Bear Down Wildcats

Defense was in the driver seat for the first half of this season and led to great offense. Went to the back of the wagon the second half. Only time it was in the spotlight was when it was absolutely needed. Imo

We need a deep threat or two.
Hope Bal can do it. Maybe terry can improve his 3pt shooting.

They should all go to a pro wrestling training school. Learn to take some bumps.

I was really hoping we would have seen Bal these last 2 games if even as just a way to get a spark on offense.

Postmaster wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:03 pm We need a deep threat or two.
Hope Bal can do it. Maybe terry can improve his 3pt shooting.

They should all go to a pro wrestling training school. Learn to take some bumps.

I think during the last month Terry's 3-pt shooting has been fantastic. I love when he shoots the 3 now.

Duke took apart Texas Tech in the second half with dribble drives and shot 71%. Houston sped up our offense and made us think and work for passes instead of playing within the system.

I thought Benn was great in the second half and Tommy helped get him good looks.

Also, Villanova fans were ready to ship Jay Wright off to the NBA in 2015 and they won it all.

KillerKlown wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:59 pm Defense was in the driver seat for the first half of this season and led to great offense. Went to the back of the wagon the second half. Only time it was in the spotlight was when it was absolutely needed. Imo

Pretty much yeah. When Arizona was at it's most dominant was when they were a 5-6 kenpom defense.

Our offense was in the mid teens but that was when Arizona looked it's best.

The defense wheels really fell off the second half of the season.

RondaeShimmy wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:10 pm Defense
N°1: San Diego St -- 85.0
N°2: Texas Tech -- 85.1
N°3: LSU -- 85.5
N°4: VCU -- 86.9
N°5: Tennessee -- 88.2
N°5: Arizona -- 88.2
N°7 Boise St -- 88.3

So we had basically a 15 place drop since mid February-early March to now. Just kept getting worse every week.

Pretty embarrassing tourney for a lot of our players. As someone mentioned in another thread, it was very easy to see where the real talent is on this team. First time in the tourney for the whole team though so hopefully it pays dividends next year.

The Pac12 commish could do all of us a favor if he got some balls and overhauled the conference officiating to be less pussified and more like the rest of the country.

mofo wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:27 pm The Pac12 commish could do all of us a favor if he got some balls and overhauled the conference officiating to be less pussified and more like the rest of the country.

That was Lute's complaint decades ago. The PAC refs call so many touch fouls they teach the players to play soft, and they get destroyed in games with physical teams with non-PAC refs.

Except that 2 refs in this game reffed in the PAC. But go on.

I think they ref differently when outside of Pac 12 games. I think the conference has set a style of play that the officials follow.
Larry wanted a tennis match and the conference had guidelines for refs.

Olsondogg wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:36 pm Executor that 2 refs in this game reffed in the PAC. But go on.

I think this game was called very well. I wish our conference would allow a game like this more often. I’ve seen much less physical games in conference play that had way more whistles. There are a handful of exceptions but not many. Maybe the 2 refs tonight were the only ones worth a shit from our conference. Or maybe these 2 refs call games different with peers from other conferences than they do in ours. Or maybe every conference in America has pussy refs and we just don’t adapt when it’s go-time in the tourney and the rules change.

You have a take or no?

Reffing is not why we lost this game. That’s the take.

Not what I said dude

Well, you see how soft UCLA and Buffy play! It's almost like they have squeegees taped to their hands. It's like flag football out there.

You asked for my take, dude. I gave it to you.

RondaeShimmy wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:10 pm

KillerKlown wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:59 pm Defense was in the driver seat for the first half of this season and led to great offense. Went to the back of the wagon the second half. Only time it was in the spotlight was when it was absolutely needed. Imo

Pretty much yeah. When Arizona was at it's most dominant was when they were a 5-6 kenpom defense.

Our offense was in the mid teens but that was when Arizona looked it's best.

The defense wheels really fell off the second half of the season.

RondaeShimmy wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:10 pm Defense
N°1: San Diego St -- 85.0
N°2: Texas Tech -- 85.1
N°3: LSU -- 85.5
N°4: VCU -- 86.9
N°5: Tennessee -- 88.2
N°5: Arizona -- 88.2
N°7 Boise St -- 88.3

So we had basically a 15 place drop since mid February-early March to now. Just kept getting worse every week.

