Bear Down Wildcats

UAEebs86 wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:02 pm

I mean, his 3 point shooting isn't ideal, but we need a SF and he's a capable SF.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or4IOTXVio4

Brooks can slash, create and shoot. Would be a huge get if it happens.

Beachcat97 wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:43 pm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or4IOTXVio4

Brooks can slash, create and shoot. Would be a huge get if it happens.

The shooting is the worry. 26%, 21% and 23% from three across his 3 years at Kentucky.

He is fairly efficient given the poor shooting, rebounds well and should have good defensive ability. Not sure he's a passer given his assist #'s, but he's our best bet to fill Terry's spot.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:53 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:43 pm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or4IOTXVio4

Brooks can slash, create and shoot. Would be a huge get if it happens.

The shooting is the worry. 26%, 21% and 23% from three across his 3 years at Kentucky.

He is fairly efficient given the poor shooting, rebounds well and should have good defensive ability. Not sure he's a passer given his assist #'s, but he's our best bet to fill Terry's spot.

He has good size, very similar to Terry. He may even be slightly bouncier than Terry, maybe just not as quick.

I think he'd fit into our starting lineup well. KK, PL, KB, AT, OB...that's a heck of a lot closer to a lineup that can compete for a Pac title.

Brooks would be great; not ideal, but plugs in some holes. Outside of that, Lloyd is going to have to scavenge the mid majors and the DII's (or lower). Maybe he can find a serviceable player or another Derrick White (Colorado) or Brandon Clarke (Gonzaga).

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:53 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 6:43 pm https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or4IOTXVio4

Brooks can slash, create and shoot. Would be a huge get if it happens.

The shooting is the worry. 26%, 21% and 23% from three across his 3 years at Kentucky.

He is fairly efficient given the poor shooting, rebounds well and should have good defensive ability. Not sure he's a passer given his assist #'s, but he's our best bet to fill Terry's spot.

It's wild that he's a pretty darn good free throw shooter (80%) and shoots well from 2 (40%) but can't hit from distance. Mechanics are wonky... don't translate well to distance. But man, he can hit a midrange with the best of them.

YoDeFoe wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 4:17 pm Keep chanting "Free Dom Harris" - together we can change the world

He’d have to sit out a year….missed the May 1st transfer protocol

ZagCatFan wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 7:42 pm

YoDeFoe wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 4:17 pm Keep chanting "Free Dom Harris" - together we can change the world

He’d have to sit out a year….missed the May 1st transfer protocol

DeFoe already mentioned that he would likely get a waiver from NCAA due to sitting out last year, and Gonzaga would probably be fine with him leaving to get a different recruit with his scholly.

Brooks on Campus, Proctor just reclassed and will play for Duke next season. Doubt Ramey goes there now. Can we get both please?

NickyBCats wrote: Thu Jun 02, 2022 8:09 pm Brooks on Campus, Proctor just reclassed and will play for Duke next season. Doubt Ramey goes there now. Can we get both please?

coming out of this situation with Brooks and Ramey/Dom Harris would be pretty awesome….get er done TL

I haven't seen Ramey, but I'll take others' enthusiasm here as a good sign.

Lloyd now has much more playing time to sell. Shouldn't be a hard pitch to some of these guys, especially given that we're about to have three guys drafted.

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 7:52 am I haven't seen Ramey, but I'll take others' enthusiasm here as a good sign.

Lloyd now has much more playing time to sell. Shouldn't be a hard pitch to some of these guys, especially given that we're about to have three guys drafted.

Ramey is a solid two way guard. My biggest question is how we take two guys who are accustomed to starting at big time programs and convince at least one to come off the bench.

Brooks started every game last year and Ramey started 58 of his last 60. It's usually unrealistic to think someone who starts at KY or TX will leave to get demoted to the bench.

I don't see how Kerr and Larsson don't start, so at least one of the two is looking at the bench. Add Bal in and it's difficult to honestly sell either one automatically being the starter. I think Brooks slots so naturally into Terry's SF position he starts. So, how do we sell Ramey, a 4 year starter, on taking a bench role?

