2018-2019 Arizona Basketball

97cats · Post by **97cats** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:52 am

RawleArenas wrote:
Akot has the size and skills to be the best player on our team

i dont think i can ever recover from this quote - i will always remember us this way...

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:52 am

RawleArenas, welcome aboard.

I'm not sure I agree with your post, though. The flip side is we beat ISU and Illinois got whipped by them. I think we're performing to our situation so far. Gonzaga is a rough matchup for us because their frontcourt strength corresponds with our biggest weakness. Hachimura is a pro, and we just don't really have an answer for him.

On development, I think Randolph and Lee have shown development. They just struggle with basic concepts some times. That said, sophomores used to be players you accepted needing some seasoning. Things are accelerated in the one and done era, but in older days, on a 4 year timeline, we'd be fine with where Lee, Akot and Randolph are.

We beat the team we needed to beat. Zaga and Auburn are better than we are and we need breaks and a good game to beat them. We really didn't get either with Zaga.

prh · Post by **prh** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 11:59 am

Merkin wrote:I do realize the Cats were gassed yesterday, but when you have 2-3 fouls on pretty much every Gonzaga player, you keep attacking the basket and stop chucking up 3s. Yes, the 3 UA guards has no legs 2nd half, and it's just easier to get to the 3 point line and chuck.

If guys have lost their legs enough they can't drive the ball, then they don't have the legs to make 3s consistently either.

We started out 4-8 from 3, and finished 7-23, so we went 3-15 after our hot start.

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:02 pm

The tech foul on Jeter completely took the wind out of our sails. After that, we had zero help inside. We were still tied at the 12 minute mark but without Jeter the game was essentially over because of our lack of depth.

I'm extremely disappointed with Akot. I expected him to be a glue guy and doing a little bit of everything. He seems lost and without a role right now.

The prospects for this team can be monitored by Dylan Smith. The more minutes he gets -- the worse I feel because it means no other player has stepped up. Smith has not converted a shot against a quality opponent since last year. Total up his shooting percentage from the Pac 12 tourney through last night and it's just abysmal. But it's not just his shooting. His decision making is terrible and defensively he's likely to make a positive play, grab a rebound and then chuck the ball out of bounds. He's the second coming of Jamelle Horne, without the athleticism. His basketball IQ is terrible.

I love Miller, but I've seen a pattern where he recruits players who don't understand the game. Randolph is another player with low hoops IQ.
I see a lot of players who have a lot of limitations: Lee, Luther, Akot, etc... It will be fun to see Williams develop but it's really gonna be a miracle if Miller can coach this team to somehow reach the NCAA tourney.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:03 pm

With all due respect, the vibe I get from some of the guys is that we're some kind of disabled, special needs program and that Gonzaga is vastly superior. Rui is a pro, a true poor man's DWill, but he is not unstoppable. Akot was projected to give us much more considering his pedigree and we're just not seeing it, otherwise Miller wouldn't have made the point for Akot to be more aggressive.

I don't expect the Golden State Warriors, just serviceable offense from our bench. This last game showed me that this team can be really good, especially considering that we shot woefully, with no meaningful contributions from our bench in the first half.

prh · Post by **prh** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:17 pm

zonagrad wrote:The tech foul on Jeter completely took the wind out of our sails. After that, we had zero help inside. We were still tied at the 12 minute mark but without Jeter the game was essentially over because of our lack of depth.

I'm extremely disappointed with Akot. I expected him to be a glue guy and doing a little bit of everything. He seems lost and without a role right now.

The prospects for this team can be monitored by Dylan Smith. The more minutes he gets -- the worse I feel because it means no other player has stepped up. Smith has not converted a shot against a quality opponent since last year. Total up his shooting percentage from the Pac 12 tourney through last night and it's just abysmal. But it's not just his shooting. His decision making is terrible and defensively he's likely to make a positive play, grab a rebound and then chuck the ball out of bounds. He's the second coming of Jamelle Horne, without the athleticism. His basketball IQ is terrible.

I love Miller, but I've seen a pattern where he recruits players who don't understand the game. Randolph is another player with low hoops IQ.
I see a lot of players who have a lot of limitations: Lee, Luther, Akot, etc... It will be fun to see Williams develop but it's really gonna be a miracle if Miller can coach this team to somehow reach the NCAA tourney.

