. You say you want Romar to replace Miller without thinking aboot the fact that Romar very likely was doing the same shit. Am I supposed to believe now that Washington, not even a top 15 program, was able to pull Otto Porter and Markelle Fultz and everything was in the up and up? Youre nuts. There has been enough knowledge dropped in here saying like Miller, a guy like Romar is one of 100, maybe even more.

Quite frankly, this whole thing is disgusting, but so is life, so is business, so is politics. Very little in this world is pure and what we perceive it to be. I understand where u and some others are coming from, I wish things were pure. But the reality is, they arent, and we all just got a taste of how things really are in college basketball. At the end of the day, we just gotta buck up and enjoy the ride and see how far the wind carries our belived program and the sport in general. What else can you do as a fan? I mean, some of have thousands invested in season tickets and to me, there isnt much better in life than taking my boys to see the games. That's a lot of financial and emotional uncertainty, but u have to keep plugging on.

[CalStateTempe]

every top 50 program for the last 25 years has paid for the vast majority of their top players.

the top, top programs pay for a much higher percentage due to the fact that they get a higher percentage of top players -- its been a know practice and somewhat accepted for as long as i can remember, and yes, Arizona is right there with the best of them.

the programs with the pedigree, resources, and willingness to "do what it takes" have had the clear advantage in landing the top stars.

where this falls on Adidas is that they have long been cornered with direct benefits to the teams they sponsor, whereas other programs like Arizona have had a deft process and tight secrecy.

Book exposed Arizona thru a channel it has never used, Adidas, for his own personal greed and gain -- not to mention 5k...and therein lies where all Arizona fans should be infuriated, fucking Book Richardson did this for 5k, 5 fucking k, and did so by going outside of the model that was so effective and un-penetrable up to this point.

so, its not about if the teams cheat, its how they cheat, and Arizona did it as good or better than anyone.

and one last thing, how do you guys think i know all the inside information i know? is it because you think i talk to Sean Miller everyday? or that Greg Byrne and Jim Livengood used to call me and tell me that Stanley Johnson was going to commit, or Aaron Gordon was coming to Arizona or that Chase Budinger was going to stay for his Jr year or that Sean Miller met with our main booster in Santa Fe or that John Calipari convinced Miller to come to AZ?

no, its because the web of involvement of people not directly affiliated with the program are intertwined in the mix, they are the ones who pull the strings and cover the man holes, and its like that at every school that handles their business effectively at this level.

its the darkest kept secret of of a 1000 or so people around the country at various universities who are not employees or staff members who are vital to the culture of college basketball today, and that culture is a culture of greed and billions and billions of dollars on the line.... from CBS and FOX to ESPN and Adidas and NIKE and Under Armor and Foot Locker and McDonalds and on and on and on.....

I'm not sure why the bluster of last night holds true now--you know Miller was ahead of things. It doesn't seem he was ahead of anything.

If anything, since the whole truth will (has?) gotten out, the best thing to do is fire Miller, impose 2 years of sanctions along with 2 scholarships and encourage the NCAA to add more if they think its necessary, and ASAP. The sooner we get on with things the sooner we can feel better about this....and ourselves.

Further, we now know there is a current team player who has a relative in receipt of money. What's the hold up there? That player should already be off the team.

I agree with those here who ask what's the point?

For me, I can't see one anymore.

Why fire Miller when pretty much every successful college basketball coach does the exact same thing. Clearly paying athletes and all this other shady shit became a necessity to have success and keep your job. Who would u replace him with when theres probably a plethora of shady coaches below the collegiate level and most of the D1 coaches are involved in the same stuff? You also gotta believe Arizona would be stupid to even offer imposing self sanctions until the dust settles - is the NCAA really going to put every top 50 program on probation and do tournament bans?

It seems we need to come to terms with the fact that everyone is getting dragged into this. There will be no winners, and hopefully it leads to things getting cleaned up, until they find another way, rinse, repeat.

