Why can't we consistently fill AZ Stadium?

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 8:52 am

Alieberman wrote:Getting rid of the zoo is ridiculous. This is a college football team. We need college kids there up front and loud. The question is how do you engage this generation and turn the live experience into a must be there kind of atmosphere for the students?

Winning certainly helps.

Agree. And this certainly isn't an Arizona specific problem. Every school from eastern Michigan to Alabama and back is having issues filling their student sections, keeping them full and having them stay the whole game. It's a product of the world we live in. Winning absolutely helps. But as far as keeping them engaged and wanting to go to every game, I don't know how you can do that with the young post millennial whippersnappers in college these days.

I just don't know if kids even have a desire to go sit in a stadium in the same place for 5 hours straight nowadays, even if they are a big fan.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:10 am

ChooChooCat wrote:
PHXCATS wrote:
ASUHATER! wrote:
PHXCATS wrote:The "ZONA ZOO" should be aborted
So should you and your sorry ass posts and fandom.
Yeah ban the guy who goes to the games and financially supports the program

The zoo looked awful yet again on tv. If you don't abort it you gotta do something and I am all ears for suggestions. The current situation doesn't work for anyone.
Give their seats to the paying public, move students to south end zone.

That was my thought. The side opposite the Zoo last night looked at least 4/5ths full. The Zoo did not.

I think moving the Zoo to the south end zone saves money on renovating that area and saves face when the students decide they have better things to do.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:16 am

Other schools don't have their student section on tv every play so it is a bigger deal for UA. What about selling a pass to move to the zoo from your other seats? If the zoo isn't filled 30 minutes before anyone can show their ticket and move to the zoo until it is filled for a fee.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:30 am

Create a fan group, the RR rowdies. The old red zone crew could fill that zoo and fit right in.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:35 am

azcat49 wrote:Create a fan group, the RR rowdies. The old red zone crew could fill that zoo and fit right in.

What ever happened to that group ZonaDefender1 from TOS was a part of? Remember they made national news one time, forgot what for, just getting rowdy.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:37 am

azcat49 wrote:Create a fan group, the RR rowdies. The old red zone crew could fill that zoo and fit right in.

While not a terrible idea, there definitely isn't enough of them to fill a 10000 seat student section.

scumdevils86 · Post by **scumdevils86** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:38 am

Winning is always by far and away the most helpful thing. Always will be.

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:45 am

Just need enough to cover for the students that are not showing up. I really think next year will be a great year attendance wise. We will have lots of hype and the bball team might be uneven so all the anticipation will be for football.

I like the students where they are. I do think we need to have a fan group that can and will show up and use the student section. Nothing more impressive than when it is full and loud

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:47 am

azcat49 wrote:Just need enough to cover for the students that are not showing up. I really think next year will be AZ great year attendance wise. We will have lots of hype and the bball team might be uneven o all the anticipation will be for football.

I like the students where they are. I do think we need to have a fan group that can and will show up and use the student section. Nothing more impressive than when it is full and loud

Agree. Back when I was in school and the zona zoo was new, it was pretty much full or completely full every game and loud and rocking, and this was when we didn't go to a bowl my first 3 years in school.

azpenguin · Post by **azpenguin** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 1:07 pm

This year's home schedule: NAU, Houston, Utah, UCLA, Washington St., Oregon St. Some decent teams but not the names that gets people to the stadium.

Next year: BYU, Southern Utah, USC, Oregon, Cal, Colorado, ASU. BYU will draw a good share of opposing fans, but USC, Oregon and ASU - that's worth buying a season ticket right there when you look at individual game prices.

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 4:42 pm

Anyone have the numbers on how may seats are available for the Zoo and how many students attend? I wonder if shrinking the zoo will help. Maybe reducing it from goal to goal to 20 yard line to 20 yard line or something. Another problem is that they all crunch in together leaving the ends empty. Remember, the students pay the athletics fee so "aborting" the zoo is not an option, it would be a PR disaster.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 4:52 pm

UALoco wrote:Anyone have the numbers on how may seats are available for the Zoo and how many students attend? I wonder if shrinking the zoo will help. Maybe reducing it from goal to goal to 20 yard line to 20 yard line or something. Another problem is that they all crunch in together leaving the ends empty. Remember, the students pay the athletics fee so "aborting" the zoo is not an option, it would be a PR disaster.

This. The students normally pack like 6 sections of people into about 4 sections so it looks worse on TV

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 4:56 pm

Aborting the Zoo was a little strong.

