Bear Down Wildcats

pc in NM wrote:

billk78 wrote:

Postmaster wrote:

zonagrad wrote:

Postmaster wrote:Maybe someone from the coaching/training staff should have checked him out.

If you do that, then Green has to be removed. You don’t get to “check someone out” and not exit the game. And at that point, Altman then decides who shoots the FT.

At that point, watching him roll around for that long, I felt it was more important to have him checked out than to let him stay in to shoot.

I agree. Also, if you watch the tv broadcast while he is rolling around Dylan Smith (I think thats who it was) was yelling at him to hurry up and get up because he won't be able to take his FTs if he stays down.

I saw & heard that, too.... Seemed a bit cold!

Dylan didn’t want Altman to pick him to shoot them.

Alieberman wrote:If we finish the regular season behind both ASU and UCLA, I'm not sure how someone can honestly say this year wasn't a failure.

The talent on our roster compared to those 2 aren't even close.

I use to believe that meme (our talent is better) because it get's repeated over and over and over and the Arizona bias fuels these over inflated talking points. With basically a full season in the books the empirical evidence shows otherwise.

Outside of Zeke Nnaji, who was vastly underrated coming in, the other freshmen are very freshmen like and the bench supporting cast is basically average PAC12 talent at best.

We're a middle of the road, PAC12 team and our talent actually isn't better than everyone else's IMO. We have good talent in spots and so does everyone else.

In-fact I'm going to go out on limb and say with little apprehension that if this team didn't have Zeke Nnaji as its primary weapon this team may not even be going to the big dance this year.

In short, the Arizona name of today isn't the respected icon it once was and we don't have better talent. We're OK and that's going to have to be good enough.

Alieberman wrote:If we finish the regular season behind both ASU and UCLA, I'm not sure how someone can honestly say this year wasn't a failure.

The talent on our roster compared to those 2 aren't even close.

This x 1000.

Gladiator Cat wrote:

Alieberman wrote:If we finish the regular season behind both ASU and UCLA, I'm not sure how someone can honestly say this year wasn't a failure.

The talent on our roster compared to those 2 aren't even close.

I use to believe that meme (our talent is better) because it get's repeated over and over and over and the Arizona bias fuels these over inflated talking points. With basically a full season in the books the empirical evidence shows otherwise.

Outside of Zeke Nnaji, who was vastly underrated coming in, the other freshmen are very freshmen like and the bench supporting cast is basically average PAC12 talent at best.

We're a middle of the road, PAC12 team and our talent actually isn't better than everyone else's IMO. We have good talent in spots and so does everyone else.

In-fact I'm going to go out on limb and say with little apprehension that if this team didn't have Zeke Nnaji as its primary weapon this team may not even be going to the big dance this year.

In short, the Arizona name of today isn't the respected icon it once was and we don't have better talent. We're OK and that's going to have to be good enough.

Food for thought:

2019 Recruiting Rankings per ESPN
4. Oregon
5. UGA
6. UW
7. ARIZONA
9. USC
11. UNC
12. UF
16. Texas

2018 Recruiting Rankings
3. UCLA
4. Oregon
8. Texas
15. USC


Arizona basically has no recruiting class from 2018 in regards to the 2020 season -- Brandon Williams is on the shelf. Doutrive has transferred.
Oregon had back to back top 5 classes, plus returned a senior point guard who is arguably a NPOY candidate. And Arizona outplayed Oregon both times only to fail to close the deal and fell in overtime.

Washington had a higher recruiting class rank than Arizona. Check the conference standings for how well that 6th ranked recruiting class is doing. USC has had back to back top 15 recruiting classes and is hovering on the bubble with another mediocre season. Texas has had two solid recruiting classes and is dogshit. Check the ACC standings for Blue Blood North Carolina's performance with their 11th ranked recruiting class.