As for Miller being ahead of things, purely speculation on my part, but say the FBI came around w questions bc of Book (or even before then), would it not bode well if Miller, with his knowledge and candor, said look, FBI, here is the deal, and laid the entire blueprints and inner workings of what really goes down? You help the FBI take down the big guys, they take care of you. The more you help and if it leads to convictions, the better

First, everyone won't be dragged into this. This (hope) is a pipe dream. If anything, we have already seen every program that will be "caught." The fact that the FBI is subpoenaing Nike and UA means little, IMO. Why? Arizona got caught on tape, red-handed. That's akin to Marion Barry getting caught in a hotel room paying cash for cocaine. Yes, Arizona looks that lame and will be one of 5/6/7 programs put front-and-center as an example.

As for Miller and the excuse he was doing what everyone does, see above. Everyone does it, yes, but everyone doesn't get caught. As for the excuse, Book went rogue. Yes, Book went rogue but at this point, so what? Bottom line: we got caught because of Miller's staff; we are now paying for that and the cost will only grow if Miller stays. He's permanently tainted.

Self governing oneself shows the university is embarrassed. As I am. We should do some things just on principle. Here they are:

(1) Apologize first.
(2) The player whose relative took money.... gone.
(3) Miller gone.
($) Romar in
(5) No NCAA's this year (This will be impressive because even w/o Ayton we could be a FF team, still.)
(6) 2 scholies gone for 2 years
(7) 1 scholie gone for 2 additional years

Do this and I'm still a fan--partially at least.

Why should we put ourselves through the wait. We are already being punished NOW, with no end in sight.

FUCK THAT!

We have the playbook. Play nice initially. Delay hearings/decisions. Delay again. Delay again. Oh hearing is set for April 15th? Great. Take slap on the wrist punishment. Once that's handed down, sue in court.

But lol that shit you said, FUCK THAT NOISE.

SCC:

THATS the Carolina Way! See academic fraud as the playbook.

[rgdeuce]

Honestly I'm not drinking the cool-aid, I seriously doubt EVERY school does this and I seriously doubt ALL shoe companies do this, yes some do, but I think it's always an rogue individual involved...Book threw away his life for a few thousand bucks, that is simply stupid on PED's, I basically think most people are good, most people are not greedy to the point of trashing other people and major institutions may have problems but it is not everyone doing this shit...Mark Few of Gonzaga comes to mind.

Why play for Mark Few as a grad transfer when you could go to school X Y and Z and make a nice amount of cash as a one-year rental? Theyve had quite a bit of NBA talent rolling through those parts and landed some nice recruits lately.

[azgreg]

Yep, I'm not getting shit done today.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Honestly I'm not drinking the cool-aid, I seriously doubt EVERY school does this and I seriously doubt ALL shoe companies do this, yes some do, but I think it's always an rogue individual involved...Book threw away his life for a few thousand bucks, that is simply stupid on PED's, I basically think most people are good, most people are not greedy to the point of trashing other people and major institutions may have problems but it is not everyone doing this shit...Mark Few of Gonzaga comes to mind.

Why play for Mark Few as a grad transfer when you could go to school X Y and Z and make a nice amount of cash as a one-year rental? Theyve had quite a bit of NBA talent rolling through those parts and landed some nice recruits lately.

A guy like Mark Few (or Sean Miller) doesn't have to drive it. They just have to not stop it. Some of this is going on when players are 12-13 years old.

[CatFanOneMil]

Honestly I'm not drinking the cool-aid, I seriously doubt EVERY school does this and I seriously doubt ALL shoe companies do this, yes some do, but I think it's always an rogue individual involved...Book threw away his life for a few thousand bucks, that is simply stupid on PED's, I basically think most people are good, most people are not greedy to the point of trashing other people and major institutions may have problems but it is not everyone doing this shit...Mark Few of Gonzaga comes to mind.

Why play for Mark Few as a grad transfer when you could go to school X Y and Z and make a nice amount of cash as a one-year rental? Theyve had quite a bit of NBA talent rolling through those parts and landed some nice recruits lately.

I dunno call me an optimist, I really don't think this is as bad as everyone wants to make it, it borders on all those typical conspiracy stories that everyone repeats but end up being just so much noise.