How about this? Zoo is currently sections 1-8. Move it to 4-12. Anyone in 9-12 that's a STH and Wildcat Club member can get tickets in 1-3 for two years at the price they paid this year per ticket.

Will still give students great seats and will look way better on tv

scumdevils86 · Post by **scumdevils86** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 4:57 pm

No, we should still abort the student section. Perfect choice of words and sentiment. Rep to you.

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:01 pm

azpenguin wrote:This year's home schedule: NAU, Houston, Utah, UCLA, Washington St., Oregon St. Some decent teams but not the names that gets people to the stadium.

Next year: BYU, Southern Utah, USC, Oregon, Cal, Colorado, ASU. BYU will draw a good share of opposing fans, but USC, Oregon and ASU - that's worth buying a season ticket right there when you look at individual game prices.

As long as Tate is healthy and eligible, Arizona will have the entire off-season to market a Heisman hopeful. Attendance is always going to be lower in the odd years when we play in Tempe. That's just how it goes. Crapping the bed against Houston and Utah took the wind out of the sails early. Expectations were really low to start the season. Two early losses did nothing to help. Next year will be a whole lot different.

scumdevils86 · Post by **scumdevils86** » Sun Nov 12, 2017 10:53 pm

zonagrad wrote:
azpenguin wrote:This year's home schedule: NAU, Houston, Utah, UCLA, Washington St., Oregon St. Some decent teams but not the names that gets people to the stadium.

Next year: BYU, Southern Utah, USC, Oregon, Cal, Colorado, ASU. BYU will draw a good share of opposing fans, but USC, Oregon and ASU - that's worth buying a season ticket right there when you look at individual game prices.
As long as Tate is healthy and eligible, Arizona will have the entire off-season to market a Heisman hopeful. Attendance is always going to be lower in the odd years when we play in Tempe. That's just how it goes. Crapping the bed against Houston and Utah took the wind out of the sails early. Expectations were really low to start the season. Two early losses did nothing to help. Next year will be a whole lot different.

Exactly. 2 blah losses to Utah and Houston plus late as fuck starts destroyed any potential attendance.

Next year will boost by 5000+ automatically

PieceOfMeat · Post by **PieceOfMeat** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:23 am

PHXCATS wrote:The "ZONA ZOO" should be aborted

This is one of the worst, absolutely low-class, posts you've ever made. Congrats.

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:44 am

I think I remember that our season ticket count was around 19k at the beginning of last year. I think that was down from 29k we saw in the Stoops peak. I bet it was even lower this year...my guess around 16k maybe? The USC/ASU/Oregon/etc home game slate plus Tate's junior year should add 5-10k season ticket holders.

On another topic: what are the chances Tate sticks around for his senior season? I imagine the NFL will want to see a lot more passing out of pro-sets from him. I wonder if RR would be willing to adjust the scheme to make Tate more NFL-ready and more attractive to the GM's out there. It could be a win win because having a top draft pick is great for recruiting, especially for the most important position on the field.

To bring this around, a Tate senior season would do wonders for season ticket counts if he can keep this up.

Beardown.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:47 am

UALoco wrote:I think I remember that our season ticket count was around 19k at the beginning of last year. I think that was down from 29k we saw in the Stoops peak. I bet it was even lower this year...my guess around 16k maybe? The USC/ASU/Oregon/etc home game slate plus Tate's junior year should add 5-10k season ticket holders.

On another topic: what are the chances Tate sticks around for his senior season? I imagine the NFL will want to see a lot more passing out of pro-sets from him. I wonder if RR would be willing to adjust the scheme to make Tate more NFL-ready and more attractive to the GM's out there. It could be a win win because having a top draft pick is great for recruiting, especially for the most important position on the field.

To bring this around, a Tate senior season would do wonders for season ticket counts if he can keep this up.

Beardown.

Tate is a better QB and better thrower and passer than most people give him credit for nation wide and in the media but he isnt nearly good enough yet to be an NFL QB. We wills see how much he improves but I dont see him leaving after his JR year to be an NFL QB at this point. If he wants to be a RB then that might be a different situation.

btfd16 · Post by **btfd16** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:47 am

scumdevils86 wrote:Winning is always by far and away the most helpful thing. Always will be.

This. Plain and simple.

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:35 pm

Well that was an all but guaranteed win with 6 under our belt and the most electric QB in the game. Just under 41K for our last home game...

