let's talk '18

[Spaceman Spiff]

[RichardCranium]

I know there’s like zero reason to expect JB to end up a Wildcat, but why the f would he go to Nevada? Reminds me a little of Zimmerman choosing UNLV over better programs.

Totally agree. At least UNLV had a legacy of some regard and Zimmerman was a LV native. It is unclear why JB would find Nevada more appealing than an elite program.

Maybe he likes skiing?

[SunnyAZ]

watching all the BIL stuff (scrimmage, game, and 1v1) gotta say Little is a monster, Cherry is soft, Akinjo would have been a solid backup plan to BWill, the guy that is going to USC next year is a freak athlete and looks like a really good player, Shareef leaving is fine (always have felt this way)

[Chicat]

Lotta salty bitch-ass Zags fans on social media.

Good

[zonagrad]

Lotta salty bitch-ass Zags fans on social media.

Good

Zags & Ducks never would have had a chance at BW if it wasn't for Schlabach & ESPN.

Miller has been incredible. Hopefully he has a restful summer and is reinvigorated with his recruiting success.

[Beachcat97]

Lotta salty bitch-ass Zags fans on social media.

Good

That makes zero sense. They’re a top 10 team next year, and we’ll have to scrape/claw just to get into the tourney. Zags are getting greedy.

[scumdevils86]

Oh damn. Traveled 10 hours today from rural Wisconsin back to Tucson and totally missed out. Awesome

[zonagrad]

Lotta salty bitch-ass Zags fans on social media.

Good

That makes zero sense. They’re a top 10 team next year, and we’ll have to scrape/claw just to get into the tourney. Zags are getting greedy.

I'm growing to dislike their program because they play such a shit schedule in a shit conference. It's the equivalent of Arizona playing Washington State 15 times in a season.

[zonagrad]

One more little nugget I just read about the Brandon Williams recruitment. Tad Boyle and Colorado tried to get involved late in the process.

So Williams visited ASU --- and they didn't even make the final cut.

Visited Gonzaga and Oregon.

And chose Arizona. I'd say Williams is helping "vindicate" Miller. Nice.

[goslingswagg]

Lotta salty bitch-ass Zags fans on social media.

Good

That makes zero sense. They’re a top 10 team next year, and we’ll have to scrape/claw just to get into the tourney. Zags are getting greedy.

Disagree, think we’re legit PAC12 contenders, and imo favorites with a Jordan Brown commitment.

[Beachcat97]

Jordan Brown Watch 2018 begins...NOW.

[CalStateTempe]

This is awesome news. Really happy for the program.

[CalStateTempe]

Is he the point guard that is promised?

[Beachcat97]

Lotta salty bitch-ass Zags fans on social media.

Good

That makes zero sense. They’re a top 10 team next year, and we’ll have to scrape/claw just to get into the tourney. Zags are getting greedy.

Disagree, think we’re legit PAC12 contenders, and imo favorites with a Jordan Brown commitment.

I’d still give an edge to Oregon, even if JB comes to AZ. That Duck frontcourt is loaded.

[ASUHATER!]

this is one of the most loaded classes coming into the pac 12 ever next season. arizona, asu, ucla, oregon and usc all have top 20ish classes coming in. even with BW it is far from certain that we'll be the best team in the conference, even a top 2-3 team. at this point all we know is that we won't be as awful as we looked to be a month ago and that we are a tournament level team with the roster.

[pc in NM]

Lotta salty bitch-ass Zags fans on social media.

Good

That makes zero sense. They’re a top 10 team next year, and we’ll have to scrape/claw just to get into the tourney. Zags are getting greedy.

That’s never happened to a program that’s risen from the middle of the pack (PAC??) before, I’m sure!!!

[YoDeFoe]

Didn’t believe. Amazing

Believe it Yo. We ain’t going down without a fight.

Very much appreciate you keeping the faith.