Sadly, I think this is a much bigger issue across college basketball in general (hell sometimes the NBA too). Watch any Kentucky team in the last few years and it doesn't take long to realize why they've only got 1 title under Calipari. Smith is certainly bad, but I think a lot more coaches are plagued with this than we think. We just don't watch many other teams consistently enough to notice.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:29 pm

prh wrote:
zonagrad wrote:The tech foul on Jeter completely took the wind out of our sails. After that, we had zero help inside. We were still tied at the 12 minute mark but without Jeter the game was essentially over because of our lack of depth.

I'm extremely disappointed with Akot. I expected him to be a glue guy and doing a little bit of everything. He seems lost and without a role right now.

The prospects for this team can be monitored by Dylan Smith. The more minutes he gets -- the worse I feel because it means no other player has stepped up. Smith has not converted a shot against a quality opponent since last year. Total up his shooting percentage from the Pac 12 tourney through last night and it's just abysmal. But it's not just his shooting. His decision making is terrible and defensively he's likely to make a positive play, grab a rebound and then chuck the ball out of bounds. He's the second coming of Jamelle Horne, without the athleticism. His basketball IQ is terrible.

I love Miller, but I've seen a pattern where he recruits players who don't understand the game. Randolph is another player with low hoops IQ.
I see a lot of players who have a lot of limitations: Lee, Luther, Akot, etc... It will be fun to see Williams develop but it's really gonna be a miracle if Miller can coach this team to somehow reach the NCAA tourney.
Sadly, I think this is a much bigger issue across college basketball in general (hell sometimes the NBA too). Watch any Kentucky team in the last few years and it doesn't take long to realize why they've only got 1 title under Calipari. Smith is certainly bad, but I think a lot more coaches are plagued with this than we think. We just don't watch many other teams consistently enough to notice.

High IQ, high talent players are your top 5-10 ranked recruits. Being lower than that is usually a sign that either talent or IQ is lagging.

Who do you recruit, Alex Barcello, who has good IQ but leaves you wondering if he's talented enough to make plays? Brandon Randolph, who oozes talent and looks like he doesn't understand things sometimes?

Shoot, look at last year's NBA draft lottery. That's the cream of the crop and about half those guys had some IQ questions.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:34 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
prh wrote:
zonagrad wrote:The tech foul on Jeter completely took the wind out of our sails. After that, we had zero help inside. We were still tied at the 12 minute mark but without Jeter the game was essentially over because of our lack of depth.

I'm extremely disappointed with Akot. I expected him to be a glue guy and doing a little bit of everything. He seems lost and without a role right now.

The prospects for this team can be monitored by Dylan Smith. The more minutes he gets -- the worse I feel because it means no other player has stepped up. Smith has not converted a shot against a quality opponent since last year. Total up his shooting percentage from the Pac 12 tourney through last night and it's just abysmal. But it's not just his shooting. His decision making is terrible and defensively he's likely to make a positive play, grab a rebound and then chuck the ball out of bounds. He's the second coming of Jamelle Horne, without the athleticism. His basketball IQ is terrible.

I love Miller, but I've seen a pattern where he recruits players who don't understand the game. Randolph is another player with low hoops IQ.
I see a lot of players who have a lot of limitations: Lee, Luther, Akot, etc... It will be fun to see Williams develop but it's really gonna be a miracle if Miller can coach this team to somehow reach the NCAA tourney.
Sadly, I think this is a much bigger issue across college basketball in general (hell sometimes the NBA too). Watch any Kentucky team in the last few years and it doesn't take long to realize why they've only got 1 title under Calipari. Smith is certainly bad, but I think a lot more coaches are plagued with this than we think. We just don't watch many other teams consistently enough to notice.
High IQ, high talent players are your top 5-10 ranked recruits. Being lower than that is usually a sign that either talent or IQ is lagging.

Who do you recruit, Alex Barcello, who has good IQ but leaves you wondering if he's talented enough to make plays? Brandon Randolph, who oozes talent and looks like he doesn't understand things sometimes?

Shoot, look at last year's NBA draft lottery. That's the cream of the crop and about half those guys had some IQ questions.

I would amend that by saying that for the most part 5 star athletes have more of the ideal combination of IQ and talent, although it has been watered down considerable over the last five years or so. I have a nagging concern that some of the players (like Akot and Barcello) are still suffering from a hangover from last year's FBI mess.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:39 pm

I'm not sure it's all 5 stars. Here's a list of 2017 5 stars. I'd say at least half those guys are average IQ or below.

https://247sports.com/Season/2017-Baske ... highschool" target="_blank

Guys like Mitchell Robinson, Brandon McCoy, Nick Richards...they're on that list because they're 7 feet tall and athletic. Basketball IQ wise...eh.