Get us beer and/or a shuttle service and we're over 48K several games next season

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:42 pm

Jefe wrote:Well that was an all but guaranteed win with 6 under our belt and the most electric QB in the game. Just under 41K for our last home game...

Get us beer and/or a shuttle service and we're over 48K several games next season

I think the perceived issue of parking is far worse than the actual issue. I got out of the garages quickly every week, minus the time I took the cat cruiser, which was also fair quick.

HaCats · Post by **HaCats** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:47 pm

Better and more name brand opponents next year and an off season of optimism should totally change this around next year. The days of 56k are gone but hopefully we average 48-50k next year.

It's definitely time for a reduction in seat capacity, and I know individual seat backs through the whole stadium should shave 3-5k in capacity. Aside from that, Hansen wrote recently that the top 15 or so rows of the East Side Upper Deck either 'should be' removed 'or are potentially being planned to be' removed. I can never really tell with Hansen if he's referencing an actual plan or if he's just pulling some idea out of his arse.

I think a nice intimate 48k seat stadium with individual chairs, updated restrooms and concessions........and we'll get back to a respectable place with attendance. Heeke knows what has to be done, it's now about adjusting to the shift in what modern day fans demand for their dollar.

prh · Post by **prh** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:56 pm

azcat49 wrote:First off this Rick Kane who says he was a long time lurker, well that's just too convenient. Someone is socking, especially with the content of those posts.

As a sports fan of AZ and all sports, those teams need to earn the right to my hard working dollar earned. Starting a game at 8:15 has lost me. Now I still have tickets to both basketball and football and I am a wildcat member but so far this year I have been to one football game and I will not be going to any bball games except he one up in Phoenix against A&M.

Next year I plan on buying season tickets to bball (still won't go), baseball and women's volleyball. I think I will come down for a few weekend series for the baseball team who I actually love watching.

Family does come first and my wife just does not like going to games so I a have a choice of going it alone or hanging with her. For any reasonable start time (6pm or earlier) I will be there for kick off but I am not spending 500 a weekend to watch a game that ends at midnight.

That said I will be Autzen next week suckas!!!! Hate the ducks and I may get arrested so stay tuned on that one.

Be safe! That's the only venue I've ever gone to where I felt legitimately concerned for my well-being. Hopefully it's toned down now since they suck and no one cares anymore.

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:20 pm

btfd16 wrote:
scumdevils86 wrote:Winning is always by far and away the most helpful thing. Always will be.
This. Plain and simple.

Only that it was completely proven wrong this year.

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:26 pm

From what I understand, adding seat backs to the stadium is a much more complicated effort than folks think. You can't just pull the benches and install seats. Because the amount of room you need for a row with seatbacks compared to a row with a bench, you have to repour concrete and make each row deeper. I think I heard it would cost over $100MM. Again, there is probably someone who can explain this better and who might have more details.

azgreg · Post by **azgreg** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:27 pm

UALoco wrote:
btfd16 wrote:
scumdevils86 wrote:Winning is always by far and away the most helpful thing. Always will be.
This. Plain and simple.
Only that it was completely proven wrong this year.

It usually lags a season doesn't it?

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:29 pm

UALoco wrote:
btfd16 wrote:
scumdevils86 wrote:Winning is always by far and away the most helpful thing. Always will be.
This. Plain and simple.
Only that it was completely proven wrong this year.

Not even remotely. We started the season 2-2 with 2 home losses after going 3-9 the previous season and having very low expectations. That killed attendance the rest of the season, along with it being a meh home slate. The winning came far too late to make a difference.

But if we finish the season 9-4 or something and are potentially ranked preseason and have a Heisman contender in Tate and a better home schedule, that will reenergize attendance. The 2-2 start just took the casual fans' interest and drowned it in the bathtub and it couldn't recover.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:44 pm

azgreg wrote:
UALoco wrote:
btfd16 wrote:
scumdevils86 wrote:Winning is always by far and away the most helpful thing. Always will be.
This. Plain and simple.
Only that it was completely proven wrong this year.
It usually lags a season doesn't it?

In truth, it's a marketing issue. The AD needs a marketing team nimble enough to quickly pivot and take advantage of a surprise season. But usually public colleges have 2-3 people handling the marketing for all the teams, and they don't outsource work to agencies.