The criticism is that Sean Miller is blowing it with a stellar recruiting class. The problem is we see a top recruiting class and automatically equate that to Final Four material. And it just isn't so. The cupboard was basically bare this season when you factor Brandon Williams and Devonair Doutrive out of the equation. Compared to UW, USC and even Oregon's great classes, Arizona is actually doing quite well. But our expectations are a product of media hype and projection. If Arizona had an all-conference caliber player or two returning to combine with three great freshmen, then yes you'd have an argument.

These rankings drive home the argument that unless you are pulling a DeAndre Ayton or Zion Williams, a stellar recruiting class isn't going to move the needle as much as you expect. You need roster stability and 4-year players who are really solid contributors.

If all three freshmen were to stay another season (and by talent and performance they should), then the expectations for Arizona would be appropriate.

Beachcat97 wrote:

Alieberman wrote:If we finish the regular season behind both ASU and UCLA, I'm not sure how someone can honestly say this year wasn't a failure.

The talent on our roster compared to those 2 aren't even close.

This x 1000.

Yeah, and you're probably one who thinks that performance at the NBA Combine is the sole measure of NBA "talent", too....

pc in NM wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

Alieberman wrote:If we finish the regular season behind both ASU and UCLA, I'm not sure how someone can honestly say this year wasn't a failure.

The talent on our roster compared to those 2 aren't even close.

This x 1000.

Yeah, and you're probably one who thinks that performance at the NBA Combine is the sole measure of NBA "talent", too....

Nah. I'm the one who thought a class of Nico/Zeke/Josh plus our returners would produce better than a 5th place Pac finish.

UCLA is actually extremely talented, Alford was that bad of a coach

zonagrad wrote:
The criticism is that Sean Miller is blowing it with a stellar recruiting class. The problem is we see a top recruiting class and automatically equate that to Final Four material. And it just isn't so. The cupboard was basically bare this season when you factor Brandon Williams and Devonair Doutrive out of the equation. Compared to UW, USC and even Oregon's great classes, Arizona is actually doing quite well. But our expectations are a product of media hype and projection. If Arizona had an all-conference caliber player or two returning to combine with three great freshmen, then yes you'd have an argument.

These rankings drive home the argument that unless you are pulling a DeAndre Ayton or Zion Williams, a stellar recruiting class isn't going to move the needle as much as you expect. You need roster stability and 4-year players who are really solid contributors.

Miller blew it then too, with the best OAD the UA ever had, and upper classmen in Trier, Ristic, PJC and so on, with solid freshmen Randolph and Akot.

I love how soft our fans have become

PHXCATS wrote:I love how soft our fans have become

Agree. We used to not make so many excuses.

Sad times, indeed.

SCCats wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:I love how soft our fans have become

Agree. We used to not make so many excuses.

Sad times, indeed.

Giving reasons is not the same as making excuses

PHXCATS wrote:I love how soft our fans have become

Could be how soft our players have become. Remember NO EASY BUCKETS?

Merkin wrote:

zonagrad wrote:
The criticism is that Sean Miller is blowing it with a stellar recruiting class. The problem is we see a top recruiting class and automatically equate that to Final Four material. And it just isn't so. The cupboard was basically bare this season when you factor Brandon Williams and Devonair Doutrive out of the equation. Compared to UW, USC and even Oregon's great classes, Arizona is actually doing quite well. But our expectations are a product of media hype and projection. If Arizona had an all-conference caliber player or two returning to combine with three great freshmen, then yes you'd have an argument.

These rankings drive home the argument that unless you are pulling a DeAndre Ayton or Zion Williams, a stellar recruiting class isn't going to move the needle as much as you expect. You need roster stability and 4-year players who are really solid contributors.

Miller blew it then too, with the best OAD the UA ever had, and upper classmen in Trier, Ristic, PJC and so on, with solid freshmen Randolph and Akot.

I’m still amazed we won the conference regular season and tourney despite PJC as our point guard. But that was Miller’s fault to ride that.