It's the FBI fer crying out loud the fact that they said "We have your play book" is almost an admission of weakness on their part, if they ACTUALLY had the playbook and hard evidence they would not need to make such statements, they would simply make more arrests...as it is the first shoe to drop with the FBI is usually the biggest and smelliest and very seldom does it get worse as it goes along...

Is it bad that Book took and pushed bribes? Absolutely and he went to jail and had to post bond, but its not like he had to post half a mil, he had to come up with $5k...which he HAD in bribe money...if this was as bad as people are trying to make it (meaning Miller and most NCAA Div1 schools are doing this shit) Book would either be on a hit list or still in jail...he's not.

[dmjcat]

Curse Hank of Sb all you want but he is closer to reality than most here are.

Bottom line is that the UA was caught on Tape.........not Kentucky, Duke, or UCLA. The NCAA is going to throw the 6/7 teams who were caught red handed under the bus........period. The only question is when will the NCAA get around to it?? This year or next??? My guess:

1) Paid player suspended (if they can figure out who he is)
2) No 2018 PAC12 tournament (Does anyone here really think that Larry Scott is going to forgive UA/Miller?)
3) No NCAA tournament (2018)
4) Loss of multiple scholarships for several years

And if thats all we get......we will be lucky.

We are not Duke.......we are (in the eyes of the NCAA) UNLV in Tucson.
Most everyone else on this board is seriously rationalizing

[SCCats]

SCC:

THATS the Carolina Way! See academic fraud as the playbook.

What I would say is the NCAA itself has shown us that that is the path to the best result.

[Olsondogg]

Curse Hank of Sb all you want but he is closer to reality than most here are.

Bottom line is that the UA was caught on Tape.........not Kentucky, Duke, or UCLA. The NCAA is going to throw the 6/7 teams who were caught red handed under the bus........period. The only question is when will the NCAA get around to it?? This year or next??? My guess:

1) Paid player suspended (if they can figure out who he is)
2) No 2018 PAC12 tournament (Does anyone here really think that Larry Scott is going to forgive UA/Miller?)
3) No NCAA tournament (2018)
4) Loss of multiple scholarships for several years

And if thats all we get......we will be lucky.

We are not Duke.......we are (in the eyes of the NCAA) UNLV in Tucson.

People who write like this are acting like this scandal is over instead of just beginning.

[Gilbertcat]

Been thinking. Obviously this is bad. But its the NCAA. They only know what they know. So we cant assume they will dig up more dirt unless tipped off. I think it will look similar to other cases.

1 Year Post Season Ban
Players involved ineligble
XYZ fine
Repayment of money received
Possible Miller suspension for games
Loss of one or two scholarships.
Recruiting penalties regarding visits.
Loss of wins and or pac title.

Not happy. I believe it happens everywhere. Book was just dumb enough to get caught. It will be hard to recover but it will happen. Ultimately Arizona Basketball makes a ton of money for others. Tournaments, home teams selling out. Money will talk in the long run.

Most of my ideas happened from other cases. Of course not every school gets punished the same way.
https://www.seccountry.com/mississippi/ ... ccept-them" target="_blank

[dmjcat]

Curse Hank of Sb all you want but he is closer to reality than most here are.

Bottom line is that the UA was caught on Tape.........not Kentucky, Duke, or UCLA. The NCAA is going to throw the 6/7 teams who were caught red handed under the bus........period. The only question is when will the NCAA get around to it?? This year or next??? My guess:

1) Paid player suspended (if they can figure out who he is)
2) No 2018 PAC12 tournament (Does anyone here really think that Larry Scott is going to forgive UA/Miller?)
3) No NCAA tournament (2018)
4) Loss of multiple scholarships for several years

And if thats all we get......we will be lucky.

We are not Duke.......we are (in the eyes of the NCAA) UNLV in Tucson.

People who write like this are acting like this scandal is over instead of just beginning.