It's even worse on T-Rank. We went from 7th in Defensive Efficiency in early February to 88th after tonight. We also went from 149th in DRB% to 253rd. We got worse in every defensive metric from February - now.

The scouting gets more dialed in once you start playing teams twice and I think the defensive drop off is correlated. Opponents dialed in on Kerr, Kier and Tubelis, which is why you saw a lot more of Koloko and Ballo on the floor together. We had elite 2pt% defense despite not creating a lot of turnovers.

I love Benn as a player, but he would get easily lost at times. It’s a young team that would be even better next year if they all came back.

Men's NCAA Tournament Post Game Press Conference vs. Houston

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcfbRm6DSJo

SabinoDrifter wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 11:28 pm The scouting gets more dialed in once you start playing teams twice and I think the defensive drop off is correlated. Opponents dialed in on Kerr, Kier and Tubelis, which is why you saw a lot more of Koloko and Ballo on the floor together. We had elite 2pt% defense despite not creating a lot of turnovers.

I love Benn as a player, but he would get easily lost at times. It’s a young team that would be even better next year if they all came back.

Ballo contributed a lot more than expected, but he and Koloko together was a lineup with challenges.

Koloko played well in space this year, but Ballo and Tubelis less so. That meant two bigs were vulnerable to spreading the floor unless we went small.

I always worried Lloyd's philosophy of being further up the line off ball would struggle vs more talented teams. Less talent won't make one on one plays. Better teams have the individuals who can exploit less help.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:19 am

SabinoDrifter wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 11:28 pm The scouting gets more dialed in once you start playing teams twice and I think the defensive drop off is correlated. Opponents dialed in on Kerr, Kier and Tubelis, which is why you saw a lot more of Koloko and Ballo on the floor together. We had elite 2pt% defense despite not creating a lot of turnovers.

I love Benn as a player, but he would get easily lost at times. It’s a young team that would be even better next year if they all came back.

Ballo contributed a lot more than expected, but he and Koloko together was a lineup with challenges.

Koloko played well in space this year, but Ballo and Tubelis less so. That meant two bigs were vulnerable to spreading the floor unless we went small.

I always worried Lloyd's philosophy of being further up the line off ball would struggle vs more talented teams. Less talent won't make one on one plays. Better teams have the individuals who can exploit less help.

Completely agreed. It's how you can be a top 20 defensive efficiency team with a top 10 effective FG% and top 2 two-point defense and bottom third team in turnover % and non-steal turnover%. Koloko and Ballo aren't going to steal the ball, they're going to protect the rim and block shots.

I think CTM has a lot to learn despite losing four games in his first season. He got a lot more out of this group than I would have expected in November.

SabinoDrifter wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:26 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 8:19 am

SabinoDrifter wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 11:28 pm The scouting gets more dialed in once you start playing teams twice and I think the defensive drop off is correlated. Opponents dialed in on Kerr, Kier and Tubelis, which is why you saw a lot more of Koloko and Ballo on the floor together. We had elite 2pt% defense despite not creating a lot of turnovers.

I love Benn as a player, but he would get easily lost at times. It’s a young team that would be even better next year if they all came back.

Ballo contributed a lot more than expected, but he and Koloko together was a lineup with challenges.

Koloko played well in space this year, but Ballo and Tubelis less so. That meant two bigs were vulnerable to spreading the floor unless we went small.

I always worried Lloyd's philosophy of being further up the line off ball would struggle vs more talented teams. Less talent won't make one on one plays. Better teams have the individuals who can exploit less help.

Completely agreed. It's how you can be a top 20 defensive efficiency team with a top 10 effective FG% and top 2 two-point defense and bottom third team in turnover % and non-steal turnover%. Koloko and Ballo aren't going to steal the ball, they're going to protect the rim and block shots.

I think CTM has a lot to learn despite losing four games in his first season. He got a lot more out of this group than I would have expected in November.

Some of it was beyond control too. Aiken disappearing was obviously unexpected, and he was pretty specifically a bench piece brought in to be a smaller, more mobile 4 to keep us out of the issues with 2 bigs.