To your point about how good Ramey is...he's better than Kier, which is a positive and negative.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 8:30 am

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 7:52 am I haven't seen Ramey, but I'll take others' enthusiasm here as a good sign.

Lloyd now has much more playing time to sell. Shouldn't be a hard pitch to some of these guys, especially given that we're about to have three guys drafted.

Ramey is a solid two way guard. My biggest question is how we take two guys who are accustomed to starting at big time programs and convince at least one to come off the bench.

Brooks started every game last year and Ramey started 58 of his last 60. It's usually unrealistic to think someone who starts at KY or TX will leave to get demoted to the bench.

I don't see how Kerr and Larsson don't start, so at least one of the two is looking at the bench. Add Bal in and it's difficult to honestly sell either one automatically being the starter. I think Brooks slots so naturally into Terry's SF position he starts. So, how do we sell Ramey, a 4 year starter, on taking a bench role?

To your point about how good Ramey is...he's better than Kier, which is a positive and negative.

I was thinking: Kriisa, Larsson, Brooks, Tubelis, Ballo as our staring five. Ramey, Bal, Veesaar off the bench.

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 8:44 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 8:30 am

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 7:52 am I haven't seen Ramey, but I'll take others' enthusiasm here as a good sign.

Lloyd now has much more playing time to sell. Shouldn't be a hard pitch to some of these guys, especially given that we're about to have three guys drafted.

Ramey is a solid two way guard. My biggest question is how we take two guys who are accustomed to starting at big time programs and convince at least one to come off the bench.

Brooks started every game last year and Ramey started 58 of his last 60. It's usually unrealistic to think someone who starts at KY or TX will leave to get demoted to the bench.

I don't see how Kerr and Larsson don't start, so at least one of the two is looking at the bench. Add Bal in and it's difficult to honestly sell either one automatically being the starter. I think Brooks slots so naturally into Terry's SF position he starts. So, how do we sell Ramey, a 4 year starter, on taking a bench role?

To your point about how good Ramey is...he's better than Kier, which is a positive and negative.

I was thinking: Kriisa, Larsson, Brooks, Tubelis, Ballo as our staring five. Ramey, Bal, Veesaar off the bench.

I agree that's how I think it would shake out on the perimeter, although I think we eventually see Tubelis and Veesaar starting at the 4-5 and it's just a question of how long it takes.

I just wonder whether Ramey is ready to come here after being a 4 year starter if his role is the bench. It's not like he's Kier where the selling point is no longer being on a bottom feeding P5 team and giving up a starting role on that crap team in exchange for a 20 mpg bench role on a really good team.

Ramey's been a starter on high level tourney teams. If he goes somewhere other than Arizona, he could be a starter on a tourney team next year. Is he ready to accept the bench?

put me in the camp that thinks HV starts day one…too talented and too perfect of a fit for Tommy’s system to go with Ballo over him

goslingswagg wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:13 am put me in the camp that thinks HV starts day one…too talented and too perfect of a fit for Tommy’s system to go with Ballo over him

Ballo already knows the system, though, and is possibly a better defensive player.

Brooks would be an interesting fit. Hes not someone Lloyd had last year. He definitely isnt going to fill Dalen's role. He looks more like a tweener 4 who can masquerade some at the 3. Doesnt look great defending on the perimeter, Kentucky had him mainly at the 4, banging in the post and helping around the rim.

I assume he would play a similar role here, as someone who operates as the DHO guy, and not the guy receiving the DHO (like Terry). Although, I think he could see some time in jumbo lineups at the 3, to help get the ball downhill and draw fouls, pressure the offensive glass.

He reminds me of a 3 that Miller would have, and we would be asking for him the play the 4.

Albeit it was a limited review of how he plays. Watching him inside that offense, he was spotting up, moving around, and working without the ball, posting up, grabbing offensive rebounds. Similar defensively. Hes athletic, but didnt look great sliding laterally, or staying up on guards.

Not sold on him at the 3 on either end of the floor, but it certainly could be worse. If we end the class with Ramey and Brooks, that fills multiple needs, regardless of how we think they fit. So difficult to be too upset.