AD marketing budgets are usually allocated well in advance, so it's tough to shift dollars into channels that have high conversion rates. Most money is spent before the season in a push to sign up season ticket holders. So there isn't much left in the middle of the season to say, "Hey, the team is actually really good and we've got this kid making history. Come see us play."

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 9:15 pm

Even numbered years will always have an attendance advantage over odd numbered years based on the odd number of conference games scheduled (9) and ASU being the pivotal game. Generally speaking, the ASU game is the closest thing to a "sure thing" in terms of getting a sellout.

The next variable is the attractiveness of the non-conference opponent. Consumers will make their choice based on the attractiveness of Arizona's opponent. Getting a crappy team from a Big 5 conference is generally much more attractive than scheduling a good team from a non-power 5. And let's face it, there aren't many good teams from non-power 5 anyway. We might as well schedule Kansas as opposed to New Mexico. Both are dreadful programs but fan sees a Big XII opponent and takes notice and is more inclined to purchase.

If Tate stays through his senior season and all things being equal (quality of opponent of conference and non-conference foes), attendance will be better next season than Tate's senior season solely because of the ASU factor.

Harvey Specter · Post by **Harvey Specter** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:03 am

UALoco wrote:
btfd16 wrote:
scumdevils86 wrote:Winning is always by far and away the most helpful thing. Always will be.
This. Plain and simple.
Only that it was completely proven wrong this year.

Yes, it is that simple to dogmatic fans who are linear thinkers... assessing the issue in greater depth might offer some valuable insights, but it could give you a headache, so proceed with caution.

By the time it was apparent this team was good, we had 2 regular season games remaining. The WSU game turnout was a disappointment, but a game over Halloween weekend with a team expected to suck your balls (even a Tijuana whore would not do that) is a tall order. Our final matchup was against a doormat opponent.

Alieberman · Post by **Alieberman** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:53 am

If we truly want sellouts in both football and basketball, the football and basketball teams should just swap venues.

Problem solved

jimson · Post by **jimson** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:50 am

PHXCATS wrote:
Jefe wrote:Well that was an all but guaranteed win with 6 under our belt and the most electric QB in the game. Just under 41K for our last home game...

Get us beer and/or a shuttle service and we're over 48K several games next season
I think the perceived issue of parking is far worse than the actual issue. I got out of the garages quickly every week, minus the time I took the cat cruiser, which was also fair quick.

For youth through middle age maybe, but if you are a fairly active senior with arthritis or a hip replacement, you might get seats you don't have to climb 100's of stairs to, but are you going to walk from the 6th st garage?

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:00 am

Good point. There is Cherry garage also but good point with that Jim.

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:01 am

The mounting excuses are funny to read. Marketing, lag time, etc., etc. It boils down to the fact that the average Arizona football fan is so casual in their "fandom" that they are not able realize their team is special and get to a game unless they are given a year's heads up. You are all making my point for me. Not enough hard core fans. Just a quick glance on your phone and you can see some of the amazing plays KT and the rest of the team are making on your twitter feed, facebook, or favorite sports app. Also, I spoke to so many folks at the tailgate that were just heading home to watch the game after partying all day. That is a problem as well.

Anyways, I'll hold out hope that next year I am proven all wrong, and we fill the stadium next year with a Heisman front runner, coming off a good bowl performance, and probably picked to be 1st or 2nd in the P12 South. Doubtful. I predict we'll still see attendance problems and more lame excuses. The ASU and USC games will sell out, maybe the BYU due to the LDS population and maybe Oregon if they improve next year, but the Cal and Colorado games will struggle. Each conference game should sell out. Yes, I know we are seeing attendance issues across the board and it is not unique to AZ, doesn't mean I like it.

Also, the personal jibes are not necessary. It is funny to see how personal folks are taking these criticisms. It is just an opinion.

wyo-cat · Post by **wyo-cat** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:03 am

PHXCATS wrote:Good point. There is Cherry garage also but good point with that Jim.

There’s a new parking garage across Sixth from Sancet Field.

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:15 am

Harvey Specter wrote:assessing the issue in greater depth might offer some valuable insights, but it could give you a headache, so proceed with caution.

team expected to suck your balls (even a Tijuana whore would not do that) is a tall order.

