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Frybry02 · Post by **Frybry02** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 1:26 pm

Just got an email response from Flohoops about how long it takes for the video replays to become available on their website.... 5-7 days. What a joke

NYCat · Post by **NYCat** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:08 pm

84Cat wrote:Favorite tweet of the day goes to BR's mom

RaisingArizona · Post by **RaisingArizona** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:35 pm

I said the first time I saw him play that It was silly that Randolph was not a five star and I still believe that to be true. He was on the same court as Ayton, Bamba and Reddish and was arguably the most impacuful player.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:03 pm

Arizona wins big, Brandon Randolph shines in first game of Spain exhibition tour

https://www.diehards.com/arizona/arizon ... ition-tour" target="_blank

Wildcats blow out Combinado Valenciano in first exhibition

box score
https://www.azdesertswarm.com/basketbal ... highlights" target="_blank

SunnyAZ · Post by **SunnyAZ** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:07 pm

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:07 pm

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:08 pm

Bad sign: Enhanced box score shows Randolph clapped for the ball more times than Trier.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:16 pm

Confirmation Ayton played.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:19 pm

Replay, but gotta join.

http://www.flohoops.com/video/1242891-a ... ZDeZ1GJjIV" target="_blank

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:27 pm

Certainly appears we have 11 capable guys. Who are the odd guys with very reduced roles?

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:32 pm

azcat49 wrote:Certainly appears we have 11 capable guys. Who are the odd guys with very reduced roles?

Have heard the possibility that Pinder may very well redshirt this year now that the Ayton issue has been taken care of. Not 100% on that, but it's definitely a major option being discussed.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:40 pm

gumby wrote:Bad sign: Enhanced box score shows Randolph clapped for the ball more times than Trier.

What was his overall Sulk%?

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:41 pm

Would make sense considering Akot reclassified. The hard one for me is Barcelo. He is the only other natural looking PG as Smith, Trier or Akot wouldn't be my back up PG.

Miller is going to earn his dough this year and he may need to extend that bench to 10 like he did in the DWill year

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:45 pm

SunnyAZ wrote:

Some fantastic per minute production.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:46 pm

azcat49 wrote:Would make sense considering Akot reclassified. The hard one for me is Barcelona. He is the only other natural looking PG as Smith, Trier or Akot wouldn't be my back up PG.

Miller is going to earn his dough this year and he may need tyo extend that bench to 10 like he did in the DWill year

As of this moment Barcello is your 2nd string PG, Akot is your 3rd, and Trier behind him for an emergency. I still think Smith at this moment is on the outside looking in regardless of how well he played today.

Miller extended his rotation to 10 during the DWill year, because nobody was so great that they separated themselves from the rest of the pack outside of DWill of course. I mean offensively DWill was options 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, all the way to Z that year, while every one else played off what was given to them via what DWill's mere presence created for them. This season we have so many offensive weapons that can create for themselves I just don't see a need to remotely go 10 deep in a close game.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:52 pm

Agreed as it gets deeper into the season and with Smith being a wing you would think his role would be easily diminished. I still wonder about Lee and his progression and ultimate role.

I really think this years team is the most talented Miller has had. Going to be fun to watch

Longhorned · Post by **Longhorned** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:55 pm

I don't understand. To me, the point guard position is going to hit a wall as soon as Arizona faces a quality team in the tourney. I can't imagine a non-elite freshman combo guard to be of any value as a point guard in a real, face-in-the-toilet-water tourney game. Just sayin'

prh · Post by **prh** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:34 pm

Longhorned wrote:I don't understand. To me, the point guard position is going to hit a wall as soon as Arizona faces a quality team in the tourney. I can't imagine a non-elite freshman combo guard to be of any value as a point guard in a real, face-in-the-toilet-water tourney game. Just sayin'

I agree with the premise but have a slightly different take on the conclusion. I think that a seasoned Akot at point can solve some of PJC's issues against better teams. He will be much better defensively, and he will not be a primary ball handler, but be a more capable offensive player off the ball. While PJC can be a good playmaker at times, when push comes to shove in the tourney, he isn't going to be the guy running the show. Off the ball, his primary offensive skill is shooting the 3.