Heck, even top guys like Porter Jr., I was never blown away by his BBall IQ. He's just 6'10, a good shooter and great athlete.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:42 pm

Fair enough

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 12:53 pm

RawleArenas wrote:Fair enough

I don't mean to be overly argumentative. Your basic point, that we have some guys who need to be better in their underatanding, is dead on.

It's something that needs to evolve as the season progresses. We won't get more talented, but better execution and understanding can improve to make us more of a viable tourney team

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:09 pm

RawleArenas wrote:With all due respect, the vibe I get from some of the guys is that we're some kind of disabled, special needs program and that Gonzaga is vastly superior. Rui is a pro, a true poor man's DWill, but he is not unstoppable. Akot was projected to give us much more considering his pedigree and we're just not seeing it, otherwise Miller wouldn't have made the point for Akot to be more aggressive.

I don't expect the Golden State Warriors, just serviceable offense from our bench. This last game showed me that this team can be really good, especially considering that we shot woefully, with no meaningful contributions from our bench in the first half.

I don't think you can call someone a "poor man's _____" when the guy will be a much better pro than the guy you're comparing him to. And make no mistake, Rui will have a much longer and more successful NBA career. He is legit

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:19 pm

Possibly. You never know. All kinds of things can happen to a player: injuries, bad system or they just don't translate to the next level. People have too short of a memory when it comes to DWill. He was a true alpha male. Rui stayed an extra year and has a LOT of help in terms of personnel to help him shine for Gonzaga.

He is good, no doubt. But DWill was a monster.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 5:29 pm

Just think Arizona could've had Rui if Miller decided he wanted him. C'est la vie.

SunnyAZ · Post by **SunnyAZ** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:11 pm

Win tonight and that would be a great tourney. Should be ranked too.

ByJoveByJingle · Post by **ByJoveByJingle** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:24 pm

Haha wait, am I missing something? Or in the wrong thread. Or everybody else was busy teaching in studio while Gonzaga beat Duke, too? Nobody is going to re-examine their takes in light of that development? I mean had Duke blown out Gonzaga I could get it. But not even the dude who said the Zags aren’t even a Final Four quality team?

We were ahead by 12 points 30 minutes into a game with the third ranked team who just beat the team who the idiots said could beat Cleveland.

Frybry02 · Post by **Frybry02** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:37 pm

ByJoveByJingle wrote:Haha wait, am I missing something? Or in the wrong thread. Or everybody else was busy teaching in studio while Gonzaga beat Duke, too? Nobody is going to re-examine their takes in light of that development? I mean had Duke blown out Gonzaga I could get it. But not even the dude who said the Zags aren’t even a Final Four quality team?

We were ahead by 12 points 30 minutes into a game with the third ranked team who just beat the team who the idiots said could beat Cleveland.

Don’t you know the sky is falling??

azgreg · Post by **azgreg** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:39 pm

What a great thread.

Frybry02 · Post by **Frybry02** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:42 pm

Frybry02 wrote:
I am rooting for Dylan. This may not age well but i believe he will be our best 3 point shooter. I think he averaged 37% during conference play. I am hoping he improves to near 40%. What this team needs from Dylan is consistency on both ends of the floor.

Well this did not age well. I now know what Trump feels like with many of his tweets.

bri · Post by **bri** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:45 pm

ByJoveByJingle wrote:Haha wait, am I missing something? Or in the wrong thread. Or everybody else was busy teaching in studio while Gonzaga beat Duke, too? Nobody is going to re-examine their takes in light of that development? I mean had Duke blown out Gonzaga I could get it. But not even the dude who said the Zags aren’t even a Final Four quality team?

We were ahead by 12 points 30 minutes into a game with the third ranked team who just beat the team who the idiots said could beat Cleveland.

No shit, negative Nancys in here. No matter what happens tonight, I feel better about this team than after Atlantis last year.