I think it's a combo of a bit of complacency from success and teams figuring out they could use spacing and penetration to create 3 point looks and focusing there instead of driving into our strength, which was having a good to great rim protection presence out there at all times.

loomer wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 11:11 pm

RondaeShimmy wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:10 pm

KillerKlown wrote: Thu Mar 24, 2022 9:59 pm Defense was in the driver seat for the first half of this season and led to great offense. Went to the back of the wagon the second half. Only time it was in the spotlight was when it was absolutely needed. Imo

Pretty much yeah. When Arizona was at it's most dominant was when they were a 5-6 kenpom defense.

Our offense was in the mid teens but that was when Arizona looked it's best.

The defense wheels really fell off the second half of the season.

RondaeShimmy wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:10 pm Defense
N°1: San Diego St -- 85.0
N°2: Texas Tech -- 85.1
N°3: LSU -- 85.5
N°4: VCU -- 86.9
N°5: Tennessee -- 88.2
N°5: Arizona -- 88.2
N°7 Boise St -- 88.3

So we had basically a 15 place drop since mid February-early March to now. Just kept getting worse every week.

It's even worse on T-Rank. We went from 7th in Defensive Efficiency in early February to 88th after tonight. We also went from 149th in DRB% to 253rd. We got worse in every defensive metric from February - now.

I think we're in the 100s since the start of the pac 12 tournament.

Playing out worst basketball at the worst time.

Also, Kansas is definitely playing championship level basketball

What a great season an so bummed to see it end. That said I am wonder about a few things.

When Andy Lopez retired and JJ took over we made that ru to the championship series and lost it. I posted, what if this is as good as it gets? We did make another run and got in the CWS but fizzled out pretty quick so in theory, it never did get better.

Now I am wondering two things. What if this is as good as it gets with Lloyd and the second question is what are the kind of played Lloyd wants in his system going forward to allow us to go further?

Like JJ, Lloyd inherited the bulk of these players and molded them into a very efficient group. Still, I wonder what he will look for in future players.

I think a guy like Terry is his model player. Great handle, long, athletic with great court vision and basketball IQ.

I think this offseason will be very interesting to see who stats and who goes and how we use the portal. Certainly think we need to find some shooters and I wonder if we will begin to learn what Lloyd values greatly in a player?

azcat49 wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 11:54 am What a great season an so bummed to see it end. That said I am wonder about a few things.

When Andy Lopez retired and JJ took over we made that ru to the championship series and lost it. I posted, what if this is as good as it gets? We did make another run and got in the CWS but fizzled out pretty quick so in theory, it never did get better.

Now I am wondering two things. What if this is as good as it gets with Lloyd and the second question is what are the kind of played Lloyd wants in his system going forward to allow us to go further?

Like JJ, Lloyd inherited the bulk of these players and molded them into a very efficient group. Still, I wonder what he will look for in future players.

I think a guy like Terry is his model player. Great handle, long, athletic with great court vision and basketball IQ.

I think this offseason will be very interesting to see who stats and who goes and how we use the portal. Certainly think we need to find some shooters and I wonder if we will begin to learn what Lloyd values greatly in a player?

The Jay Johnson comparison doesn’t work because Jay was landing highly rated recruits, but they’d never step foot on campus because they were drafted out of HS. Lloyd is already landing highly rated guys and the NBA isn’t a threat to prevent them from getting on campus.

Also JJ went to 2 CWS, not just the one right after Lopez.

Yea he made the run with Lopes guys and lost to CC. Then last year. My question after that first run was could get duplicate that and he didn’t.

Choo’s comment is fair as lots of those top HS kids don’t get to campus in baseball. That leads me to that second question though about the type of player he wants.

Watching Gonzaga fizzle out and wondering if their window has closed makes me wonder what Lloyd wants in a player that he can get at AZ that would separate us from say a Gonzaga.

Maybe it’s unanswerable at the moment but I wonder what he will be looking for this offseason

azcat49 wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 11:54 am What a great season an so bummed to see it end. That said I am wonder about a few things.

When Andy Lopez retired and JJ took over we made that ru to the championship series and lost it. I posted, what if this is as good as it gets? We did make another run and got in the CWS but fizzled out pretty quick so in theory, it never did get better.

