Bear Down Wildcats

1290 was talking earlier about how the story on ESPN may not have gone through all the processes to fact check because Yahoo and other sources beat ESPN to stories earlier.

Part of me (most?) feels that having him at practice revs up the "what is going on" and "why won't he speak at a presser" talk. He obviously missed the presser today, and I think missing practice too allows time to get things in order--legally speaking.

You have to understand, if you are reading this you are an insane, crazy fan. You've found this board somehow and you frequent it. You are the 95% of people who read the headline Friday and went only that far.

Beachcat97 wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:Pascoe saying Miller was not at practice.

That sucks.

Consistent with him not coaching vs Oregon, IMO. We talk about shortcoming in ESPN's report, but to have him back, there probably needs to be something more definite.

What this is probably coming to is an announcement about his future. What the content of that announcement is...

Longhorned wrote:

Postmaster wrote:

phxcat23 wrote:The thing is, if Miller was tipped off about Book doing his own thing on the side, chances are the FBI wasn't around to get anything on Miller until Dawkins started to communicate with Book. Since this timeline seems so jacked, when was it that Book made contact with Dawkins? That's probably the point in time the FBI started sniffing around Arizona....then found only enough evidence to get Book, and Miller has nothing solid against him.

They were listening to Dawkins not Miller and I believe the investigation goes back to at least 2015 so those taps could have occurred a long time ago.

And the FBI thought so much about those tapped conversations that they didn't include them or Miller in their complaint for activities through September 2017? And decided just to get Book?

I'm not trying to side against AZ.
My points were that I'm not sure the timeline couldn't work out (unfortunately) and that people keep talking as if the FBI was servayling Miller. I believe Miller was caught up while the were listing to Dawkins.

I agree with you in that if the FBI felt miller had committed a crime based on the wiretaps then he would have been arrested when Book was.

AzSRRinCal wrote:It's been almost two decades since I was a regular on a UA forum but like most here, this story has grabbed my heart and mind and I can't shake loose of it.

I've never been much of a Sean Miller fan. I've always been bothered by his sideline comportment. And while I consider him an above average coach, I still don't think he really knows how to maximize the talent available to him nor has he adjusted well to the changing game. That said, even with the "possible" mishandling of the Pitts situation, I've never once doubted the man's integrity and it will take a lot more than a shaky ESPN report to change that.

I don't believe there's some grand conspiracy to bring Sean or UA down but nothing about the way ESPN handled this during the first 24 hours makes sense to me.

Welcome to the board. Stick around.

Postmaster wrote:

Longhorned wrote:

Postmaster wrote:

phxcat23 wrote:The thing is, if Miller was tipped off about Book doing his own thing on the side, chances are the FBI wasn't around to get anything on Miller until Dawkins started to communicate with Book. Since this timeline seems so jacked, when was it that Book made contact with Dawkins? That's probably the point in time the FBI started sniffing around Arizona....then found only enough evidence to get Book, and Miller has nothing solid against him.

They were listening to Dawkins not Miller and I believe the investigation goes back to at least 2015 so those taps could have occurred a long time ago.

And the FBI thought so much about those tapped conversations that they didn't include them or Miller in their complaint for activities through September 2017? And decided just to get Book?

I'm not trying to side against AZ.
My points were that I'm not sure the timeline couldn't work out (unfortunately) and that people keep talking as if the FBI was servayling Miller. I believe Miller was caught up while the were listing to Dawkins.

I agree with you in that if the FBI felt miller had committed a crime based on the wiretaps then he would have been arrested when Book was.

Thanks. I didn't mean I thought that's how you felt about it. I'm just addressing the logistics that would affect.

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:Pascoe saying Miller was not at practice.

That sucks.

Consistent with him not coaching vs Oregon, IMO. We talk about shortcoming in ESPN's report, but to have him back, there probably needs to be something more definite.

What this is probably coming to is an announcement about his future. What the content of that announcement is...

That’s how I interpret this as well, not good, or necessary bad, it giving the legal eagles and admin an chance to make a decision.

Chicat wrote:

OSCat wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:Pascoe saying Miller was not at practice.

Not a great sign or am I wrong?

