'17/18 Polls

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:59 am

I legit don't give a fuck about a poll in November. I don't even care about losing those three games.

We've been saying it all off season: gimme a shitty season and a stellar tournament, rather than the other way around.

Maybe this is the road to that. You grow through adversity. Failure indicates areas of opportunity. These guys are competitors and the staff are professionals. They'll figure it out.

There's no hiding what needs to be done. There's no "well we still got the W despite such and such deficiencies." We can't say "yeah I don't defend the rim or dribble penetration but I do these other things and that's enough."

So guys know what they're failing at. Plenty of game film to show what we're failing at as a team. Fine. Good.

Rawle comes back soon. We get some practice time instead of three games in three days. And we've got a chance to bounce back with a tune up game on Wednesday and the road game at UNLV next week (which will be a great test of Ayton vs McCoy... we'll see if Ayton is buying in and he'll get more game film showing otherwise if not). Then two quality opponents in A&M and Alabama.

We can lose lose lose so long as we figure shit out come March. Fine by me.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:01 am

I know this is bad, but am I the only one who sees a strange silver lining? This team is now faced with having to earn every bit of national respect from here on out. Nothing is given freely, as it was heading into the season. If being unranked and laughed at by the whole country doesn't motivate this team, I'm not sure anything can. Hopefully this pisses them off and gets them to practice harder, commit to playing smart defense on every possession, and rededicate themselves to the process. This team has an opportunity to be special. It starts at practice today.

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:05 am

scumdevils86 wrote:There it is. Unranked. First time in 31 years a team went from top 2 to unranked in a week.

ASU is #20.

ASU being ranked ahead of UA won't stay very long.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:07 am

YoDeFoe wrote:I legit don't give a fuck about a poll in November. I don't even care about losing those three games.

We've been saying it all off season: gimme a shitty season and a stellar tournament, rather than the other way around.

Maybe this is the road to that. You grow through adversity. Failure indicates areas of opportunity. These guys are competitors and the staff are professionals. They'll figure it out.

There's no hiding what needs to be done. There's no "well we still got the W despite such and such deficiencies." We can't say "yeah I don't defend the rim or dribble penetration but I do these other things and that's enough."

So guys know what they're failing at. Plenty of game film to show what we're failing at as a team. Fine. Good.

Rawle comes back soon. We get some practice time instead of three games in three days. And we've got a chance to bounce back with a tune up game on Wednesday and the road game at UNLV next week (which will be a great test of Ayton vs McCoy... we'll see if Ayton is buying in and he'll get more game film showing otherwise if not). Then two quality opponents in A&M and Alabama.

We can lose lose lose so long as we figure shit out come March. Fine by me.

Gotta make the tournament.........

Would not if it was held today but I think it will get turned around in time to do so.

UCONN last 20 Years > Arizona last 20 years. Think you are saying similar things.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:42 am

Screw polls. We need to get better.

If last week is evidence of anything, it's that a poll number doesn't hide floor performance. Either we pull it together on the floor or we don't. Polls are meaningless in comparison.

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:44 am

YoDeFoe wrote:I legit don't give a fuck about a poll in November. I don't even care about losing those three games.

We've been saying it all off season: gimme a shitty season and a stellar tournament, rather than the other way around.

Maybe this is the road to that. You grow through adversity. Failure indicates areas of opportunity. These guys are competitors and the staff are professionals. They'll figure it out.

There's no hiding what needs to be done. There's no "well we still got the W despite such and such deficiencies." We can't say "yeah I don't defend the rim or dribble penetration but I do these other things and that's enough."

So guys know what they're failing at. Plenty of game film to show what we're failing at as a team. Fine. Good.

Rawle comes back soon. We get some practice time instead of three games in three days. And we've got a chance to bounce back with a tune up game on Wednesday and the road game at UNLV next week (which will be a great test of Ayton vs McCoy... we'll see if Ayton is buying in and he'll get more game film showing otherwise if not). Then two quality opponents in A&M and Alabama.

We can lose lose lose so long as we figure shit out come March. Fine by me.

The biggest problems are the two starting seniors, I don't see how their handicaps will be fixed by March, at this point it's who they are.

Possibly the only solution is not playing them, but we all know Sean.

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:52 am

PHXCATS wrote:
Gotta make the tournament.........

Would not if it was held today but I think it will get turned around in time to do so.

UCONN last 20 Years > Arizona last 20 years. Think you are saying similar things.

Agreed - those thoughts were running through my mind while writing that.

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:59 am

RondaeShimmy wrote:
YoDeFoe wrote:I legit don't give a fuck about a poll in November. I don't even care about losing those three games.

We've been saying it all off season: gimme a shitty season and a stellar tournament, rather than the other way around.