Now I am wondering two things. What if this is as good as it gets with Lloyd and the second question is what are the kind of played Lloyd wants in his system going forward to allow us to go further?

Like JJ, Lloyd inherited the bulk of these players and molded them into a very efficient group. Still, I wonder what he will look for in future players.

I think a guy like Terry is his model player. Great handle, long, athletic with great court vision and basketball IQ.

I think this offseason will be very interesting to see who stats and who goes and how we use the portal. Certainly think we need to find some shooters and I wonder if we will begin to learn what Lloyd values greatly in a player?

I'd look at what went wrong (not enough defensive intensity, not enough scoring, not enough guys who could run the offense) and look at the three guards that Lloyd has pulled in and see if that isn't the exact answer to those problems.

Bal, Boswell, Lewis - long, big, high IQ players who can share it or get their own bucket.

Assume that we pick up another guy like that in the portal and that we return and develop further Larsson and Terry. That'd go a long way in changing the outcome of a game like last night.

Year 1…:

1…..


1…..

YoDeFoe wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:09 pm

azcat49 wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 11:54 am What a great season an so bummed to see it end. That said I am wonder about a few things.

When Andy Lopez retired and JJ took over we made that ru to the championship series and lost it. I posted, what if this is as good as it gets? We did make another run and got in the CWS but fizzled out pretty quick so in theory, it never did get better.

Now I am wondering two things. What if this is as good as it gets with Lloyd and the second question is what are the kind of played Lloyd wants in his system going forward to allow us to go further?

Like JJ, Lloyd inherited the bulk of these players and molded them into a very efficient group. Still, I wonder what he will look for in future players.

I think a guy like Terry is his model player. Great handle, long, athletic with great court vision and basketball IQ.

I think this offseason will be very interesting to see who stats and who goes and how we use the portal. Certainly think we need to find some shooters and I wonder if we will begin to learn what Lloyd values greatly in a player?

I'd look at what went wrong (not enough defensive intensity, not enough scoring, not enough guys who could run the offense) and look at the three guards that Lloyd has pulled in and see if that isn't the exact answer to those problems.

Bal, Boswell, Lewis - long, big, high IQ players who can share it or get their own bucket.

Assume that we pick up another guy like that in the portal and that we return and develop further Larsson and Terry. That'd go a long way in changing the outcome of a game like last night.

I don't know what Lloyd's philosophy is yet, but I was surprised at how much improved many of our players were this season:

Larsson: I thought he looked lost up until the 2nd half of the Pac schedule and after that displayed more confident shooting and fantastic defense

Koloko: I watched him sulk as he sat on the bench during an early season game and Lloyd propped his head up to speak directly to him. No yelling and no condescension from Lloyd. Koloko was meteorically improved versus last season

Ballo: he looked lost during the early season games and then began playing with a passion on both ends of the court leading into the Pac schedule

I credit Lloyd for these 3 players improving rather drastically this season. I believe Lloyd will help to improve a few other necessary pieces next year, like Bal and Kriisa. Krissa needs a mid range shot and a floater like Miles had.

Tubelis will be Lloyd's most difficult rehabilitation because he regressed so clearly over the course of the season.

I'm no longer a fan of defense, although others have pointed out it's important. I simply want to see Lloyd's teams try to get to 100 points, so that I can get a coupon for a free Domino's pizza!!!

YoDeFoe wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:09 pm I'd look at what went wrong (not enough defensive intensity, not enough scoring, not enough guys who could run the offense) and look at the three guards that Lloyd has pulled in and see if that isn't the exact answer to those problems.

Bal, Boswell, Lewis - long, big, high IQ players who can share it or get their own bucket.

Assume that we pick up another guy like that in the portal and that we return and develop further Larsson and Terry. That'd go a long way in changing the outcome of a game like last night.

There are unanswered questions within that too, though. Boswell and Lewis being 2023, Terry and Larsson would have to stay for their senior season. Larsson probably does, but I doubt Terry's still here.

Bal will be here unless he is homesick or transfers. So you think of a core of senior Larsson, junior Bal, freshmen in Lewis and Boswell. Up front, Anderson is a soph, Ballo a senior. Is Tubelis here as a senior?

