The 2022-2023 Season Thread

[Chicat]

This is a great lineup of teams. Very curious as to who will still be on the team as upperclassmen when this rolls around.

[RondaeShimmy]

Mathurin 100% gone. Koloko 50/50. Terry 25/75

Everyone else back.

[Beachcat97]

Always so hard for me to turn the page on a season. Really loved that group!

I wanna be enthusiastic about next year, but my heart can only take so much of this crap...

[WildcatStunner]

Bring on next year!

[Beachcat97]

Mathurin 100% gone. Koloko 50/50. Terry 25/75

Everyone else back.

I'd say Koloko's more 75/25. His stock has been rising. That dude will absolutely play in the NBA.

Terry will be back.

Think we're looking at a starting five of:

Kriisa
Terry
Larsson
Tubelis
Ballo

Bench: Bal, Nowell, Anderson

We'll have to see what happens with our '23 commits reclassifying. I also expect we'll take some transfers.

[Olsondogg]

I think Larsson will take a huge leap.

[Merkin]

Tubelis is completely discouraged. I know Lloyd kept him in longer than he should have to help his confidence v. Houston, but he completely shit the bed 2 games in a row, and can't shoot at all now, and has wet soft hands.

Going to take Phil Jackson and his moments of Zen to get Zu's head on straight in order to get him to come back. Otherwise, he can collect a nice paycheck in Europe immediately and won't have to deal with so much quicker and stronger players that you see here on elite teams.

Just seems a head case like Loren Woods, and like someone else said Ryan Anderson.

Lloyd has promised him that if he comes back, they can teach Zu how to use his right hand. That will help him in every league.

I think Larsson will take a huge leap.

I thought Larsson was much better than expected. Turned into a great defender, which very quick hands and feet. I thought he would just be a 3 point shooter hanging out at the perimeter.

Maybe Houston wouldn't have jumped out to an immediate 10 point lead if Larsson was out there instead of Tubelis.

[RondaeShimmy]

I love the freedom and ball movement of the system but in the tournament when the refs let teams be more physical and let teams get away with far more contact that negates the freedom of movement and play.

The conference has to really stop with so much touch fouls. Saw something similar with Gonzaga today also. Ultimately I think this will be our huge downfall for this conference's teams.

The one thing I'm looking for this upcoming season is as I said in another thread, the tournament really shows you how much talent you actually have. At the end of this run I kept thinking to myself that this team didn't at the end of the really have many. It was Mathurin, dropoff then Koloko, then another dropoff and then Terry. We had no depth, Kerr sucking because of injury or not, who else is better? Tubelis being a black hole, well who else is better?

[ZagCatFan]

Thanks for an exciting year Wildcat Nation….players coaches fans!

Lloyd will reload and adjust.

Lloyd has built his foundation strong and recruits will respond.

Good Luck

BTFD

[RondaeShimmy]

Mathurin 100% gone. Koloko 50/50. Terry 25/75

Everyone else back.

I'd say Koloko's more 75/25. His stock has been rising. That dude will absolutely play in the NBA.

Terry will be back.

Think we're looking at a starting five of:

Kriisa
Terry
Larsson
Tubelis
Ballo

Bench: Bal, Nowell, Anderson

We'll have to see what happens with our '23 commits reclassifying. I also expect we'll take some transfers.

Could be right about Koloko. The one thing I noticed in the tournament is how unathletic our team is outside of Mathurin and Terry (Koloko is a big and is pretty mobile for a big).

Kriisa
Larsson
Terry
Tubelis
Ballo

Is very unathletic and slow. Kerr and Pelle are going to have to be knock down shooters at high volume. But even so, we have no one next year who can attack the basket.

[Chicat]

Hearing Terry might test the waters just to see what his draft stock is.

[84Cat]

Hearing Terry might test the waters just to see what his draft stock is.

Probably a good strategy. Hopefully he will be level headed and come back if he needs to. Right here though is the problem. We want a tough team but our guys jump as soon as they can. Houston has 3 graduate students and Edwards is a senior. That's how you build a team with tough defense. Their guys are completely bought in

[Merkin]

I surmised that too based on this comments last night, and don't blame him, since there is no penalty.

He just seems to have a really good time with his fellow Arizona players. They really seem to like each other a lot.

