lets talk '16

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 8:08 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:Trevon Duvall and Billy Preston top 10 class of 17 both at Unlv game too? Possible package deal? See Arizona is doin well w Preston
Neither of them were at the UNLV game, they were playing in a tourney up in PHX. Only Preston made it down to Tucson after the tourney.

Ahh. Saw that they were on Twitter. Guess it was for yesterday then. There was a Duvall interview too and he said he was going to Arizona "tomorrow."

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:15 am

rgdeuce wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:Trevon Duvall and Billy Preston top 10 class of 17 both at Unlv game too? Possible package deal? See Arizona is doin well w Preston
Neither of them were at the UNLV game, they were playing in a tourney up in PHX. Only Preston made it down to Tucson after the tourney.
Ahh. Saw that they were on Twitter. Guess it was for yesterday then. There was a Duvall interview too and he said he was going to Arizona "tomorrow."

Those are two very talented kids. Preston is a physical freak.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 11:18 am

rgdeuce wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:Trevon Duvall and Billy Preston top 10 class of 17 both at Unlv game too? Possible package deal? See Arizona is doin well w Preston
Neither of them were at the UNLV game, they were playing in a tourney up in PHX. Only Preston made it down to Tucson after the tourney.
Ahh. Saw that they were on Twitter. Guess it was for yesterday then. There was a Duvall interview too and he said he was going to Arizona "tomorrow."

Yeah Duval didn't end up making it unfortunately.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:27 pm

That's too bad, still plenty of time and hopefully we get an official visit from them together. Reading a lot of nice things on Preston, that he may be the toughest guy to guard in that class.

dirtbags · Post by **dirtbags** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:28 pm

great to see dusan have a big offensive game on saturday -- hope it helps his confidence and we see him continue to improve across all dimensions of this game. i was wondering if CSM will want to grab another big for '16 if there's a potential question mark down low with dusan (inconsistent), lauri (untested), and chance (green/size).

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:39 pm

I think we need one. Grad transfer or juco guy maybe? We are losing Zeus, Anderson and Tollefsen. Next year Dusan, Lauri, and Chance. You need more than three. I suppose Smith can slide to the 4 for depth, or maybe start there if Trier is back and we land JJ. Wouldn't hurt to have a backup for injury, or heaven forbid, Smith's knee(s) have problems.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:39 pm

dirtbags wrote:great to see dusan have a big offensive game on saturday -- hope it helps his confidence and we see him continue to improve across all dimensions of this game. i was wondering if CSM will want to grab another big for '16 if there's a potential question mark down low with dusan (inconsistent), lauri (untested), and chance (green/size).

This guy is visiting in January.

http://www.scout.com/player/201439-harry-froling" target="_blank

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:47 pm

rgdeuce wrote:That's too bad, still plenty of time and hopefully we get an official visit from them together. Reading a lot of nice things on Preston, that he may be the toughest guy to guard in that class.

He reminds me of Perry Jones III, except he hopefully won't squander oodles of physical talent by playing for Scott Drew. As a reference, I thought Jones was one of the biggest wastes of talent.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:49 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:That's too bad, still plenty of time and hopefully we get an official visit from them together. Reading a lot of nice things on Preston, that he may be the toughest guy to guard in that class.
He reminds me of Perry Jones III, except he hopefully won't squander oodles of physical talent by playing for Scott Drew. As a reference, I thought Jones was one of the biggest wastes of talent.

He may squander oodles of talent by not even qualifying to play college ball.

carolinacat · Post by **carolinacat** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 11:58 pm

I'm not big on knowing the truths, half-truths and total b.s. about recruiting "experts." We could sure use a true point guard next year.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Arizona is now in the mix for 2016 Kobi Simmons, who is also considering Ohio State, UNLV and UK, sources confirm.</p>— Adam Zagoria (@AdamZagoria) <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamZagoria/status/ ... ">December 19, 2015</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:21 am

carolinacat wrote:I'm not big on knowing the truths, half-truths and total b.s. about recruiting "experts." We could sure use a true point guard next year.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Arizona is now in the mix for 2016 Kobi Simmons, who is also considering Ohio State, UNLV and UK, sources confirm.</p>— Adam Zagoria (@AdamZagoria) <a href="https://twitter.com/AdamZagoria/status/ ... ">December 19, 2015</a></blockquote> <script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

I am not an expert, but there's no one on here more an expert than I that's ever hinted we're actually in the mix for Simmons.