[YoDeFoe]

I really don't get why Brown wouldn't take his last official visit with Arizona, given that we're in his final three. Logically that doesn't make a ton of sense to me... and unlike Cal, who he also hasn't taken an official visit to, we're not in his backyard - he could use the Zona sponsored official to get here.

What's the hold up? What's the harm in taking it?

[ChooChooCat]

I really don't get why Brown wouldn't take his last official visit with Arizona, given that we're in his final three. Logically that doesn't make a ton of sense to me... and unlike Cal, who he also hasn't taken an official visit to, we're not in his backyard - he could use the Zona sponsored official to get here.

What's the hold up? What's the harm in taking it?

Brown did take an official to Cal back in February. I imagine if he's not 100% sold on Nevada then he uses his visit to Arizona some time in the next two weeks.

[rgdeuce]

Against all odds, still a witch.

[Beachcat97]

I really don't get why Brown wouldn't take his last official visit with Arizona, given that we're in his final three. Logically that doesn't make a ton of sense to me... and unlike Cal, who he also hasn't taken an official visit to, we're not in his backyard - he could use the Zona sponsored official to get here.

What's the hold up? What's the harm in taking it?

Brown did take an official to Cal back in February. I imagine if he's not 100% sold on Nevada then he uses his visit to Arizona some time in the next two weeks.

I like the way you're thinking, Choo.

Come on, JB!

[zonagrad]

Miller has guided Arizona to back to back Pac 12 regular season & tournament titles. I actually like the fact that Arizona won't be the favorites. But inside that Arizona locker room, you can bet Miller will have this team ready to contend. I still like our chances for a 3PEAT. I really do.

[Beachcat97]

I still like our chances for a 3PEAT. I really do.

The reason I'm not quite as sanguine is because I don't know who's going to lead this team. We do have the older transfers coming in (Coleman and Luther), so that's good, but we'll have to see if a vocal floor leader emerges in the pre-season. Seems like the FF teams always have a couple key 3rd/4th year players. Then again, as I scan the Pac, I don't see many players who fit that description. Maybe Pritchard on Oregon. Travis on Stanford.

[SteveKerrsStroke]

Uninformed guesses but I'm pinning leadership hopes on Coleman or BWill.

Not sure how the feel of the locker room is? Seems like our collection of wings all seem to be easygoing. Maybe BRandolph will emerge as one if he ends up being a starter or super 6th man for us next year.

[Pop McKale]

I really don't get why Brown wouldn't take his last official visit with Arizona, given that we're in his final three. Logically that doesn't make a ton of sense to me... and unlike Cal, who he also hasn't taken an official visit to, we're not in his backyard - he could use the Zona sponsored official to get here.

What's the hold up? What's the harm in taking it?

Just spitballing -- maybe there's a fear on his part that he'll really like what he sees in Tucson and then will have a REAL decision to make whereas Nevada is virtually in his backyard and a safer choice as he sees it. Avoids muddying the waters if it stays out of sight/out of mind. Who knows.

[ezinaz]

I really don't get why Brown wouldn't take his last official visit with Arizona, given that we're in his final three. Logically that doesn't make a ton of sense to me... and unlike Cal, who he also hasn't taken an official visit to, we're not in his backyard - he could use the Zona sponsored official to get here.

What's the hold up? What's the harm in taking it?

Just spitballing -- maybe there's a fear on his part that he'll really like what he sees in Tucson and then will have a REAL decision to make whereas Nevada is virtually in his backyard and a safer choice as he sees it. Avoids muddying the waters if it stays out of sight/out of mind. Who knows.

Didn't JB cancel his "official" visit to Nevada (and instead used an unofficial visit to go there) so that he could use his last official visit for a trip to Tucson?

[EVCat]

this is one of the most loaded classes coming into the pac 12 ever next season. arizona, asu, ucla, oregon and usc all have top 20ish classes coming in. even with BW it is far from certain that we'll be the best team in the conference, even a top 2-3 team. at this point all we know is that we won't be as awful as we looked to be a month ago and that we are a tournament level team with the roster.