I think our needs at PG are non traditional, and therefore I think a non traditional route may be optimal in the tourney. However, this would require rolling Akot at PG a lot more during the season to get him to that point. This would cause some growing pains but I think the extra option would be worth it in March (and April). Just some thoughts, although I'll admit to having views similar to 97 regarding our PG situation and its impact on a FF trip.

Longhorned · Post by **Longhorned** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:42 pm

prh wrote:
Longhorned wrote:I don't understand. To me, the point guard position is going to hit a wall as soon as Arizona faces a quality team in the tourney. I can't imagine a non-elite freshman combo guard to be of any value as a point guard in a real, face-in-the-toilet-water tourney game. Just sayin'
I agree with the premise but have a slightly different take on the conclusion. I think that a seasoned Akot at point can solve some of PJC's issues against better teams. He will be much better defensively, and he will not be a primary ball handler, but be a more capable offensive player off the ball. While PJC can be a good playmaker at times, when push comes to shove in the tourney, he isn't going to be the guy running the show. Off the ball, his primary offensive skill is shooting the 3.

I think our needs at PG are non traditional, and therefore I think a non traditional route may be optimal in the tourney. However, this would require rolling Akot at PG a lot more during the season to get him to that point. This would cause some growing pains but I think the extra option would be worth it in March (and April). Just some thoughts, although I'll admit to having views similar to 97 regarding our PG situation and its impact on a FF trip.

I potentially agree as far as Akot goes, at least insofar as he's an elite recruit. I was responding to Choo's depth chart where Barcello is ahead of Akot.

prh · Post by **prh** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:44 pm

Longhorned wrote:
prh wrote:
Longhorned wrote:I don't understand. To me, the point guard position is going to hit a wall as soon as Arizona faces a quality team in the tourney. I can't imagine a non-elite freshman combo guard to be of any value as a point guard in a real, face-in-the-toilet-water tourney game. Just sayin'
I agree with the premise but have a slightly different take on the conclusion. I think that a seasoned Akot at point can solve some of PJC's issues against better teams. He will be much better defensively, and he will not be a primary ball handler, but be a more capable offensive player off the ball. While PJC can be a good playmaker at times, when push comes to shove in the tourney, he isn't going to be the guy running the show. Off the ball, his primary offensive skill is shooting the 3.

I think our needs at PG are non traditional, and therefore I think a non traditional route may be optimal in the tourney. However, this would require rolling Akot at PG a lot more during the season to get him to that point. This would cause some growing pains but I think the extra option would be worth it in March (and April). Just some thoughts, although I'll admit to having views similar to 97 regarding our PG situation and its impact on a FF trip.
I potentially agree as far as Akot goes, at least insofar as he's an elite recruit. I was responding to Choo's depth chart where Barcello is ahead of Akot.

Oh my bad, I've just been on Akot at PG train and missed you were referring to Barcello. I definitely agree on him. It's an interesting long term situation with Barcello/Akot and the guys coming in next year.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:02 pm

I mean that's just the depth chart as of today Longhorned. I think Barcello's shot, ballhandling, and his intrinsical ability to play hard all the time will ensure he gets PT this year. I'm sure Miller will utilize Akot at the 1 if his size makes more sense. It's all situational anyways.

gumby · Post by **gumby** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 10:02 pm

Chicat wrote:
gumby wrote:Bad sign: Enhanced box score shows Randolph clapped for the ball more times than Trier.
What was his overall Sulk%?

Broke Salim's freshman record.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 4:58 am

http://tucson.com/sports/arizonawildcat ... 7f25c.html" target="_blank

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:21 am

prh wrote:
Longhorned wrote:I don't understand. To me, the point guard position is going to hit a wall as soon as Arizona faces a quality team in the tourney. I can't imagine a non-elite freshman combo guard to be of any value as a point guard in a real, face-in-the-toilet-water tourney game. Just sayin'
I agree with the premise but have a slightly different take on the conclusion. I think that a seasoned Akot at point can solve some of PJC's issues against better teams. He will be much better defensively, and he will not be a primary ball handler, but be a more capable offensive player off the ball. While PJC can be a good playmaker at times, when push comes to shove in the tourney, he isn't going to be the guy running the show. Off the ball, his primary offensive skill is shooting the 3.