Small sample size of two games (Tennessee and Auburn), so take it for what its worth.

goslingswagg wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:13 am put me in the camp that thinks HV starts day one…too talented and too perfect of a fit for Tommy’s system to go with Ballo over him

I think HV starts roughly midway through conference season.

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:21 am

goslingswagg wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:13 am put me in the camp that thinks HV starts day one…too talented and too perfect of a fit for Tommy’s system to go with Ballo over him

Ballo already knows the system, though, and is possibly a better defensive player.

I wouldn't say that. Veesaar is mobile in a way Ballo can't dream of. He also blocks a fair number of shots, so he brings a lot of the rim protection without the lack of mobility Ballo has.

The only reason I don't install Veesaar day 1 is the learning curve. But he'll get there. His offensive versatility is light years ahead of Ballo too.

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:40 am Brooks would be an interesting fit. Hes not someone Lloyd had last year. He definitely isnt going to fill Dalen's role. He looks more like a tweener 4 who can masquerade some at the 3. Doesnt look great defending on the perimeter, Kentucky had him mainly at the 4, banging in the post and helping around the rim.

I assume he would play a similar role here, as someone who operates as the DHO guy, and not the guy receiving the DHO (like Terry). Although, I think he could see some time in jumbo lineups at the 3, to help get the ball downhill and draw fouls, pressure the offensive glass.

He reminds me of a 3 that Miller would have, and we would be asking for him the play the 4.

Albeit it was a limited review of how he plays. Watching him inside that offense, he was spotting up, moving around, and working without the ball, posting up, grabbing offensive rebounds. Similar defensively. Hes athletic, but didnt look great sliding laterally, or staying up on guards.

Not sold on him at the 3 on either end of the floor, but it certainly could be worse. If we end the class with Ramey and Brooks, that fills multiple needs, regardless of how we think they fit. So difficult to be too upset.

Small sample size of two games (Tennessee and Auburn), so take it for what its worth.

I think Brooks is more naturally a small 4, but I don't see the roles aligning. Tubelis should start at the 4 and get a minimum of 25 mpg. Ballo and Veesaar should be 20+ as well, so we're looking at maybe 5-10 minutes. For all of those to go to Brooks, Anderson basically would redshirt.

Compared to the perimeter where, absent Brooks, we have 3 guys for 3 positions right now. Ramey would make 4. You have Borocavinin floating in the background like Anderson, although I see Borocavinin as much in the small 4 vein as Brooks is.

Just bottom line, the minutes are on the perimeter, so I think we'd have to live with Brooks there. That said, I felt that during the Efe talk, I wasn't on the same page with Lloyd at all.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:59 am

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:21 am

goslingswagg wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:13 am put me in the camp that thinks HV starts day one…too talented and too perfect of a fit for Tommy’s system to go with Ballo over him

Ballo already knows the system, though, and is possibly a better defensive player.

I wouldn't say that. Veesaar is mobile in a way Ballo can't dream of. He also blocks a fair number of shots, so he brings a lot of the rim protection without the lack of mobility Ballo has.

The only reason I don't install Veesaar day 1 is the learning curve. But he'll get there. His offensive versatility is light years ahead of Ballo too.

You guys are getting me pumped to see Veesaar in an AZ jersey!

When the dust settles, I still don't think we''ll bring in enough to offset the loss of Terry, Mathurin and Koloko. But it's also possible we'll just have a different looking team. Veesaar is unlike anyone on last year's roster. Same would be true of Brooks, if he comes to AZ. We'll have a lower ceiling next season, imo, but if things click, we should still make the tourney.

Sometimes I wonder if it's better to let young guys get experience instead of bringing in 1 years guys to make sure we make the tournament. Let the young guys play more to be ready for a ff run in 2023. Just a thought

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:05 am

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:40 am Brooks would be an interesting fit. Hes not someone Lloyd had last year. He definitely isnt going to fill Dalen's role. He looks more like a tweener 4 who can masquerade some at the 3. Doesnt look great defending on the perimeter, Kentucky had him mainly at the 4, banging in the post and helping around the rim.

I assume he would play a similar role here, as someone who operates as the DHO guy, and not the guy receiving the DHO (like Terry). Although, I think he could see some time in jumbo lineups at the 3, to help get the ball downhill and draw fouls, pressure the offensive glass.