This team doesn't have the expectations of recent years, not deep and can't afford foul trouble, but they are by far a tourney team. It will be fun to watch the guards develop, gain experience and cohesion.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 6:49 pm

I may have been a bit premature about the FF prognostication on the Zags. But in my defense, even Zag fans were concerned after the Illini game and felt they were more of a top 15 team than a top 3 team. That being said, they could make the FF, but if they run into a team equally deep and with experience, I can see them being bounced out early.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:02 pm

Auburn will be difficult to beat. They will match up well with us on the perimeter. Our lack of depth and scoring off the bench (or lack thereof) might catch up to us in the third game in 3 nights

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:09 pm

RawleArenas wrote:I may have been a bit premature about the FF prognostication on the Zags. But in my defense, even Zag fans were concerned after the Illini game and felt they were more of a top 15 team than a top 3 team. That being said, they could make the FF, but if they run into a team equally deep and with experience, I can see them being bounced out early.

Their best shooter, and maybe second best player overall, isn't playing. At this point, I'd say there is A VERY good chance they will enter the tournament undefeated. You aren't just a bit off about them, you're watching some other team than the rest of the world.

Perkins - 5th year senior PG who already played in a championship game
Norvell Jr - Absolute stud, GREAT shooter
Rui - he's been discussed
Tillie - He's really fucking good
Clark - impressed the hell out of me this tournament
Jones, the white dude sf, the reserve guard who played really well against Duke (he was bad against us), the big Serbian frosh)

This team had high level talent and a very strong bench

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 7:26 pm

I stand by my analysis. Perkins is hit and miss and Geno Crandall is not a good second option. Norvell is a streaky shooter who had a great game.They have depth. But if a good team runs with our first half blueprint and supersizes it, I can see them running into some problems. Duke plays young, and is not used to being challenged.

In short, the Zags have great pieces and they played a great game against Duke. But there are a lot of teams that have more experience than talent in addition to depth that can challenge the Zags.

I just don't get carried away with popular opinions on teams, I try to look at them objectively.
Did you not watch the Illini game and come away feeling unimpressed?

loomer · Post by **loomer** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:22 pm

The one thing that could stop the Zags is their guard play. Josh Perkins can be turnover prone and makes dubious decisions at times, and he is not the stabilizing force that Williams-Goss was a couple of years ago. Norvell is really good. Crandall has been pretty brutal thus far with the leap in competition. Their frontcourt is insanely deep but guard play wins in March.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Nov 21, 2018 9:22 pm

ChooChooCat wrote:Just think Arizona could've had Rui if Miller decided he wanted him. C'est la vie.

What happened here? I don't remember this.

Postmaster · Post by **Postmaster** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:21 am

Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 1:39 am

Miller's quote following Auburn loss in Maui: “We haven't tried Devonaire Doutrive, who I would say is our ninth or tenth guy and I think it's up to us to get him in the game now, give him a try. And sometimes a young guy like that will come in with confidence and maybe bolster what we have.”

Can't be any worse than watching Dylan Smith.

PieceOfMeat · Post by **PieceOfMeat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 2:17 am

zonagrad wrote:Miller's quote following Auburn loss in Maui: “We haven't tried Devonaire Doutrive, who I would say is our ninth or tenth guy and I think it's up to us to get him in the game now, give him a try. And sometimes a young guy like that will come in with confidence and maybe bolster what we have.”

Can't be any worse than watching Dylan Smith.

Little late Miller

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 5:08 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:Just think Arizona could've had Rui if Miller decided he wanted him. C'est la vie.
What happened here? I don't remember this.

Rui wanted to come to Arizona, Miller decided to pass on him.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 5:09 am

Postmaster wrote:Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?

Stone Gettings technically is eligible in January, but Miller isn't going to waste him on this season.

Miller has to land another trustworthy big to bring in for next year though. Gettings and Jeter will be fine, but there's no way he can trust Lee as his primary fill in.

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 5:54 am

RawleArenas wrote:I stand by my analysis. Perkins is hit and miss and Geno Crandall is not a good second option. Norvell is a streaky shooter who had a great game.They have depth. But if a good team runs with our first half blueprint and supersizes it, I can see them running into some problems. Duke plays young, and is not used to being challenged.

In short, the Zags have great pieces and they played a great game against Duke. But there are a lot of teams that have more experience than talent in addition to depth that can challenge the Zags.

I just don't get carried away with popular opinions on teams, I try to look at them objectively.
Did you not watch the Illini game and come away feeling unimpressed?

You have a clear bias against Gonzaga. If you have come away from this weekend doubting them because Illinois mucked it up against them and we had a good half against them, instead of focusing on how dominant they were in our second half and, frankly, for 35 minutes against Duke, then that's your prerogative. But I won't make that mistake

Bordercat · Post by **Bordercat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 6:47 am

Postmaster wrote:Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?

x1000

Bordercat · Post by **Bordercat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 6:56 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
Postmaster wrote:Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?
Stone Gettings technically is eligible in January, but Miller isn't going to waste him on this season.