With Allen as a senior and PJC as a junior, I don't really see PG as a position of need, either, at least not until 2017.

DiehardDave37 · Post by **DiehardDave37** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:01 am

[quote= With Allen as a senior and PJC as a junior, I don't really see PG as a position of need, either, at least not until 2017.[/quote]

I'd like a frosh PG learning how to scrap from the KaBoom Allen of the last few games.
Simon was projected as a possible back-up, but that doesn't look good with the amount of minutes he is getting with Pitts not playing. I've also lost some confidence in PJC. I'd like him to stay, but be a situational sub. I think we need another alternative next year in case KA gets hurt, and he is feisty enough to do that.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:29 am

DiehardDave37 wrote:
With Allen as a senior and PJC as a junior, I don't really see PG as a position of need, either, at least not until 2017.[/quote wrote:
I'd like a frosh PG learning how to scrap from the KaBoom Allen of the last few games.
Simon was projected as a possible back-up, but that doesn't look good with the amount of minutes he is getting with Pitts not playing. I've also lost some confidence in PJC. I'd like him to stay, but be a situational sub. I think we need another alternative next year in case KA gets hurt, and he is feisty enough to do that.
Simmons is a top 20 recruit nationally. He would not come in to serve an apprenticeship or just be an alternative. I mean, it would be nice if he would, but I don't think that is a realistic expectation.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:43 am

I think with the way that PJC hasn't progressed on the offensive side of the ball (and there is no possible progression defensively due to his height/weight), we definitely should address the PG position in 2016 if at all possible. Unless Justin Simon really can play that position, which I haven't seen so far.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:03 am

Chicat wrote:I think with the way that PJC hasn't progressed on the offensive side of the ball (and there is no possible progression defensively due to his height/weight), we definitely should address the PG position in 2016 if at all possible. Unless Justin Simon really can play that position, which I haven't seen so far.

I am back and forth on this. I think we are fine with Allen as starter and PJC as backup in 2016. It really depends whether you are ready to simply recruit over PJC. I see your point on his game, but I can see him as a competent 4 year backup. I have trouble seeing him as more than that.

Allen's presence as a solid starter is why I don't see it as a necessity in 2016, but it is by 2017.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:07 am

I think my fear is that if Allen goes down with a significant injury you've got 5' 7" PJC running the show for 30+ minutes a game. I do like the kid, but I feel like in that scenario we go from Final Four contender to struggling to make the tourney.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:15 am

Like Dave said above, he is a "situational sub".

Saw it last year when he was playing well on offense, but could not cover taller guards and was benched.

Still have hope for Simon who played PG in HS, but he may just be another JP Prince who came in to the UA as a tall PG, but really couldn't play the position well and ended up a wing at Tennessee.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:16 am

Chicat wrote:I think my fear is that if Allen goes down with a significant injury you've got 5' 7" PJC running the show for 30+ minutes a game. I do like the kid, but I feel like in that scenario we go from Final Four contender to struggling to make the tourney.

Ditto on this. Good kid, but undersized. Needs higher level skill set to see him as a FF pg.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:52 am

Chicat wrote:I think my fear is that if Allen goes down with a significant injury you've got 5' 7" PJC running the show for 30+ minutes a game. I do like the kid, but I feel like in that scenario we go from Final Four contender to struggling to make the tourney.

I don't really disagree that an Allen injury would be a major issue. I think we would more likely cure that issue by finding out if 97 is right that Trier (if he is here) is like Chauncey Billups.

