Ancestry

[Merkin]

Just one time. Only paid once, got my ancestry info, and for the most part never went back although your DNA account remains active.

[azgreg]

I might have to give that a try then.

[CalStateTempe]

How do they get your DNA?

[scumdevils86]

you spit in a tube and shake it up and mail it back

[azgreg]

How do they get your DNA?

http://dna.ancestry.com/" target="_blank

[CalStateTempe]

So what your saying is no brazzers?

[BigSkyCatinMT]

My sister traced, Ethan Allen of the Green Mountain Boys on dads side. Followed Joseph Smith and Brigham Young eventually to Utah (Ethan didn't, children eventually did). That's why there are Ethan Allen furniture stores there. Brother born in Provo. English and Dutch.

Mom's side - both her parents left Germany at different times, between the World Wars. Met in Kansas, married, moved to the plains of Idaho and bred like bunnies. Great grandad, who I met like twice origionally came from Leningrad Russia, through Berlin and then to the U.S. following his son. It is my hope to make it to Ellis Island to see their names before I'm over.

[azgreg]

I very much want to visit Ellis Island some day.

[pc in NM]

I've found the databases (easily) accessible through ancestry.com to be infinitely more valuable than the DNA database; there is so much available data that one has to become really good at critical analysis to not over-endorse possible matches....

... and the latter is almost totally dependent upon how well developed (and how many generations deep) both your and the other person who shares some DNA probability with you happen to already have documented....

[Merkin]

My ancestors came over in 1882, so they never saw Ellis Island except to pass it by.

https://familysearch.org/" target="_blank is free.

It's run by the Mormons and came out of their plan to baptize all the dead people into the LDS faith.

The census information is there, my ancestor:

Event Type Census
Event Date 1910
Event Place Elmdale, Morrison, Minnesota, United States
Gender Male
Age 66
Marital Status Married
Race White
Race (Original) White
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Relationship to Head of Household (Original) Head
Birth Year (Estimated) 1844
Birthplace Germany
Immigration Year 1882
Father's Birthplace Germany
Mother's Birthplace Germany
Sheet Letter A
Sheet Number 26

Unfortunately (or fortunately) the churches in Eastern Europe stopped the Mo's from scanning their birth and baptism records. The area of Germany my ancestor came from was given to the Poles after the war, and the German speaking occupants given 24 hours to leave.

[Chicat]

Was that Gunther Von Merkin? Of the Schöneberg Von Merkins?

[CalStateTempe]

Has anyone ever worked with a professional genealogist?

I’d like know what year my ancestor nationalized.

Apparently Giovanni CST was the John Smith of Italy emigrating to Arizona in the early 1990s. I’ve so far identified my great grandfather but like 8 Arizonans named John Giovanni CST nationalized between 1897 and 1910.

I found the ship manifest...pretty bad ass, came with his mother, his mother in law, and new bride (great grandmomma) 6 years his younger (23-17) arriving sept 2 1900 on Ellis island.

Living in a primary estrogen household (wife and two toddler daughters with mom in law always over), I feel for the guy, I bet it was a hell of a road trip from Italy with that crew! Lol

[ProfessorFate]

Here is how my new sis found me. We thought maybe it was one of my mom's brothers that hooked up with her, but comparing our DNA history, we only matched on my dad's side, not my mom's.

That 1st cousin blond is a cousin on my mom's said, and not on her list. Don't know the other blond.

Hey Merk, is the one at the top with "Close family - 1st cousins" your half-sister?

[Merkin]

Here is how my new sis found me. We thought maybe it was one of my mom's brothers that hooked up with her, but comparing our DNA history, we only matched on my dad's side, not my mom's.

That 1st cousin blond is a cousin on my mom's said, and not on her list. Don't know the other blond.

Hey Merk, is the one at the top with "Close family - 1st cousins" your half-sister?

Yea, the top one. Her daughter actually lives in Phoenix, although she lives in Ohio where she has lived her whole life. They come down to Tucson to see my dad and the rest of my family around Christmas time.

[scumdevils86]

So as a quarantine hobby and as a way to distract myself from current events I've jumped back into a lot of genealogy research.

Found out my dad had a half brother that died as a baby that he was never told about.

My dad's great Grandma on his dad's side popped out at least 12 kids that lived over a period of 28 years from age 21 in 1888 to age 49 in 1916.

My mom's grandpa on her dad's side supported his family in Lompoc in the 30s with some kind of modern sounding multi level marketing scheme.

Possibly uncovered the identity of my wife's biological grandfather that she never has met.

Goes on and on. Also, I've had updates to my DNA results. I'm even whiter than it said a couple years ago.



Has anyone seen the PBS show Finding Your Roots? I like it because of a lot of the focus is on black family history and how hard it is to find with how awful this country has been for generations. Same thing for families of Jewish descent from eastern Europe.