Some of it is the type of recruits. Some of it...well, we had guys who could be great defenders, because for half the season they were this year. I think that's the second half of things that matters as much, if not more than personnel.

I see Houston as indicative of a late season where we just fell off where we were earlier. Identifying why that occurred and how to build culture so that it does not recur is just as big a deal for Lloyd going forward. Some of the answer may be personnel. Some of it may be the bad timing of Kerr's ankle. Some of it may run deeper.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:36 pm

YoDeFoe wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:09 pm I'd look at what went wrong (not enough defensive intensity, not enough scoring, not enough guys who could run the offense) and look at the three guards that Lloyd has pulled in and see if that isn't the exact answer to those problems.

Bal, Boswell, Lewis - long, big, high IQ players who can share it or get their own bucket.

Assume that we pick up another guy like that in the portal and that we return and develop further Larsson and Terry. That'd go a long way in changing the outcome of a game like last night.

There are unanswered questions within that too, though. Boswell and Lewis being 2023, Terry and Larsson would have to stay for their senior season. Larsson probably does, but I doubt Terry's still here.

Bal will be here unless he is homesick or transfers. So you think of a core of senior Larsson, junior Bal, freshmen in Lewis and Boswell. Up front, Anderson is a soph, Ballo a senior. Is Tubelis here as a senior?

Some of it is the type of recruits. Some of it...well, we had guys who could be great defenders, because for half the season they were this year. I think that's the second half of things that matters as much, if not more than personnel.

I see Houston as indicative of a late season where we just fell off where we were earlier. Identifying why that occurred and how to build culture so that it does not recur is just as big a deal for Lloyd going forward. Some of the answer may be personnel. Some of it may be the bad timing of Kerr's ankle. Some of it may run deeper.

Kerr needs to be crafty and intelligent next season. I believe he should watch tapes of Miles, who I think was the craftiest player at his size and physical ability.

TJ was extremely intelligent, but lacked the desire to score, so I always go back to Miles as the model of success.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:36 pm There are unanswered questions within that too, though. Boswell and Lewis being 2023, Terry and Larsson would have to stay for their senior season. Larsson probably does, but I doubt Terry's still here.

Bal will be here unless he is homesick or transfers. So you think of a core of senior Larsson, junior Bal, freshmen in Lewis and Boswell. Up front, Anderson is a soph, Ballo a senior. Is Tubelis here as a senior?

Some of it is the type of recruits. Some of it...well, we had guys who could be great defenders, because for half the season they were this year. I think that's the second half of things that matters as much, if not more than personnel.

I see Houston as indicative of a late season where we just fell off where we were earlier. Identifying why that occurred and how to build culture so that it does not recur is just as big a deal for Lloyd going forward. Some of the answer may be personnel. Some of it may be the bad timing of Kerr's ankle. Some of it may run deeper.

Kerr, Zu, and Mathurin looked terrible on defense - otherwise I thought the rest of the squad played good D. Chalk up Kerr to his ankle and Zu to whatever was going on with Zu. Mathurin was only briefly an engaged defender this season.

So yeah, I agree, it's about having health and having guys who give a shit about playing D. Who take it seriously. Personally.

Terry and Larsson are those guys to me. Kerr is as well, if his body allows it (and I mean that even when he's healthy). Boswell and Lewis are those kinds of guys and I'm hoping Bal is as well.

To your question about 2023 - who knows what the roster looks like. There are 11 committed recruits in the top 50 (and we have 2 of them).

But for both next season and 2023 I think we'll see transfers in who fit that mold. Long, athletic, physical guys who are high effort two way players. That's what Lloyd has brought in so far.

LuteIsGod wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:49 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:36 pm

YoDeFoe wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 3:09 pm I'd look at what went wrong (not enough defensive intensity, not enough scoring, not enough guys who could run the offense) and look at the three guards that Lloyd has pulled in and see if that isn't the exact answer to those problems.

Bal, Boswell, Lewis - long, big, high IQ players who can share it or get their own bucket.

Assume that we pick up another guy like that in the portal and that we return and develop further Larsson and Terry. That'd go a long way in changing the outcome of a game like last night.

There are unanswered questions within that too, though. Boswell and Lewis being 2023, Terry and Larsson would have to stay for their senior season. Larsson probably does, but I doubt Terry's still here.