I just don't know who we would recruit that puts us in a better spot. A midlevel recruit isn't going to be any more stable than a junior PJC. A high level guy like Simmons, well, we can't sell him on being a starter, so we have that working against us.

If Simmons wants to come, hey, let's do it. I just wonder how real that is when he steps into a competition with a senior starting pg. I don't think a 50-150 level recruit is really getting us closer to the FF than PJC unless we hit a diamond in the rough.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:02 am

While it's not his primary position, Josh Jackson can handle point guard duties if we need him to. He's more than capable actually.

I've yet to hear from any credible source that we are recruiting Simmons and I certainly don't trust Zagoria. Seriously the mention of us in this recruitment screams "pay attention to my hype train," when his decision has already been made long ago (Ohio State).

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:06 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Chicat wrote:I think my fear is that if Allen goes down with a significant injury you've got 5' 7" PJC running the show for 30+ minutes a game. I do like the kid, but I feel like in that scenario we go from Final Four contender to struggling to make the tourney.
I don't really disagree that an Allen injury would be a major issue. I think we would more likely cure that issue by finding out if 97 is right that Trier (if he is here) is like Chauncey Billups.

I just don't know who we would recruit that puts us in a better spot. A midlevel recruit isn't going to be any more stable than a junior PJC. A high level guy like Simmons, well, we can't sell him on being a starter, so we have that working against us.

If Simmons wants to come, hey, let's do it. I just wonder how real that is when he steps into a competition with a senior starting pg. I don't think a 50-150 level recruit is really getting us closer to the FF than PJC unless we hit a diamond in the rough.

Yeah, that's the biggest question in that scenario: Who could come in as a freshman and be better than a junior PJC and would be willing to be 2nd or 3rd on the depth chart at that position. The answer is probably "nobody".

Miller has had some good luck with grad transfers, but what senior is going to come here for a year to see only 10-15 minutes of playing time off the bench?

I'm guessing the answer has to either be on our bench already (Simon) or a top level incoming freshman who can be convinced that he'll be above PJC on the depth chart and that Allen will play more off the ball. I know Sean Miller is a witch, but I doubt he's got that much magic in him to convince someone that all of that will fall that way.

Edit: If Josh Jackson is playing point guard next year, some things have gone seriously wrong with this team.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:16 am

Let's be honest not many teams have more than 2 real point guards on their roster. Heck two years ago Nick Johnson was our back up point guard. If Josh Jackson is playing PG next year then it means we suffered from the injury bug as well as poor player evaluation/development.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:59 am

Chicat wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Chicat wrote:I think my fear is that if Allen goes down with a significant injury you've got 5' 7" PJC running the show for 30+ minutes a game. I do like the kid, but I feel like in that scenario we go from Final Four contender to struggling to make the tourney.
I don't really disagree that an Allen injury would be a major issue. I think we would more likely cure that issue by finding out if 97 is right that Trier (if he is here) is like Chauncey Billups.

I just don't know who we would recruit that puts us in a better spot. A midlevel recruit isn't going to be any more stable than a junior PJC. A high level guy like Simmons, well, we can't sell him on being a starter, so we have that working against us.

If Simmons wants to come, hey, let's do it. I just wonder how real that is when he steps into a competition with a senior starting pg. I don't think a 50-150 level recruit is really getting us closer to the FF than PJC unless we hit a diamond in the rough.
Yeah, that's the biggest question in that scenario: Who could come in as a freshman and be better than a junior PJC and would be willing to be 2nd or 3rd on the depth chart at that position. The answer is probably "nobody".

Miller has had some good luck with grad transfers, but what senior is going to come here for a year to see only 10-15 minutes of playing time off the bench?

I'm guessing the answer has to either be on our bench already (Simon) or a top level incoming freshman who can be convinced that he'll be above PJC on the depth chart and that Allen will play more off the ball. I know Sean Miller is a witch, but I doubt he's got that much magic in him to convince someone that all of that will fall that way.

