Bear Down Wildcats

Merkin wrote:I used to coach my son's teams when they were growing up. I was always yelling at the better players, even grabbed one by the arm one time for not listening to me. Once they reached junior high though I had to quit, hated the teen insolence.

Don't do it CSM! NBA players don't listen!

I will slit my wrists. And in JJ's video, he said "some coaches go to the NBA." Ugh.. Someone with more knowledge of an NBA head coaches "day in the life," I imagine it is a case of more family time when you're in town, but obviously more time AWAY from the family w the extended road trips?

Again, I just don't see CSM as an NBA guy. He wants to finish what he started at AZ.

rgdeuce wrote:

Merkin wrote:I used to coach my son's teams when they were growing up. I was always yelling at the better players, even grabbed one by the arm one time for not listening to me. Once they reached junior high though I had to quit, hated the teen insolence.

Don't do it CSM! NBA players don't listen!

I will slit my wrists. And in JJ's video, he said "some coaches go to the NBA." Ugh.. Someone with more knowledge of an NBA head coaches "day in the life," I imagine it is a case of more family time when you're in town, but obviously more time AWAY from the family w the extended road trips?

There's less recruiting trip time too. In the NBA, prospects come to you, instead of you having to jet to Vegas or other AAU tourneys. Much longer season, though and more stress.

I doubt Miller will ever be a NBA coach, but there are 2 big negatives in college ball.

1. Recruiting
2. NCAA rules

But like Larry Brown said, the biggest difference between college and the NBA is that in college they still listen to you.

Can you imagine if Miller had a player like Kobe or LeBron who dictates more than listens? How about trying to get Iverson to practice?

Merkin wrote:

gumby wrote:
Apologies for the liberal arts reference.

Long as you paid for it yourself and didn't take any federal or state money.

I did, but just sent a check to Kenny's parents for their portion.

rgdeuce wrote:Not sure if my dad ever called me a motherf--ker,

Mine either, but I was like 7 years old and not 22.

Just imagine Miller pulling one of his little tirades against Kobe or LeBron or a Sprewell clone. He would be toes up at center court contemplating replays on the jumbotron.

Never seen Miller as an NBA guy, but im sure he can make the transition because he's a good coach.

How he fares? Thats another debate and I honestly cant see him tying his future in the NBA to Robert Sarver.

TucsonClip wrote:Never seen Miller as an NBA guy, but im sure he can make the transition because he's a good coach.

How he fares? Thats another debate and I honestly cant see him tying his future in the NBA to Robert Sarver.

In Sarver-related issues, the Suns have a really iffy roster composition. Two pg's, a roster that looks like it would be built for speed and also Tyson Chandler. It's the type of team that would flourish with a 16 second shot clock.

I think Miller is a really good coach, but I'm not sure anyone could really succeed a ton with what the Suns have. If you want to make the college/pro jump, you want to be Billy Donovan and have KD and Westbrook.

It will probably be like that as long as Sarver is there. It's hard to build stability off a guy like that.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

TucsonClip wrote:Never seen Miller as an NBA guy, but im sure he can make the transition because he's a good coach.

How he fares? Thats another debate and I honestly cant see him tying his future in the NBA to Robert Sarver.

In Sarver-related issues, the Suns have a really iffy roster composition. Two pg's, a roster that looks like it would be built for speed and also Tyson Chandler. It's the type of team that would flourish with a 16 second shot clock.

I think Miller is a really good coach, but I'm not sure anyone could really succeed a ton with what the Suns have. If you want to make the college/pro jump, you want to be Billy Donovan and have KD and Westbrook.

It will probably be like that as long as Sarver is there. It's hard to build stability off a guy like that.

Suns need to package some picks in this draft and/or future picks with some talent to bring back someone that can speed up the development process. Bledsoe and Knight are on great deals plus Warren and Booker look like good pieces. I think you can conceivably package Knight/Bledsoe and some picks to bring back a nice piece. The problem is finding that piece to deal for.