He reminds me of a 3 that Miller would have, and we would be asking for him the play the 4.

Albeit it was a limited review of how he plays. Watching him inside that offense, he was spotting up, moving around, and working without the ball, posting up, grabbing offensive rebounds. Similar defensively. Hes athletic, but didnt look great sliding laterally, or staying up on guards.

Not sold on him at the 3 on either end of the floor, but it certainly could be worse. If we end the class with Ramey and Brooks, that fills multiple needs, regardless of how we think they fit. So difficult to be too upset.

Small sample size of two games (Tennessee and Auburn), so take it for what its worth.

I think Brooks is more naturally a small 4, but I don't see the roles aligning. Tubelis should start at the 4 and get a minimum of 25 mpg. Ballo and Veesaar should be 20+ as well, so we're looking at maybe 5-10 minutes. For all of those to go to Brooks, Anderson basically would redshirt.

Compared to the perimeter where, absent Brooks, we have 3 guys for 3 positions right now. Ramey would make 4. You have Borocavinin floating in the background like Anderson, although I see Borocavinin as much in the small 4 vein as Brooks is.

Just bottom line, the minutes are on the perimeter, so I think we'd have to live with Brooks there. That said, I felt that during the Efe talk, I wasn't on the same page with Lloyd at all.

I was all over Efe, and wanted him quite a bit. Thought he would clearly start at the 5. That said, ill believe Ballo can handle 25 minutes when I see it. I see him at 15-20, pending matchups.

If we land Brooks, I can likely see him starting at the 3, but not sure how that plays out. Id prefer Pelle start there, as I think Brooks' best minutes come at the 4, but same with Zu. I could see him getting 10 at the 3, and the start, and 15 at the 4. Pelle comes in first sub, Zu and/or Ballo out, Brooks slides up to the 4, HV/Zu to the 5.

I dont have any expectations that Anderson sees much of the floor barring injury or foul trouble.

84Cat wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:11 am Sometimes I wonder if it's better to let young guys get experience instead of bringing in 1 years guys to make sure we make the tournament. Let the young guys play more to be ready for a ff run in 2023. Just a thought

We don’t have enough guys right now to serve enough depth on the team. We have to add a couple of guys. Also new guys won’t prevent our young guys from getting PT.

ChooChooCat wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:36 am

84Cat wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:11 am Sometimes I wonder if it's better to let young guys get experience instead of bringing in 1 years guys to make sure we make the tournament. Let the young guys play more to be ready for a ff run in 2023. Just a thought

We don’t have enough guys right now to serve enough depth on the team. We have to add a couple of guys. Also new guys won’t prevent our young guys from getting PT.

Choo, is our depleted roster by any chance reopening the possibility of Boswell and/or Lewis reclassifying to '22, or has that ship sailed?

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:16 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:05 am

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:40 am Brooks would be an interesting fit. Hes not someone Lloyd had last year. He definitely isnt going to fill Dalen's role. He looks more like a tweener 4 who can masquerade some at the 3. Doesnt look great defending on the perimeter, Kentucky had him mainly at the 4, banging in the post and helping around the rim.

I assume he would play a similar role here, as someone who operates as the DHO guy, and not the guy receiving the DHO (like Terry). Although, I think he could see some time in jumbo lineups at the 3, to help get the ball downhill and draw fouls, pressure the offensive glass.

He reminds me of a 3 that Miller would have, and we would be asking for him the play the 4.

Albeit it was a limited review of how he plays. Watching him inside that offense, he was spotting up, moving around, and working without the ball, posting up, grabbing offensive rebounds. Similar defensively. Hes athletic, but didnt look great sliding laterally, or staying up on guards.

Not sold on him at the 3 on either end of the floor, but it certainly could be worse. If we end the class with Ramey and Brooks, that fills multiple needs, regardless of how we think they fit. So difficult to be too upset.

Small sample size of two games (Tennessee and Auburn), so take it for what its worth.

I think Brooks is more naturally a small 4, but I don't see the roles aligning. Tubelis should start at the 4 and get a minimum of 25 mpg. Ballo and Veesaar should be 20+ as well, so we're looking at maybe 5-10 minutes. For all of those to go to Brooks, Anderson basically would redshirt.