It is a great class. We have seen that work and that fail miserably when there is a core of upper-classmen who have, in their mind, earned the time. The Oregon class is highly ranked, but I don't think it is the best we have seen recently...just it is in a year where so many of the prospects in the class are near the top of the ratings. Of course, year to year, classes differ. And this one is ranked top 3, but is also not packed with top 10 or 20 prospects. No one touches what Duke has done, but there is simply more spreading out this year beyond Duke.

The problem there will be integrating the new guys with players who have played in a Final Four and new guys getting lots of attention. Only one of Oregon's class is a supposed sure-fire hit...Bol Bol. He will be much like Ayton was for us, and they should hope he progresses as much as Ayton did. The rest of the class is int he 20s, 30s, and 50s...in other words, like Randolph, Akot and company. Will Richardson has had a meteoric rise, so that is to be seen how he assimilates.

But I think it is getting ahead of things to say their two-5 star, two-4 star class is one of the most loaded ever. They will be favorites. The talent is certainly there. Over the years, there have been problems when a near starting 5 of highly touted freshmen come onto a team with successful holdovers (I think the best example goes a ways back, in the 90's at UNC..a title team adding Stackhouse and Wallace and losing little should have been a sure thing...instead, they imploded. The seniors never trusted the freshmen, and the freshmen didn't respect the seniors. And that was Dean Smith. Will Altman have as much control?

Again, not saying they aren't the class of the PAC. They are. But this class is a very good class in a year when two 5-stars and two 4-stars gets you a top 3 class. Beyond Bol Bol, none of these guys are automatic day one impact players.

We are in a position to challenge for a top 3 spot now. It is a bit of guesswork right now to know if Jeter is legit or a bust, if BW is ready to run from day one, if some of the things happening off the court with Barcello are resolved enough (not related to him or trouble) to allow him to make the jump as a sophomore, if Randolph was really just intimidated by Trier or not clutch, etc, etc...

But star for ranking star, we are right there with everyone 7 deep. I am excited to even think we have a chance.

[YoDeFoe]

One of the most loaded years for PAC-12 recruiting, not solely Oregon.

[Newportcat]

this is one of the most loaded classes coming into the pac 12 ever next season. arizona, asu, ucla, oregon and usc all have top 20ish classes coming in. even with BW it is far from certain that we'll be the best team in the conference, even a top 2-3 team. at this point all we know is that we won't be as awful as we looked to be a month ago and that we are a tournament level team with the roster.

It is a great class. We have seen that work and that fail miserably when there is a core of upper-classmen who have, in their mind, earned the time. The Oregon class is highly ranked, but I don't think it is the best we have seen recently...just it is in a year where so many of the prospects in the class are near the top of the ratings. Of course, year to year, classes differ. And this one is ranked top 3, but is also not packed with top 10 or 20 prospects. No one touches what Duke has done, but there is simply more spreading out this year beyond Duke.

The problem there will be integrating the new guys with players who have played in a Final Four and new guys getting lots of attention. Only one of Oregon's class is a supposed sure-fire hit...Bol Bol. He will be much like Ayton was for us, and they should hope he progresses as much as Ayton did. The rest of the class is int he 20s, 30s, and 50s...in other words, like Randolph, Akot and company. Will Richardson has had a meteoric rise, so that is to be seen how he assimilates.

But I think it is getting ahead of things to say their two-5 star, two-4 star class is one of the most loaded ever. They will be favorites. The talent is certainly there. Over the years, there have been problems when a near starting 5 of highly touted freshmen come onto a team with successful holdovers (I think the best example goes a ways back, in the 90's at UNC..a title team adding Stackhouse and Wallace and losing little should have been a sure thing...instead, they imploded. The seniors never trusted the freshmen, and the freshmen didn't respect the seniors. And that was Dean Smith. Will Altman have as much control?

Again, not saying they aren't the class of the PAC. They are. But this class is a very good class in a year when two 5-stars and two 4-stars gets you a top 3 class. Beyond Bol Bol, none of these guys are automatic day one impact players.