Maybe this is the road to that. You grow through adversity. Failure indicates areas of opportunity. These guys are competitors and the staff are professionals. They'll figure it out.

There's no hiding what needs to be done. There's no "well we still got the W despite such and such deficiencies." We can't say "yeah I don't defend the rim or dribble penetration but I do these other things and that's enough."

So guys know what they're failing at. Plenty of game film to show what we're failing at as a team. Fine. Good.

Rawle comes back soon. We get some practice time instead of three games in three days. And we've got a chance to bounce back with a tune up game on Wednesday and the road game at UNLV next week (which will be a great test of Ayton vs McCoy... we'll see if Ayton is buying in and he'll get more game film showing otherwise if not). Then two quality opponents in A&M and Alabama.

We can lose lose lose so long as we figure shit out come March. Fine by me.
The biggest problems are the two starting seniors, I don't see how their handicaps will be fixed by March, at this point it's who they are.

Possibly the only solution is not playing them, but we all know Sean.

Agree. They need to have limited roles. They can still be important components depending on matchups. But our defense suffers with them. We need to run more motion offene. Sets are ok for Ayton but not Trier.

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:04 pm

RondaeShimmy wrote: The biggest problems are the two starting seniors, I don't see how their handicaps will be fixed by March, at this point it's who they are.

Possibly the only solution is not playing them, but we all know Sean.

I know Miller will let seniors play until they prove they cannot. Ristic is proving he cannot, which is why he averaged 15min/g in the Bahamas, with a high of 17 and a low of 11. That's who he is on this team because he and Ayton are the same dude on defense: can't offensive rebound, can't protect the paint and the perimeter on the same possession.

For reference: the last time Risitc got that few minutes he was backing up Zeus. That's the direction Miller went and I've got confidence he'll continue to go there if it bears fruit.

I doubt Parker loses his spot, however. Most games we're fine playing him heavy minutes. But against the best teams... Parker can't score. If you check his stats its year in and year out... he just can't get to the free throw line or make a field goal. He still passes very well, no matter the competition. But you can see his FG% drops from the 50s to the 40s and his free throw rate drops from the 40s to the 20s. This year same as last year and the years before that.

I think Miller knows what to do about Ristic. I don't know if we have an answer to what to do about PJC in the big games. Maybe a line-up of PJC, Trier, Alkins, pick another wing, Ayton is enough to get it done. Maybe that's enough firepower that it's fine that PJC can't score against good competition.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:38 pm

There was a point last season when many thought Comanche should have been starting and/or getting more minutes than Ristic.

CatHoops · Post by **CatHoops** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:52 pm

Ristic should get garbage minutes. Lacks any court awareness. Hopefully Miller rolls out a new starting 5 this week.

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:54 pm

So if Miller does a new starting line up and mixes things up and the team does much better, will we punish Miller for not starting the right guys at first like many of you have done with RR with the Tate/Dawkins thing

TucsonClip · Post by **TucsonClip** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:04 pm

PHXCATS wrote:So if Miller does a new starting line up and mixes things up and the team does much better, will we punish Miller for not starting the right guys at first like many of you have done with RR with the Tate/Dawkins thing

Havent you been paying attention for the last few years? Remember York over RHJ?

TucsonClip · Post by **TucsonClip** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:05 pm

rgdeuce wrote:There was a point last season when many thought Comanche should have been starting and/or getting more minutes than Ristic.

Not from me. I was not a Comanche fan at all.

MountainCat · Post by **MountainCat** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:51 pm

PHXCATS wrote:
YoDeFoe wrote:I legit don't give a fuck about a poll in November. I don't even care about losing those three games.

We've been saying it all off season: gimme a shitty season and a stellar tournament, rather than the other way around.

Maybe this is the road to that. You grow through adversity. Failure indicates areas of opportunity. These guys are competitors and the staff are professionals. They'll figure it out.

There's no hiding what needs to be done. There's no "well we still got the W despite such and such deficiencies." We can't say "yeah I don't defend the rim or dribble penetration but I do these other things and that's enough."

So guys know what they're failing at. Plenty of game film to show what we're failing at as a team. Fine. Good.

Rawle comes back soon. We get some practice time instead of three games in three days. And we've got a chance to bounce back with a tune up game on Wednesday and the road game at UNLV next week (which will be a great test of Ayton vs McCoy... we'll see if Ayton is buying in and he'll get more game film showing otherwise if not). Then two quality opponents in A&M and Alabama.

We can lose lose lose so long as we figure shit out come March. Fine by me.
Gotta make the tournament.........

Would not if it was held today but I think it will get turned around in time to do so.

UCONN last 20 Years > Arizona last 20 years. Think you are saying similar things.

Yes we would. Maybe a 12 seed, but we still would.