Not a great sign. If Miller was there I’d be confident that his case is airtight and this shit is going to work out in his favor.

Maybe moved him to witness protection

Unsurprisingly we have friends in Michigan State

https://247sports.com/college/michigan- ... -115564572" target="_blank

Olsondogg wrote:Miller was probably meeting with University officials and lawyers and the such...just sayin.

I would go with this as they had to meet sometime today and why not make it during practice to deflect a bit

UAdevil wrote:

AzSRRinCal wrote:It's been almost two decades since I was a regular on a UA forum but like most here, this story has grabbed my heart and mind and I can't shake loose of it.

I've never been much of a Sean Miller fan. I've always been bothered by his sideline comportment. And while I consider him an above average coach, I still don't think he really knows how to maximize the talent available to him nor has he adjusted well to the changing game. That said, even with the "possible" mishandling of the Pitts situation, I've never once doubted the man's integrity and it will take a lot more than a shaky ESPN report to change that.

I don't believe there's some grand conspiracy to bring Sean or UA down but nothing about the way ESPN handled this during the first 24 hours makes sense to me.

Welcome to the board. Stick around.

I think we'll all stick around. But I do wonder what we'll be talking about if the basketball program is gutted. Maybe move the football board up a notch. We can get that baseball board going. How about a literature section? Who wants to talk Gabriel Garcia Marquez?

Longhorned wrote:

UAdevil wrote:

AzSRRinCal wrote:It's been almost two decades since I was a regular on a UA forum but like most here, this story has grabbed my heart and mind and I can't shake loose of it.

I've never been much of a Sean Miller fan. I've always been bothered by his sideline comportment. And while I consider him an above average coach, I still don't think he really knows how to maximize the talent available to him nor has he adjusted well to the changing game. That said, even with the "possible" mishandling of the Pitts situation, I've never once doubted the man's integrity and it will take a lot more than a shaky ESPN report to change that.

I don't believe there's some grand conspiracy to bring Sean or UA down but nothing about the way ESPN handled this during the first 24 hours makes sense to me.

Welcome to the board. Stick around.

I think we'll all stick around. But I do wonder what we'll be talking about if the basketball program is gutted. Maybe move the football board up a notch. We can get that baseball board going. How about a literature section? Who wants to talk Gabriel Garcia Marquez?

legit concern of mine

The AZ Board of Regents, the President of the UofA, and the AD need to all be 100% sure that Miller is clean before they let him back with the team. They aren't going to risk their future's for Miller's.

It is going to be tough to get them all on Miller's side and it's certainly going to take some time and investigating.

A quick announcement is not going to give us the outcome we desire.

Longhorned wrote:
How about a literature section? Who wants to talk Gabriel Garcia Marquez?

I’m down.

Well if ABOR ever wanted to fuck us...

“We must review all evidence to clear you”

“But the investigation is ongoing and won’t be completed till all parties go to trial in 2019”

“Them’s the breaks...”

CalStateTempe wrote:

Spaceman Spiff wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:

Olsondogg wrote:Pascoe saying Miller was not at practice.

That sucks.

Consistent with him not coaching vs Oregon, IMO. We talk about shortcoming in ESPN's report, but to have him back, there probably needs to be something more definite.

What this is probably coming to is an announcement about his future. What the content of that announcement is...

That’s how I interpret this as well, not good, or necessary bad, it giving the legal eagles and admin an chance to make a decision.

I dropped you a PM earlier that laid out exactly what I thought the delay was. That's the heart of it, right there.

The only other thing would be if Miller is negotiating a voluntary parting of ways.

Yes spiff, I saw that and that would take some time, especially to get everyone on board.

But we all know how cantankerous ABOR can be with all matters UofA.

got a bad feeling he's done

Whether true or false, this is an up close experience of how fake news can destroy someone's life. Because even if this story is true, you can see how easily it could be false and someone's career and rep is damaged forever.

Even if true, bend the words here, have a compromised source there, anything to go viral.

The libel and defamation laws need to be tougher. ESPN needs to be Gawkered if this is false.

So for all you CNN, MSNBC, and even FOX fans, this is what you consume and give eyeballs to, bringing in add revenue to them, because you a sheep.