Miller has to land another trustworthy big to bring in for next year though. Gettings and Jeter will be fine, but there's no way he can trust Lee as his primary fill in.

Why wait? We have a good team.

Akot isn't ready apparently. Until he can hit a jumper he's not helping us. Akot has an NBA body but outside of that he doesn't appear to know the game of basketball. I would encourage him to transfer. Scrap it and end this project.

Smith- bench him. Make him mad. Play Dourtrive over him. He will stew on the bench and maybe come in less scared and timid but with something to prove. Maybe surprise us later in the season.

Lee- Love his effort and hustle but he just doesn't really appear to have a position. Stuck between a guard and a big. We need him regardless.

Barcello needs more than two minutes- he is a better version of BLav. Remember we all knew what a great shooter he was but until coach gave him reps he didn't start hitting. In my mind Barcello is the one player of these three that will pan out.

Dourtive- bring him on. Get him acclimated.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:27 am

Bordercat wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
Postmaster wrote:Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?
Stone Gettings technically is eligible in January, but Miller isn't going to waste him on this season.

Miller has to land another trustworthy big to bring in for next year though. Gettings and Jeter will be fine, but there's no way he can trust Lee as his primary fill in.
Why wait? We have a good team.

Akot isn't ready apparently. Until he can hit a jumper he's not helping us. Akot has an NBA body but outside of that he doesn't appear to know the game of basketball. I would encourage him to transfer. Scrap it and end this project.

Smith- bench him. Make him mad. Play Dourtrive over him. He will stew on the bench and maybe come in less scared and timid but with something to prove. Maybe surprise us later in the season.

Lee- Love his effort and hustle but he just doesn't really appear to have a position. Stuck between a guard and a big. We need him regardless.

Barcello needs more than two minutes- he is a better version of BLav. Remember we all knew what a great shooter he was but until coach gave him reps he didn't start hitting. In my mind Barcello is the one player of these three that will pan out.

Dourtive- bring him on. Get him acclimated.

You could waste the remainder of Stone's eligibility on half a season where the NCAA tournament doesn't even appear within grasp at the moment, or you can use him next year on a team where you add Two McDonald's All Americans in Green and Mannion along with another solid piece in Armstrong to go with the remainder of players who can consistently contribute now a la Williams, Jeter, and maybe Randolph. Would you rather utilize the guy on this year's team, which even if every thing goes right and we sneak in the tourney the final outcome won't be grand, or utilize the guy on a team that can compete for a final four? Another thing to think about is unless Zeke Nnaji gives us good news tomorrow, we have a Chase Jeter, Ira Lee, and a big who will need some development in Koloko as the only posts on next year's team. We could of course play the grad transfer lottery, but you never know what you're going to get with that.

What's funny is you start off by saying we have a good team and then dissect every single guy on the bench and the best thing you can say about any of them is that one of them is a version of Blav. Yeah...

Frybry02 · Post by **Frybry02** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 7:46 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
Bordercat wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
Postmaster wrote:Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?
Stone Gettings technically is eligible in January, but Miller isn't going to waste him on this season.

Miller has to land another trustworthy big to bring in for next year though. Gettings and Jeter will be fine, but there's no way he can trust Lee as his primary fill in.
Why wait? We have a good team.

Akot isn't ready apparently. Until he can hit a jumper he's not helping us. Akot has an NBA body but outside of that he doesn't appear to know the game of basketball. I would encourage him to transfer. Scrap it and end this project.

Smith- bench him. Make him mad. Play Dourtrive over him. He will stew on the bench and maybe come in less scared and timid but with something to prove. Maybe surprise us later in the season.

Lee- Love his effort and hustle but he just doesn't really appear to have a position. Stuck between a guard and a big. We need him regardless.

Barcello needs more than two minutes- he is a better version of BLav. Remember we all knew what a great shooter he was but until coach gave him reps he didn't start hitting. In my mind Barcello is the one player of these three that will pan out.