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 3:39 pm

TucsonClip wrote:
PHXCATS wrote:So if Miller does a new starting line up and mixes things up and the team does much better, will we punish Miller for not starting the right guys at first like many of you have done with RR with the Tate/Dawkins thing
Havent you been paying attention for the last few years? Remember York over RHJ?

You mean when RHJ was a soph and York a JR in 2015? Or the previous season? Because we went 67-9 over that stretch.

I wasn't a fan either until I realized that we couldn't run a line-up that features only one outside shooter with TJ / Stan / RHJ / Brash / Zeus.

Miller will bench a player, even a four year guy like PJC, for a better player. Just need a better player.

Also: we're not getting guys from Compton Magic anymore - they're Adidas/UCLA now. So pissing off PJC and York's AAU team is no longer a concern.

rgdeuce · Post by **rgdeuce** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 4:27 pm

TucsonClip wrote:
rgdeuce wrote:There was a point last season when many thought Comanche should have been starting and/or getting more minutes than Ristic.
Not from me. I was not a Comanche fan at all.

Would you partially agree that the offense last year was more fluid with Chance on the floor (rather than Dusan) and without Ristic growing roots in the paint, it opened things up for other players, ball movement was better, players were less stagnant? Or that we looked better defensively, especially against pick and roll/pop etc because Chance (I didnt think highly of him as a defender) was more athletic/mobile? Not being a smartass, you know a hell of a lot more about the game than I do and I'm curious about your take. I didn't think the world of Chance or anything, I just thought in most lineups against more teams than not, the other four guys on the floor were better players and were able to do more when they were playing with Comanche instead of Ristic.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 6:33 pm

Fucking embarrassing.

Postmaster · Post by **Postmaster** » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:13 pm

Pjc is the best point guard on this team. If you base opinions on red/blue and preseason games then Sidiki and kyrel would have been all-Americans.

The best thing about Chance was the he would go just below free throw line to recieve a pass. That is a soft spot in a zone defense. As far as I could see, no one else understood that in the last several years.

I also feel that having our centers hedge out beyond 3 point line on defense and having them set screens at top of key every time on offense does them no favors. Both situations pull them too far from basket.

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:39 am

Postmaster wrote:I also feel that having our centers hedge out beyond 3 point line on defense and having them set screens at top of key every time on offense does them no favors. Both situations pull them too far from basket.

They made that adjustment to hedge hard because PJC and Trier can't/don't fight through ball screens.

Chicat · Post by **Chicat** » Mon Dec 04, 2017 7:13 pm

- Coach of UC Davis

Jefe · Post by **Jefe** » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:21 am

We got less votes with 2 solid wins. Can't have a team with 3 losses in the top 25

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:23 am

Jefe wrote:We got less votes with 2 solid wins. Can't have a team with 3 losses in the top 25

Win tonight and it will be fine

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:04 pm

23. Arizona (5–3)

Last Week (NR): beat Long Beach State, beat UNLV, beat No. 7 Texas A&M
This Week: vs. Alabama

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2 ... -tennessee" target="_blank

By Molly Geary December 06, 2017

Don't know Molly Geary...so

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:55 pm

HiCat wrote:23. Arizona (5–3)

Last Week (NR): beat Long Beach State, beat UNLV, beat No. 7 Texas A&M
This Week: vs. Alabama

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2 ... -tennessee" target="_blank

By Molly Geary December 06, 2017

Don't know Molly Geary...so

Beat Bama and it starts working itself out.

Bear Down Vegas · Post by **Bear Down Vegas** » Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:35 pm

HiCat wrote:23. Arizona (5–3)

Last Week (NR): beat Long Beach State, beat UNLV, beat No. 7 Texas A&M
This Week: vs. Alabama

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2 ... -tennessee" target="_blank

By Molly Geary December 06, 2017

Don't know Molly Geary...so

Funny thing about this particular 'Cats team....I think there are more than 22 teams that would beat us on a neutral court tomorrow. I also think there are A LOT less than 22 teams that can beat us on a neutral court come March. Bear Down.

jsbowl16 · Post by **jsbowl16** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 7:36 am

Arizona State is number 1 in the ESPN power rankings. They can enjoy it for 19 more days.

HiCat · Post by **HiCat** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 7:57 am

espn
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basket ... -move-no-1" target="_blank

yahoo
https://sports.yahoo.com/college-basket ... 16654.html" target="_blank

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:33 am

HiCat wrote:espn
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basket ... -move-no-1" target="_blank

yahoo
https://sports.yahoo.com/college-basket ... 16654.html" target="_blank

Holy shit, Arizona back up to #6 Mr. Yahoo Writer? Please and thank you.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:39 am

YoDeFoe wrote:
HiCat wrote:espn
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basket ... -move-no-1" target="_blank

yahoo
https://sports.yahoo.com/college-basket ... 16654.html" target="_blank
Holy shit, Arizona back up to #6 Mr. Yahoo Writer? Please and thank you.