If abor tries to fire CSM are they going to donate the 10 mil?

Bosy Billups wrote:Whether true or false, this is an up close experience of how fake news can destroy someone's life. Because even if this story is true, you can see how easily it could be false and someone's career and rep is damaged forever.

The libel and defamation laws need to be tougher. ESPN needs to be Gawkered if this is false.

So for all you CNN, MSNBC, and even FOX fans, this is what you consume and give eyeballs to, bringing in add revenue to them, because you a sheep.

yep. imprison all journalists amirite? especially those critical of dear leader...

RJ just straight killin' DukieV on twitter

FBI investigation aside, wouldn't Robbins/Heeke/ABOR ask Sean Miller whether he or his current/former staff knowingly have ever payed or orchestrated payment to anyone for any player to attend the University regardless of this situation or not. If Miller has (and didn't lie to them), then maybe the University & Miller mutually part ways while still both going after ESPN for damages depending on the outcome of this and Miller can potentially save his career. Maybe I am naive and maybe people don't ask the questions they don't want to know the answer to. Obviously this could go a number of ways, but we live in a world of instant gratification.

The damage has already been done to the program and the University. The program already has a de-facto NCAA tournament ban the next season or two at the minimum.

BE4RDOWN21 wrote:RJ just straight killin' DukieV on twitter

Link?

Postmaster wrote:If abor tries to fire CSM are they going to donate the 10 mil?

I think that issue with CSM contract has been reported incorrectly. Came out this morning that if he is terminated with cause, he only gets what he has earned up until the date of termination.

I also don't know why he would have said the vindicated line if he was going to leave on his own.
And the money owed is a decent amount to stick around for.

Unless he had already talked to admin about leaving after this year.

Right now, with no evidence against him, how would they show cause?

scumdevils86 wrote:

Bosy Billups wrote:Whether true or false, this is an up close experience of how fake news can destroy someone's life. Because even if this story is true, you can see how easily it could be false and someone's career and rep is damaged forever.

The libel and defamation laws need to be tougher. ESPN needs to be Gawkered if this is false.

So for all you CNN, MSNBC, and even FOX fans, this is what you consume and give eyeballs to, bringing in add revenue to them, because you a sheep.

yep. imprison all journalists amirite? especially those critical of dear leader...

Nope, not imprison, but punish. If you're a public figure, basically impossible to have recourse because of different legal standard. Let puvluc figures have private figure standard, where truth is the only defense. Let me know if you need to borrow my elite common sense.

CalStateTempe wrote:

BE4RDOWN21 wrote:RJ just straight killin' DukieV on twitter

Link?

https://twitter.com/roadtrippinpod/stat ... 3312376833" target="_blank

i just want him to finish this year for two reasons:

1) it would be a tremendous shot in the arm to the players to get him back and the us against the world mentality could really take shape

and

2) it means there are clear holes in the report and the potential for future sanctions from this incident are quieted a bit.

after that, i dont give a shit what he does

Postmaster wrote:Right now, with no evidence against him, how would they show cause?

Come on bro, after Book got perped, they could have fired him if they wanted.

But they know we'll not have a top coach for years if they did.

97cats wrote:i just want him to finish this year for two reasons:

1) it would be a tremendous shot in the arm to the players to get him back and the us against the world mentality could really take shape

and

2) it means there are clear holes in the report and the potential for future sanctions from this incident are quieted a bit.

after that, i dont give a shit what he does

Completely agree. Look how they responded initially against Oregon. An angry Ayton is nothing to Fuck with

97cats wrote:i just want him to finish this year for two reasons:

1) it would be a tremendous shot in the arm to the players to get him back and the us against the world mentality could really take shape

and

2) it means there are clear holes in the report and the potential for future sanctions from this incident are quieted a bit.

after that, i dont give a shit what he does

I'm in the same place.

I want a god damned storybook ending!

BE4RDOWN21 wrote:

CalStateTempe wrote:

BE4RDOWN21 wrote:RJ just straight killin' DukieV on twitter

Link?

https://twitter.com/roadtrippinpod/stat ... 3312376833" target="_blank

Thanks dude

Postmaster wrote:Right now, with no evidence against him, how would they show cause?