Dourtive- bring him on. Get him acclimated.
You could waste the remainder of Stone's eligibility on half a season where the NCAA tournament doesn't even appear within grasp at the moment, or you can use him next year on a team where you add Two McDonald's All Americans in Green and Mannion along with another solid piece in Armstrong to go with the remainder of players who can consistently contribute now a la Williams, Jeter, and maybe Randolph. Would you rather utilize the guy on this year's team, which even if every thing goes right and we sneak in the tourney the final outcome won't be grand, or utilize the guy on a team that can compete for a final four? Another thing to think about is unless Zeke Nnaji gives us good news tomorrow, we have a Chase Jeter, Ira Lee, and a big who will need some development in Koloko as the only posts on next year's team. We could of course play the grad transfer lottery, but you never know what you're going to get with that.

What's funny is you start off by saying we have a good team and then dissect every single guy on the bench and the best thing you can say about any of them is that one of them is a version of Blav. Yeah...

Keep Gettings eligible for next season. He doesn't solve our lack of production from our backcourt "depth." I use the term depth loosely.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:27 am

dcZONAfan wrote:
RawleArenas wrote:I stand by my analysis. Perkins is hit and miss and Geno Crandall is not a good second option. Norvell is a streaky shooter who had a great game.They have depth. But if a good team runs with our first half blueprint and supersizes it, I can see them running into some problems. Duke plays young, and is not used to being challenged.

In short, the Zags have great pieces and they played a great game against Duke. But there are a lot of teams that have more experience than talent in addition to depth that can challenge the Zags.

I just don't get carried away with popular opinions on teams, I try to look at them objectively.
Did you not watch the Illini game and come away feeling unimpressed?
You have a clear bias against Gonzaga. If you have come away from this weekend doubting them because Illinois mucked it up against them and we had a good half against them, instead of focusing on how dominant they were in our second half and, frankly, for 35 minutes against Duke, then that's your prerogative. But I won't make that mistake

Ok, if you want to block out the sun with your middle finger, be my guest. If Chase hadn't fouled out and we had just an average bench, they would have lost. And that's with an unproven, raw team. I think there's a better place for you and your appreciation of the Zags: http://www.slipperstillfits.com" target="_blank. Enjoy!

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:34 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:Just think Arizona could've had Rui if Miller decided he wanted him. C'est la vie.
What happened here? I don't remember this.
Rui wanted to come to Arizona, Miller decided to pass on him.

Too much of a project on the academic side? Or a did Miller underestimate his level of basketball knowledge at the time? Or ability to obtain basketball knowledge?

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:39 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
Bordercat wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
Postmaster wrote:Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?
Stone Gettings technically is eligible in January, but Miller isn't going to waste him on this season.

Miller has to land another trustworthy big to bring in for next year though. Gettings and Jeter will be fine, but there's no way he can trust Lee as his primary fill in.
Why wait? We have a good team.

Akot isn't ready apparently. Until he can hit a jumper he's not helping us. Akot has an NBA body but outside of that he doesn't appear to know the game of basketball. I would encourage him to transfer. Scrap it and end this project.

Smith- bench him. Make him mad. Play Dourtrive over him. He will stew on the bench and maybe come in less scared and timid but with something to prove. Maybe surprise us later in the season.

Lee- Love his effort and hustle but he just doesn't really appear to have a position. Stuck between a guard and a big. We need him regardless.

Barcello needs more than two minutes- he is a better version of BLav. Remember we all knew what a great shooter he was but until coach gave him reps he didn't start hitting. In my mind Barcello is the one player of these three that will pan out.

Dourtive- bring him on. Get him acclimated.
You could waste the remainder of Stone's eligibility on half a season where the NCAA tournament doesn't even appear within grasp at the moment, or you can use him next year on a team where you add Two McDonald's All Americans in Green and Mannion along with another solid piece in Armstrong to go with the remainder of players who can consistently contribute now a la Williams, Jeter, and maybe Randolph. Would you rather utilize the guy on this year's team, which even if every thing goes right and we sneak in the tourney the final outcome won't be grand, or utilize the guy on a team that can compete for a final four? Another thing to think about is unless Zeke Nnaji gives us good news tomorrow, we have a Chase Jeter, Ira Lee, and a big who will need some development in Koloko as the only posts on next year's team. We could of course play the grad transfer lottery, but you never know what you're going to get with that.

What's funny is you start off by saying we have a good team and then dissect every single guy on the bench and the best thing you can say about any of them is that one of them is a version of Blav. Yeah...