Edit: If Josh Jackson is playing point guard next year, some things have gone seriously wrong with this team.

I agree. I think we are just in the reality of most teams, who would take a really significant blow if they lost a starting PG. Very few teams in the last 10 years have 2 PG's who are FF caliber.

Playing a lineup designed to camouflage the weakness is easier in my opinion. On that point, I could see a Trier/Simon backcourt being good enough to mask a lack of a true PG. Not ideal, but good enough.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:07 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
Chicat wrote:I think my fear is that if Allen goes down with a significant injury you've got 5' 7" PJC running the show for 30+ minutes a game. I do like the kid, but I feel like in that scenario we go from Final Four contender to struggling to make the tourney.
I don't really disagree that an Allen injury would be a major issue. I think we would more likely cure that issue by finding out if 97 is right that Trier (if he is here) is like Chauncey Billups.

I just don't know who we would recruit that puts us in a better spot. A midlevel recruit isn't going to be any more stable than a junior PJC. A high level guy like Simmons, well, we can't sell him on being a starter, so we have that working against us.

If Simmons wants to come, hey, let's do it. I just wonder how real that is when he steps into a competition with a senior starting pg. I don't think a 50-150 level recruit is really getting us closer to the FF than PJC unless we hit a diamond in the rough.

Agree with you here. If Trier comes back AND Allen goes down, he can slide into that spot. If we got a healthy Smith and JJ commits, you really losing much? Simon can also improve a lot over a year and I bet he can be more than sufficient in a pinch. I mean lets face it here, if most teams lost their starting PG, they are going to have huge concerns. Safety nets cant always happen at every position, injuries hurt. And you are right, we arent likely to pull a guy from the HS ranks who can be a better option than PJC in year one outside of simmons.

dirtbags · Post by **dirtbags** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:12 pm

i've got faith in PJC. we saw what he was capable of last year under TJ despite his size and inexperience. he wrongly assumed the starting pg spot was his and didn't put in the work during the offseason. that won't happen again.

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:39 pm

rgdeuce wrote: Agree with you here. If Trier comes back AND Allen goes down, he can slide into that spot. If we got a healthy Smith and JJ commits, you really losing much? Simon can also improve a lot over a year and I bet he can be more than sufficient in a pinch. I mean lets face it here, if most teams lost their starting PG, they are going to have huge concerns. Safety nets cant always happen at every position, injuries hurt. And you are right, we arent likely to pull a guy from the HS ranks who can be a better option than PJC in year one outside of simmons.

I'm curious about what people have seen out of Trier that makes them think he can slide over and play the point? I know 97 has talked about him being like Chauncey, but it doesn't really feel like that after watching him through 11 (12?) games.

While he may be a runaway train on the fast break with sick crossovers, his ball handling, in all reality, isn't great. Multiple times this year I've seen him get the ball up court and then look like he was going to lose the ball because there was some potential pressure coming to him. Not even real pressure, just impending pressure.

I'm not sure I trust him to facilitate an offense.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:48 pm

He can handle the rock, he unbelievable court vision (watch his drives, he reads multiple layers of defenders) and hes at worst an adequate passer. Yes, he has gotten himself into trouble in the past with over dribbling or dribbling into traffic. I see those instances more as freshman mistakes rather than a broken or loose handle, and both PJC and Allen have done the same. He would be a shoot first point who can handle the ball, and penetrate and open things up for his teammates. In a pinch, you find a way to adapt, and part of that may be pushing the "traditional point guard" idea to the side. Teams have had plenty of success with point forwards like Lamar Odom or Scottie Pippen. It limits his scoring production a little, but next year we should have plenty of guys to pick up the slack.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:51 pm

I'm not sure I trust Trier as a facilitator, but you don't necessarily need your 1 to facilitate. Look at the Jordan Bulls or the Shaq Lakers or even the Warriors. It's harder to play that way because you need more of a team commitment to offset not having a facilitator, but it can be done.