We are in a position to challenge for a top 3 spot now. It is a bit of guesswork right now to know if Jeter is legit or a bust, if BW is ready to run from day one, if some of the things happening off the court with Barcello are resolved enough (not related to him or trouble) to allow him to make the jump as a sophomore, if Randolph was really just intimidated by Trier or not clutch, etc, etc...

But star for ranking star, we are right there with everyone 7 deep. I am excited to even think we have a chance.

I do not know what it is about Bol but something about him makes me think he will have no where near the impact as Ayton did. He has immense talent for sure but heard he was lazy at Mater Dei and has no where near the strength as Ayton. I could be totally wrong but he reminds me of a lot of One and Done's who stay for a year, don't really have this dramatic impact like you think they would then leave. Great skill for sure

We get Brown, I feel like we are right back in the thick of things

[Beachcat97]

Bol’s size is ridiculous, and he’ll block/change a lot of shots. Oregon may not need him to score a lot of points to make an impact.

There’s no way he’ll be as valuable as Ayton, but he’ll definitely be a factor in the Pac race, imo. I’m curious to see how foul-prone he is.

[EVCat]

One of the most loaded years for PAC-12 recruiting, not solely Oregon.

True that

[catgrad97]

Bol’s size is ridiculous, and he’ll block/change a lot of shots. Oregon may not need him to score a lot of points to make an impact.

There’s no way he’ll be as valuable as Ayton, but he’ll definitely be a factor in the Pac race, imo. I’m curious to see how foul-prone he is.

With Pac-12 refs? He's going to be a foul magnet.

At least against the teams not named Arizona.

[cpt]

When is Jordan Brown supposed to decide?

[Beachcat97]

When is Jordan Brown supposed to decide?

I believe Choo said within the next two weeks.

[ChooChooCat]

When is Jordan Brown supposed to decide?

I believe Choo said within the next two weeks.

I mean that's what his dad said. Who knows when he'll decide in all actuality.

[Beachcat97]

When is Jordan Brown supposed to decide?

I believe Choo said within the next two weeks.

I mean that's what his dad said. Who knows when he'll decide in all actuality.

I'm gonna trust his dad on this one. I bet they wanna wrap this up and go public with it. Come on, JB! No fans in America will love you the way ours will!

[Chicat]

When is Jordan Brown supposed to decide?

I believe Choo said within the next two weeks.

I mean that's what his dad said. Who knows when he'll decide in all actuality.

Unfortunately I have no inside info on this one.

[Beachcat97]

When is Jordan Brown supposed to decide?

I believe Choo said within the next two weeks.

I mean that's what his dad said. Who knows when he'll decide in all actuality.

Unfortunately I have no inside info on this one.

If the guy's options are Nevada, Cal and AZ, I can't see how the first two are even in the conversation. BW had three very good options; JB seems to have one.

[NorCalCat]

When is Jordan Brown supposed to decide?

I believe Choo said within the next two weeks.

I mean that's what his dad said. Who knows when he'll decide in all actuality.

I'm gonna trust his dad on this one. I bet they wanna wrap this up and go public with it. Come on, JB! No fans in America will love you the way ours will!

A tiny bit of insight as my kid plays hoops on a team with the Asst AD of his old high school who knows him pretty well. When I asked about the three schools his response was "His family is notorious for over thinking everything". I guess we kinda knew that already though. He also mentioned they've known Musselman for a while and value his NBA bonafides.

[Beachcat97]

He also mentioned they've known Musselman for a while and value his NBA bonafides.

Aha. That explains the Nevada thing. If Musselman's been handling this recruitment well and making a good pitch, maybe JB opts for the quiet confines of the Mountain West.

[Bear Down Vegas]

Cal is def not a great basketball option - but the best school option. Like it or not, UNR is a legit basketball option now. As good as UofA? We're all biased and probably not, but Reno & Musselman are far from a bad option these days. Hard not to get optimistic about this though from our perspective.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Cal is def not a great basketball option - but the best school option. Like it or not, UNR is a legit basketball option now. As good as UofA? We're all biased and probably not, but Reno & Musselman are far from a bad option these days. Hard not to get optimistic about this though from our perspective.