Bal will be here unless he is homesick or transfers. So you think of a core of senior Larsson, junior Bal, freshmen in Lewis and Boswell. Up front, Anderson is a soph, Ballo a senior. Is Tubelis here as a senior?

Some of it is the type of recruits. Some of it...well, we had guys who could be great defenders, because for half the season they were this year. I think that's the second half of things that matters as much, if not more than personnel.

I see Houston as indicative of a late season where we just fell off where we were earlier. Identifying why that occurred and how to build culture so that it does not recur is just as big a deal for Lloyd going forward. Some of the answer may be personnel. Some of it may be the bad timing of Kerr's ankle. Some of it may run deeper.

Kerr needs to be crafty and intelligent next season. I believe he should watch tapes of Miles, who I think was the craftiest player at his size and physical ability.

TJ was extremely intelligent, but lacked the desire to score, so I always go back to Miles as the model of success.

My list for Kerr would be this:

1. Continue to develop as a defender.
2. Become more consistent with the 3 ball.
3. Develop his floater so he is a midrange threat on the p&r.

His distribution game is solid with 4.7 apg, and you figure that will go up a bit and the 2.2 to's come down a bit as he further settles into the college game.

I list D first because we could use a defensive leader at PG. We really have not had that since TJ. His 3 ball was so inconsistent this year. If he can hit it more consistently and make the D respect his midrange, it will open him up to really make more plays for others without the TO's.

He keeps developing and he'll be an all Pac player someday, potentially as soon as next year.

I see Houston as indicative of a late season where we just fell off where we were earlier. Identifying why that occurred and how to build culture so that it does not recur is just as big a deal for Lloyd going forward.

Had the same thought this morning. The question was what kind of recruit Arizona (Coach) needed to get next season? Maybe -guys who are tougher, physical, can get stops on defense..and able to shoot with a let it rip mentality.

It will be easier for Llyod to recruit better athletes to come to Arizona than it was with Gonzaga.

HiCat wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 4:03 pm

I see Houston as indicative of a late season where we just fell off where we were earlier. Identifying why that occurred and how to build culture so that it does not recur is just as big a deal for Lloyd going forward.

Had the same thought this morning. The question was what kind of recruit Arizona (Coach) needed to get next season? Maybe -guys who are tougher, physical, can get stops on defense..and able to shoot with a let it rip mentality.

I sigh hard because I thought we had those guys this year. I give Kerr a pass because other people might not have played on that ankle.

I wound up disappointed that what was a really good defensive and rebounding team sort of ceased to be that late year.

I hope the first step is this...that returners set a tone reflecting they didn't like how this season ended. We got kicked around two straight games, and you hope the guys who lived through it are ready to make sure it does not happen again.

I always talk about responding to losses. How our returners and coaches respond to this one is the first big deal.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 4:49 pm

HiCat wrote: Fri Mar 25, 2022 4:03 pm

I see Houston as indicative of a late season where we just fell off where we were earlier. Identifying why that occurred and how to build culture so that it does not recur is just as big a deal for Lloyd going forward.

Had the same thought this morning. The question was what kind of recruit Arizona (Coach) needed to get next season? Maybe -guys who are tougher, physical, can get stops on defense..and able to shoot with a let it rip mentality.

I sigh hard because I thought we had those guys this year. I give Kerr a pass because other people might not have played on that ankle.

I wound up disappointed that what was a really good defensive and rebounding team sort of ceased to be that late year.

I hope the first step is this...that returners set a tone reflecting they didn't like how this season ended. We got kicked around two straight games, and you hope the guys who lived through it are ready to make sure it does not happen again.

I always talk about responding to losses. How our returners and coaches respond to this one is the first big deal.

Amen to this.

great season i have lots of specific thoughts for this thread as the days march on but kudos to Lloyd who had an incredible first season as the head man in Tucson.

he absolutely overachieved and exceeded almost every expectation coming into the season and rejuvenated a thirsty fanbase with exciting and fun winning regular season basketball.

as a Wildcat fan and supporter i am thrilled about the future and excited for him to mature as a head coach.

some stats:

Mark Few has been the head coach at Gonzaga since 1999. over that period the Bulldogs are 3-13 vs the top three seeds and 0-9 vs number one seeded teams with their last win vs a top three seeded team against #3 seeded Utah in 2016.

for contrast, Lute Olson was 7-3 against number one seeded teams from 1980-2003 and ended his career 7-6 against number one seeds.