Losing Allen would mean a less than ideal situation, period. In my vision of Trier sliding in, he does it as part of a backcourt that can split up the load when it comes to initiating the offense, rather than installing him as the new TJ McConnell. Let him advance the ball and then run motion without relying on a specific playmaker. Then, hope all your players are aware and unselfish and will move the ball. I don't think we have a terrible composition for that approach.

Harvey Specter · Post by **Harvey Specter** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 2:41 pm

dcZONAfan wrote:
rgdeuce wrote: Agree with you here. If Trier comes back AND Allen goes down, he can slide into that spot. If we got a healthy Smith and JJ commits, you really losing much? Simon can also improve a lot over a year and I bet he can be more than sufficient in a pinch. I mean lets face it here, if most teams lost their starting PG, they are going to have huge concerns. Safety nets cant always happen at every position, injuries hurt. And you are right, we arent likely to pull a guy from the HS ranks who can be a better option than PJC in year one outside of simmons.
I'm curious about what people have seen out of Trier that makes them think he can slide over and play the point? I know 97 has talked about him being like Chauncey, but it doesn't really feel like that after watching him through 11 (12?) games.

While he may be a runaway train on the fast break with sick crossovers, his ball handling, in all reality, isn't great. Multiple times this year I've seen him get the ball up court and then look like he was going to lose the ball because there was some potential pressure coming to him. Not even real pressure, just impending pressure.

I'm not sure I trust him to facilitate an offense.

You and I see this the same way... Kid has shown lately why he was so highly thought of coming out of HS - but I don't see him running the team - from either a skills or mindset perspective. Plus we'd be taking him out of the role where I think he can do the most damage. A CG who plays spot minutes at the point when needed (ala Nick Johnson) is where I see him contributing at the 1.

Stranger things have happened, though - and while I am not typically big on "the coaches know more than us" declarations, I'll lean on it here. In Miller I trust: I have supreme confidence that he will make the right calls to put the team in the best possible position to be successful - regardless of whatever obstacles present themselves.

DiehardDave37 · Post by **DiehardDave37** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:11 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
DiehardDave37 wrote:
With Allen as a senior and PJC as a junior, I don't really see PG as a position of need, either, at least not until 2017.[/quote wrote:
I'd like a frosh PG learning how to scrap from the KaBoom Allen of the last few games.
Simon was projected as a possible back-up, but that doesn't look good with the amount of minutes he is getting with Pitts not playing. I've also lost some confidence in PJC. I'd like him to stay, but be a situational sub. I think we need another alternative next year in case KA gets hurt, and he is feisty enough to do that.
Simmons is a top 20 recruit nationally. He would not come in to serve an apprenticeship or just be an alternative. I mean, it would be nice if he would, but I don't think that is a realistic expectation.
You can't find the name Simmons anywhere in my post. I was responding to PG not being a position of need. I never suggested that Kobi would be willing to do that. I don't know where to find the guy willing to do that, but I would like another PG with some size. Maybe Justin will get it just in time.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:48 pm

Dave, the quotes got messed up, so I'll just respond here.

I said Simmons bc he is a top prospect. With those guys, I'm sure we'd take them, but not sure they'd come based on available PT.

That leaves us with a developmental guy. I don't see that guy being a better option than a junior PJC, and a 3 deep PG depth chart basically means they wouldn't play.

My preference would be to go big (if we are ready to recruit over PJC in '16) or just wait until '17, when we have immediate playing time to attract a top prospect, then pair him with senior PJC. A big time freshman and an experienced senior is a good combo.

I just do not see us at the place where we have to compromise a lot in recruiting.