Merkin wrote:

PHXCATS wrote:I love how soft our fans have become

Could be how soft our players have become. Remember NO EASY BUCKETS?

Who on the team is soft?

zonagrad wrote:

Merkin wrote:

zonagrad wrote:
The criticism is that Sean Miller is blowing it with a stellar recruiting class. The problem is we see a top recruiting class and automatically equate that to Final Four material. And it just isn't so. The cupboard was basically bare this season when you factor Brandon Williams and Devonair Doutrive out of the equation. Compared to UW, USC and even Oregon's great classes, Arizona is actually doing quite well. But our expectations are a product of media hype and projection. If Arizona had an all-conference caliber player or two returning to combine with three great freshmen, then yes you'd have an argument.

These rankings drive home the argument that unless you are pulling a DeAndre Ayton or Zion Williams, a stellar recruiting class isn't going to move the needle as much as you expect. You need roster stability and 4-year players who are really solid contributors.

Miller blew it then too, with the best OAD the UA ever had, and upper classmen in Trier, Ristic, PJC and so on, with solid freshmen Randolph and Akot.

I’m still amazed we won the conference regular season and tourney despite PJC as our point guard. But that was Miller’s fault to ride that.

I am still amazed how much hate PJC got when he was no where near the issue on the team for years

zonagrad wrote: I’m still amazed we won the conference regular season and tourney despite PJC as our point guard. But that was Miller’s fault to ride that.

Miller sure has Dick Tomey's level of stubbornness in playing players like PJC instead of developing younger talent. I forgot PJC's stats v. Buffalo, but recall he had no assists, and couldn't hit the water from a boat.

Mannion has his faults, but has much better court vision than PJC, and can push it pretty good. PJC was better at running the half court slow down offense than Nico, and don't recall PJC blowing so many leads as this current team does.

I am so tired of this shtick

Just win two games this week ffs. Win a big game for a change. Too much to ask for?

PJC in this thread?!

Beachcat97 wrote:Just win two games this week ffs. Too much to ask for?

Yes

It’s demoralizing that everyone here knows we’re not winning two games this week.

I just need to recalibrate my expectations for this program. They’ve been out of whack for years.

Beachcat97 wrote:It’s demoralizing that everyone here knows we’re not winning two games this week.

I just need to recalibrate my expectations for this program. They’ve been out of whack for years.

We could easily go 2-0 this week.

This team is so frustrating to this fan base because everyone also knows we can go 0-2.

We just have no idea which team will show up

Beachcat97 wrote:It’s demoralizing that everyone here knows we’re not winning two games this week.

I just need to recalibrate my expectations for this program. They’ve been out of whack for years.

It's going to be even more demoralizing when we get swept this week. I don't think we have a chance of beating UCLA. We just don't match up with them. They're stronger and tougher than we are. I just hope we don't get blown out again. That loss at home to them was absolutely humiliating. USC is in desperation mode needing another Q1 win to improve their tournament resume so they'll be ready. I think we finish by sweeping the Washington schools but as flaky as this team is I wouldn't be surprised if we lost one. I'm actually glad this season is heading into the final turn. Probably because we all know how it's going to end. Then summer, then football. Yuck.

zonagrad wrote:

Gladiator Cat wrote:

Alieberman wrote:If we finish the regular season behind both ASU and UCLA, I'm not sure how someone can honestly say this year wasn't a failure.

The talent on our roster compared to those 2 aren't even close.

I use to believe that meme (our talent is better) because it get's repeated over and over and over and the Arizona bias fuels these over inflated talking points. With basically a full season in the books the empirical evidence shows otherwise.

Outside of Zeke Nnaji, who was vastly underrated coming in, the other freshmen are very freshmen like and the bench supporting cast is basically average PAC12 talent at best.

We're a middle of the road, PAC12 team and our talent actually isn't better than everyone else's IMO. We have good talent in spots and so does everyone else.