Baloney. It IS over as far as the UA is concerned (unless Miller is implicated). There were only a handful of schools that were caught red-handed by the FBI........the other 200+ or so Div. 1 schools were not. Duke/Kentucky/everyone else are not going to suddenly stand up and proclaim to the world that they are guilty as hell too.........they will keep their mouth shut. The NCAA has a finite number of investigators and resources. They will simply shoot the handful of teams on tape. There may very well be some new regulations regarding agents/shoe companies that will come down but thats it. You, and a lot of others here, are rationalizing/dreaming. The UA is going to get Whacked, pure and simple.

[Olsondogg]

I am not rationlaizing nor dreaming. I am listening and reading those that actually know something. When reporters use terms like "tip of the iceberg" and when AAU programs are getting raided...and when the FBI is in multiple college towns, I tend to think that something is bigger than the 4 assistant coaches that were arrested.

But don't let me stop you from your awesome analysis of an ongoing situation.

[Jefe]

And that's why I say Fuck Book. This could have been a whole bunch of schools not named Arizona but he needed some scratch for a bottle of Popov.

But in the investigation, it could have come out how much we have been paying players...

Books court date set for October 10th. Does he squeal?

Richardson appeared in front of Magistrate Judge D. Thomas Ferraro wearing a red T-shirt emblazoned with "New Orleans Basketball" and a pair of black athletic shorts. His next court appearance is scheduled for Oct. 10 in New York.

The prosecutor asked Ferraro for a $100,000 bond, but defense attorney Brick Storts said that was "totally unreasonable," after which Ferraro agreed to the lower bond.

Outside of court, Storts said UA "has nothing to do with it."

[baycat93]

Curse Hank of Sb all you want but he is closer to reality than most here are.

Bottom line is that the UA was caught on Tape.........not Kentucky, Duke, or UCLA. The NCAA is going to throw the 6/7 teams who were caught red handed under the bus........period. The only question is when will the NCAA get around to it?? This year or next??? My guess:

1) Paid player suspended (if they can figure out who he is)
2) No 2018 PAC12 tournament (Does anyone here really think that Larry Scott is going to forgive UA/Miller?)
3) No NCAA tournament (2018)
4) Loss of multiple scholarships for several years

And if thats all we get......we will be lucky.

We are not Duke.......we are (in the eyes of the NCAA) UNLV in Tucson.

People who write like this are acting like this scandal is over instead of just beginning.

Baloney. It IS over as far as the UA is concerned (unless Miller is implicated). There were only a handful of schools that were caught red-handed by the FBI........the other 200+ or so Div. 1 schools were not. Duke/Kentucky/everyone else are not going to suddenly stand up and proclaim to the world that they are guilty as hell too.........they will keep their mouth shut. The NCAA has a finite number of investigators and resources. They will simply shoot the handful of teams on tape. There may very well be some new regulations regarding agents/shoe companies that will come down but thats it. You, and a lot of others here, are rationalizing/dreaming. The UA is going to get Whacked, pure and simple.

The NCAA has not even started an investigation. This is the FBI and they have the power of subpoena. TOTALLY different situations. I doubt the NCAA even begins until the FBI runs its course for awhile.

[Gilbertcat]

I would argue that we didnt know anything about this 48 hours ago. It was a secret FBI sting over two years. So now to assume everyone is getting raided and more info comes out soon would seem odd vs how it was handled in the past. NCAA is to small to look into everything. Change in the future would have to come though. Its just not every school is going to be dragged through the dirt.

[jsbowl16]

Auburn is refunding season tickets.

[Olsondogg]

I would argue that we didnt know anything about this 48 hours ago. It was a secret FBI sting over two years. So now to assume everyone is getting raided and more info comes out soon would seem odd vs how it was handled in the past. NCAA is to small to look into everything. Change in the future would have to come though. Its just not every school is going to be dragged through the dirt.

I would argue that the FBI released the info that they wanted you to know, or that they indicted who they needed to move forward in another direction...

I mean people really think this is done and the NCAA is moving in now? The fucking last thing the NCAA wanted was this...

[CalStateTempe]

Book is represented by Brick?

"Throw the Brick at him!" Or is it book? I don't know anymore.

[gumby]

He has a platform to elaborate on this. If he doesn't, it's just whining.

How much to land you, JWill?