If there's a big question about Nevada, it's how long Musselman is at Nevada. He's a legit rising star in the coaching world, and it would not shock anyone to see him get looks at major programs immediately.

[YoDeFoe]

Bol’s size is ridiculous, and he’ll block/change a lot of shots. Oregon may not need him to score a lot of points to make an impact.

There’s no way he’ll be as valuable as Ayton, but he’ll definitely be a factor in the Pac race, imo. I’m curious to see how foul-prone he is.

With Pac-12 refs? He's going to be a foul magnet.

At least against the teams not named Arizona.

He has the benefit of being lean and long rather than wide and strong. The Pac-12 refs seem particularly focused on post players using their lower bodies to move guys (see: Ira Lee) rather than on long players slapping balls and catching a bit of hand.

Just my observation, could be wrong.

[ChooChooCat]

Cal is def not a great basketball option - but the best school option. Like it or not, UNR is a legit basketball option now. As good as UofA? We're all biased and probably not, but Reno & Musselman are far from a bad option these days. Hard not to get optimistic about this though from our perspective.

If there's a big question about Nevada, it's how long Musselman is at Nevada. He's a legit rising star in the coaching world, and it would not shock anyone to see him get looks at major programs immediately.

Well that and do the twins come back or just go pro? If they come back then with brown they are a legit final four contender. If they don't then they're not worth shit quite frankly.

[baycat93]

Cal is def not a great basketball option - but the best school option. Like it or not, UNR is a legit basketball option now. As good as UofA? We're all biased and probably not, but Reno & Musselman are far from a bad option these days. Hard not to get optimistic about this though from our perspective.

If there's a big question about Nevada, it's how long Musselman is at Nevada. He's a legit rising star in the coaching world, and it would not shock anyone to see him get looks at major programs immediately.

Well that and do the twins come back or just go pro? If they come back then with brown they are a legit final four contender. If they don't then they're not worth shit quite frankly.

Are the twins a package to stay/go? What are their prospects? How long could that realistically go?

[Spaceman Spiff]

Cal is def not a great basketball option - but the best school option. Like it or not, UNR is a legit basketball option now. As good as UofA? We're all biased and probably not, but Reno & Musselman are far from a bad option these days. Hard not to get optimistic about this though from our perspective.

If there's a big question about Nevada, it's how long Musselman is at Nevada. He's a legit rising star in the coaching world, and it would not shock anyone to see him get looks at major programs immediately.

Well that and do the twins come back or just go pro? If they come back then with brown they are a legit final four contender. If they don't then they're not worth shit quite frankly.

Yeah, but does FF contention mean much to Brown? These days, you just don't know. If it did, there would be a lot of schools who are close to a FF that would like his services, IMO.

[ChooChooCat]

Cal is def not a great basketball option - but the best school option. Like it or not, UNR is a legit basketball option now. As good as UofA? We're all biased and probably not, but Reno & Musselman are far from a bad option these days. Hard not to get optimistic about this though from our perspective.

If there's a big question about Nevada, it's how long Musselman is at Nevada. He's a legit rising star in the coaching world, and it would not shock anyone to see him get looks at major programs immediately.

Well that and do the twins come back or just go pro? If they come back then with brown they are a legit final four contender. If they don't then they're not worth shit quite frankly.

Yeah, but does FF contention mean much to Brown? These days, you just don't know. If it did, there would be a lot of schools who are close to a FF that would like his services, IMO.

If playing on a quality team didnt matter to Brown he would've committed to Cal months ago.

[ChooChooCat]

Cal is def not a great basketball option - but the best school option. Like it or not, UNR is a legit basketball option now. As good as UofA? We're all biased and probably not, but Reno & Musselman are far from a bad option these days. Hard not to get optimistic about this though from our perspective.

If there's a big question about Nevada, it's how long Musselman is at Nevada. He's a legit rising star in the coaching world, and it would not shock anyone to see him get looks at major programs immediately.