I think our needs at PG are non traditional, and therefore I think a non traditional route may be optimal in the tourney. However, this would require rolling Akot at PG a lot more during the season to get him to that point. This would cause some growing pains but I think the extra option would be worth it in March (and April). Just some thoughts, although I'll admit to having views similar to 97 regarding our PG situation and its impact on a FF trip.

I don't necessarily think it's too early to say that if we lose in the tourney, all eyes are going to the pg position.

It's just the only place we aren't loaded with talent. If I had to list my concerns about the season, there would be pg and then everything else way on the back burner.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:20 am

Don't have time to look it up right now, but have most champs from recent seasons had star-level PG play? Is average PG play effectively a deal-breaker?

By the way, I'm probably in the minority here in thinking PJC will be good enough to help us to a FF this season.

elriop20 · Post by **elriop20** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:40 am

Beachcat97 wrote:Don't have time to look it up right now, but have most champs from recent seasons had star-level PG play? Is average PG play effectively a deal-breaker?

By the way, I'm probably in the minority here in thinking PJC will be good enough to help us to a FF this season.

Last year the Zags and NC both had top level point guards leading their team.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:41 am

Beachcat97 wrote:Don't have time to look it up right now, but have most champs from recent seasons had star-level PG play? Is average PG play effectively a deal-breaker?

By the way, I'm probably in the minority here in thinking PJC will be good enough to help us to a FF this season.

Last team that won it all that really didn't have a quality point guard was Duke in 2010 with Jon Scheyer manning the 1 for them.

Main Event · Post by **Main Event** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:49 am

Longhorned · Post by **Longhorned** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:19 am

In homage to ASUHATER!, I wouldn't mind trading a few of those Valencia starters for some of ours.

EVCat · Post by **EVCat** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 11:42 am

ChooChooCat wrote: I think Barcello's ...intrinsical ability to play hard all the time will ensure he gets PT this year.

You have seen him play a bit, I am guessing

I don't want to overhype the kid, or claim he is somehow gives so much more effort than the others, who all work hard. And I don't want to make him into some "Rudy" type character, either, because that isn't fair to his talent.

But what you touch on here...it is just different than most. Jordan-like. He is relentless.

I hope, as a fan of the team and someone who thinks he is a good kid, his talents are great enough to allow that maniacal drive to pay dividends here.

loomer · Post by **loomer** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:02 pm

Beachcat97 wrote:Don't have time to look it up right now, but have most champs from recent seasons had star-level PG play? Is average PG play effectively a deal-breaker?

By the way, I'm probably in the minority here in thinking PJC will be good enough to help us to a FF this season.

It's probably a deal breaker if you want to win a title, not if you want to get to a Final Four.

2017 - Berry (a bit overrated)
2016 - Arch + Brunson
2015 - Jones
2014 - Napier
2013 - Siva + Smith (excellent on defense, always had trouble offensively)
2012 - Teague (weakest on the list)
2011 - Kemba
2010 - Scheyer

ChooChooCat wrote: Last team that won it all that really didn't have a quality point guard was Duke in 2010 with Jon Scheyer manning the 1 for them.

Scheyer was a quality point. Scheyer wasn't a pure point but he was great at being a game manager and he was proficient on defense. Overall, he's really underrated.

NYCat · Post by **NYCat** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:14 pm

You need a strong back court, that's what wins in tournament play. It's the reason why UConn could beat that massive Kentucky team. Guards win in March.

Trier half of the equation and he's obviously an elite talent, all rests on PJC. He has to step during the tournament, during the reg season, largely unimportant as Arizona has too much talent to be squandered.

ChooChooCat · Post by **ChooChooCat** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:22 pm

loomer wrote:
Scheyer was a quality point. Scheyer wasn't a pure point but he was great at being a game manager and he was proficient on defense. Overall, he's really underrated.

Truthfully you just described a best case scenario for PJC, although Scheyer obviously scored way more than PJC will ever have to. God what a crap year of college basketball that was though. That Duke team wouldn't even make the final four in most years.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:34 pm

loomer wrote:
Beachcat97 wrote:Don't have time to look it up right now, but have most champs from recent seasons had star-level PG play? Is average PG play effectively a deal-breaker?