Who knows? The hallmark of this season so far is zero consistency with teams.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:44 am

I’m fine with ASU being ranked ahead of us for the time being. They’ve earned it. Their party ends on 12/30.

RondaeShimmy · Post by **RondaeShimmy** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:46 am

Asu #5

Arizona #23

https://collegebasketball.ap.org/poll" target="_blank

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:53 am

Nice to be ranked again. I expect a steady climb in these polls in the coming weeks.

Bear Down Vegas · Post by **Bear Down Vegas** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:58 am

I don't care too much about the polls yet & I guess it's because of some of these clowns who vote. How 'bout this guy?

http://collegepolltracker.com/basketbal ... 017/week-6" target="_blank

MountainCat · Post by **MountainCat** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:16 am

How is Kansas ranked and #13? They lost two at home this week (I know only one was at home). Also how does Florida edge us out at #22? Oh well, we are slowly making it back,

azcat49 · Post by **azcat49** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:40 am

Losing two with one at home and the other at a second home site is far worse than dropping 3 in the Bahamas in November IMO. I assume from above we are #23, not sure we deserve to be ranked yet but we are making progress. Get to 10-3 and then I would think we should be ranked

Merkin · Post by **Merkin** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:45 am

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:50 am

Merkin wrote:

I mean, really...who the F cares? I guess when you’re ASU and have spent many years as a Pac doormat, being ranked highly is better than sex. For us, it’s pretty mundane.

YoDeFoe · Post by **YoDeFoe** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:52 am

Kansas ought to be in the high teens or early twenties until they get more players on their team.

Kentucky hasn't done a damn thing and doesn't deserve anything near a top ten vote.

Florida's losses are worse than ours but it's one spot on the board so fuck it.

Agreed with Beachcat - polls are meaningless in December.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:54 am

I care about our developmental process. If we develop like we can, we can be a 16 seed for all I care. This team hits potentia and it won't matter.

ASUHATER! · Post by **ASUHATER!** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:36 pm

So wrong seeing ASU ranked much less top 5

PHXCATS · Post by **PHXCATS** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:43 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:I care about our developmental process. If we develop like we can, we can be a 16 seed for all I care. This team hits potentia and it won't matter.

Seeding and matchups are so important. I get what you are saying about potential but no UA team played to potential in March since 2011. Got to get good enough for favorable matchups in March where you can win at less than your best, which clearly didn't happen the last two years

Olsondogg · Post by **Olsondogg** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:02 pm

Being ranked top 5 and 10 did alot for us the last two years. Good on ASU, would be nice to have teams prep for both teams for once in conference play.

CatFanOneMil · Post by **CatFanOneMil** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:02 pm

Bear Down Vegas wrote:I don't care too much about the polls yet & I guess it's because of some of these clowns who vote. How 'bout this guy?

http://collegepolltracker.com/basketbal ... 017/week-6" target="_blank

That guy is an absolute joke, how in fuck does he have a job contributing to polls?

zonagrad · Post by **zonagrad** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:14 pm

Laughable that he has KU at #6. And ASU barely in the top 20. He works in Great Falls, MT and has no business voting in a national poll.

77HoyaCat4Ever · Post by **77HoyaCat4Ever** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:22 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:I care about our developmental process. If we develop like we can, we can be a 16 seed for all I care. This team hits potentia and it won't matter.

It's all about the process . . .

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:26 pm

Olsondogg wrote:Being ranked top 5 and 10 did alot for us the last two years. Good on ASU, would be nice to have teams prep for both teams for once in conference play.

Bingo. You can be a 1 seed with bad matchups and a 7 seed with favorable matchups. Seed doesn't mean you get opponents that lend themselves to your style of play. If you want to make a FF, you have to beat some good teams.

We need to get our house in order. This team, playing to full potential, doesn't need to worry about not being a 1.

CalStateTempe · Post by **CalStateTempe** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:32 pm

Preach spiff.

Beachcat97 · Post by **Beachcat97** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:56 pm

Spaceman Spiff wrote:This team, playing to full potential, doesn't need to worry about not being a 1.

This team playing to its full potential is your 2018 national champion.

Spaceman Spiff · Post by **Spaceman Spiff** » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:59 pm

Beachcat97 wrote:
Spaceman Spiff wrote:This team, playing to full potential, doesn't need to worry about not being a 1.
This team playing to its full potential is your 2018 national champion.

I agree. That's why polls are beyond the point for me. If you have a NC level team, it's about what it takes to get firing on that level, not about when the media catches on.

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