Homeless Thread

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CatsbyAZ
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Re: Homeless Thread

Post by CatsbyAZ »

Merkin wrote: Sun Mar 03, 2024 10:37 am
Recent crackdowns against the homeless are (understandably, IMO) occurring due to the mounting chaos that increasing homelessness is bringing to West Coast cities. Along with living in San Diego, I routinely work in the West Coast’s largest cities – Seattle, Portland, Bay Area, LA – seeing first hand where homelessness is most prevalent.

Speaking for San Diego, SD’s first responders have done a much better job of staying on top of their homeless population in terms of accounting for the day-to-day lives of their homeless population. SDPD’s strategy is to keep the homeless on their toes.

The city does this by posting flyers at sidewalk encampments which give notice to the PDs planned shakedown of their encampments of usually 5 – 15 tents. They next morning a caravan of first responders arrive that includes:
1) Armed police officers to oversee the uprooting of tents, confiscate illegal weapons/drugs, and arrest certain individuals for active arrest warrants, mostly drug related.
2) Social workers (some unarmed, badged police officers) who are both familiar with the downtown homeless on a first name basis and who are looking for specific homeless individuals who have fallen off the city's radar, usually women who are forcibly drugged into sidewalk prostitution by downtown pimps.
3) Paramedics to address the common health ailments, namely foot and dental sores.
4) City-contracted crews of cleanup specialists who arrive with flatbeds to haul away trash and pressure-wash the sidewalks once the tents are removed.

Quite often a 1) volunteer veterinarian is along to assess the dogs homeless keep as pets and 2) homeless advocates attend as well, specifically Amie Zamudio and Michael McConnell whom the article interviews. McConnell is correct to describe the process as “Whac-A-Mole” because once the property of the homeless is cleared and handed back to the homeless – tents, shopping carts, furniture – the homeless are free to set up along another downtown sidewalk until the process begins in another 3 to 4 weeks. (McConnell mostly attends these shakedowns to keep the police from throwing away property of homeless he personally knows.)

The city does this because their shakedowns prevent large portions of downtown sidewalks from becoming permanent encampments as allowed in Seattle, Portland, LA, and the Bay Area where their permanent encampments descend into major public health hazards of forced prostitution, overdoses, and vermin infestations. Though there are 1200 – 2000 homeless living in downtown, San Diego has largely avoided the chaos of its fellow West Coast cities through its proactive policing of downtown encampments.

I personally view this as an effective, organized, lesser-of-evils approach that allows the city to disrupt the heroin/meth trade, extract women forced into prostitution, steer homeless individuals to helpful resources, and keep the sidewalks from turning into a public health hazards. Part of San Diego’s motive is to do enough to avoid lawsuits brought on by two fronts: 1) the downtown business association suing the city on behalf of business owners whose cash flows they claim are disrupted by homeless camping in front of their storefronts AND 2) the apartment towers who residences have broken leases to leave the downtown, citing the block-by-block homeless presence.

Though street level drug abuse is still visible and downtown was hit hard by the Fentanyl crisis that picked up in 2022, San Diego was never unwise enough to legalize hard drugs like Portland did, and is now recriminalizing:
And I said, ‘That last thing is what you can't get...Nobody can get to that last thing. We keep on living in hopes of catching it once and for all.’ Jack Kerouac, On The Road
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Re: Homeless Thread

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Chicat wrote: Sun Mar 03, 2024 11:09 am It being illegal to be un-housed is one of those things that people from other countries look at and decide that Americans are just the absolute fucking worst.
American exceptionalism
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Re: Homeless Thread

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CatsbyAZ wrote: Sun Mar 10, 2024 8:51 am Recent crackdowns against the homeless…
The use of the term “crackdown” is ridiculous to me. What are these people doing besides existing in poverty?

We should crack down on the lack of housing and social services. Not on people just trying to not die.
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Merkin
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Re: Homeless Thread

Post by Merkin »

Only bond issue on the most recent California election was to deal with mental health and homeless issues. Last I read it was too close to call.



Proposition 1
Authorizes $6.38 Billion in Bonds to Build Mental Health Treatment Facilities for Those With Mental Health and Substance Use Challenges; Provides Housing for the Homeless. Legislative Statute.


ANALYSIS OF MEASURE
OVERVIEW
Proposition 1 has two major components related to providing mental health care and drug or alcohol treatment to people and addressing homelessness. The proposition:

Changes the Mental Health Services Act that was passed by voters in 2004, with a focus on how the money from the act can be used.
Approves a $6.4 billion bond to build (1) more places for mental health care and drug or alcohol treatment and (2) more housing for people with mental health, drug, or alcohol challenges.
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CatsbyAZ
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Re: Homeless Thread

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Chicat wrote: Sun Mar 10, 2024 12:42 pm The use of the term “crackdown” is ridiculous to me. What are these people doing besides existing in poverty?
High percentages of homeless abuse drugs in public settings, leading to overdoses and reinforcing their fates to the streets. To go along with that, nearly all homeless are continually solicited to buy drugs by dealers.