Tommy Lloyd has yet to face a top three seeded team as a head coach. i will be paying very close attention to how the numbers play out in the next several years as Gonzaga's poor numbers against top ranked teams, imo has some correlation to style, player choice, and schedule.

Great stuff, 97.

I think there's an under-appreciated connection between what we call "softness" and experience. I think Tommy Lloyd's Arizona will benefit from continuity, both in terms of culture and getting challenged more early. They need a head start in adjusting to what works against Arizona's players and style against pre-conference and conference opponents. Sampson looked like a genius out of nowhere but I think the PAC-12 was also just starting to catch on at the tail end and they'll be ready for us next year, which will prepare us better for the tourney.

Before the tournament, I couldn't have been the only one wondering about inexperience as a factor. In spite of how great this team and coach were this year, this was everyone's FIRST NCAA tournament. That matters. I don't think we were close to our peak performance in any of the three games, and against Houston, I really thought inexperience caught up with us. That, and Houston getting impossibly hot from 3.

I do want to credit Sampson and his guys. Their defense is the real deal, and we could never get into a rhythm on offense. They were in the Final Four last year, so clearly they know how to win in this tournament.

Tommy is going to learn from this experience. He strikes me as a super-competitive, tireless guy, and I expect we'll see much better tourney performances from our team in the coming years. It's hard knowing we're losing Benn and probably CK. Those guys were outstanding. But if there's one thing we know about AZ hoops, it's that new stars are always waiting to arrive and emerge. Tommy's going to bring many great players to Tucson.

Love this coach, excited for the future.

Just watching the tournament play out it reminds me of Lute when he told the guys before overtime that the toughest team would win. You heard Cronin say the same thing when the cats beat UCLA in Vegas.

Watching Houston and Villanova play though is not artistic. It’s a straight up street battle and while teams need to find a way to play through so much contact, the rough style really takes a lot away from the beautiful game of basketball.

I wonder how a coach like Lute or Lloyd can get his team to run their stuff when they are being bumped, held and jammed which minimizes flow.

You have to wonder given the current state of college basketball if the style we play (and Gonzaga), with the way things are officiated in the tournament, can we get it done

The NCAA is going to have to decide what it wants. Allowing teams that play great defense to play physical leads to closer games, but also less exciting ones. Allowing teams that play fast to move through the offensive zone without being grabbed, bumped, and held leads to more high scoring games, but also some blowouts.

Right now they are banking on close games keeping viewers locked in throughout, thus maximizing viewership through the entire game and advertisers ROI. But would more people tune in in anticipation of seeing tourney games with scores in the 80s and 90’s even if there was the possibility of blow outs?

Chicat wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 1:07 pm The NCAA is going to have to decide what it wants. Allowing teams that play great defense to play physical leads to closer games, but also less exciting ones. Allowing teams that play fast to move through the offensive zone without being grabbed, bumped, and held leads to more high scoring games, but also some blowouts.

Right now they are banking on close games keeping viewers locked in throughout, thus maximizing viewership through the entire game and advertisers ROI. But would more people tune in in anticipation of seeing tourney games with scores in the 80s and 90’s even if there was the possibility of blow outs?

It's looking like three of the four E8 games are going to be noncompetitive and the other was one of the worst E8 games in the history of the tournament.

azcat49 wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 12:56 pm Just watching the tournament play out it reminds me of Lute when he told the guys before overtime that the toughest team would win. You heard Cronin say the same thing when the cats beat UCLA in Vegas.

Watching Houston and Villanova play though is not artistic. It’s a straight up street battle and while teams need to find a way to play through so much contact, the rough style really takes a lot away from the beautiful game of basketball.

I wonder how a coach like Lute or Lloyd can get his team to run their stuff when they are being bumped, held and jammed which minimizes flow.

You have to wonder given the current state of college basketball if the style we play (and Gonzaga), with the way things are officiated in the tournament, can we get it done

I think the Zags playing in the championship game two out of the last 5 years is proof enough for me.