Compared to the perimeter where, absent Brooks, we have 3 guys for 3 positions right now. Ramey would make 4. You have Borocavinin floating in the background like Anderson, although I see Borocavinin as much in the small 4 vein as Brooks is.

Just bottom line, the minutes are on the perimeter, so I think we'd have to live with Brooks there. That said, I felt that during the Efe talk, I wasn't on the same page with Lloyd at all.

I was all over Efe, and wanted him quite a bit. Thought he would clearly start at the 5. That said, ill believe Ballo can handle 25 minutes when I see it. I see him at 15-20, pending matchups.

If we land Brooks, I can likely see him starting at the 3, but not sure how that plays out. Id prefer Pelle start there, as I think Brooks' best minutes come at the 4, but same with Zu. I could see him getting 10 at the 3, and the start, and 15 at the 4. Pelle comes in first sub, Zu and/or Ballo out, Brooks slides up to the 4, HV/Zu to the 5.

I dont have any expectations that Anderson sees much of the floor barring injury or foul trouble.

I was a charter member of skepticism about Ballo, but even with Koloko (who I intially believed it would be impossible for him to play alongside) he carved out 15-20 mpg last year. Now that he's the only true 5 on the roster, I can easily see that at 20-25.

Veesaar is the guy I think really changes the dynamic, though. Tubelis gets 25-30, so you're looking at he and Ballo getting probably 50-55 minutes between them. I like Veesaar's ceiling and think he'll be 25-30 by season's end, just a matter of how fast he gets there.

And that's basically a wrap minutes wise for the 4/5, as I don't like the idea of Veesaar or Tubelis chasing a 3.

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:12 am
, as I don't like the idea of Veesaar or Tubelis chasing a 3.

Me neither. That's where Brooks and Bal are needed.

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:52 am

ChooChooCat wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:36 am

84Cat wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:11 am Sometimes I wonder if it's better to let young guys get experience instead of bringing in 1 years guys to make sure we make the tournament. Let the young guys play more to be ready for a ff run in 2023. Just a thought

We don’t have enough guys right now to serve enough depth on the team. We have to add a couple of guys. Also new guys won’t prevent our young guys from getting PT.

Choo, is our depleted roster by any chance reopening the possibility of Boswell and/or Lewis reclassifying to '22, or has that ship sailed?

Nah, it won’t be necessary, plus it’s better for all parties if they don’t come in until 2023.

Ballo: 15-20min
Zu: 25-30min
Veesaar: 20-25min

Total: 60-75min

So that leaves between 5 and 20min available for Brooks at the four.

My best guess:

Ballo: 17min
Zu: 27min
Veesaar: 23min

Which leaves 13min/g for Brooks at the four and another 12min/g for him at the three (basically all of the non-Pelle minutes).

That conflicts with the nine man rotation / Boro minutes, but you can solve for that by reducing the above guys to their mins (15 / 25 / 20), giving 15min for Brooks at the four and 10min for him at the three, with Boro getting the remaining 5 min at the four and whatever is left at the three (a handful of non-Pelle/non-Brooks minutes depending on the two guard rotation).

Edit: This is all so useless but I do this dumb "what might the minutes be" thing every offseason

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:12 am

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:16 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:05 am

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:40 am Brooks would be an interesting fit. Hes not someone Lloyd had last year. He definitely isnt going to fill Dalen's role. He looks more like a tweener 4 who can masquerade some at the 3. Doesnt look great defending on the perimeter, Kentucky had him mainly at the 4, banging in the post and helping around the rim.

I assume he would play a similar role here, as someone who operates as the DHO guy, and not the guy receiving the DHO (like Terry). Although, I think he could see some time in jumbo lineups at the 3, to help get the ball downhill and draw fouls, pressure the offensive glass.

He reminds me of a 3 that Miller would have, and we would be asking for him the play the 4.

Albeit it was a limited review of how he plays. Watching him inside that offense, he was spotting up, moving around, and working without the ball, posting up, grabbing offensive rebounds. Similar defensively. Hes athletic, but didnt look great sliding laterally, or staying up on guards.