In-fact I'm going to go out on limb and say with little apprehension that if this team didn't have Zeke Nnaji as its primary weapon this team may not even be going to the big dance this year.

In short, the Arizona name of today isn't the respected icon it once was and we don't have better talent. We're OK and that's going to have to be good enough.

Food for thought:

2019 Recruiting Rankings per ESPN
4. Oregon
5. UGA
6. UW
7. ARIZONA
9. USC
11. UNC
12. UF
16. Texas

2018 Recruiting Rankings
3. UCLA
4. Oregon
8. Texas
15. USC


Arizona basically has no recruiting class from 2018 in regards to the 2020 season -- Brandon Williams is on the shelf. Doutrive has transferred.
Oregon had back to back top 5 classes, plus returned a senior point guard who is arguably a NPOY candidate. And Arizona outplayed Oregon both times only to fail to close the deal and fell in overtime.

Washington had a higher recruiting class rank than Arizona. Check the conference standings for how well that 6th ranked recruiting class is doing. USC has had back to back top 15 recruiting classes and is hovering on the bubble with another mediocre season. Texas has had two solid recruiting classes and is dogshit. Check the ACC standings for Blue Blood North Carolina's performance with their 11th ranked recruiting class.

The criticism is that Sean Miller is blowing it with a stellar recruiting class. The problem is we see a top recruiting class and automatically equate that to Final Four material. And it just isn't so. The cupboard was basically bare this season when you factor Brandon Williams and Devonair Doutrive out of the equation. Compared to UW, USC and even Oregon's great classes, Arizona is actually doing quite well. But our expectations are a product of media hype and projection. If Arizona had an all-conference caliber player or two returning to combine with three great freshmen, then yes you'd have an argument.

These rankings drive home the argument that unless you are pulling a DeAndre Ayton or Zion Williams, a stellar recruiting class isn't going to move the needle as much as you expect. You need roster stability and 4-year players who are really solid contributors.

If all three freshmen were to stay another season (and by talent and performance they should), then the expectations for Arizona would be appropriate.

This is well put.
Also the criteria for one and done seems way different and it seems like many more kids are leaving early and kids that are not nearly as ready for the NBA. Josh is not where Nick was when he went. Nico is not tj yet, and Zeke is no Aaron Gordon, not that he needs to be, but he could stand to put on a few pounds and get more reliable from distance.

I'm not dogging the guys, I just hate seeing guys go early, be woefully unprepared for the league, get drafted and then fizzling out after a couple years and they aren't even in their man body yet.

Would love to see a couple of them come back and work on stuff. That's just me.
Looking forward to the end of OND.
Hope it means we keep our guys for long enough to get to know them and see them improve.

dmjcat wrote:

Guarantee they'll be right as rain by tip-off.

Hopefully they don’t spread that to our guys.

Dosia wrote:Hopefully they don’t spread that to our guys.

My thought too...

UCLA will be hard enough as is without players feeling worn and tired

Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Merkin wrote:Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Moral of the story: for the love of god, stop going all in on 5 star freshmen. It’s a strategy that’s produced very few national champs or FF teams.

I don’t mind the graduate transfers. Or even undergrad transfers like Kadeem, Brown and Akinjo. But there’s a legit question to ask about which player means more to a program, a Nico Mannion or a Peyton Pritchard. There’s room on a roster for both, of course, but Sean has not been getting many high impact 3-4 year players.

Beachcat97 wrote:

Merkin wrote:Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Moral of the story: for the love of god, stop going all in on 5 star freshmen. It’s a strategy that’s produced very few national champs or FF teams.

I don’t mind the graduate transfers. Or even undergrad transfers like Kadeem, Brown and Akinjo. But there’s a legit question to ask about which player means more to a program, a Nico Mannion or a Peyton Pritchard. There’s room on a roster for both, of course, but Sean has not been getting many high impact 3-4 year players.