Not funny, not necessary.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:08 pm

UALoco wrote:The mounting excuses are funny to read. Marketing, lag time, etc., etc. It boils down to the fact that the average Arizona football fan is so casual in their "fandom" that they are not able realize their team is special and get to a game unless they are given a year's heads up. You are all making my point for me. Not enough hard core fans. Just a quick glance on your phone and you can see some of the amazing plays KT and the rest of the team are making on your twitter feed, facebook, or favorite sports app. Also, I spoke to so many folks at the tailgate that were just heading home to watch the game after partying all day. That is a problem as well.

Anyways, I'll hold out hope that next year I am proven all wrong, and we fill the stadium next year with a Heisman front runner, coming off a good bowl performance, and probably picked to be 1st or 2nd in the P12 South. Doubtful. I predict we'll still see attendance problems and more lame excuses. The ASU and USC games will sell out, maybe the BYU due to the LDS population and maybe Oregon if they improve next year, but the Cal and Colorado games will struggle. Each conference game should sell out. Yes, I know we are seeing attendance issues across the board and it is not unique to AZ, doesn't mean I like it.

Also, the personal jibes are not necessary. It is funny to see how personal folks are taking these criticisms. It is just an opinion.

How do you propose to change the character of the average Arizona fan?

If there's any immutable aspect of the discussion, it's the composition of the fanbase. Short of synthesizing a serum to create rabid UA football fans and dumping it into Pima County's water supply, fan behavior, interest and allegiance is a static factor.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:13 pm

UALoco wrote:The mounting excuses are funny to read. Marketing, lag time, etc., etc. It boils down to the fact that the average Arizona football fan is so casual in their "fandom" that they are not able realize their team is special and get to a game unless they are given a year's heads up. You are all making my point for me. Not enough hard core fans. Just a quick glance on your phone and you can see some of the amazing plays KT and the rest of the team are making on your twitter feed, facebook, or favorite sports app. Also, I spoke to so many folks at the tailgate that were just heading home to watch the game after partying all day. That is a problem as well.

Anyways, I'll hold out hope that next year I am proven all wrong, and we fill the stadium next year with a Heisman front runner, coming off a good bowl performance, and probably picked to be 1st or 2nd in the P12 South. Doubtful. I predict we'll still see attendance problems and more lame excuses. The ASU and USC games will sell out, maybe the BYU due to the LDS population and maybe Oregon if they improve next year, but the Cal and Colorado games will struggle. Each conference game should sell out. Yes, I know we are seeing attendance issues across the board and it is not unique to AZ, doesn't mean I like it.

Also, the personal jibes are not necessary. It is funny to see how personal folks are taking these criticisms. It is just an opinion.

Says the guy that throws out personal jibes. And no, no one has made your point for you. They've all obliterated any point you thought you had.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:18 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
UALoco wrote:The mounting excuses are funny to read. Marketing, lag time, etc., etc. It boils down to the fact that the average Arizona football fan is so casual in their "fandom" that they are not able realize their team is special and get to a game unless they are given a year's heads up. You are all making my point for me. Not enough hard core fans. Just a quick glance on your phone and you can see some of the amazing plays KT and the rest of the team are making on your twitter feed, facebook, or favorite sports app. Also, I spoke to so many folks at the tailgate that were just heading home to watch the game after partying all day. That is a problem as well.

Anyways, I'll hold out hope that next year I am proven all wrong, and we fill the stadium next year with a Heisman front runner, coming off a good bowl performance, and probably picked to be 1st or 2nd in the P12 South. Doubtful. I predict we'll still see attendance problems and more lame excuses. The ASU and USC games will sell out, maybe the BYU due to the LDS population and maybe Oregon if they improve next year, but the Cal and Colorado games will struggle. Each conference game should sell out. Yes, I know we are seeing attendance issues across the board and it is not unique to AZ, doesn't mean I like it.

Also, the personal jibes are not necessary. It is funny to see how personal folks are taking these criticisms. It is just an opinion.
How do you propose to change the character of the average Arizona fan?

If there's any immutable aspect of the discussion, it's the composition of the fanbase. Short of synthesizing a serum to create rabid UA football fans and dumping it into Pima County's water supply, fan behavior, interest and allegiance is a static factor.

See that is where I have an issue a bit. There are enough people to be excited about U of A to sell out a practice, a blown out experience practice but still a practice, but cannot get 41k to the final game of the year when we are having a great year. Does winning mean that much? If it is we have to say that U of A in both sports has lots of fair weather fans. I think there is an aspect of McKale being the place to be and place to be seen that rolls with it too.

Alieberman joked about it earlier but if U of A played Duke in Tucson in basketball you could sell 40k tickets. So how do we besides "winning" turn those people who support basketball and follow it so closely into football financial supports as well?