Don't think he will get that in the D League.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Hearing Terry might test the waters just to see what his draft stock is.

I would if I was Terry. There's no penalty without an agent and he has a profile where I think there's no downside to gauging interest.

Benn should be gone. Koloko should be as well unless he just personally prefers college. He's probably the single player with the biggest draft stock rise in the whole tourney.

I used to think Tubelis should. The way he finished the year, I pull it back because I doubt he gets the looks he wants from NBA teams. Plus, minus Benn, Koloko and maybe Terry, his role should expand a lot next year.

[Beachcat97]

Hearing Terry might test the waters just to see what his draft stock is.

Think that's smart.

[SabinoDrifter]

I went back to Sam Vecenie's mock draft last month and he had Koloko in the first round. I guess the big question is whether he takes another offseason to get stronger in his lower body and improve his post footwork, or does he expect to take that leap at the next level? I keep thinking back to him missing those two free throws against Oregon at McKale two years ago to where he's at today and the transformation has been incredible. I do think Tubelis can take a big, big jump next year if he focuses his offseason 100% on getting stronger to become a finisher at the rim and developing a right hand.

[Spaceman Spiff]

I went back to Sam Vecenie's mock draft last month and he had Koloko in the first round. I guess the big question is whether he takes another offseason to get stronger in his lower body and improve his post footwork, or does he expect to take that leap at the next level? I keep thinking back to him missing those two free throws against Oregon at McKale two years ago to where he's at today and the transformation has been incredible. I do think Tubelis can take a big, big jump next year if he focuses his offseason 100% on getting stronger to become a finisher at the rim and developing a right hand.

NBAdraft.net moved Koloko from 2023 to #25 in the 2022 draft after the TCU game.

I think it's realistic to see him as a solid first rounder. I'd go if I were him. He can continue to develop in the pros, and his stock is rising very fast right now. Take the first round guaranteed money and don't risk injury or your stock cooling if you return but don't improve like the scouts expect.

It is insane. I was at that Oregon game and he was so raw at that point. I was surprised he was getting minutes and was hoping he'd be a contributor as a junior.

Instead he's conference DPOY with blossoming NBA stock. Just amazing. All credit to him for the work, Miller for seeing his promise and Lloyd for overseeing his development.

[AzCatFan2]

Benn is gone. Lottery pick. Koloko and Terry will test the waters. My guess is 50/50 on both. Koloko is a likely 1st round pick, but another year, he could play himself into the lottery. Terry has NBA potential, but could use another 15 pounds of muscle, and work on his shot/mid range game. I think Zu comes back. He and Kerr had awful tournaments, and I think both will want another shot at playing in the Big Dance.

I see Bal breaking out next year. Reminds me a lot of Michael Dickerson, who didn't play much his freshman year until called into action late against ASU. Was unstoppable. Became a monster his sophomore year. Bal has that potential, especially with Benn leaving. Not sure if Nowell sticks it out another year. I hope so. Might depend on what Terry does.

[Postmaster]

Terry reminds me of Hill.
Everything is there, it just hasn’t synced up yet.
One more year in college should help him stick in pros.
He has gotten better but I see a lot more potential.

I have to wonder if AT is having an off court issue. He missed a ton of shots the last two games, shots he usually makes.
Injury, fatigue, mental fatigue? Maybe the war is weighing on his mind? Maybe the visit from mom made him homesick? Maybe a girl?
Who knows? But clearly something is off.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Benn is gone. Lottery pick. Koloko and Terry will test the waters. My guess is 50/50 on both. Koloko is a likely 1st round pick, but another year, he could play himself into the lottery. Terry has NBA potential, but could use another 15 pounds of muscle, and work on his shot/mid range game. I think Zu comes back. He and Kerr had awful tournaments, and I think both will want another shot at playing in the Big Dance.

I never really agree with the idea Koloko stands to gain a lot by returning. The NBA basically DGAF about back to the basket centers and will work on physical stuff. He's shown he's a high level rim protector and rim runner, and that will get him 15-25. His stock reminds me a lot of guys like Jarrett Allen and Clint Capela, who went 22nd and 25th.

The only similar guy(s) who made the lottery in the last 5 years are Jaxson Hayes and Mo Bamba. Both more or less produced similar to Koloko as freshman and made the lottery because of their long term potential being 19 and 20 in their rookie seasons. Koloko, if he left today, would ve 22 in his rookie year. I just see him as a guy who will almost forever be trapped in the 15-25 range because of his skill set.