Not sold on him at the 3 on either end of the floor, but it certainly could be worse. If we end the class with Ramey and Brooks, that fills multiple needs, regardless of how we think they fit. So difficult to be too upset.

Small sample size of two games (Tennessee and Auburn), so take it for what its worth.

I think Brooks is more naturally a small 4, but I don't see the roles aligning. Tubelis should start at the 4 and get a minimum of 25 mpg. Ballo and Veesaar should be 20+ as well, so we're looking at maybe 5-10 minutes. For all of those to go to Brooks, Anderson basically would redshirt.

Compared to the perimeter where, absent Brooks, we have 3 guys for 3 positions right now. Ramey would make 4. You have Borocavinin floating in the background like Anderson, although I see Borocavinin as much in the small 4 vein as Brooks is.

Just bottom line, the minutes are on the perimeter, so I think we'd have to live with Brooks there. That said, I felt that during the Efe talk, I wasn't on the same page with Lloyd at all.

I was all over Efe, and wanted him quite a bit. Thought he would clearly start at the 5. That said, ill believe Ballo can handle 25 minutes when I see it. I see him at 15-20, pending matchups.

If we land Brooks, I can likely see him starting at the 3, but not sure how that plays out. Id prefer Pelle start there, as I think Brooks' best minutes come at the 4, but same with Zu. I could see him getting 10 at the 3, and the start, and 15 at the 4. Pelle comes in first sub, Zu and/or Ballo out, Brooks slides up to the 4, HV/Zu to the 5.

I dont have any expectations that Anderson sees much of the floor barring injury or foul trouble.

I was a charter member of skepticism about Ballo, but even with Koloko (who I intially believed it would be impossible for him to play alongside) he carved out 15-20 mpg last year. Now that he's the only true 5 on the roster, I can easily see that at 20-25.

Veesaar is the guy I think really changes the dynamic, though. Tubelis gets 25-30, so you're looking at he and Ballo getting probably 50-55 minutes between them. I like Veesaar's ceiling and think he'll be 25-30 by season's end, just a matter of how fast he gets there.

And that's basically a wrap minutes wise for the 4/5, as I don't like the idea of Veesaar or Tubelis chasing a 3.

Im not sold on Zu playing 30 minutes either. He averaged 24.6, which was 5th among starters. Ballo averaged 15.2. I think its reasonable to expect them to play more this year, but not at the expense of playing Brooks at the 3 full time.

I think Zu is fine where he is at, unless he makes strides passing, shooting, defending. Ballo is somewhat likewise, although I think he does get the bump to 20 just based on his size and rim protection.

4: Zu 25, Brooks 15
5: Ballo 18, HV 18, Up for grabs 4.

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:32 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:12 am
, as I don't like the idea of Veesaar or Tubelis chasing a 3.

Me neither. That's where Brooks and Bal are needed.

Pelle, Brooks and Bal.

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 2:04 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:32 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:12 am
, as I don't like the idea of Veesaar or Tubelis chasing a 3.

Me neither. That's where Brooks and Bal are needed.

Pelle, Brooks and Bal.

How impressed are you with Pelle as a defender? He's not bad, but he doesn't have the lateral speed of these other guys.

We need someone who can guard the other team's most athletic player.

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 2:20 pm

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 2:04 pm

Beachcat97 wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:32 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:12 am
, as I don't like the idea of Veesaar or Tubelis chasing a 3.

Me neither. That's where Brooks and Bal are needed.

Pelle, Brooks and Bal.

How impressed are you with Pelle as a defender? He's not bad, but he doesn't have the lateral speed of these other guys.

We need someone who can guard the other team's most athletic player.

Considering Bal looked lost on the floor a lot last year, and Brooks doesnt profile to anything near a wing stopper, at least from the little I have seen, Pelle is definitely the better option of the three. Ramey would be clutch, because thats the type of defender we are lacking on the perimeter.