It would have to be the article at this point unless he admits internally, and I don't know why he would.

Seeking the evidence would be the thing.

Alieberman wrote:

97cats wrote:i just want him to finish this year for two reasons:

1) it would be a tremendous shot in the arm to the players to get him back and the us against the world mentality could really take shape

and

2) it means there are clear holes in the report and the potential for future sanctions from this incident are quieted a bit.

after that, i dont give a shit what he does

I'm in the same place.

I want a god damned storybook ending!

At Arizona we are due.

97cats wrote:after that, i dont give a shit what he does

Seriously, 97? You're ready to close the book on the Miller era?

97cats wrote:i just want him to finish this year for two reasons:

1) it would be a tremendous shot in the arm to the players to get him back and the us against the world mentality could really take shape

and

2) it means there are clear holes in the report and the potential for future sanctions from this incident are quieted a bit.

after that, i dont give a shit what he does

yes yes yes

This has to be draining and I'm sure they are meeting with a variety of people might take a few days. I don't think hes gone.

Guy's most folks are missing the most important dynamic of this ESPN shitshow.

Yes the front-line, low level commentators and hacks that the fans see everyday broke this story but make no bones this was approved and given legs to run with this cluster fuck of a targeted attack on Sean Miller and Arizona from the highest executive level.

The low level hacks like Dickie V and rest are compromised scumbags all with an agenda, but all of the reported material was a grade school journalism course failure and was approved from top level ESPN personal.

That scummy, biased, no integrity and unfit for public consumption company cannot burn to the ground fast enough. They are beyond irresponsible with this disgusting character assassination of Sean Miller.

Gladiator Cat wrote:Guy's most folks are missing the most important dynamic of this ESPN shitshow.

Yes the front-line, low level commentators and hacks that the fans see everyday broke this story but make no bones this was approved and given legs to run with this cluster fuck of a targeted attack on Sean Miller and Arizona from the highest executive level.

The low level hacks like Dickie V and rest are compromised scumbags all with an agenda, but all of the crap the reporting material that would be a grade school journalism course failure was approved from top level ESPN personal.

That scummy, biased, no integrity and unfit for public consumption company cannot burn to the ground fast enough. They are beyond irresponsible with this disgusting character assassination of Sean Miller.

Does it NOT fit the idea this was leaked to deflect from the Yahoo report? How much of the Yahoo report was covered extensively after the Miller news? 90/10? The timing is obvious af

ESPN = MSM, same folks, same tactics, same everything. The powers that be wanted to bury the Yahoo reporr, and bury a man to do so.

Beachcat97 wrote:
Seriously, 97? You're ready to close the book on the Miller era?

ive thought this was the last season for Miller since September - what i didnt know what was the perception of him among many folks that fly at a different altitude than me.

a cocktail party here an xmas party there and its easy for me to understand why Bilas and Greenberg jumped on his ass prematurely, the narrative inside college sports is that Miller is dirty, he just cheats better than anyone else.

is this true? i dont know about to that extent, but as soon as people smelled one drop of blood it was pile on time, and i tell you that because off the record thats the reputation he has inside and around college basketball.

so, am i ready to close the book (no pun intended)? im not sure.

but i can tell you i could care far less about him leaving now than i did any year before this season - i just dont want him to leave like Todd Bozemon with shit stain trail.

thats why im praying he gets through these next few days and finds his way back onto the court...thats what all AZ fans should be hoping for.

Wouldn't be surprised if ESPN sat on this for months, waiting for the perfect time. This was not cooked up in the last week, this I guarantee

97cats wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:
Seriously, 97? You're ready to close the book on the Miller era?

ive thought this was the last season for Miller since September - what i didnt know what was the perception of him among many folks that fly at a different altitude than me.

a cocktail party here an xmas party there and its easy for me to understand why Bilas and Greenberg jumped on his ass prematurely, the narrative inside college sports is that Miller is dirty, he just cheats better than anyone else.

is this true? i dont know about to that extent, but as soon as people smelled one drop of blood it was pile on time, and i tell you that because off the record thats the reputation he has inside and around college basketball.

so, am i ready to close the book (no pun intended)? im not sure.

but i can tell you i could care far less about him leaving now than i did any year before this season - i just dont want him to leave like Todd Bozemon with shit stain trail.

thats why im praying he gets through these next few days and finds his way back onto the court...thats what all AZ fans should be hoping for.