Terry's more interesting. I fully agree on his J, but I could see a team taking a flyer on him based on physical profile and him sneaking in late first.

I'd tell him to test the waters, but with an expanded role available without Benn, he has good reasons to return too.

[RondaeShimmy]

Someone with more insight can correct me but I think the idea of Koloko returning would be he'd get more outside shots (2-3 3s a game) to try to improve his draft stock.

Because he is who he is and his stock will likely be the same next year no matter what because he's not one dimensional like say Kofi.

[Beachcat97]

One thing's clear: Koloko's decision will have a huge impact on our prospects next season. I love Ballo and think he'll get much better, but putting him alongside a senior Koloko? That's probably good enough to win the Pac again.

[Merkin]

If Koloko works on getting an outside shot, he could become a lottery pick like Channing Frye, who played 13(?) years in the league. Channing was drafted as a senior. Let Koloko get some minutes as a stretch 4 when Ballo is on the court.

[AzCatFan2]

Benn is gone. Lottery pick. Koloko and Terry will test the waters. My guess is 50/50 on both. Koloko is a likely 1st round pick, but another year, he could play himself into the lottery. Terry has NBA potential, but could use another 15 pounds of muscle, and work on his shot/mid range game. I think Zu comes back. He and Kerr had awful tournaments, and I think both will want another shot at playing in the Big Dance.

I never really agree with the idea Koloko stands to gain a lot by returning. The NBA basically DGAF about back to the basket centers and will work on physical stuff. He's shown he's a high level rim protector and rim runner, and that will get him 15-25. His stock reminds me a lot of guys like Jarrett Allen and Clint Capela, who went 22nd and 25th.

The only similar guy(s) who made the lottery in the last 5 years are Jaxson Hayes and Mo Bamba. Both more or less produced similar to Koloko as freshman and made the lottery because of their long term potential being 19 and 20 in their rookie seasons. Koloko, if he left today, would ve 22 in his rookie year. I just see him as a guy who will almost forever be trapped in the 15-25 range because of his skill set.

Terry's more interesting. I fully agree on his J, but I could see a team taking a flyer on him based on physical profile and him sneaking in late first.

I'd tell him to test the waters, but with an expanded role available without Benn, he has good reasons to return too.

Maybe Koloko can't improve his draft stock. But he want from 5.3 ppg and 4.8 rpg to 12.6 ppg and 7.3 rpg in one year. If he can put on another few pounds of muscle, and average closer to 15 and 8, Koloko could come out of college as the polished player that everyone hoped Bamba would become. It's a risk, for Koloko, because there is no guarantee he'll improve enough to make a difference. And if he doesn't, then he loses a year of NBA salary for what? A degree, which is nice, as I believe Koloko is on schedule to graduate next year. But you can always go back to school whenever you want.

I agree a team like Golden State might take a late, first round flyer on Terry. He already fits the mold for the type of player Kerr likes. Glue guy who is happy to take an open shot, but pass one up if a better one is available. All while playing solid defense. Still, Terry only averaged 8 ppg this year, and with Benn gone, Terry is likely to benefit from having more of the ball.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Someone with more insight can correct me but I think the idea of Koloko returning would be he'd get more outside shots (2-3 3s a game) to try to improve his draft stock.

Because he is who he is and his stock will likely be the same next year no matter what because he's not one dimensional like say Kofi.

Kofi's a 1995 lottery pick. I mean it as a compliment and insult at the same time.

I get the point about Koloko's faceup J and potential development...but that's also something you tell the NBA he will develop there. Sometimes it's better they see potential than reality. It's just difficult to project whether he will or won't be able to be a legit 3 point option by next year because he's literally never made a single three in his college career.

[Alieberman]

Maybe Koloko will just want to come back?

[Beachcat97]

If Koloko works on getting an outside shot, he could become a lottery pick like Channing Frye, who played 13(?) years in the league. Channing was drafted as a senior. Let Koloko get some minutes as a stretch 4 when Ballo is on the court.

Can you imagine the accolades that would roll in for CK if he comes back? Pre-season All-American, pre-season Naismith Award candidate, pre-season Pac 12 POY frontrunner...would be beautiful.