By the way, I'm probably in the minority here in thinking PJC will be good enough to help us to a FF this season.
It's probably a deal breaker if you want to win a title, not if you want to get to a Final Four.

2017 - Berry (a bit overrated)
2016 - Arch + Brunson
2015 - Jones
2014 - Napier
2013 - Siva + Smith (excellent on defense, always had trouble offensively)
2012 - Teague (weakest on the list)
2011 - Kemba
2010 - Scheyer

ChooChooCat wrote: Last team that won it all that really didn't have a quality point guard was Duke in 2010 with Jon Scheyer manning the 1 for them.
Scheyer was a quality point. Scheyer wasn't a pure point but he was great at being a game manager and he was proficient on defense. Overall, he's really underrated.

I think this shows the situation with PJC.

We are championship level on the wing and in the post. PJC would be last on that list by a decent margin. Ball distribution is the only specific area I would not put him last in, either.

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 2:50 pm

Did anyone try watching the stream on 2 different computers? I caved in and bought the sub.

This team is incredible. Ayton is a beast, Randolph is cold blooded, Smith was on fire and Barcello found his groove in the 2H. He made some great passes to find open guys and took quality shots off screens. I was very impressed. Trier and Rawle were excellent as always.

We are so damn deep its unfair

That was a JV/Freshman squad but I see us having a handful of 50 point wins this season. We held them to 5 pts in the 3Q while we put up 33 pts

If you guys aren't in the FB group you could request to join and watch the game. Someone streamed it in 2 parts:

https://www.facebook.com/michael.quiroz ... 935879108/" target="_blank
https://www.facebook.com/michael.quiroz ... 162844782/" target="_blank

A pic from a fan in attendance:

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 2:55 pm

In a recent interview Trier was noted as the third option at PG, with Barcello as the second. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcyeIlBXMqc

For those of us expecting Akot to play a big role at PG, it seems he has a ways to go from fourth in the rotation.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 2:57 pm

As locked in as ever. Love it!

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:00 pm

I can't get over the fact we had fans (maybe parents and of course DC from this board) representing. I find that incredible given it was in Spain.

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:01 pm

You couldnt see the other side of the court but we had 20-30 fans behind our bench. More than the other team

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:52 pm

azcat49 wrote:I can't get over the fact we had fans (maybe parents and of course DC from this board) representing. I find that incredible given it was in Spain.

Well, I couldn't get to the game in Valencia (three hour train ride from Barcelona and I have friends in town visiting) but I will most certainly be in the stands the next two games

97cats · Post by **97cats** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 4:18 pm

counting on middling freshman PG's to win on the road in conf play and in March is a bad business plan.

once again Sean Miller has put his never been before final four hopes in the hands of a small, injury prone, complementary player, two freshman who arent PG's, and a shooting guard who wants to shoot.

just dont say i didnt tell ya so.....

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 4:31 pm

97cats wrote:counting on middling freshman PG's to win on the road in conf play and in March is a bad business plan.

once again Sean Miller has put his never been before final four hopes in the hands of a small, injury prone, complementary player, two freshman who arent PG's, and a shooting guard who wants to shoot.

just dont say i didnt tell ya so.....

Oh man. Tell us how you really feel, 97.

I'll respectfully disagree because I think our other strengths are enough to compensate for this perceived weakness at PG.

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 5:16 pm

7 assists 0 turnovers but I counted 3 or 4 buckets due to him getting beat. He needs 10 assists a night. Trier or Randolph can run the point just fine if not

SunnyAZ · Post by **SunnyAZ** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 6:04 pm

Jefe wrote: If you guys aren't in the FB group you could request to join and watch the game. Someone streamed it in 2 parts:

https://www.facebook.com/michael.quiroz ... 935879108/" target="_blank
https://www.facebook.com/michael.quiroz ... 162844782/" target="_blank

how do you get in the fb group? When I click the link it just says the link may have expired or isn't available because you aren't in the audience.

RichardCranium · Post by **RichardCranium** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:47 pm

Main Event wrote:

I never really played BB seriously. Just a bit in PE class mainly. I am really much too short.

But in 'my day' almost every shot shown in that highlight real would have been waved off for traveling. Clearly times have changed and I have no idea when it happened.