I have been a proponent of the Bledsoe-Knight backcourt from day one. Maybe they can pawn Chandler off somewhere this summer. Cousins is a great fit (on paper), but im not sure that move is even possible. Love would be a great fit, but the Cavs arent going to be interested in draft picks and would require someone like Bledsoe to play next to Irving.

Lots of problems, very little answers. Might have to find a way to hit it big this draft and especially next.

Went to a Suns game over the holidays. Conclusion: Keep the gorilla. Everyone else is expendable.

gumby wrote:Went to a Suns game over the holidays. Conclusion: Keep the gorilla. Everyone else is expendable.

The roster is so terrible.

Miller:

But did Miller have any regrets about his outburst?

"No," he said Saturday after the team's win against Oregon State. "I don’t care what it’s perceived like. I have a great relationship with Kaleb, and he has a great relationship with me..."

"I’m myself. I’m the coach and I’m going to push our team to the best that we can be," he said. "I’m going to push our players to be the best they can be. I’m going to love them, but once in a while they’re not going to like the things that you do."


"The standards are the standards," he said. "For me, it’s not about anything other than what do we do to become the best team we can be, and to bring out the best in him."

"All that other stuff is nothing but noise. I can’t worry about that."

http://www.azdesertswarm.com/basketball ... s-behavior" target="_blank

Speaking of azdesertswarm, anyone see the article about the Miller/Zeus thing being exactly what is wrong with NCAA sports? Dude basically was saying NCAA coaches "abuse" players verbally and mentally without repercussions. And these student athletes have absolutely no way out and just have to deal with it. The thing that killed me the most though, quote: "People say "this is big boy basketball". When's the last time you saw Gregg Popovich absolutely lay into one of his players like this. When did Phil Jackson do it?" I mean, it isn't common knowledge that Pop screams at and gets in ALL of his players asses, Duncan included? The dude who screamed at one of his players (cant recall who) to shut the F up during a timeout. And he must not have seen the Zen master hit Pau Gasol in the chest and then push him out of the way during a playoff game.

It all makes sense when you, look up the author, Jason Bartel, on facebook.

HiCat wrote:Miller:

But did Miller have any regrets about his outburst?

"No," he said Saturday after the team's win against Oregon State. "I don’t care what it’s perceived like. I have a great relationship with Kaleb, and he has a great relationship with me..."

"I’m myself. I’m the coach and I’m going to push our team to the best that we can be," he said. "I’m going to push our players to be the best they can be. I’m going to love them, but once in a while they’re not going to like the things that you do."


"The standards are the standards," he said. "For me, it’s not about anything other than what do we do to become the best team we can be, and to bring out the best in him."

"All that other stuff is nothing but noise. I can’t worry about that."

http://www.azdesertswarm.com/basketball ... s-behavior" target="_blank

Apparently in CSM's world, relationships aren't mutual - My "relationship" with you is distinct from your "relationship" with me...

pc in NM wrote:

HiCat wrote:Miller:

But did Miller have any regrets about his outburst?

"No," he said Saturday after the team's win against Oregon State. "I don’t care what it’s perceived like. I have a great relationship with Kaleb, and he has a great relationship with me..."

"I’m myself. I’m the coach and I’m going to push our team to the best that we can be," he said. "I’m going to push our players to be the best they can be. I’m going to love them, but once in a while they’re not going to like the things that you do."


"The standards are the standards," he said. "For me, it’s not about anything other than what do we do to become the best team we can be, and to bring out the best in him."

"All that other stuff is nothing but noise. I can’t worry about that."

http://www.azdesertswarm.com/basketball ... s-behavior" target="_blank

Apparently in CSM's world, relationships aren't mutual - My "relationship" with you is distinct from your "relationship" with me...

Jesus dude based on your consistent attempts to make this into an actual story, you sound like a huge pussy. This is not a big deal. At all. Get the fuck over it

pc in NM wrote:

HiCat wrote:Miller:

But did Miller have any regrets about his outburst?