Well one was a loss against an up tempo North Carolina team, who was the last non grind it out team to win, and the other was a blow out against Baylor who beat them up.

We might see a couple up tempo teams this year if TV wants that Duke/NC game but I think my question was more about my perceived direction of college basketball. I certainly was not on the Jay Bilas side when he railed for freedom of movement but after watching the sweet 16 it seems that the strategy is a lot of tough
Mindedness, grabbing, holding and very physical play to move forward

The thing is, even though Houston was fouling us a lot, the refs were actually calling things. And then when we got a couple of their guys in foul trouble, we didn't go at them and get them out of the game.

azcat49 wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 12:56 pm Just watching the tournament play out it reminds me of Lute when he told the guys before overtime that the toughest team would win. You heard Cronin say the same thing when the cats beat UCLA in Vegas.

Watching Houston and Villanova play though is not artistic. It’s a straight up street battle and while teams need to find a way to play through so much contact, the rough style really takes a lot away from the beautiful game of basketball.

I wonder how a coach like Lute or Lloyd can get his team to run their stuff when they are being bumped, held and jammed which minimizes flow.

You have to wonder given the current state of college basketball if the style we play (and Gonzaga), with the way things are officiated in the tournament, can we get it done

I think the reality is if Arizona had tougher ball handlers that could create their own shot and attack and finish at the rim, what Houston would've done to us would've been irrelevant because we'd kill them with our guards and that would free up Terry/Bennedict on the wings.

Houston being able to dominate our ball handlers also made it impossible to feed the post, made our size irrelevant. That's the game where we miss Akinjo or a Mark Lyons type. Something similar happened to Miller and PJC and probably even Kadeem Allen. Point guard is still the most important position.

I'm pretty sure Kerr had 20 or less FGs in the paint the entire season. Can't win like that, injured ankle or not.

RondaeShimmy wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 5:15 pm

azcat49 wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 12:56 pm Just watching the tournament play out it reminds me of Lute when he told the guys before overtime that the toughest team would win. You heard Cronin say the same thing when the cats beat UCLA in Vegas.

Watching Houston and Villanova play though is not artistic. It’s a straight up street battle and while teams need to find a way to play through so much contact, the rough style really takes a lot away from the beautiful game of basketball.

I wonder how a coach like Lute or Lloyd can get his team to run their stuff when they are being bumped, held and jammed which minimizes flow.

You have to wonder given the current state of college basketball if the style we play (and Gonzaga), with the way things are officiated in the tournament, can we get it done

I think the reality is if Arizona had tougher ball handlers that could create their own shot and attack and finish at the rim, what Houston would've done to us would've been irrelevant because we'd kill them with our guards and that would free up Terry/Bennedict on the wings.

Houston being able to dominate our ball handlers also made it impossible to feed the post, made our size irrelevant. That's the game where we miss Akinjo or a Mark Lyons type. Something similar happened to Miller and PJC and probably even Kadeem Allen. Point guard is still the most important position.

I'm pretty sure Kerr had 20 or less FGs in the paint the entire season. Can't win like that, injured ankle or not.

We won “like that”. A lot!!!

Remember how bad we looked against UCLA in LA?? Remember the next two games???

Houston couldn’t make threes against Villanova - their legs were gone because of the exertion needed to beat us! The UH/Vill game wasn’t nearly as hectic or physical as our game against Houston. I’d bet on Arizona in a series against Houston, btw…

I do agree we need more quickness at the 1. We couldn’t get in the paint with much efficiency except at time with Terry. BM had the strength but his handle was a bit loose.

We also need more consistency from our 3 ball shooters. I think Larsson really steps up next year and Bal gives us a much needed threat from deep

azcat49 wrote: Sun Mar 27, 2022 6:12 pm I do agree we need more quickness at the 1. We couldn’t get in the paint with much efficiency except at time with Terry. BM had the strength but his handle was a bit loose.

We also need more consistency from our 3 ball shooters. I think Larsson really steps up next year and Bal gives us a much needed threat from deep

Quickness, handles and defense at the 1. As well as we did against tygress Campbell this year, that little fucker still got into the lane too easily. Similar problems against Oregon and Tennessee.