Especially Trier's shots - he took 2 or 3 steps on every layup. Every shot that was shown, he was traveling except for the one from the corner at around the 52 second mark, and he almost shuffled his feet on that one (why did the ref signal that was a two point shot - is that a thing in Euro ball?).

Main Event · Post by **Main Event** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 9:57 pm

Believe it or not, they actually called traveling about 4 times in the game

SunnyAZ · Post by **SunnyAZ** » Mon Aug 14, 2017 10:54 pm

I didn't see any travels. They start counting steps after you get possession of the ball, not after the ball hits the floor. And you get two steps on drives. Also FIBA/euro is way stricter than USA.

dcZONAfan · Post by **dcZONAfan** » Tue Aug 15, 2017 7:34 am

RichardCranium wrote:
Main Event wrote:
I never really played BB seriously. Just a bit in PE class mainly. I am really much too short.

But in 'my day' almost every shot shown in that highlight real would have been waved off for traveling. Clearly times have changed and I have no idea when it happened.

Especially Trier's shots - he took 2 or 3 steps on every layup. Every shot that was shown, he was traveling except for the one from the corner at around the 52 second mark, and he almost shuffled his feet on that one (why did the ref signal that was a two point shot - is that a thing in Euro ball?).

I've said it before, 'Zo is the best in college basketball at making 3 steps look like two when he's on a fast break. He's as good as anyone I've ever seen, to be honest. It's different from the Eurostep, which is just a really slow, awkward looking non-travel

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:18 am

97cats wrote:counting on middling freshman PG's to win on the road in conf play and in March is a bad business plan.

Are we counting on Alex Barcello to win us close games? Pretty sure he's expected to contribute maybe 10m/g. It's possible that Barcello is an above average player (though it may take a year for that player to emerge). Barcello's success prior to joining the Cats is impressive. Two time state champion. Two time Gatorade AZ POY. All American Honorable Mention. Nike EYBL Peach MVP. NBPA All Tournament First Team selection along with Jaylen Hands and Zion Williamson.

97cats wrote:Once again Sean Miller has put his never been before final four hopes in the hands of a small, injury prone, complementary player, two freshman who arent PG's, and a shooting guard who wants to shoot.

Who was the last small, injury prone, complementary player to lead a Final Four caliber Arizona team at the PG position? Let me know so we can talk about "again."

Also... what does "two freshmen who aren't PGs" mean. Is that bad? That we have freshman players? Who are the two? Ayton, a top 5 draft pick, and Akot, a top 20 recruit? What are you even talking about? And a shooting guard who wants to shoot.

I honestly regret responding at all.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:25 am

YoDeFoe wrote:
97cats wrote:counting on middling freshman PG's to win on the road in conf play and in March is a bad business plan.
Are we counting on Alex Barcello to win us close games? Pretty sure he's expected to contribute maybe 10m/g. It's possible that Barcello is an above average player (though it may take a year for that player to emerge). Barcello's success prior to joining the Cats is impressive. Two time state champion. Two time Gatorade AZ POY. All American Honorable Mention. Nike EYBL Peach MVP. NBPA All Tournament First Team selection along with Jaylen Hands and Zion Williamson.

97cats wrote:Once again Sean Miller has put his never been before final four hopes in the hands of a small, injury prone, complementary player, two freshman who arent PG's, and a shooting guard who wants to shoot.
Who was the last small, injury prone, complementary player to lead a Final Four caliber Arizona team at the PG position? Let me know so we can talk about "again."

Also... what does "two freshmen who aren't PGs" mean. Is that bad? That we have freshman players? Who are the two? Ayton, a top 5 draft pick, and Akot, a top 20 recruit? What are you even talking about? And a shooting guard who wants to shoot.

I honestly regret responding at all.

Just translating:

Again is about how, for 3 years in a row, PJC is our big option at PG. The reliance on Parker again to get us to the promised land is a concern for me too.

The freshmen comment is about how Barcello and Akot are our only other options beyond Parker. I do agree with that, neither one is a true pg and for right now, neither is ready.

So, we're back to hoping Parker can step up to the plate for another year. I wish I had more confidence the answer was yes.

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