"No," he said Saturday after the team's win against Oregon State. "I don’t care what it’s perceived like. I have a great relationship with Kaleb, and he has a great relationship with me..."

"I’m myself. I’m the coach and I’m going to push our team to the best that we can be," he said. "I’m going to push our players to be the best they can be. I’m going to love them, but once in a while they’re not going to like the things that you do."


"The standards are the standards," he said. "For me, it’s not about anything other than what do we do to become the best team we can be, and to bring out the best in him."

"All that other stuff is nothing but noise. I can’t worry about that."

http://www.azdesertswarm.com/basketball ... s-behavior" target="_blank

Apparently in CSM's world, relationships aren't mutual - My "relationship" with you is distinct from your "relationship" with me...

You've never gotten angry with someone you have a good relationship with? I have. You can do it without having to wander around butthurt for the rest of your life.

Working with someone closely for 4 years, there will be bad along with good. That just means life is occurring. So, until there is any actual evidence that the Zeus/Miller relationship is actually bad, this is weak.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

pc in NM wrote:

HiCat wrote:Miller:

But did Miller have any regrets about his outburst?

"No," he said Saturday after the team's win against Oregon State. "I don’t care what it’s perceived like. I have a great relationship with Kaleb, and he has a great relationship with me..."

"I’m myself. I’m the coach and I’m going to push our team to the best that we can be," he said. "I’m going to push our players to be the best they can be. I’m going to love them, but once in a while they’re not going to like the things that you do."


"The standards are the standards," he said. "For me, it’s not about anything other than what do we do to become the best team we can be, and to bring out the best in him."

"All that other stuff is nothing but noise. I can’t worry about that."

http://www.azdesertswarm.com/basketball ... s-behavior" target="_blank

Apparently in CSM's world, relationships aren't mutual - My "relationship" with you is distinct from your "relationship" with me...

You've never gotten angry with someone you have a good relationship with? I have. You can do it without having to wander around butthurt for the rest of your life.

Working with someone closely for 4 years, there will be bad along with good. That just means life is occurring. So, until there is any actual evidence that the Zeus/Miller relationship is actually bad, this is weak.

Yes, I've certainly gotten angry with someone with whom I've been in a relationship - and, at at times I've handled it poorly. I am not, nor do I expect perfection from anyone.... (Except maybe in grammar and vocabulary )

When I, or any adult express anger in an inappropriate or over-the-top manner, an apology is due. Period. And, I believe a simple public apology from CSM was 1) the right thing to do, 2) could have easily happened without any loos of authority of face on his part. OTOH, his using this particular phraseology to duck making an apology is, I believe, 1) awkward, 2) revealing, and worthy of note.... I believe that making light of such a comment is valid, and should not provoe the pathetic overreaction, or name-calling, that it appears to have done for some.

As for my opinion of the incident, I think it is relatively minor in the overall scope of assessing CSM as a coach, and probably of little surprise to any player who's played for him. I expect that all involved will move forward.

I also think the Bobby Knight was one of the best basketball coaches of his generation, in spite of his anger-control issues; but I also recall how the majority of Arizona posters of the years severely criticized BK, and especially in comparison with Lute Olson. I see no reason for that to change.

Dig yourselves.

dcZONAfan wrote: Jesus dude based on your consistent attempts to make this into an actual story, you sound like a huge pussy. This is not a big deal. At all. Get the fuck over it

pc in NM wrote: Yes, I've certainly gotten angry with someone with whom I've been in a relationship - and, at at times I've handled it poorly. I am not, nor do I expect perfection from anyone....

When I, or any adult express anger in an inappropriate or over-the-top manner, an apology is due. Period. And, I believe a simple public apology from CSM was 1) the right thing to do, 2) could have easily happened without any loos of authority of face on his part. OTOH, his using this particular phraseology to duck making an apology is, I believe, 1) awkward, 2) revealing, and worthy of note.... I believe that making light of such a comment is valid, and should not provoe the pathetic overreaction, or name-calling, that it appears to have done for some.