The bigger issue is that AZ has experienced a high rate of premature turnover from guys that should not leave a program so early. He has been getting 3-4 year players on paper, but they are not staying with the program. Nothing wrong with bringing in guys like Aaron Gordon and Stanley Johnson when your team returns experienced talent and depth. AZ has simply experienced way too much turnover and its roster always seems depleted and inexperienced (and the lost 2018 recruiting class from the bogus FBI tapes story is still being felt).

Beachcat97 wrote:

Merkin wrote:Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Moral of the story: for the love of god, stop going all in on 5 star freshmen. It’s a strategy that’s produced very few national champs or FF teams.

I don’t mind the graduate transfers. Or even undergrad transfers like Kadeem, Brown and Akinjo. But there’s a legit question to ask about which player means more to a program, a Nico Mannion or a Peyton Pritchard. There’s room on a roster for both, of course, but Sean has not been getting many high impact 3-4 year players.

“Very few”

Champs
2012 UK- Davis, Kidd-Gilchrist, Kyle Wiltjer
2015 Duke- Tyus Jones, Okafor, Grayson Allen, Winslow
2016 Villanova- Brunson, DiVencenzo, Mikal Bridges

Final 4
2011 UK- Terrance Jones, Brandon Knight, Doran Lamb
2013 Michigan- Glenn Robinson, Mitch McGary, Nik Stauskas, Caris LeVert
2013 Cuse- Jerami Grant
2014 UK- Harrison twins, Julius Randle
2015 UK- Booker, Ulis, Towns, Lyles
2017 Gonzaga- Rui, Zach Collins, Norvell

So only 3 times in the last decade have all four final 4 teams not had a major contributing freshman. These teams had multiple (except the cuse team). It’s a strategy that DOES work. Yes, having upperclassmen absolutely helps. But you can’t say it doesn’t work.

IndianaZonaFan wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

Merkin wrote:Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Moral of the story: for the love of god, stop going all in on 5 star freshmen. It’s a strategy that’s produced very few national champs or FF teams.

I don’t mind the graduate transfers. Or even undergrad transfers like Kadeem, Brown and Akinjo. But there’s a legit question to ask about which player means more to a program, a Nico Mannion or a Peyton Pritchard. There’s room on a roster for both, of course, but Sean has not been getting many high impact 3-4 year players.

“Very few”

Champs
2012 UK- Davis, Kidd-Gilchrist, Kyle Wiltjer
2015 Duke- Tyus Jones, Okafor, Grayson Allen, Winslow
2016 Villanova- Brunson, DiVencenzo, Mikal Bridges

Final 4
2011 UK- Terrance Jones, Brandon Knight, Doran Lamb
2013 Michigan- Glenn Robinson, Mitch McGary, Nik Stauskas, Caris LeVert
2013 Cuse- Jerami Grant
2014 UK- Harrison twins, Julius Randle
2015 UK- Booker, Ulis, Towns, Lyles
2017 Gonzaga- Rui, Zach Collins, Norvell

So only 3 times in the last decade have all four final 4 teams not had a major contributing freshman. These teams had multiple (except the cuse team). It’s a strategy that DOES work. Yes, having upperclassmen absolutely helps. But you can’t say it doesn’t work.

But...most if not all of these teams you've listed, Indiana, had at least one key upperclassmen. In some cases, *multiple* key upperclassmen. That '12 UK team was very freshmen-driven, but Duke in '15 and Nova in '16 absolutely had important juniors and/or seniors. I can't speak on that list of FF teams, but I would suspect it's similar.

The strategy to load your roster with 5-star freshmen *only* works when/if you've got these high-impact upperclassmen, and if push came to shove, I'd rather have the latter than the former. It's the Pritchard > Mannion argument.

Beachcat97 wrote:

Merkin wrote:Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Moral of the story: for the love of god, stop going all in on 5 star freshmen. It’s a strategy that’s produced very few national champs or FF teams.