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 2:03 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 11:12 am

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:16 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 10:05 am

TucsonClip wrote: Fri Jun 03, 2022 9:40 am Brooks would be an interesting fit. Hes not someone Lloyd had last year. He definitely isnt going to fill Dalen's role. He looks more like a tweener 4 who can masquerade some at the 3. Doesnt look great defending on the perimeter, Kentucky had him mainly at the 4, banging in the post and helping around the rim.

I assume he would play a similar role here, as someone who operates as the DHO guy, and not the guy receiving the DHO (like Terry). Although, I think he could see some time in jumbo lineups at the 3, to help get the ball downhill and draw fouls, pressure the offensive glass.

He reminds me of a 3 that Miller would have, and we would be asking for him the play the 4.

Albeit it was a limited review of how he plays. Watching him inside that offense, he was spotting up, moving around, and working without the ball, posting up, grabbing offensive rebounds. Similar defensively. Hes athletic, but didnt look great sliding laterally, or staying up on guards.

Not sold on him at the 3 on either end of the floor, but it certainly could be worse. If we end the class with Ramey and Brooks, that fills multiple needs, regardless of how we think they fit. So difficult to be too upset.

Small sample size of two games (Tennessee and Auburn), so take it for what its worth.

I think Brooks is more naturally a small 4, but I don't see the roles aligning. Tubelis should start at the 4 and get a minimum of 25 mpg. Ballo and Veesaar should be 20+ as well, so we're looking at maybe 5-10 minutes. For all of those to go to Brooks, Anderson basically would redshirt.

Compared to the perimeter where, absent Brooks, we have 3 guys for 3 positions right now. Ramey would make 4. You have Borocavinin floating in the background like Anderson, although I see Borocavinin as much in the small 4 vein as Brooks is.

Just bottom line, the minutes are on the perimeter, so I think we'd have to live with Brooks there. That said, I felt that during the Efe talk, I wasn't on the same page with Lloyd at all.

I was all over Efe, and wanted him quite a bit. Thought he would clearly start at the 5. That said, ill believe Ballo can handle 25 minutes when I see it. I see him at 15-20, pending matchups.

If we land Brooks, I can likely see him starting at the 3, but not sure how that plays out. Id prefer Pelle start there, as I think Brooks' best minutes come at the 4, but same with Zu. I could see him getting 10 at the 3, and the start, and 15 at the 4. Pelle comes in first sub, Zu and/or Ballo out, Brooks slides up to the 4, HV/Zu to the 5.

I dont have any expectations that Anderson sees much of the floor barring injury or foul trouble.

I was a charter member of skepticism about Ballo, but even with Koloko (who I intially believed it would be impossible for him to play alongside) he carved out 15-20 mpg last year. Now that he's the only true 5 on the roster, I can easily see that at 20-25.

Veesaar is the guy I think really changes the dynamic, though. Tubelis gets 25-30, so you're looking at he and Ballo getting probably 50-55 minutes between them. I like Veesaar's ceiling and think he'll be 25-30 by season's end, just a matter of how fast he gets there.

And that's basically a wrap minutes wise for the 4/5, as I don't like the idea of Veesaar or Tubelis chasing a 3.

Im not sold on Zu playing 30 minutes either. He averaged 24.6, which was 5th among starters. Ballo averaged 15.2. I think its reasonable to expect them to play more this year, but not at the expense of playing Brooks at the 3 full time.

I think Zu is fine where he is at, unless he makes strides passing, shooting, defending. Ballo is somewhat likewise, although I think he does get the bump to 20 just based on his size and rim protection.

4: Zu 25, Brooks 15
5: Ballo 18, HV 18, Up for grabs 4.

I will say, I think some of that is his ankle injury and the Tenn game where refs whistled nonstop fouls on him and us. In the 5 games impacted by that, he only played 15 mpg.

Just those games and he's between 26 and 27 mpg. If you believe the ankle dogged him, you can push that # higher.

Watching more Brooks film...

