97cats wrote:all good points, and i know you werent comparing him to Shaq in the first few posts, it was the "excited to see the comparisons" post that i was chatting about - and i get it for sure.
thats why i said Kevin McHale which is still a GINORMOUS stretch for Jeter
Go Cats!!
McHale was probably the most skilled low post player ever. Adrian Dantley and Kareem are the only other two guys in the conversation for me.
McHale wasn't a physical specimen, but had long arms, incredible post footwork and an unlimited arsenal of moves.
Jeter is a good college post in that he has 2-3 solid moves, size and enough drive to keep working those moves. In college, you can be a solid post option on a title team with just those things, IMO.
Jahlil Okafor was a bigger version of Jeter and he was fine in college. In the pros...those guys get exposed a bit.
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Well, I'm excited to see Jeter as a senior with these type of comparisons floating around.
myself, i would compare Jeter and his skill set/foot work/positioning and make-up more to a very, very, very poor mans Kevin McHale than Shaq but thats just me
Hey, that's my job! I'm the only one who gets to compare everyone to Kevin McHale!
Longhorned wrote:
Hey, that's my job! I'm the only one who gets to compare everyone to Kevin McHale!
i stand corrected, Professor
Thank you.
Rule #2: No Kevin McHale comparisons based on spin moves, turnarounds, and fade aways in the post. Kevin McHale comparisons may only address a convex curvature in the barrel of the torso, tight shorts, and degrees of pectoral exposure.
Miller better step up with Altman and Hopkins in the league. I feel like every time a Miller team goes up against a Altman team we lose lately. I remember Miller saying one time that playing against Oregon is tough because they are Unpredictable. Maybe Miller should think about the predictable part.
MC1983 wrote:Miller better step up with Altman and Hopkins in the league. I feel like every time a Miller team goes up against a Altman team we lose lately. I remember Miller saying one time that playing against Oregon is tough because they are Unpredictable. Maybe Miller should think about the predictable part.
Of note: Altman is 9-8 against Miller and has won 6 of the last 8.
CalStateTempe wrote:So the last 3+seasons Oregon’s had our number.
That sleep corresponds with a Ff that I’m told was a “fluke”
Altman’s a better coach at the moment.
DWWD.
To be fair one of those games Sean Miller didn't coach and Trier was out with a bogus suspension. Last year I don't even count. If your team had a remote pulse last year and you didn't beat us then your coach is pure dogshit. Two years ago we played Oregon twice and one was literally a game they couldn't miss from 3 if they tried and the other was the Pac 12 tourney championship where we beat them.
CalStateTempe wrote:So the last 3+seasons Oregon’s had our number.
That sleep corresponds with a Ff that I’m told was a “fluke”
Altman’s a better coach at the moment.
DWWD.
To be fair one of those games Sean Miller didn't coach and my memory is hazy on if Trier played that game or not. Last year I don't even count. If your team had a remote pulse last year and you didn't beat us then your coach is pure dogshit.
Yeah, we took them to OT with no Miller, no Trier and the night after the ESPN report when everyone basically thought our program was over.
We handled them fine at home that year. We took 2 of 3 in 16-17 off their best team ever. I may be a homer, but I don't see how they've surpassed us except in not being poster boys for scandal.
I'm not sure where anyone said Oregon has surpassed us. That's crazy talk. The only thing they have on us is being to the FF more recently. That's it.
Otherwise, the Pac remains AZ's world. Other programs rise and fall. AZ remains the best by all metrics that matter. And even though we were godawful last year, we still landed the best '19 class in the league. So we don't seem to be slowing down.
ChooChooCat wrote:I will give Oregon tons of credit in extending their recruiting areas, but uncle Phil makes that much easier for them to accomplish.
Their recruiting has been weird though lately, hasn't it? Lots of transfers and late-signees. Pretty sure Bol would've been ours if the scandal hadn't hit when it did.
Altman has done fine work at Oregon (and finally getting to a final four after 3 decades was appropriate), but I would hardly rate him as elite. His former stops were largely mediocre, and with Oregon’s resources and money, one would hope he would have taken it up a notch. And it didn’t hurt that a couple of his biggest recruits were AZ cast-offs (Dorsey was a significant acquisition).
ChooChooCat wrote:I will give Oregon tons of credit in extending their recruiting areas, but uncle Phil makes that much easier for them to accomplish.