I don’t mind the graduate transfers. Or even undergrad transfers like Kadeem, Brown and Akinjo. But there’s a legit question to ask about which player means more to a program, a Nico Mannion or a Peyton Pritchard. There’s room on a roster for both, of course, but Sean has not been getting many high impact 3-4 year players.

Then Greg talked about how star studded the Cologuard Classic field is and how golf isn't about Tiger Woods because Lee Janzen is coming to Tucson this week!

This is a topic that is way too complex for Greg Hansen's intellectual capabilities.

Beachcat97 wrote:

IndianaZonaFan wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

Merkin wrote:Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Moral of the story: for the love of god, stop going all in on 5 star freshmen. It’s a strategy that’s produced very few national champs or FF teams.

I don’t mind the graduate transfers. Or even undergrad transfers like Kadeem, Brown and Akinjo. But there’s a legit question to ask about which player means more to a program, a Nico Mannion or a Peyton Pritchard. There’s room on a roster for both, of course, but Sean has not been getting many high impact 3-4 year players.

“Very few”

Champs
2012 UK- Davis, Kidd-Gilchrist, Kyle Wiltjer
2015 Duke- Tyus Jones, Okafor, Grayson Allen, Winslow
2016 Villanova- Brunson, DiVencenzo, Mikal Bridges

Final 4
2011 UK- Terrance Jones, Brandon Knight, Doran Lamb
2013 Michigan- Glenn Robinson, Mitch McGary, Nik Stauskas, Caris LeVert
2013 Cuse- Jerami Grant
2014 UK- Harrison twins, Julius Randle
2015 UK- Booker, Ulis, Towns, Lyles
2017 Gonzaga- Rui, Zach Collins, Norvell

So only 3 times in the last decade have all four final 4 teams not had a major contributing freshman. These teams had multiple (except the cuse team). It’s a strategy that DOES work. Yes, having upperclassmen absolutely helps. But you can’t say it doesn’t work.

But...most if not all of these teams you've listed, Indiana, had at least one key upperclassmen. In some cases, *multiple* key upperclassmen. That '12 UK team was very freshmen-driven, but Duke in '15 and Nova in '16 absolutely had important juniors and/or seniors. I can't speak on that list of FF teams, but I would suspect it's similar.

The strategy to load your roster with 5-star freshmen *only* works when/if you've got these high-impact upperclassmen, and if push came to shove, I'd rather have the latter than the former. It's the Pritchard > Mannion argument.

Exactly. Few Freshmen-dominant teams (meaning the starters and many of the role players are freshmen) have made Final Fours or won titles over the past 24 years since AZ won its title. Great freshmen can make an impact, be stars of the team, etc., but most teams need experienced depth.

IndianaZonaFan wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

Merkin wrote:Interesting article from Hansen about possible FF teams and lack of freshmen.

https://tucson.com/sports/greghansen/gr ... YhLoTP4stk" target="_blank

Moral of the story: for the love of god, stop going all in on 5 star freshmen. It’s a strategy that’s produced very few national champs or FF teams.

I don’t mind the graduate transfers. Or even undergrad transfers like Kadeem, Brown and Akinjo. But there’s a legit question to ask about which player means more to a program, a Nico Mannion or a Peyton Pritchard. There’s room on a roster for both, of course, but Sean has not been getting many high impact 3-4 year players.

“Very few”

Champs
2012 UK- Davis, Kidd-Gilchrist, Kyle Wiltjer
2015 Duke- Tyus Jones, Okafor, Grayson Allen, Winslow
2016 Villanova- Brunson, DiVencenzo, Mikal Bridges

Final 4
2011 UK- Terrance Jones, Brandon Knight, Doran Lamb
2013 Michigan- Glenn Robinson, Mitch McGary, Nik Stauskas, Caris LeVert
2013 Cuse- Jerami Grant
2014 UK- Harrison twins, Julius Randle
2015 UK- Booker, Ulis, Towns, Lyles
2017 Gonzaga- Rui, Zach Collins, Norvell

So only 3 times in the last decade have all four final 4 teams not had a major contributing freshman. These teams had multiple (except the cuse team). It’s a strategy that DOES work. Yes, having upperclassmen absolutely helps. But you can’t say it doesn’t work.