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:22 pm

PHXCATS wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
UALoco wrote:The mounting excuses are funny to read. Marketing, lag time, etc., etc. It boils down to the fact that the average Arizona football fan is so casual in their "fandom" that they are not able realize their team is special and get to a game unless they are given a year's heads up. You are all making my point for me. Not enough hard core fans. Just a quick glance on your phone and you can see some of the amazing plays KT and the rest of the team are making on your twitter feed, facebook, or favorite sports app. Also, I spoke to so many folks at the tailgate that were just heading home to watch the game after partying all day. That is a problem as well.

Anyways, I'll hold out hope that next year I am proven all wrong, and we fill the stadium next year with a Heisman front runner, coming off a good bowl performance, and probably picked to be 1st or 2nd in the P12 South. Doubtful. I predict we'll still see attendance problems and more lame excuses. The ASU and USC games will sell out, maybe the BYU due to the LDS population and maybe Oregon if they improve next year, but the Cal and Colorado games will struggle. Each conference game should sell out. Yes, I know we are seeing attendance issues across the board and it is not unique to AZ, doesn't mean I like it.

Also, the personal jibes are not necessary. It is funny to see how personal folks are taking these criticisms. It is just an opinion.
How do you propose to change the character of the average Arizona fan?

If there's any immutable aspect of the discussion, it's the composition of the fanbase. Short of synthesizing a serum to create rabid UA football fans and dumping it into Pima County's water supply, fan behavior, interest and allegiance is a static factor.
See that is where I have an issue a bit. There are enough people to be excited about U of A to sell out a practice, a blown out experience practice but still a practice, but cannot get 41k to the final game of the year when we are having a great year. Does winning mean that much? If it is we have to say that U of A in both sports has lots of fair weather fans. I think there is an aspect of McKale being the place to be and place to be seen that rolls with it too.

Alieberman joked about it earlier but if U of A played Duke in Tucson in basketball you could sell 40k tickets. So how do we besides "winning" turn those people who support basketball and follow it so closely into football financial supports as well?

The stakes Arizona basketball plays for involve potential Final Fours and National Championships. That drives interest in a way that does not exist in football.

Also, basketball needs 40,000 fewer people to achieve a sellout. Add the two together and there's your answer, IMO.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:31 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:
PHXCATS wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:
UALoco wrote:The mounting excuses are funny to read. Marketing, lag time, etc., etc. It boils down to the fact that the average Arizona football fan is so casual in their "fandom" that they are not able realize their team is special and get to a game unless they are given a year's heads up. You are all making my point for me. Not enough hard core fans. Just a quick glance on your phone and you can see some of the amazing plays KT and the rest of the team are making on your twitter feed, facebook, or favorite sports app. Also, I spoke to so many folks at the tailgate that were just heading home to watch the game after partying all day. That is a problem as well.

Anyways, I'll hold out hope that next year I am proven all wrong, and we fill the stadium next year with a Heisman front runner, coming off a good bowl performance, and probably picked to be 1st or 2nd in the P12 South. Doubtful. I predict we'll still see attendance problems and more lame excuses. The ASU and USC games will sell out, maybe the BYU due to the LDS population and maybe Oregon if they improve next year, but the Cal and Colorado games will struggle. Each conference game should sell out. Yes, I know we are seeing attendance issues across the board and it is not unique to AZ, doesn't mean I like it.

Also, the personal jibes are not necessary. It is funny to see how personal folks are taking these criticisms. It is just an opinion.
How do you propose to change the character of the average Arizona fan?

If there's any immutable aspect of the discussion, it's the composition of the fanbase. Short of synthesizing a serum to create rabid UA football fans and dumping it into Pima County's water supply, fan behavior, interest and allegiance is a static factor.
See that is where I have an issue a bit. There are enough people to be excited about U of A to sell out a practice, a blown out experience practice but still a practice, but cannot get 41k to the final game of the year when we are having a great year. Does winning mean that much? If it is we have to say that U of A in both sports has lots of fair weather fans. I think there is an aspect of McKale being the place to be and place to be seen that rolls with it too.

Alieberman joked about it earlier but if U of A played Duke in Tucson in basketball you could sell 40k tickets. So how do we besides "winning" turn those people who support basketball and follow it so closely into football financial supports as well?
The stakes Arizona basketball plays for involve potential Final Fours and National Championships. That drives interest in a way that does not exist in football.