Some stuff I'm looking at:

* Play finisher / cutter
** 72% field-goal percentage at the rim, 54% assisted
** Knows how to move into space for high percentage looks at the rim and finishes like a big man (74% = Koloko / Ballo finishing at the rim last season)

* Rebounder
** 12% OReb / 19% DReb / 16% TReb
** Rebounds like a big man - Zeke Nnaji-esque numbers

* Mid-range
** 54% of his attempts last season were mid-range jumpers / floaters, >60% assisted, and shot it at 40%
** He's got good efficiency on his mid-range, especially from the right elbow and left baseline, to go along with his high efficiency scoring in the paint
** Can punish zone defenses and teams that rely too much on drop coverage / collapsing to the paint
** His midrange can be a very useful tool against tough defenses in the half court

* Size and athleticism
** Looks and calls for the lob, makes plays above the rim
** Can attack in a straight line off the bounce from the perimeter or on a rip and run
** Not a plus ball handler but tough to stop once he gets a head of steam given his length, size, and athleticism
** Very good free throw shooter so you can't hack him
** Would be a real problem in Lloyd's transition offense (think of the nightmare that Brooks and Tubelis running the floor together would cause)
** Has a nice lay-up package and uses his body well to finish

* Passing
** A play finisher rather than a playmaker
** Can make some inside the paint passes / big-to-big passes - could see some growth in his assist numbers there
** Turns it over far too often for his limited assist numbers

* Defense
** Completely outmatched physically against true big men - does not have the strength and doesn't put the effort in to stop them
** Can often be "just a guy on the defense," doing things but not making a meaningful impact (beyond rebounding)
** Despite all of the rebounding and athleticism... has a habit of playing soft on D
** Can slide with guys his size (6'7") and deny shots with his length
** Can get blown by quicker players as he's often reacting to the ball

Brooks... not to get psychological but his biggest issue is that he's often either doing too much or not enough out there. He doesn't show much emotion, but too often he alternates between spun up and tuned/burnt out. I wonder if the pressure of his father (helicopter), the hype as a five star of out high school, and playing at Kentucky in a rough three year stretch for the program has been too much for him. Again, I'm out on a limb here but the inconsistency is a little baffling.

I really like him as the fifth best player on the court, which is a role he can fill here. He's got skills in his cutting and rebounding and transition finishing that would be a great fit. But his defensive weaknesses (especially at the power forward position), his lack of playmaking and his lack of an outside shot really limit his ceiling. Still my hopes for him are high, seems like a good and talented kid.

Hope he’ll be ready by September.

What's he waiting for? Get it done now

84Cat wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 8:03 am What's he waiting for? Get it done now

It's more on brand for AZ basketball if these injuries / recoveries happens right before the season starts

Alieberman wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 8:07 am

84Cat wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 8:03 am What's he waiting for? Get it done now

It's more on brand for AZ basketball if these injuries / recoveries happens right before the season starts

Man. We are becoming CYNICAL. This is what 20+ years without a FF does to you, I guess.

Jemarl Baker lost quite a bit of time after wrist surgery. Hopefully Zu's is not broken like Bakers was and can be done arthroscopically with minimal time out.

Alieberman wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 8:07 am

84Cat wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 8:03 am What's he waiting for? Get it done now

It's more on brand for AZ basketball if these injuries / recoveries happens right before the season starts

All we need now is an extreme DUI/arrest right at the start of the season to make things feel like home

Just another thing to talk about during the offseason.

Let me get it started..."Anyone know how AT is doing and will he be back by the start of fall practice?"

Rinse and repeat 150 times please.

Sounds like it's a wrist injury for Zu, so I can't imagine he's going to miss a shit ton of time here.

EastCoastCat wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 9:14 am Just another thing to talk about during the offseason.

Let me get it started..."Anyone know how AT is doing and will he be back by the start of fall practice?"

Rinse and repeat 150 times please.

150 times?

You are just talking about BeachCat alone?

Alieberman wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 10:30 am

EastCoastCat wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 9:14 am Just another thing to talk about during the offseason.

Let me get it started..."Anyone know how AT is doing and will he be back by the start of fall practice?"

Rinse and repeat 150 times please.

150 times?

You are just talking about BeachCat alone?

Hey, any word on AT's injury? Really hope he's ready for fall practice.

Now I'm a lot more interested in Brooks.

YoDeFoe wrote: Mon Jun 06, 2022 10:52 am Now I'm a lot more interested in Brooks.

He leaves something to be desired, but he could absolutely help us this season.