Their recruiting has been weird though lately, hasn't it? Lots of transfers and late-signees. Pretty sure Bol would've been ours if the scandal hadn't hit when it did.
Exactly. Altman rarely seems to be a first-choice destination.
ChooChooCat wrote:I will give Oregon tons of credit in extending their recruiting areas, but uncle Phil makes that much easier for them to accomplish.
Their recruiting has been weird though lately, hasn't it? Lots of transfers and late-signees. Pretty sure Bol would've been ours if the scandal hadn't hit when it did.
Exactly. Altman rarely seems to be a first-choice destination.
But...let's not pretend that Oregon isn't a very attractive place to be a student athlete. I'm never surprised when guys pick Oregon. On top of that, Altman is a very good coach. He's probably not as well liked as Miller or Hopkins, but he's got a good track record of successful seasons and guys getting to the pros. In terms of which Pac destinations are the most attractive these days, Oregon is right up there.
ChooChooCat wrote:I will give Oregon tons of credit in extending their recruiting areas, but uncle Phil makes that much easier for them to accomplish.
Their recruiting has been weird though lately, hasn't it? Lots of transfers and late-signees. Pretty sure Bol would've been ours if the scandal hadn't hit when it did.
Exactly. Altman rarely seems to be a first-choice destination.
But...let's not pretend that Oregon isn't a very attractive place to be a student athlete. I'm never surprised when guys pick Oregon. On top of that, Altman is a very good coach. He's probably not as well liked as Miller or Hopkins, but he's got a good track record of successful seasons and guys getting to the pros. In terms of which Pac destinations are the most attractive these days, Oregon is right up there.
getting guys to the pro's? korver, tolliver, bell? who am i missing?
ChooChooCat wrote:I will give Oregon tons of credit in extending their recruiting areas, but uncle Phil makes that much easier for them to accomplish.
Their recruiting has been weird though lately, hasn't it? Lots of transfers and late-signees. Pretty sure Bol would've been ours if the scandal hadn't hit when it did.
It's weird in the sense of the high school guys they are landing. Their highest rated guy is from Orlando, next is from Utah, then Memphis. After that they landed the top JUCO guy in the class, which is on brand for them and Addison Patterson is a Canadian so another on brand guys. The other two guys are from Africa and of course a couple of grad transfers, which are on brand well except the African guys. The high school guys are pretty much out of left field quite frankly.
ChooChooCat wrote:I will give Oregon tons of credit in extending their recruiting areas, but uncle Phil makes that much easier for them to accomplish.
Their recruiting has been weird though lately, hasn't it? Lots of transfers and late-signees. Pretty sure Bol would've been ours if the scandal hadn't hit when it did.
Exactly. Altman rarely seems to be a first-choice destination.
But...let's not pretend that Oregon isn't a very attractive place to be a student athlete. I'm never surprised when guys pick Oregon. On top of that, Altman is a very good coach. He's probably not as well liked as Miller or Hopkins, but he's got a good track record of successful seasons and guys getting to the pros. In terms of which Pac destinations are the most attractive these days, Oregon is right up there.
You may be right, and this isn't about pretending so much as not getting when you're saying about being a student athlete at Oregon. I walk around the campus in Eugene and it's just kind of small and dark and sad. I walk around campus at Arizona, and it's big, vibrant, optimistic, and basically major league in every way.
ChooChooCat wrote:I will give Oregon tons of credit in extending their recruiting areas, but uncle Phil makes that much easier for them to accomplish.
Their recruiting has been weird though lately, hasn't it? Lots of transfers and late-signees. Pretty sure Bol would've been ours if the scandal hadn't hit when it did.
It's weird in the sense of the high school guys they are landing. Their highest rated guy is from Orlando, next is from Utah, then Memphis. After that they landed the top JUCO guy in the class, which is on brand for them and Addison Patterson is a Canadian so another on brand guys. The other two guys are from Africa and of course a couple of grad transfers, which are on brand well except the African guys. The high school guys are pretty much out of left field quite frankly.
Is it wrong that when I see a number of out of left field signings, dollar signs light up my eyes?
In fairness to Oregon, I've had reactions like that to a few ex-Arizona recruits too.
Longhorned wrote:You may be right, and this isn't about pretending so much as not getting when you're saying about being a student athlete at Oregon. I walk around the campus in Eugene and it's just kind of small and dark and sad. I walk around campus at Arizona, and it's big, vibrant, optimistic, and basically major league in every way.