Also, basketball needs 40,000 fewer people to achieve a sellout. Add the two together and there's your answer, IMO.

That is all about winning, which would help for sure but there has to be things that can be done that do not involved wins.

RazorsEdgeAZ · Post by **RazorsEdgeAZ** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:07 pm

This is a long-term, maybe forever battle now for college football. For the Pac12, until at least 2025 when a new TV contract kicks in. It stands out the attendance drop-off since 2012 and new ESPN/Fox deal and launch of P12 network. So there's the main battle. With the long-term attendance issue, UA will combat loss in revenue from attendance with other revenue streams. Which revenue is the main issue. At least it is with UA admin.

Thus beer/wine sales and athletic fee. But it's not just the sales of beer/wine profits. It's the ability to sell a sponsorship deal with beer company. It's not stadium naming rights money but it's money for the right to sell and market (signage) a beer company's product. Texas just signed a annual $5 million sponsorship deals with two beer companies Corona and MillerCoors.

There are studies that show beer/wine itself does not increase sustained attendance. Shows it may keep those that already attend stay at game longer. Thus sponsorship beer deals http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Jour ... /Beer.aspx

So what is the expectation for "good" UA attendance? Days of average 55K probably long gone. 50k with an excellent schedule and great team? Look at 2014 season. Great example. UA South champions, had 3 home games in November with two kickoffs at 1:30 and one at 6pm. All three against ranked teams [EDIT: need to correct. Only ASU was ranked. Buffs and Washington were not]. The ASU game was a sellout. Even with that, UA average attendance that November 51K.

Take out the ASU game and the other two home games averaged 49K against those teams with UA trying to secure the South title. 49K average that kicked off at 6pm and 1:30pm and UA in South title contention

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:28 pm

Michigan State is the school Arizona should try to be like when it comes to success of both football and basketball. They are averaging 72865 a game or 97% of capacity. Is 94% of capacity of Arizona Stadium at 52,300 per game really too much to work for without taking winning into account?

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:35 pm

I can imagine the pipeline for talent to Michigan st is much much different than for Arizona.

btfd16 · Post by **btfd16** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:46 pm

I wish we had an AD that had the same animosity for Larry Scott as Jerry Jones shows for Goodell... We need someone to fight the good fight.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 3:55 pm

I grew up in MI. College football is a completely different way of life out there.

Both tOSU and UM average about 100K per game.

You just don't see that out west.

Just so much more to get involved with out here. Nicer weather for one.

Why is high school football so popular in Texas? I really don't know.

UALoco · Post by **UALoco** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:03 pm

ASUHATER! wrote: Says the guy that throws out personal jibes.

Examples?

prh · Post by **prh** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:22 pm

Remember a decade ago when a day of college football meant scouring regional Fox Sports channels, in addition to whatever ESPN/CBS had? It used to be so much harder to watch college football and attendance was much higher. My student career was 2007-2013 and attendance was great, especially during my undergrad years. The Zoo was full, the stadium was mostly full, and it was a pain to watch much college football except for the big games.

Fast forward to today, I can flip between about 4 games at once and be able to keep up. I can pull up ESPN's scores page, find the close games, and have them on my TV within about 30 seconds. I can literally watch every play of two games ending if the play clocks line up just right.

The difference ease/enjoyable-ness of watching at home compared to the pain in the ass of going to a game has dramatically increased. During my grad years, I had to drive to games. I parked in 6th Street since I had a permit there. It took forever to get out of there and back home, even though I just took 6th/St Mary's the whole way. Even if you park in the neighborhoods, it's still difficult. Now, I've been to a few Utah games, and the travel to/from is a much better experience.

I don't have solutions. The shuttle is an obvious issue. Stadium location in relation to the transportation network doesn't help at all. Having an on-campus stadium is great for students, but it clearly makes it more difficult to draw everyone else. Just look at Sancet vs HiC. There's obviously other factors at play there but serving beer doesn't account for the massive attendance improvement (which was there immediately in 2012, so it's not just due to the Natty)

Captain Obvious · Post by **Captain Obvious** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:23 pm

Arizona should downsize their stadium like a lot of other teams are doing. Houston bulldozed their stadium and constructed a 40,000 seat stadium for 140 million as I recall. I think a similar approach could work for Arizona. Just getting the current stadium up to code would cost a fortune. Sinking more money into it seems like a waste of time and money to me.

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