I respect whatever decision he makes -- of course -- but he could really have a great year in Tucson in 2022-23 if he comes back.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Maybe Koloko will just want to come back?

That's the wild card in all of it. He may just want to do one or the other.

The part I find interesting about the Frye comparison is it shows how much a player can develop in the NBA. Channing shot a total of 6-23 from 3 in his 4 years at Arizona, with 3-17 as a senior.

Basically, he left college not a 3 point threat, then proceeded to develop that portion of his game in the league so well he was eventually a 3 point specialist.

[LuteIsGod]

If Koloko works on getting an outside shot, he could become a lottery pick like Channing Frye, who played 13(?) years in the league. Channing was drafted as a senior. Let Koloko get some minutes as a stretch 4 when Ballo is on the court.

I agree, Merkin! Koloko shooting that free thrown line extended shot like Frye did would be fantastic!

I also believe Ballo and Tubelis should learn to take that same FT line shot confidently in the off season.

Tubelis should mold his game after Radenovic, who I always felt was an overachieving contributor. I don't feel Tubelis has the length or speed to make an NBA roster.

I'd like to see Terry run the point more next year and I hope Kriisa plays more intelligently next year.

I really hope that Lloyd continues the run and gun pace from this year. We can still flourish in that style by teaching our guys to hit pull up mid range shots in transition, which is something I rarely see college teams do in this era.

As for defense.....I don't care about defense.....get to 90 points and see who wins!

This team and its willingness to share the ball really has be excited for next season.

[TheCat]

Hearing Terry might test the waters just to see what his draft stock is.

I would if I was Terry. There's no penalty without an agent and he has a profile where I think there's no downside to gauging interest.

Benn should be gone. Koloko should be as well unless he just personally prefers college. He's probably the single player with the biggest draft stock rise in the whole tourney.

I used to think Tubelis should. The way he finished the year, I pull it back because I doubt he gets the looks he wants from NBA teams. Plus, minus Benn, Koloko and maybe Terry, his role should expand a lot next year.

I believe you can now have an agent when determining your draft status. Makes no sense to not go for an evaluation. We differ on Koloko but your point that having peaked as a draft prospects is different from you peaked as a player is a good one.

[TheCat]

Maybe Koloko will just want to come back?

That's the wild card in all of it. He may just want to do one or the other.

The part I find interesting about the Frye comparison is it shows how much a player can develop in the NBA. Channing shot a total of 6-23 from 3 in his 4 years at Arizona, with 3-17 as a senior.

Basically, he left college not a 3 point threat, then proceeded to develop that portion of his game in the league so well he was eventually a 3 point specialist.

Well it took him quite awhile till he understood that is what he could offer that wasn't common and would keep him as a fringe player on a contender..

[Chicat]

Maybe Koloko will just want to come back?

That's the wild card in all of it. He may just want to do one or the other.

The part I find interesting about the Frye comparison is it shows how much a player can develop in the NBA. Channing shot a total of 6-23 from 3 in his 4 years at Arizona, with 3-17 as a senior.

Basically, he left college not a 3 point threat, then proceeded to develop that portion of his game in the league so well he was eventually a 3 point specialist.

Well it took him quite awhile till he understood that is what he could offer that wasn't common and would keep him as a fringe player on a contender..

When he came into the league it was also extremely uncommon for guys 6’ 10” and up to play on the perimeter. He can thank Dirk and a few others for paving the way for the stretch 4.

[RaisingArizona]

I think Koloko can go 12 to 20ish. I've regularly seen it written that after the elite guys are gone GMs tend to look for elite skills to fill out roles on the roster. Koloko's defensive skills are A+++. Specifically his defensive skills away from the basket are going to be too much for some GM to pass in that range.

[Beachcat97]

I think Koloko can go 12 to 20ish. I've regularly seen it written that after the elite guys are gone GMs tend to look for elite skills to fill out roles on the roster. Koloko's defensive skills are A+++. Specifically his defensive skills away from the basket are going to be too much for some GM to pass in that range.

It’s unusual to see guys projected 12 to 20 return to school. Not saying CK’s 100% gone, but I’d be pretty surprised to see him back.

He’s had a wonderful trajectory at AZ, and I expect he’ll be a solid pro.