[gumby]

This sore just keeps oozing.

[Gilbertcat]

I agree that the FBI gave a firm no comment when asked if more people would be involved. This is a big ticket item for them. Small amounts compared to other crimes but a big headline getter. I wouldnt doubt they can find more info but announcing it probably froze others from doing it so unless the FBI has the dirt already, they would be relying on documents from the past. The NCAA is only going to be looking at the info they have seen. Not sure if the FBI would hand over additional information in regards to other areas to the NCAA.

[gumby]

Curse Hank of Sb all you want but he is closer to reality than most here are.

Bottom line is that the UA was caught on Tape.........not Kentucky, Duke, or UCLA. The NCAA is going to throw the 6/7 teams who were caught red handed under the bus........period. The only question is when will the NCAA get around to it?? This year or next??? My guess:

1) Paid player suspended (if they can figure out who he is)
2) No 2018 PAC12 tournament (Does anyone here really think that Larry Scott is going to forgive UA/Miller?)
3) No NCAA tournament (2018)
4) Loss of multiple scholarships for several years

And if thats all we get......we will be lucky.

We are not Duke.......we are (in the eyes of the NCAA) UNLV in Tucson.

People who write like this are acting like this scandal is over instead of just beginning.

Baloney. It IS over as far as the UA is concerned (unless Miller is implicated). There were only a handful of schools that were caught red-handed by the FBI........the other 200+ or so Div. 1 schools were not. Duke/Kentucky/everyone else are not going to suddenly stand up and proclaim to the world that they are guilty as hell too.........they will keep their mouth shut. The NCAA has a finite number of investigators and resources. They will simply shoot the handful of teams on tape. There may very well be some new regulations regarding agents/shoe companies that will come down but thats it. You, and a lot of others here, are rationalizing/dreaming. The UA is going to get Whacked, pure and simple.

The NCAA has not even started an investigation. This is the FBI and they have the power of subpoena. TOTALLY different situations. I doubt the NCAA even begins until the FBI runs its course for awhile.

Right. Doubt there will be penalties this season. We do need to get rid of players that would cause records to be expunged.

Grab the popcorn. Get the refillable bucket.

[phxcat23]

The problem is the NCAA is hellbent on maintaining the essence of amateurism. I don't think they care about how significant their sports programs are in the greater world of athletics. It would be a 'get back to basics' mission, with focus on the educational foundation of the university. The role that the NCAA plays in being the developmental league for pro/olympic sports could be replaced by a glorified/unaffiliated club system...or more likely minor leagues for football/basketball. I don't think it's likely, but it also would not surprise me one bit either if they blew it up.

The NCAA has a tv contract for 1.1 billion a year for broadcast rights to March Madness. They won't be jeopardizing that any time soon. A back to basics system takes billions out of their pockets too. Pretending the NCAA doesn't have a huge monetary stake in this...

Yea, but where does that money go? It goes back to the schools to support the students and the programs. It's not like the NCAA itself has huge operating expenses. Besides, if you scale the whole thing down and return the athletes to being students first and foremost, you don't need a 1.1 billion dollar TV contract. Their hypocrisy is being called out and they are going to have to choose. Everyone is assuming that they will just start paying players and all I'm saying is that it's possible they go the other direction.

I can't say that very much money is going back to schools to support students and the programs. Just last year our athletics department had a deficit of around 3 mil. Several other universities are probably having to make up for their lack of athletics profits. I was listening to College Sports Tonight on my way home yesterday, and they were discussing how the one way all of this would be fixed is if we had club teams like in Europe and other parts of the world. However, like many have pointed out, there is way too much money on the line for that drastic of a change. Guess we'll see the true character of the NCAA and Universities once the dust starts to settle.

[Longhorned]

I would argue that we didnt know anything about this 48 hours ago. It was a secret FBI sting over two years. So now to assume everyone is getting raided and more info comes out soon would seem odd vs how it was handled in the past. NCAA is to small to look into everything. Change in the future would have to come though. Its just not every school is going to be dragged through the dirt.

I would argue that the FBI released the info that they wanted you to know, or that they indicted who they needed to move forward in another direction...