Well that and do the twins come back or just go pro? If they come back then with brown they are a legit final four contender. If they don't then they're not worth shit quite frankly.

Are the twins a package to stay/go? What are their prospects? How long could that realistically go?

You almost never see twins not make the same exact decision. I've seen Caleb slotted in the early 2nd round and Cody in the latter end of the 2nd round. I think they're both at the point where they can't raise their draft stock with another year, so it'll be interesting to see what they do.

[YoDeFoe]

The three schools:

Cal

Pros: In his backyard, easy for parents to watch him play, is an excellent school, Pac-12 exposure.

Cons: Mediocre facilities, limited talent this year, limited fan base, unlikely to win much, unlikely to dance, limited relationship with new coach.

Wildcard: They have picked up coach David Grace, formerly of UCLA and the main recruiter that was drawing Brown there... so that immediately improves the coaching relationship for Cal.

Nevada

Pros: Very good team (depending on the draft, see below), close to home (2hr drive), newly re-engaged fan base (80% avg attendance), excellent coach, good relationship with coaches, very likely to win their conference, very likely to dance deep.

Cons: You're in Reno, decent facilities, Mountain West Conference is the 8th best in the country with limited top end talent, limited exposure in the MWC, meh academics, no true big man to practice against.

Wildcard: The draft and who returns, with their three best returning players testing the waters, including both starting post players... losing any of those three players would be a big blow to Nevada's preseason expectations (imo their greatest strength in the pitch). Caleb Martin, who is 23yrs old and won the conference POY last season, is the most likely to enter the draft - he's projected as a late first round pick. He'd also be the biggest loss for the Wolfpack as their leading scorer and lone remaining shooter. Their additional concern is that twin brother Cody could follow suit - he's their best defender and assist leader. The deadline for withdrawal from the draft is June 11th - four weeks from now.

Arizona

Pros: Excellent coach, world class facilities, good team, great fanbase and attendance, best exposure among the three, best pedigree of sending players to the NBA, recruiting momentum with Brandon Williams commitment, likely to compete for a conference title and dance with commitment, familiar with some of our players, five star true big (Jeter) to practice against.

Cons: ESPN reporting, the FBI cloud, unproven talent on the team, lower than Nevada preseason projection if they return their draft entrants, furthest from his father (who serves as his coach/trainer/mentor), meh academics.

Wildcard: Official visit - if we can get Brown on campus, he can see the level of talent in the players their, the energy of the team, the beauty of Tucson, and the unimpeachable facilities first hand. Hopefully we get him on campus and emphasize the easy direct flights from SFO/OAK/SJC to TUC.

All three schools provide Brown a wide open door to start at PF or C from day one.

[YoDeFoe]

Well that and do the twins come back or just go pro? If they come back then with brown they are a legit final four contender. If they don't then they're not worth shit quite frankly.

Are the twins a package to stay/go? What are their prospects? How long could that realistically go?

You almost never see twins not make the same exact decision. I've seen Caleb slotted in the early 2nd round and Cody in the latter end of the 2nd round. I think they're both at the point where they can't raise their draft stock with another year, so it'll be interesting to see what they do.

Yeah I've seen Caleb in the late first / early second - I'd think Cody would go late second. Both are already 23y/o so already old for the draft.

Like Choo said: one twin normally follows the other - and these guys are no exception. Caleb and Cody both committed to NCST, spent two seasons there and then transferred together to UNR. Both were highly productive and decorated last season. It seems likely that they'll move on together. Caleb, having won conference POY, has little more to prove in the coming season in college basketball. Chasing a title for UNR sounds nice, but at 23 years old I have to think he's more focused on entering the league ASAP.

Without Caleb and Cody, that team is pretty trash. If Caroline goes as well - they're unlikely to be conference favorites, let alone national title contenders.

Brown, from his Dad's messaging, will be making his choice two or three weeks prior to the draft withdrawal deadline. Curious how the Nevada entrants will play in that decision.