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 10:18 am

A lot of talk about how they will need to make room for JJ:

http://michiganstate.247sports.com/Boar ... s-42229934" target="_blank

http://www.scout.com/college/michigan-s ... sh-jackson" target="_blank

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 10:51 am

Jefe wrote:A lot of talk about how they will need to make room for JJ:

http://michiganstate.247sports.com/Boar ... s-42229934" target="_blank

http://www.scout.com/college/michigan-s ... sh-jackson" target="_blank

That's funny. If Jackson wants to play for MSU, a spot will exist. The talk about how Izzo won't "Crean" someone...there's a reason he's recruiting JJ hard, and it isn't because there might or might not be an open scholarship.

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 4:17 pm

Not like it matters for JJ but...

NBA Draft Top 10 Picks since 1995:

MSU - 2 (18 total 1st rounders in school history)

http://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/confe ... /nba-draft" target="_blank

AZ - 9 (21 total 1st rounders in school history)

http://basketball.realgm.com/ncaa/confe ... /nba-draft" target="_blank

DiehardDave37 · Post by **DiehardDave37** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 6:32 pm

I'm being hard-headed on this, but if CSM isn't ready to groom Simon for back-up PG duties, I want the best 2016 PG we can get with some size even if he isn't quite AZ good. He doesn't have to be 'better' than a junior PJC, just better in some situations. I know that some of you saw that word in a previous post of mine.
I have never wanted all of the scholarships to go to 5 stars. Pass me some Elmer's glue, PLEASE!
Are there any AZ PGs willing to be a Korchek? If he were really raw, I'd start him out as a potential red-shirt and use him only if KaBoom got hurt. I do love 5th year seniors regardless of how many stars they had as a frosh.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Wed Dec 23, 2015 6:58 pm

Thats what PJC kind of was out of high school though. Not the flashy, highly regarded 5 star guy that will blow you away. Skilled, steady, a guy who will be a really solid player in years 3 and 4 that would stick around and be the vet for a few teams.

Longhorned · Post by **Longhorned** » Mon Dec 28, 2015 8:58 pm

Longhorned wrote:I'm concluding that, if Jackson goes to MSU or Maryland or Kansas, something will have changed by the spring. I don't think there's any leaning in any direction. I think the coaching staffs at MSU, Maryland, and Kansas know they're on the outside looking in. The interest in Maryland is polite. The interest in MSU is inferred based on a set of circumstances. The interest in Kansas is longstanding and real. But the idea of Jackson coming to play for Miller, whom he identifies as his coach, is genuine. With all of the authority of a poster on the internets, I'm comfortable enough to end my wondering early on this one and calling Jackson to Arizona in the spring.

I've been so at ease since I settled on this over two months ago.

97cats · Post by **97cats** » Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:25 pm

slice it, dice it, mix it, im more than fine with:

Simon
Allen
Trier
Jackson
Smith
Markkanen
Ristic
Comanche

as the top eight

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:46 pm

What are the odds of both trier and Smith being here in all reality?

97cats · Post by **97cats** » Mon Dec 28, 2015 9:53 pm

well Smith i would think is 100%????? no????

and with a guy like Trier i always default to March -- meaning if he has a crazy tournament and AZ gets to the Final Four my bet is he's out, but otherwise today ive got to believe he's more likely to come back.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Dec 28, 2015 10:09 pm

What are the odds Smith will be at 100% or have anywhere near the ability or athleticism?

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Mon Dec 28, 2015 11:03 pm

ASUHATER! wrote:What are the odds Smith will be at 100% or have anywhere near the ability or athleticism?

It was a clean ACL tear in October and it's about to be the year 2016, so I'd put the odds at damn near 100%. You already said his career is over when it happened though so I guess he'll be nothing more than a ball boy right?

I look forward to your mortuary on Tyrann Mathieu's career now that he's torn his other ACL as well.

Bangkok Wildcat · Post by **Bangkok Wildcat** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 1:54 am

So what's the latest thinking on our overall needs for the '16 Class? We have LM, want / need JJ. How many do you think we end up with in this class?