[TheCat]

If he is 12-20 I would encourage him to go. I just don't think he is that high.

[Captain Obvious]

Maybe Koloko will just want to come back?

That's possible but I think Koloko should enter the draft. He's put on a lot of muscle and can put on more in the off season. I think he's as ready now as he's going to be. No upside to coming back and risking injury only to end up with nothing to show for it. Get that guaranteed money instead. We'll potentially have a lot of empty roster spots. Obviously BM but also Koloko and probably Terry. I could also see a transfer or two. Just how the college basketball world is now with the portal. We shall see.

[KaibabKat]

Here are the final Player Efficiency Ratings for each Arizona player last season;

28.0 Christian Koloko
24.9 Azuolas Yubelis
24.2 Oumar Ballo
23.5 Kim Aiken Jr.
21.5 Bennedict Mathurin
19.4 Jordan Mains
17.3 Dalen Terry
15.0 ----the "average" D1 player by definition -------
14.8 Pelle Larsson
13.4 Justin Kier
12.3 Kerr Krissa
12.0 Adama Bal
8.5 Shane Nowell
-0.8 Grant Weitman
-10.7 Tautvilas Tubelis

[RaisingArizona]

Really excited to see what kind of jump Bal makes. We could really use another marksmen.

[RondaeShimmy]

From Givony 's (who's probably the best in the business) latest mock has

Mathurin going #10
Koloko #36

[Beachcat97]

From Givony 's (who's probably the best in the business) latest mock has

Mathurin going #10
Koloko #36

If Koloko is more of a marginal first rounder, that means he could come back. I'd be a little surprised to see him leave unless he's got a first round guarantee.

[SabinoDrifter]

Still amazing we've gone to as many S16s as UCLA and one more than Gonzaga since 1997 and even more amazing we haven't been to a F4 in 21 years.

[TheCat]

From Givony 's (who's probably the best in the business) latest mock has

Mathurin going #10
Koloko #36

That is more in line with what I've seen. I have never seen 12 on any mock draft. Hell Kentucky's center is in the 2nd round on some drafts. The question is will it improve if he comes back or stay the same.

[Longhorned]

From Givony 's (who's probably the best in the business) latest mock has

Mathurin going #10
Koloko #36

That is more in line with what I've seen. I have never seen 12 on any mock draft. Hell Kentucky's center is in the 2nd round on some drafts. The question is will it improve if he comes back or stay the same.

Lloyd will basically decide this in Koloko's best interests. But the reason why his stock will improve with another year is because Koloko himself will improve. We enjoy repeating, "The NBA drafts on potential" but that's a really misleading oversimplification. While not improving as a player will lower one's stock, unrealized upside is worth less than demonstrated value, especially for a big who's still pretty new to basketball. He won't improve as a rim protector. But he can totally show next year how well he can guard multiple positions, once he takes the next step and stops committing unnecessary fouls that have nothing to do with getting beat.

[YoDeFoe]

Maybe Koloko will just want to come back?

That's the wild card in all of it. He may just want to do one or the other.

The part I find interesting about the Frye comparison is it shows how much a player can develop in the NBA. Channing shot a total of 6-23 from 3 in his 4 years at Arizona, with 3-17 as a senior.

Basically, he left college not a 3 point threat, then proceeded to develop that portion of his game in the league so well he was eventually a 3 point specialist.

The part I find interesting about Frye is its the last time a 7 footer over the age 21 was selected in the top 20.

If Koloko goes to the draft he'll probably get selected in the late first round. I could see him returning and getting selected in the same spot but I don't see a world where he comes back and upgrades his draft stock into the lottery as a 23 year old big man. Since it hasn't happened in about 20 years.

Koloko's biggest weaknesses are his lack of lower body strength and his limited offensive game - he can develop solid lower body strength in this offseason and he can develop and stretch out his jumper over a number of years of play. None of that requires Arizona. He should go.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Maybe Koloko will just want to come back?

That's the wild card in all of it. He may just want to do one or the other.

The part I find interesting about the Frye comparison is it shows how much a player can develop in the NBA. Channing shot a total of 6-23 from 3 in his 4 years at Arizona, with 3-17 as a senior.

Basically, he left college not a 3 point threat, then proceeded to develop that portion of his game in the league so well he was eventually a 3 point specialist.