Longhorned wrote:
You may be right, and this isn't about pretending so much as not getting when you're saying about being a student athlete at Oregon. I walk around the campus in Eugene and it's just kind of small and dark and sad. I walk around campus at Arizona, and it's big, vibrant, optimistic, and basically major league in every way.
It's the Eugene biome. There's mold, mushrooms and mildew growing in the rotting North East corner of every room of every domicile and building in Eugene.
“Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
I'm not getting the "Oregon sucks!" sentiment. UofA is obviously a beautiful, inviting college campus, which probably had something to do with why we went there. Oregon can also be a nice campus.
Anyway, I've known plenty of people who went to UofO and loved it. Eugene is a solid college town.
Having said that, let's kick the shit out of the Ducks this year.
I've seen some questions about Kenpom. I like Kenpom as an intellectual aside with predictive value, although the value for predictability is limited (Ken Pomeroy explicitly agrees).
But what has always been, and what will always will be, complete bullshit, is the subjective ranking of incoming classes. Just a part of the issue is the failure to value fewer relatively elite players, as opposed to a greater number of near-elite players.
More importantly, there are very few individuals who really can evaluate talent potential, and several people who write about talent potential.
I'm starting to suspect that, as opposed to what talent evaluators say, you really do need to have played and/or coached the game at a Division 1 or pro level in order to evaluate talent potential.
Longhorned wrote:
I'm starting to suspect that, as opposed to what talent evaluators say, you really do need to have played and/or coached the game at a Division 1 or pro level in order to evaluate talent potential.
A hundred years ago, I went to that basketball camp in LA whose name escapes me. Hung out with Josh Gershon. This was during his Goazcats days. At the end of the day, he asked me who I was most impressed with at the camp. I told him Fendi Onobun had the most potential of any of the players I saw. This was a camp filled with 5 star recruits. The lesson, as always . . . I’m an idiot.
Longhorned wrote:
I'm starting to suspect that, as opposed to what talent evaluators say, you really do need to have played and/or coached the game at a Division 1 or pro level in order to evaluate talent potential.
A hundred years ago, I went to that basketball camp in LA whose name escapes me. Hung out with Josh Gershon. This was during his Goazcats days. At the end of the day, he asked me who I was most impressed with at the camp. I told him Fendi Onobun had the most potential of any of the players I saw. This was a camp filled with 5 star recruits. The lesson, as always . . . I’m an idiot.
Not quite a hundred years ago, but 90 years ago, the future player who stood out to me was Angelo Chol.
In all fairness, Fendi was the #27 rated player in the nation, so we all thought it was a great get for Arizona.
He was an athletic freak as we all know, and ended up a decent draft pick with the Rams as a tight end. Don't think he ever played a NFL down, but did a few years on practice squads.
Longhorned wrote:I've seen some questions about Kenpom. I like Kenpom as an intellectual aside with predictive value, although the value for predictability is limited (Ken Pomeroy explicitly agrees).
But what has always been, and what will always will be, complete bullshit, is the subjective ranking of incoming classes. Just a part of the issue is the failure to value fewer relatively elite players, as opposed to a greater number of near-elite players.
More importantly, there are very few individuals who really can evaluate talent potential, and several people who write about talent potential.
I'm starting to suspect that, as opposed to what talent evaluators say, you really do need to have played and/or coached the game at a Division 1 or pro level in order to evaluate talent potential.
Every time I think that, I remind myself of how Michael Jordan's tenure has gone with the Bobcats/Hornets.
Drafting Cody Zeller over Giannis Antetokounmpo would haunt my dreams if I was a Hornets fan.
Up in vegas and cats are 35-1 to win it all. Oregon has moved up to 20-1, best in the PAC.
Waiting at the Rose Bowl patiently for the cats to arrive
"I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more wildcat sports"
2019 BDW Survivor Pool Champion
MC1983 wrote:Miller better step up with Altman and Hopkins in the league. I feel like every time a Miller team goes up against a Altman team we lose lately. I remember Miller saying one time that playing against Oregon is tough because they are Unpredictable. Maybe Miller should think about the predictable part.