I mean people really think this is done and the NCAA is moving in now? The fucking last thing the NCAA wanted was this...

This is reasonable. The FBI isn't in the business of releasing information for dramatic impact, or in this case to do maximum damage to college basketball. They've made very clear that this is just the beginning of a longer process where a lot of cooperation is expected. This is about illegally unreported exchanges of cash at a scale that's incommensurable with the amount they've indicated so far.

[dmjcat]

Curse Hank of Sb all you want but he is closer to reality than most here are.

Bottom line is that the UA was caught on Tape.........not Kentucky, Duke, or UCLA. The NCAA is going to throw the 6/7 teams who were caught red handed under the bus........period. The only question is when will the NCAA get around to it?? This year or next??? My guess:

1) Paid player suspended (if they can figure out who he is)
2) No 2018 PAC12 tournament (Does anyone here really think that Larry Scott is going to forgive UA/Miller?)
3) No NCAA tournament (2018)
4) Loss of multiple scholarships for several years

And if thats all we get......we will be lucky.

We are not Duke.......we are (in the eyes of the NCAA) UNLV in Tucson.

People who write like this are acting like this scandal is over instead of just beginning.

Baloney. It IS over as far as the UA is concerned (unless Miller is implicated). There were only a handful of schools that were caught red-handed by the FBI........the other 200+ or so Div. 1 schools were not. Duke/Kentucky/everyone else are not going to suddenly stand up and proclaim to the world that they are guilty as hell too.........they will keep their mouth shut. The NCAA has a finite number of investigators and resources. They will simply shoot the handful of teams on tape. There may very well be some new regulations regarding agents/shoe companies that will come down but thats it. You, and a lot of others here, are rationalizing/dreaming. The UA is going to get Whacked, pure and simple.

The NCAA has not even started an investigation. This is the FBI and they have the power of subpoena. TOTALLY different situations. I doubt the NCAA even begins until the FBI runs its course for awhile.

Agree on all points...........BUT, when they do get around to investigating (and they will) the UA's transgressions are on freaking tape. We WILL be shot. The only question is when. My guess is we will not be allowed to play in the Tourney this year.......it would be really, really bad optics.

[rgdeuce]

Curse Hank of Sb all you want but he is closer to reality than most here are.

Bottom line is that the UA was caught on Tape.........not Kentucky, Duke, or UCLA. The NCAA is going to throw the 6/7 teams who were caught red handed under the bus........period. The only question is when will the NCAA get around to it?? This year or next??? My guess:

1) Paid player suspended (if they can figure out who he is)
2) No 2018 PAC12 tournament (Does anyone here really think that Larry Scott is going to forgive UA/Miller?)
3) No NCAA tournament (2018)
4) Loss of multiple scholarships for several years

And if thats all we get......we will be lucky.

We are not Duke.......we are (in the eyes of the NCAA) UNLV in Tucson.
Most everyone else on this board is seriously rationalizing

The NCAA has no power in deciding who the FBI goes after and recommends to the DOJ. This investigatiom has been going on for three years and if u think in three years, Book was one of a small handful caught up in this you are crazy. Book literally got caught up at the tail end of that three years. I can guarantee you this wont be the only conspiracy that gets charged, or even one of a few. We dont know what the FBI has and doesnt have, but I can tell u for certain they didnt spend three years to nab seven guys and will now focus all their attention on Adidas. You dont sneak shit by the FBI, especially when they are bringing down people you tegularly have electronic and face to face interactions with fairly regularly. These guys all know each other and what they do. They may not work w them, but they do work w people who do the same thing. They are at all these showcases, AAU events, big high school games, camps, etc, right along with the FBI agents snapping pictures of them, mingling with them and taking notes.

In my time here and on the old board, 97 has been spot on on everything short of one or two last-minute recruitments that took a wild turn at the end. Given what he has explained in here, it makes sense why those one or two were misses. Add to that the stuff many prominent CBB personalities are saying, yeah, I'm inclined to believe 97 is spot on as usual. The dots all connect and common sense can fill in most of the rest.