I liked Gettings for this year and not next. We have way too many soft bigs. If anything the Auburn game showed me that we don't have the kind of bigs that can anchor the team. I felt that the guys Miller was bringing in for 2018 was a stop gap due to the FBI troubles. Now that we are in a different place, I would rather see him go after studly Euro guys or bring in better transfer guys a la Keanu.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 8:46 am

RawleArenas wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
Bordercat wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
Postmaster wrote:Can Miller find a 6’10” Serb that can transfer here in January?
Stone Gettings technically is eligible in January, but Miller isn't going to waste him on this season.

Miller has to land another trustworthy big to bring in for next year though. Gettings and Jeter will be fine, but there's no way he can trust Lee as his primary fill in.
Why wait? We have a good team.

Akot isn't ready apparently. Until he can hit a jumper he's not helping us. Akot has an NBA body but outside of that he doesn't appear to know the game of basketball. I would encourage him to transfer. Scrap it and end this project.

Smith- bench him. Make him mad. Play Dourtrive over him. He will stew on the bench and maybe come in less scared and timid but with something to prove. Maybe surprise us later in the season.

Lee- Love his effort and hustle but he just doesn't really appear to have a position. Stuck between a guard and a big. We need him regardless.

Barcello needs more than two minutes- he is a better version of BLav. Remember we all knew what a great shooter he was but until coach gave him reps he didn't start hitting. In my mind Barcello is the one player of these three that will pan out.

Dourtive- bring him on. Get him acclimated.
You could waste the remainder of Stone's eligibility on half a season where the NCAA tournament doesn't even appear within grasp at the moment, or you can use him next year on a team where you add Two McDonald's All Americans in Green and Mannion along with another solid piece in Armstrong to go with the remainder of players who can consistently contribute now a la Williams, Jeter, and maybe Randolph. Would you rather utilize the guy on this year's team, which even if every thing goes right and we sneak in the tourney the final outcome won't be grand, or utilize the guy on a team that can compete for a final four? Another thing to think about is unless Zeke Nnaji gives us good news tomorrow, we have a Chase Jeter, Ira Lee, and a big who will need some development in Koloko as the only posts on next year's team. We could of course play the grad transfer lottery, but you never know what you're going to get with that.

What's funny is you start off by saying we have a good team and then dissect every single guy on the bench and the best thing you can say about any of them is that one of them is a version of Blav. Yeah...

I liked Gettings for this year and not next. We have way too many soft bigs. If anything the Auburn game showed me that we don't have the kind of bigs that can anchor the team. I felt that the guys Miller was bringing in for 2018 was a stop gap due to the FBI troubles. Now that we are in a different place, I would rather see him go after studly Euro guys or bring in better transfer guys a la Keanu.

"Studly Euro guys" don't grow on trees and the ones that are are typically spoken for at this point, ditto with the "better transfer guys."

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:00 am

People are getting ornery because we lost to the future #1 team in the nation and another top ten team in two games where we kept it close and wore down.

I see it like this. We won the game we needed to in order to have a tourney resume. We got valuable learning experiences that exposed the areas where improvement is needed. We now need to begin that process. The remainder of OOC games are all winnable, and doing that is the goal.

This season is about building. Building together this year and building guys like Williams, Lee, Akot, etc for the years to come. Building a better culture than we saw last year.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:00 am

True that. But it seems that Mark Few is dialed in on finding the Euro guys that everyone is missing.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:03 am

RawleArenas wrote:True that. But it seems that Mark Few is dialed in on finding the Euro guys that everyone is missing.

It's difficult. I Google "Studly Euro Guys" so often that my wife is starting to ask questions, but there just aren't a ton.

UAEebs86 · Post by **UAEebs86** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:06 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
RawleArenas wrote:True that. But it seems that Mark Few is dialed in on finding the Euro guys that everyone is missing.
It's difficult. I Google "Studly Euro Guys" so often that my wife is starting to ask questions, but there just aren't a ton.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:10 am

RawleArenas wrote:True that. But it seems that Mark Few is dialed in on finding the Euro guys that everyone is missing.

His Associate Head Coach has extensive contacts in Europe, which is why he pulls these guys religiously. His current recruiting class includes 2 Euros. Joe Pasternack was our Euro connection and he's now gone. Easier said than done.

RawleArenas · Post by **RawleArenas** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:11 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
RawleArenas wrote:True that. But it seems that Mark Few is dialed in on finding the Euro guys that everyone is missing.
It's difficult. I Google "Studly Euro Guys" so often that my wife is starting to ask questions, but there just aren't a ton.