As for my opinion of the incident, I think it is relatively minor in the overall scope of assessing CSM as a coach, and probably of little surprise to any player who's played for him. I expect that all involved will move forward.

I also think the Bobby Knight was one of the best basketball coaches of his generation, in spite of his anger-control issues; but I also recall how the majority of Arizona posters of the years severely criticized BK, and especially in comparison with Lute Olson. I see no reason for that to change.

Dig yourselves.

This assumes Miller didn't go behind closed doors and apologized. Doubt he did, but it's possible. Me personally, no way I apologize. An apology could be misinterpreted as a weakness, giving in, admitting fault, or showing that the media or larger public have an influence on how you run YOUR program. There are things that happen in life where an apology may be appropriate, but you just don't do it. I'm a pushover with my wife and am probably quicker to apologize than most men. I even apologize when there is no reason to. But I can think of several instances where I haven't for a very specific reason.

For yourself and every other person who thinks this was over the top, there are plenty more who dont have a problem with it, or understand why it was done and dont think it was that big of a deal. And Bobby Knight got his rep for way more than just yelling, or "berating/acting inappropriately (if that's what you want to call it)" once in over a half decade at a program. That dude ruled on abuse and mind control, assaulted players, had numerous epic meltdowns, had no filter, etc. He was a bully. Ridiculous to even throw that name out there for this.

RG hits it. If Miller needs to apologize at all, the media is not the place. How he and Kaleb handle it between the two of them is what matters.

A better comparison than Knight is Calipari. Miller isn't choking, whipping, etc.ing players. Calipari rips players a new one publically all the time, but he never gets physical and players don't die over it.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

rgdeuce wrote:Not sure if my dad ever called me a motherf--ker, but he called me everything else, sometimes affectionately and sometimes when he was pissed. He left me alone when he coached me unless I did something really stupid, like get ejected from a game. Could havr handled it though, cuz he was intense at home

That would just be a weird insult for me to hear from my dad.

haaaa! nice work, spiff -

I must have been tired the first time I read that

Oregon St last Saturday marked Coach's 300th win

Miller, age 47, is 300-104 in his 12th season

I felt like digging up some old records, take a look at these:

Olson, 54, 300-115 in his 15th season
Coach K, 42, 300-158 in his 15th season
Wooden, 50, 300-127 in his 16th season
Self, 44, 300-132 in his 14th season
Calipari, 45, 300-122 in his 13th season
Knight, 39, 300-107 in his 15th season
Dean, 44, 300-107 in his 15th season
Calhoun, 46, 300-189 in his 18th season
Boeheim, 45, 300-106 in his 13th season
Pitino, 53, 300-162 in his 20th season
Huggins, 41, 300-129 in his 14th season
Sutton, 47, 300-123 in his 14th season

Williams, 47, 300-71 in his 11th season
Tarkanian, 50, 300-68 in his 13th season

Good company...

One of my teenage sons told me to "chill out" the other day when I raised my voice to him. I had to take about 5 seconds to collect myself, invite him into the office away from the rest of the family, and laid into him big time. No way Miller could have dealt with that issue in a private way, unless he called timeout, ushered Kaleb back to the locker room, and let him have it.

Probably did as well, if not better than, most given the heat of the moment, a VERY public place, and one of his players telling him to "relax". I might have just had a stroke right there and been done with it!

Go Cats!!

Thanks, Jef.

104!! Coach's loss # is simply amazing, especially when you consider the wreck he inherited. Sure, sure, we had/have the program rep Lute achieved-----but the picture CSM actually walked into at the time was awful. His record therefore actually belies how terrific he really has been to this point in time, huh?

CSM!