Moderate percentages of the homeless traffic in sales of stolen property. The drive behind this is to pay off drug debts to street dealers who exploit their addictions to heroin, meth, Percocet, and Xanax.

Lower percentages of the homeless (mostly women) engage in prostitution coordinated by street dealers and enforced by keeping them too drugged to consent.

Throw in the public health hazards encampments become in the way of recent outbreaks (lately Syphilis) and at some point local cities no longer 'live and let live' when it comes to their homeless communities. Certain cities draw harder, more proactive lines (San Diego) while others (Seattle, Portland, LA, Bay Area) look away until the reality of homelessness is much more difficult to account for.
And I said, ‘That last thing is what you can't get...Nobody can get to that last thing. We keep on living in hopes of catching it once and for all.’ Jack Kerouac, On The Road
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Re: Homeless Thread

Post by Chicat »

Thank you for adding color and context to my point.
Of the 12 coaches, Rush picked the one whose fans have the deepest passion, the longest memories, the greatest lung capacity and … did I mention deep passion?
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Merkin
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Re: Homeless Thread

Post by Merkin »

Bill Walton ranting about the homeless. He even mentioned it on one of the UA broadcasts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uHnuvMMZtw



Co-authored op-ed:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nba-lege ... population

"We need our President and federal government to lease 2,000 acres of MCAS Miramar land to Sunbreak Ranch at $1 per year, and to designate this land as a temporary ‘federal emergency homeless help zone.’ This will eliminate local red tape and opposition.

"We need our President to deploy the military and security services to build a tent city for Sunbreak Ranch on this site with surplus equipment from the Afghan and Iraq deployments. Our military and security services have the manpower, expertise, and equipment to build out this entire tent city within weeks.

"The cost of this Sunbreak experiment is minimal compared to the untold tens of billions of dollars currently being spent (to no avail) on homelessness annually."
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CatsbyAZ
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Re: Homeless Thread

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Last week's Supreme Court ruling in City of Grants Pass OR Vs. Johnson upheld citywide bans on homeless camping and sleeping in public spaces. This was decided as an 8th Amendment case in which municipalities across the nation are now allowed greater latitude to ban homeless camping, remove encampments, throw away homeless property, and make arrests for violations against camping bans. The Supreme Court's 6-3 decision ruled that these measures do NOT violate the Eighth Amendment’s protections against cruel and unusual punishments.

KGUN9 covered what this decision means for Tucson's approach to the homeless (but it looks like their clip is blocked from embedding - link posted below):

"Tucson’s City attorney Mike Rankin says his office is reviewing the Supreme Court decision but can already conclude it allows the city to keep doing what it’s doing now. His statement says in part:

"... Today’s Supreme Court decision reinforces the validity of the Tucson’s Homeless Encampment Protocol, under which the City’s enforcement efforts and deployment of resources to eliminate unlawful encampments are prioritized based upon the encampment’s impact on public health and safety. I expect that this approach will continue now that the Supreme Court has confirmed our authority to enforce our local ordinances."


(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yymaf4ilNW4)
And I said, ‘That last thing is what you can't get...Nobody can get to that last thing. We keep on living in hopes of catching it once and for all.’ Jack Kerouac, On The Road
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Merkin
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Re: Homeless Thread

Post by Merkin »

Guess it means they can, but don't have too. San Diego probably the worst effected city regarding homelessness passed an anti-encampment ban last year.

With the other SCOTUS ruling, I imagine Trump can now toss the homeless into concentration camps like he wanted to. That will get a lot of support from both sides, thinking Bill Walton.

Just a side note, my oldest son now has a job working at a facility here in town. It's really nice. It's all about housing, not about rehabilitation, so drug users and alcoholics are allowed, just not allowed to partake on site. Each has their own room with a locking door.

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Re: Homeless Thread

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Merkin wrote: Tue Jul 02, 2024 9:55 am Guess it means they can, but don't have too. San Diego probably the worst effected city regarding homelessness passed an anti-encampment ban last year.

With the other SCOTUS ruling, I imagine Trump can now toss the homeless into concentration camps like he wanted to. That will get a lot of support from both sides, thinking Bill Walton.

Just a side note, my oldest son now has a job working at a facility here in town. It's really nice. It's all about housing, not about rehabilitation, so drug users and alcoholics are allowed, just not allowed to partake on site. Each has their own room with a locking door.

Image
I support a variety of options for those afflicted by substance dependence.