I couldn't agree more with this. Altman is in my opinion the best coach in the Pac 12 and second best in the west after Mark Few. What I like about Altman is he makes the most out of what he has and he's proven he's just as good a recruiter as Miller (actually better now). Terrific in game coach that makes adjustments as necessary. With a recent Final Four under his belt I'm convinced Altman will have Oregon in national championship contention regularly. Sometimes I wish we could trade Miller for Altman. We'd have at least two FF's and possibly a NC banner hanging in McKale. Miller can recruit but his inflexible coaching doesn't allow players to play to their strengths. Drives me out of my mind. Recently many top recruits have removed Arizona from their lists. The FBI/NCAA soap opera doesn't help; neither does Millers reputation for being a micro-manager. This year will be no different. I guarantee it. Expect the disappointment and save yourself the grief. For now we have another sad chapter of Arizona football to look forward to.
MC1983 wrote:Miller better step up with Altman and Hopkins in the league. I feel like every time a Miller team goes up against a Altman team we lose lately. I remember Miller saying one time that playing against Oregon is tough because they are Unpredictable. Maybe Miller should think about the predictable part.
I couldn't agree more with this. Altman is in my opinion the best coach in the Pac 12 and second best in the west after Mark Few. What I like about Altman is he makes the most out of what he has and he's proven he's just as good a recruiter as Miller (actually better now). Terrific in game coach that makes adjustments as necessary. With a recent Final Four under his belt I'm convinced Altman will have Oregon in national championship contention regularly. Sometimes I wish we could trade Miller for Altman. We'd have at least two FF's and possibly a NC banner hanging in McKale. Miller can recruit but his inflexible coaching doesn't allow players to play to their strengths. Drives me out of my mind. Recently many top recruits have removed Arizona from their lists. The FBI/NCAA soap opera doesn't help; neither does Millers reputation for being a micro-manager. This year will be no different. I guarantee it. Expect the disappointment and save yourself the grief. For now we have another sad chapter of Arizona football to look forward to.
Lmao. Stopped reading at a better recruiter than SM. What SM has done considering what he’s had to deal w could’ve been done by 2 , maybe 3 other coaches in the country. And Altman isn’t one of them.
You want to argue Altman is a slightly better Xs and Os guy and in game adjustment guy than Miller .... I’ll listen. To say anyone besides the big ones are better recruiters is insane.
Not even sure coach K, izzo or Cal could’ve recovered from all this BS.
Didn’t you know that Miller’s reputation among recruits of strangling their game with his inflexibility is exactly why . . . Nico Mannion chose to play for him?
ByJoveByJingle wrote:Didn’t you know that Miller’s reputation among recruits of strangling their game with his inflexibility is exactly why . . . Nico Mannion chose to play for him?
Manion chose to play for Miller because he is a self loathing massachist who wants to be told exactly what to do on every play because he doesn't trust his instincts.
Duh.
Arizona State might have the most surprisingly anemic history in men's basketball of any program that you might think is better than it is.
-Norlander.
I'm not saying Altman is the greatest, just that he's better than Sean Miller. You need to face it that whatever car you drive, it isn't an Audi, which is better than your car. Hit your forehead three times on your steering wheel and try to internalize that. Look around, and feel the superiority of everyone's laundry detergent compared to what your second-rate spouse washed your pants with. A little tired walking up the stairs? You're getting sick. And I hate you.
Longhorned wrote:I'm not saying Altman is the greatest, just that he's better than Sean Miller. You need to face it that whatever car you drive, it isn't an Audi, which is better than your car. Hit your forehead three times on your steering wheel and try to internalize that. Look around, and feel the superiority of everyone's laundry detergent compared to what your second-rate spouse washed your pants with. A little tired walking up the stairs? You're getting sick. And I hate you.
Look, Altman is a good coach, but he's missed the tourney three times with Oregon.
We don't follow them as closely, so no one trips about that. Also, if you thought the FBI/ESPN stuff was bad, I'd take that every day of the week over the rape scandal Altman sidestepped. I'm still a bit shocked Altman survived that.
The point is, coaches have flaws. We just don't see Altman's with the same clarity as Miller's as Arizona fans.
Spaceman Spiff wrote:Look, Altman is a good coach, but he's missed the tourney three times with Oregon.
We don't follow them as closely, so no one trips about that. Also, if you thought the FBI/ESPN stuff was bad, I'd take that every day of the week over the rape scandal Altman sidestepped. I'm still a bit shocked Altman survived that.
The point is, coaches have flaws. We just don't see Altman's with the same clarity as Miller's as Arizona fans.
I once saw Altman eat mayo with a spoon right from the jar.
Try looking past that flaw.....
Of the 12 coaches, Rush picked the one whose fans have the deepest passion, the longest memories, the greatest lung capacity and … did I mention deep passion?