I can absolutely see why it happened. Nothing angers me more than when my teenage daughter says I need to chill, or calm down...that is when the open verbal discussion gets taken behind a closed door for more pointed discussion. For me, my voice actually goes down when I am really angry, more of a whisper through clenched teeth. I am a talker, so if I say "this is done", it really is done. My kids are really good...in lots of ways, I don't deserve them given the stuff I did as a kid. I am pretty open with them, especially the older one, about many things and we have a great relationship. Which is why I know if I lose my shit when they really go over the edge, that behavior will be modified immediately. I am sure if it were possible, CSM would have preferred to take Zeus somewhere one on one. But it wasn't possible, so he let go right there. And possibly purposely for the others to see. We are friendly, but we aren't friends...that is my motto about my children, and I imagine Miller is the same way with his players. We get along great, love each other, and there are parts of my kids personalities that are right up my alley and would make them great friends if we were not related. But I am dad, and they are my children, and no matter how friendly we are, that line is there for a reason, and it is my role to teach and to modify behavior first and foremost. And they respect me because of it. I don't see this much differently.

Would I have rather Miller toned it down some for public consumption just to avoid this ridiculous debate? Yeah. I bet he does, too, regardless of what he says openly. Would I want to see it on the regular? No...not at all. I went from loving Stoops to being embarrassed to watch our games at times thanks to his meltdowns. There is a point where it crosses from righteous anger to spoiled tantrum. I don't see this as a similar issue.

EVCat wrote: For me, my voice actually goes down when I am really angry, more of a whisper through clenched teeth. .

I envy you. I will probably never be able to coach because of my temper. Was ejected from 3 baseball games and a basketball game before I turned 18. I get loud. Even when agitated, people confuse that with rage, but they just haven't seen me really mad. I've had to force myself to get a lot better after having kids, but it still comes out sometimes. Thankfully my oldest has picked up some of the cues to know when daddy is about 5 seconds from losing his sh*t.

Even if people do not think it is a big deal, there are enough people that do and that needs to be respected. This is a big black eye on Miller and the program. Le Batard went off on him on his show. Say what you want but I think everyone would be better off if Miller just yanked Kaleb and talked to him at halftime.

PHXCATS wrote:Even if people do not think it is a big deal, there are enough people that do and that needs to be respected.

There are also a lot of people who think the moon landing was faked and the Loch Ness Monster is real. Does that need to be respected?

Check back in a week. No one (outside of maybe a few people right here) will be talking about this.

PHXCATS wrote:Even if people do not think it is a big deal, there are enough people that do and that needs to be respected. This is a big black eye on Miller and the program. Le Batard went off on him on his show. Say what you want but I think everyone would be better off if Miller just yanked Kaleb and talked to him at halftime.

You know, I look at ESPN's top 100 recruits and I don't see anyone named LeBatard.

PHXCATS wrote:Even if people do not think it is a big deal, there are enough people that do and that needs to be respected. This is a big black eye on Miller and the program. Le Batard went off on him on his show. Say what you want but I think everyone would be better off if Miller just yanked Kaleb and talked to him at halftime.

There are also people who say Miller should be fired. This year, and in years past. There are idiots on social media and newspaper sites every week who explain how the team should run its offense or defense, but say (I kid you not) "The big players need to start playing near the basket more and play more pop and shot." And LeBatard is an idiot, it's a story, he and so many other hacks make something out of nothing because it fills in air time.

Black eye on the program? Are you serious? In a world of buying strippers/hookers for recruits, illegal recruiting, improper benefits to players, academic scandals, this is a black eye? Not expecting everyone to like what happened. Some love it, to some it isn't a big deal, and some think Miller went overboard. But take a step back and get on social media and see who is running with this and won't let go: ASU fans mostly, followed by conference rivals who are jealous of the program's and Miller's success. Mix in some of the school's where Miller has pried away a recent recruit from, and there is 80 percent of the people who have beef with this. Most of the rest are people who have never sat court side at a college or NBA basketball game and/or never played competitive sports past age 14 and this shocked them. They don't know this is completely common and considered normal to most athletes. And then you have the grumpy Lute fans who refuse to believe Miller can even be close to being the same level as Lute and use this, elite 8 losses (while totally forgetting about the loaded Lute teams that lost in opening rounds), and single regular season losses to throw shade at Miller. My friend's dad compared Miller to a woman beater the other day, but has supported in-your-face antics when talking about baseball in the past. He's the Lute is God, Miller is the antichrist type since Miller arrived.