That's exactly what I and others are hoping for, I'm quite sure.

It's unfortunate to hear this about SM's reputation. If true, then maybe it is better that a change comes once the season concludes. Coaching changes are just so destabilizing to a program, or at least they can be.

Recruiting was done as soon as that report dropped, and it's done for the several years especially if Miller stays. I don't see how Miller survives, and why anyone would want him to if he won't be able to recruit. Think he's ultimately done.

97cats wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:
Seriously, 97? You're ready to close the book on the Miller era?

ive thought this was the last season for Miller since September - what i didnt know what was the perception of him among many folks that fly at a different altitude than me.

a cocktail party here an xmas party there and its easy for me to understand why Bilas and Greenberg jumped on his ass prematurely, the narrative inside college sports is that Miller is dirty, he just cheats better than anyone else.

is this true? i dont know about to that extent, but as soon as people smelled one drop of blood it was pile on time, and i tell you that because off the record thats the reputation he has inside and around college basketball.

so, am i ready to close the book (no pun intended)? im not sure.

but i can tell you i could care far less about him leaving now than i did any year before this season - i just dont want him to leave like Todd Bozemon with shit stain trail.

thats why im praying he gets through these next few days and finds his way back onto the court...thats what all AZ fans should be hoping for.

Sounds like people became jealous of Sean, he was the golden boy, cool, got the best recruits, always played it off casual. Funny, before Arizona at a small school, he was considered clean. So he played hardball against K, Self, etc. I can see those "execs" planting the seed against Miller. Waiting for this moment.

Funny, how many have come to his defense in the coaching elite? When you know damn well they pay for recruits.

let me make this clear for about the 100th time -- every, and i mean every, big-time college program pays for its top players.

and to that, 90% of the middeling programs do as well, and shockingly enough some Division II and even blooming schools.

just want to make sure thats crystal clear -- so when Andy Enfield says to my face that nobody can compete with how Sean Miller cheats, he just means that USC's basketball machine isnt up to the standards of AZ's well oiled machine, cause SC is right therein the money fight, but the resources for basketball in tucson are PLENTIFUL.

and mind you, there are many many many culpable people here who arent coaches, Greg Byrne being one of them and hundreds of boosters.

Bosy Billups wrote:

97cats wrote:

Beachcat97 wrote:
Seriously, 97? You're ready to close the book on the Miller era?

ive thought this was the last season for Miller since September - what i didnt know what was the perception of him among many folks that fly at a different altitude than me.

a cocktail party here an xmas party there and its easy for me to understand why Bilas and Greenberg jumped on his ass prematurely, the narrative inside college sports is that Miller is dirty, he just cheats better than anyone else.

is this true? i dont know about to that extent, but as soon as people smelled one drop of blood it was pile on time, and i tell you that because off the record thats the reputation he has inside and around college basketball.

so, am i ready to close the book (no pun intended)? im not sure.

but i can tell you i could care far less about him leaving now than i did any year before this season - i just dont want him to leave like Todd Bozemon with shit stain trail.

thats why im praying he gets through these next few days and finds his way back onto the court...thats what all AZ fans should be hoping for.

Sounds like people became jealous of Sean, he was the golden boy, cool, got the best recruits, always played it off casual. Funny, before Arizona at a small school, he was considered clean. So he played hardball against K, Self, etc. I can see those "execs" planting the seed against Miller. Waiting for this moment.

Funny, how many have come to his defense in the coaching elite? When you know damn well they pay for recruits.

Right now, I don't know if any coach will stick his neck out. Miller's friends in the pros have supported more, but in college, the underlying scandal is wide enough that no one wants to be sucked into it.

PS - how many coaches out there work harder than CSM? Maybe they were jealous of his work ethic too, made them feel low. Maybe they are threatened by a new class of coaches overtaking the old guard. Or the fan base wishing their coach was more like Miller, or that SM was talked about as a replacement for the geriatric coaches on a pedestal.