Well played sir, Well played.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:11 am

Beating Auburn would’ve done wonders for our tourney hopes. Now we’re looking at needing to win all (or most of?) our remaining OOC games, plus a top 3 Pac finish, to even be in the conversation for the tourney. We’ll have a few chances for top 25 wins vs. UCLA and Oregon this season (maybe ASU), but generally speaking, the Pac is weak AF again. You can’t finish lower than 3rd in a weak conference and still get into the tourney. I guess there’s always the Pac tourney, but I’m talking here about locking up an at large bid.

Anyway, I’m proud of how they played in Maui given the circumstances. We have no frontcourt depth. Zilch. And our bench, in general, is basically sh*t. It’s really hard to win 20+ games with such a depleted roster. Williams will improve. Hopefully Luther will too. I never really saw this season as a sure-thing for the tourney, but if we can pull a few upsets and win all the ones we’re supposed to, we can gradually improve our RPI and other key metrics. Gonna be an interesting ride.

Bear down!

ralmom22 · Post by **ralmom22** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 9:35 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote:People are getting ornery because we lost to the future #1 team in the nation and another top ten team in two games where we kept it close and wore down.

I see it like this. We won the game we needed to in order to have a tourney resume. We got valuable learning experiences that exposed the areas where improvement is needed. We now need to begin that process. The remainder of OOC games are all winnable, and doing that is the goal.

This season is about building. Building together this year and building guys like Williams, Lee, Akot, etc for the years to come. Building a better culture than we saw last year.

Agree! Our point guard is better than we thought! Jeter too. Improvement from the bench is next. In my view we are going to be competitive in the PAC. And I thoroughly believe after this weeks performances, Coleman isn’t going to allow us to miss the tourney. In April we thought we were in a much worse place, now we are upset we aren’t already top 25 caliber? I am finding myself enjoying this season more than the last 3. They are fun to watch and it’s not death if they lose. How can you not want to root like crazy for this crew? Bear Down!

billk78 · Post by **billk78** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 10:14 am

After the Maui tournament how does everyone feel about this team? Are they better or worse than you expected? Or are they exactly what you thought.

For me the starting lineup is better than I anticipated. Especially Coleman and Jeter. Jeter does so many little things throughout the game. He is so important. And what a surprise Coleman is. After the Red and Blue game people were writing him off. He's already worlds better than PJC. Luther just kind of quietly does his job. I know he doesn't show up big on the stat sheet every night, but he plays fairly smart and doesn't kill us (no bad shots or forcing things).

On the flip side the bench looks atrocious. I was hoping for more from Lee. I was expecting Doutrive to play more. Akot looks lost (although I will say I think he may still develop. Not ready to give up on him yet. But he needs to find an offensive identity. Is he a jump shooter? Should he be driving? Handling the ball? He does all of the above so far but hasn't done any of them well.) Never like to bash our guys but Barcello and Smith might be good in practice, but they are liabilities right now. And unlike Akot, I really do not see these two turning it around.

So overall I come away semi-happy with the team right now. They play hard. They don't really give up. They have strung together some excellent stretches. Let's get more consistent. Let's hope one or two bench players can become good enough just to give us minutes and not be a liability. In my opinion the liabilities were what cost us these games. Teams went on big runs when Barcello, Smith, Akot and Lee were in and making really poor decisions.

I will say I'm thankful for this possible starting 5 next year:
Jeter
Green
Randolph
Williams
Nico

Gettings and Lee/Akot (hopefuly they improve) may also start at the 4 just depending on who does what. But that main 5 is pretty darn good.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Thu Nov 22, 2018 11:04 am

Quietly, Iowa State smoked Illinois and SDSU. They're on the way to being a good win.

Coleman's assertiveness suprised me and is nice to see. I'm happy he's vastly exceeded what I thought we'd get.

Jeter is necessary. He brings a dimension we just lack otherwise. I'm more positive on Akot than most. We want him to be more, but think of it this way, if he was in the Pitts role in 13-14, we'd have been better. As a 7th, 8th man, a versatile defender who is figuring out offense is fine. We just want more because with Smith missing everything, we have no bench offense.

Luther o-fered the last 2 games. Him getting into more of a rhythym would be good. The Brandons playing smarter and more consistent is a big deal too.

We're about what I thought. A team that has tourney pieces and needs to develop and come together. ISU was the measuring stick and we passed that test. We're clearly not at Zaga/Auburn's level, but who thought we were?

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