The part I find interesting about Frye is its the last time a 7 footer over the age 21 was selected in the top 20.

If Koloko goes to the draft he'll probably get selected in the late first round. I could see him returning and getting selected in the same spot but I don't see a world where he comes back and upgrades his draft stock into the lottery as a 23 year old big man. Since it hasn't happened in about 20 years.

Koloko's biggest weaknesses are his lack of lower body strength and his limited offensive game - he can develop solid lower body strength in this offseason and he can develop and stretch out his jumper over a number of years of play. None of that requires Arizona. He should go.

I could not agree more with the bolded...well, really all your post. I'd 100% tell him to go. He's done what he can in college to maximize his draft stock.

The vast likelihood is it only has one way to go from here. Things like shooting...the NBA will project things like free throws.

[goslingswagg]

one thing I was thinking about for next year - this past year’s team ended up being hurt significantly not having a competent backup 4 behind Tubelis. I know Tommy prefers playing big, but I loved our lineups this year with Larsson at the 4. I wonder if we go all in on adding perimeter talent and work to prepare Larsson for that role next year. A “lineup of death” with Kerr, Boswell/GT guard X, Terry, Larsson, & the Euro would be very intriguing to me. We’d likely have Tubelis, Bal, Ballo, & Boswell/GT guard X on the bench too so still plenty of talent available.

[azcat49]

Do you would suggest moving Tubelis to the bench? I don’t think that would be in the plans at all unless he just has lost all confidence.

If Koloko and Terry return my guess would be they are both featured fully next year and Tubelis is going to be the next option. Our sanctions will play a huge role in what we do I think

[goslingswagg]

Do you would suggest moving Tubelis to the bench? I don’t think that would be in the plans at all unless he just has lost all confidence.

If Koloko and Terry return my guess would be they are both featured fully next year and Tubelis is going to be the next option. Our sanctions will play a huge role in what we do I think

no, just Larsson preparing to play 10-15 mins per game as Tubelis’ backup (while also playing another 10-15 mins at the 3). Larsson probably isn’t quick enough to consistently defend high level 1s/2s so makes sense to get him some minutes at the 4 imo.

[RondaeShimmy]

one thing I was thinking about for next year - this past year’s team ended up being hurt significantly not having a competent backup 4 behind Tubelis. I know Tommy prefers playing big, but I loved our lineups this year with Larsson at the 4. I wonder if we go all in on adding perimeter talent and work to prepare Larsson for that role next year. A “lineup of death” with Kerr, Boswell/GT guard X, Terry, Larsson, & the Euro would be very intriguing to me. We’d likely have Tubelis, Bal, Ballo, & Boswell/GT guard X on the bench too so still plenty of talent available.

Tubelis really hurts us with spacing in the half court because he can't shoot. It really hurt us if we have 3 guards out there of which one is inevitably going to have to play on the wings.

Our grad transfers should only be two positions of need imo. PG/CG if Boswell doesn't reclassify and a 3/4 hybrid or smaller than Tubelis but more athletic 4.

[goslingswagg]

one thing I was thinking about for next year - this past year’s team ended up being hurt significantly not having a competent backup 4 behind Tubelis. I know Tommy prefers playing big, but I loved our lineups this year with Larsson at the 4. I wonder if we go all in on adding perimeter talent and work to prepare Larsson for that role next year. A “lineup of death” with Kerr, Boswell/GT guard X, Terry, Larsson, & the Euro would be very intriguing to me. We’d likely have Tubelis, Bal, Ballo, & Boswell/GT guard X on the bench too so still plenty of talent available.

Tubelis really hurts us with spacing in the half court because he can't shoot. It really hurt us if we have 3 guards out there of which one is inevitably going to have to play on the wings.

Our grad transfers should only be two positions of need imo. PG/CG if Boswell doesn't reclassify and a 3/4 hybrid or smaller than Tubelis but more athletic 4.

yeah I agree with those needs - what I'm saying is I don't mind going after two guards if it means that we just use Larsson to fill that 3/4 hybrid role, because I think he can do it and also is probably a better fit for that role than he is as a combo-guard type player. He just isn't quick enough to defend those types, but can be very good defensively if he's matched up against the 3/4 hybrid forwards out there (e.g., Jacquez, Guerrier, etc.).