It works for 1 man - John Calipari.
Can't even say it really works for Coach K. he made it 1 year. and had a 5* SR PG in Quinn Cook
"Nova - Brunson started, bridges came off the bench and DeVencenzo got 8 minutes a game
Gonzaga - Collins came off the bench w/ 17 min and Rui off the bench with 5 minutes. Norvell was not on the team.

My point was not that it’s the BEST strategy. But that it has worked for other teams. Just making sure we are t discounting the importance of 5 star players. Not saying it’s the best strategy to have to replace more than half of your starters every single year. It’s just hard to navigate with players thinking they are all worthy of being one and done. If it weren’t for this year’s weak draft class, I would think 2 of our freshmen starters would return. But that’s not the case and it’s possible we lose all 3 of them unfortunately

IndianaZonaFan wrote:My point was not that it’s the BEST strategy. But that it has worked for other teams. Just making sure we are t discounting the importance of 5 star players. Not saying it’s the best strategy to have to replace more than half of your starters every single year. It’s just hard to navigate with players thinking they are all worthy of being one and done. If it weren’t for this year’s weak draft class, I would think 2 of our freshmen starters would return. But that’s not the case and it’s possible we lose all 3 of them unfortunately

But Indiana, how many 5-stars does Gonzaga currently have? How about San Diego State? How about Baylor? How about Dayton? Florida State? How many did UVA have last year?

I'm not saying that we should just discontinue our practice of recruiting 5-star players. I *am* saying that many teams reach the top 5 without a single one of these players.

Beachcat97 wrote:Just win two games this week ffs. Win a big game for a change. Too much to ask for?

Maybe you should teach free throw shooting Riverside. I mean Miller only hit 90% in college and won the coaches challenge. How disappointed do you think he was? Koloko I get....not his deal yet.

Beachcat97 wrote:

IndianaZonaFan wrote:My point was not that it’s the BEST strategy. But that it has worked for other teams. Just making sure we are t discounting the importance of 5 star players. Not saying it’s the best strategy to have to replace more than half of your starters every single year. It’s just hard to navigate with players thinking they are all worthy of being one and done. If it weren’t for this year’s weak draft class, I would think 2 of our freshmen starters would return. But that’s not the case and it’s possible we lose all 3 of them unfortunately

But Indiana, how many 5-stars does Gonzaga currently have? How about San Diego State? How about Baylor? How about Dayton? Florida State? How many did UVA have last year?

I'm not saying that we should just discontinue our practice of recruiting 5-star players. I *am* saying that many teams reach the top 5 without a single one of these players.

Riverside....you know what the top four teams have in common? Didn't think so.

Hearing no Josh Green tonight

NickyBCats wrote:Hearing no Josh Green tonight

Concussion?

Just great

Well, talk about sandbagging the fans. If he has concussion it would have been known quite a while ago, right? HIPPA rules notwithstanding isn't it typical to speak publicly about player injury? How long before UofA mentioned PJC's concussion?

Josh didn't make the trip to LA. Out for ucla too

Fuck

Sprained SI from fall accumulation against Oregon????

Sure. Sounds legit.

Absolutely pathetic performance tonight....team just sucks, nothing else to say. Need to move on.

goslingswagg wrote:Absolutely pathetic performance tonight....team just sucks, nothing else to say. Need to move on.

Miller needs to pack his belongings and move on

Offensive philosophy and coaching is pure shit

Metrics be damned, zero ability to utilize your quickness and athletes on D to speed games up

Deciding to press with 56 seconds left down 9 is abominable