However, facilities like this designed to serve "drug users and alcoholics" that have policies like "just not allowed to partake" are problematic. In what other area of medicine are the ill removed for having symptoms of their disorder???

Most users of alcohol and/or drugs, whether addicted or merely so-called "recreational", do in fact, "use" at home - probably primarily at home. D'uh!!! A "home" is not a "home" if you aren't free...

A definition of addiction requires evidence of relapse - a major defining characteristic that is present in the huge majority of successful "recoveries" over time. Relapse happens.

I favor, have and do support, and have conduct theory trainings in the concept of "Harm Reduction" strategies. (Harm reduction is used to decrease negative consequences of recreational drug use and sexual activity without requiring abstinence, recognizing that those unable or unwilling to stop can still make positive change to protect themselves and others.)
“If you have the choice between humble and cocky, go with cocky. There's always time to be humble later, once you've been proven horrendously, irrevocably wrong.”

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CatsbyAZ
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Re: Homeless Thread

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This is the difference though – “supportive housing projects” such as these are not medical facilities. Meaning the public money assigned to them isn’t designated for facilitating the understandable ebb and flow of case by case drug withdrawal. That more intensive option you’re discussing, of overseeing rehabilitation, is available in San Diego County (for instance) through dozens of facilities dedicated to impatient and outpatient substance abuse recovery. To which certain amounts of public money are assigned for aiding drug abuse victims across the homeless community.

Supportive housing projects that outright ban onsite drug abuse aren’t so much as denying understandable addiction relapses but rather protecting their communities against citywide networks of dealers who takeover street corners, encampments, and shelter housing in order to solicit the homeless community with heroin, meth, and opioids. Hence the name pushers who indebt the homeless with drug debts and worst of all, establish forced prostitution rings by keeping homeless women drugged beyond legal consent for sex work. Banning drugs is the most forthright method of disallowing the illicit victimizing by bad-faith dealers (most of whom are also homeless).

I saw how this setting played out at a Women's Village in Portland’s Kenton neighborhood where the goal was first and foremost to remove women from the street despite whatever ongoing addictions they battled. Residents were subject to various soft drug controls, and for those who couldn’t keep up they weren’t kicked back to the street but rather referred to area rehab centers.

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And I said, ‘That last thing is what you can't get...Nobody can get to that last thing. We keep on living in hopes of catching it once and for all.’ Jack Kerouac, On The Road
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Re: Homeless Thread

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Though a number of other states wasted no time stepping up their dismantling of homeless encampments since last month’s the Supreme Courts ruling upheld municipality bans on homeless camping as not cruel and unusual punishment, I guess Newsom issuing his own statewide bans is news because it’s California, home of an estimated 1/3rd of the nation’s homeless population.

His executive order “directs state agencies to move urgently to address dangerous encampments while supporting and assisting the individuals living in them.”

“The order says state agencies should ask local organizations to help displaced encampment residents. But it doesn’t require any follow-through by the state. And it says nothing about how public agencies should reconcile the disparity between supply and demand: California counts 71,000 shelter beds for a homeless population of 181,000.”

“Newsom’s order goes on to encourage cities and counties to apply for their share of $3.3 billion in newly available grant money through Proposition 1, which voters passed this year to expand behavioral health services for the unhoused. Meanwhile, the state allocated $1 billion to an Encampment Resolution Fund that aims to move people into shelter and, ideally, long-term housing.”
And I said, ‘That last thing is what you can't get...Nobody can get to that last thing. We keep on living in hopes of catching it once and for all.’ Jack Kerouac, On The Road
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Re: Homeless Thread

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Going through the city I live in right now.

But every person "evicted" is offered a bed.

However, you can't make them. Some living in the camps have chickens, others have cats, and no room for animals.

https://santamariatimes.com/news/local/ ... 39fae.html

While Buttitta emphasizes the positive aspects of offering the homeless shelter when they leave the camps, Kevin Lord Dirksen, 42, talked Friday about conditions and rules that he says concern him.

"I prefer to be considered homefree instead of homeless, considering I'm lacking nothing. Quality of life is perspective and we're all entitled to that," he said.

Dirksen compared the shelter system to concentration camps, criticizing the lack of freedom and autonomy.

"It’s a concentration camp because there is no freedom. They are not offering a free place to live, they are offering a place to control you," he said.
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Re: Homeless Thread

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Under the Biden-Harris Administration, veteran homelessness has dropped to the lowest levels on record!

https://bsky.app/profile/artcandee.bsky ... otd7d3wk2e
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Re: Homeless Thread

Post by UofAlum05 »

The jails are over 200% capacity so I'm not sure why people think arresting them would work.

Wrap around services is the only thing that has shown to work long term. You can't just build little houses. People need rehab, job training, support, etc.
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