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 7:44 am

97cats wrote:slice it, dice it, mix it, im more than fine with:

Simon
Allen
Trier
Jackson
Smith
Markkanen
Ristic
Comanche

as the top eight

I assume pretty much every Wildcat fan would like it because it includes priority 1 (Jackson). If we get JJ, it not only adds a tremendous talent, it allows us to move Smith back at his own pace. I'm not saying he won't be ready, but 2 years of no live action can make for some rust.

If I had to add a wish to that, I would add a solid 15 mpg grad transfer at the 4/5. My only minor concern is whether LM and Chance will both be ready for the role asked of them. I think they will, but a 3 man rotation at the 4/5 means everyone has to produce. If we get JJ, it will be easy enough to play him, Smith and Chance/LM as a slightly (as in, all 3 guys are taller than Jesse Perry) rotation.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 7:57 am

We have 3 guys who can play the 5 (LM, DR, CC) and 3 guys who can play the 4 (LM, JJ, RS). We're fine.

This also assumes we don't land that Aussie post player who's visiting next month. If we land him then we probably won't even have minutes for him.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 8:19 am

ChooChooCat wrote:We have 3 guys who can play the 5 (LM, DR, CC) and 3 guys who can play the 4 (LM, JJ, RS). We're fine.

This also assumes we don't land that Aussie post player who's visiting next month. If we land him then we probably won't even have minutes for him.

Both JJ and Smith are true 3's. If we don't need to make them play the 4, so much the better for the program and for them (they both have a pro future at the 3).

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 8:49 am

ChooChooCat wrote:We have 3 guys who can play the 5 (LM, DR, CC) and 3 guys who can play the 4 (LM, JJ, RS). We're fine.

This also assumes we don't land that Aussie post player who's visiting next month. If we land him then we probably won't even have minutes for him.

Thats two true centers and one true power forward. Sure LM at the 5 (plenty of concerns here per scouting reports) and JJ and RS can move to the 4 in a pinch or in a smaller lineup, but I don't think we should call it a day until we are two deep at both big positions. LM is going to probably struggle with physical 4's and reading his scouting report, he is a guy who is probably going to struggle with foul trouble as a freshman. Chance has been adequate in a pinch, but him being able to handle major minutes and keep us at an elite level in his 2nd year is not a given. Im never comfortable entering a season w 3 true bigs, especially taking into account Pac 12 officiating, the new officiating in general, and losing Bash and Zeus in the last three years for extended periods. Im all for playing things safe and bringing in a grad transfer 4 or 5 just to have a body and fouls to give in the worst case scenario, and best case, he being a quality backup who can give us solid minutes.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 10:58 am

What is your definition of a true college power forward? Bennett Davison, Rick Anderson, Rondae Hollis-Jefferson, Jesse Perry, etc., have played the 4 plenty for successful Arizona teams. True college power forwards are different than true NBA power forwards. Jackson and Smith make us 3 deep at the position.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 11:02 am

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
ChooChooCat wrote:We have 3 guys who can play the 5 (LM, DR, CC) and 3 guys who can play the 4 (LM, JJ, RS). We're fine.

This also assumes we don't land that Aussie post player who's visiting next month. If we land him then we probably won't even have minutes for him.
Both JJ and Smith are true 3's. If we don't need to make them play the 4, so much the better for the program and for them (they both have a pro future at the 3).

How many true 3's have not played some 4 at some point for Arizona in history?

DiehardDave37 · Post by **DiehardDave37** » Tue Dec 29, 2015 11:22 am

97cats wrote:slice it, dice it, mix it, im more than fine with:

Simon
Allen
Trier
Jackson
Smith
Markkanen
Ristic
Comanche

as the top eight

Wow! You expect Justin to beat out PJC for PG back-up. I assume your Jackson is Josh and not J-C. I was hoping to see Simon used more than he was, but I did not allow myself to think that much out of the box. However, Miller had a reason for keeping him and letting Dorsey get away. That choice does not look good right now, but I hope it will next year. I never played hoops at a high level, so I apparently miss some of Simon's flaws, but he sure passes my eye test when he is is in the game and making good things happen.

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