Bobby Hurley's temper tantrum and tough guy posturing and classless pandering to the crowd was completely embarrassing. But that too is not even close to being a black eye. Most people are running with this Miller thing because they are looking for any little thing to pop the guy because of envy, or it's just another bullet for their agenda gun.. college sports are so bad, blah blah blah, greedy evil, walmart, blah blah blah, power, bullying, blah blah blah, coaches make millions, mind control over poor kids, blah blah blah, college is about school, not sports, blah blah blah, I got cut from the JV team and had to join the chess club, blah blah blah. People sit and complain about the millennial generation and the sense of entitlement, laziness, etc., but continue to enable these problems with stuff like this. Kaleb is a grown ass man. Kaleb has seen that countless times. Kaleb and a lot of us saw that before we were allowed to vote. There does not always have to be a victim and a big bad wolf in everything in life. It's telling that Kaleb, Miller, and the team has moved on from this but people are still upset about it.

I should "respect" Dan LeBatard--a dime-a-dozen talk radio host who panders for listeners like the rest of them?

Of course phxcats gets all whiny and agrees with lebatard. What a chode

This is still a story? Zzzz.....

Puerco wrote:This is still a story? Zzzz.....

It never was one.

It would have to be the slowest news day ever if "Coach Yells At Player" is a buzzworthy story.

Really enjoying his "next question" presser.

Chicat wrote:

Puerco wrote:This is still a story? Zzzz.....

It never was one.

It would have to be the slowest news day ever if "Coach Yells At Player" is a buzzworthy story.

Morning laugh.

Olsondogg wrote:Really enjoying his "next question" presser.

link?

dcZONAfan wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:Really enjoying his "next question" presser.

link?

http://arizonawildcats.com/mediaPortal/ ... M_ID=30700" target="_blank

Olsondogg wrote:Really enjoying his "next question" presser.

What's the story there? Didn't seem like an objectionable question.

Sure like Kaleb. Gonna miss that guy.

gumby wrote:Sure like Kaleb. Gonna miss that guy.

Oh, relax.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

gumby wrote:Sure like Kaleb. Gonna miss that guy.

Oh, relax.

MFer.



... also, was that reporter the same dude that CSM shut down last season on multiple occasions?

dirtbags wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

gumby wrote:Sure like Kaleb. Gonna miss that guy.

Oh, relax.

MFer.



... also, was that reporter the same dude that CSM shut down last season on multiple occasions?

No, it's some new guy at channel 4.

Bruins Nation sure ran a crybaby of a write up on Sean Miller.

Miller shouldn't be coaching kids

Miller called Kaleb MFer

Miller is hated by the refs

Take your 13-10 W/L record, your sour grapes, and your job hopping coach and SHOVE IT Bruins Nation!!!

CatsbyAZ wrote:Bruins Nation sure ran a crybaby of a write up on Sean Miller.

Miller shouldn't be coaching kids

Miller called Kaleb MFer

Miller is hated by the refs

Take your 13-10 W/L record, your sour grapes, and your job hopping coach and SHOVE IT Bruins Nation!!!

They would probably be more supportive if Miller was accused of raping someone, right?

UAEebs86 wrote:

dirtbags wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

gumby wrote:Sure like Kaleb. Gonna miss that guy.

Oh, relax.

MFer.



... also, was that reporter the same dude that CSM shut down last season on multiple occasions?

No, it's some new guy at channel 4.

Because?

gumby wrote:

UAEebs86 wrote:

dirtbags wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

gumby wrote:Sure like Kaleb. Gonna miss that guy.

Oh, relax.

MFer.



... also, was that reporter the same dude that CSM shut down last season on multiple occasions?

No, it's some new guy at channel 4.

Because?

ostensibly, the reporter who blew up the CSM-kaleb story a couple of weeks ago

Ari Alexander?

rgdeuce wrote:Ari Alexander?

Yep