[KaibabKat]

Was able to get this far back on fathers side:

Ca. 1320 – Meijns Meijnszn van der vliet (father) born at De Lier (?), Nederland, and Dochter (aka N.N.) Coppaertsdr Van Dorp (mother born 1294) were the parents of Coppaert Meynsensv (V.D. Vliet). Meijns van der vliet died ca. 1360.
(Dochter Coppaertsdr Van Dorp is a direct descendant of Dirk van Voorne, born about 1000 in the Netherlands).

[Alieberman]

Has anyone seen the PBS show Finding Your Roots? I like it because of a lot of the focus is on black family history and how hard it is to find with how awful this country has been for generations. Same thing for families of Jewish descent from eastern Europe.

That's a great show and my jaw drops every time they find a bill of sale from slave owner to slave owner to discover someone's family history. It's crazy

[OriginalAZ]

I did 23 and me a few years ago and I'm 98.9% Central and South Asian and 0.5% Western Asian and North African. My initial results a few years ago said 2% European and 0.8% Finnish. I was excited about that but a few years later now it's gone.
I am very disappointed in my ancestors for not being more diverse. I didn't even break the trend. Maybe I should talk to my wife about it. It's never too late.

[Merkin]

I am about as white bread as they come, but am very proud of my parents and siblings, even the Trumpsters (my 3 brothers) since our children don't seem to have any 'obvious' racial biases (outside of their parents supporting a racist). My daughter married a man who is part Puerto Rican, and they have 2 beautiful brown eyed children. I have another niece by one of my sisters married to an African American, with the cutest son you have ever seen. I call them a JC Penney family since they should be models in their catalog. My oldest brother's daughter married a man with a Korean mother, and my youngest brother has a daughter with a long term relationship with a man with Japanese and Latino parents.

My DNA:

[Longhorned]

Those results are why I capitalize "Black" but never capitalize "white" unless I start a sentence with it.

Being white is a mixture of lots of peoples, becoming both an assumed default and the opposite of what it means to have an ethnicity.

Being Black means you're part of a heritage that created one of the most recognizable and amazing cultures in the history of humanity, in spite of whites doing everything in their unearned and undeserved power to stop it.

When a white person like me wants to admire a culture, they have to look to the accomplishments of Mexicans, modern Harlem or New Orleans, medieval Italians, early modern Dutch, the French revolutionaries, and being a portion of the amazing World War II Americans, etc.

Otherwise, we're mixed bags of flesh with no cause for any pride associated with "whiteness." To have white pride is to be a complete fucking idiot, in addition to being evil.

[scumdevils86]

Those results are why I capitalize "Black" but never capitalize "white" unless I start a sentence with it.

Being white is a mixture of lots of peoples, becoming both an assumed default and the opposite of what it means to have an ethnicity.

Being Black means you're part of a heritage that created one of the most recognizable and amazing cultures in the history of humanity, in spite of whites doing everything in their unearned and undeserved power to stop it.

When a white person like me wants to admire a culture, they have to look to the accomplishments of Mexicans, modern Harlem or New Orleans, medieval Italians, early modern Dutch, the French revolutionaries, and being a portion of the amazing World War II Americans, etc.

Otherwise, we're mixed bags of flesh with no cause for any pride associated with "whiteness." To have white pride is to be a complete fucking idiot, in addition to being evil.

I quite enjoyed this.

[pc in NM]

Those results are why I capitalize "Black" but never capitalize "white" unless I start a sentence with it.

Being white is a mixture of lots of peoples, becoming both an assumed default and the opposite of what it means to have an ethnicity.

Being Black means you're part of a heritage that created one of the most recognizable and amazing cultures in the history of humanity, in spite of whites doing everything in their unearned and undeserved power to stop it.

When a white person like me wants to admire a culture, they have to look to the accomplishments of 20th century Harlem or New Orleans, medieval Italians, early modern Dutch, the French revolutionaries, and being a portion of the amazing World War II Americans, etc.

Otherwise, we're mixed bags of flesh with no cause for any pride associated with "whiteness." To have white pride is to be a complete fucking idiot, in addition to being evil.

“white” is a “social construction”...

People of my heritage - the Irish - were not “white” in the 1800’s USA, and were pitted against African-Americans in competition for cheap labor. Similar transitions occurred with Spanish, Italian and other national groups...

All eventually became “white”, and in the case of most Irish Catholics, with a vengeance....

[Merkin]

People of my heritage - the Irish - were not “white” in the 1800’s USA, and were pitted against African-Americans in competition for cheap labor. Similar transitions occurred with Spanish, Italian and other national groups...

All eventually became “white”, and in the case of most Irish Catholics, with a vengeance....

I recall reading about that years ago. The Irish actually contributed greatly to racism against African Americans since they were competing for the same jobs.

Anyone not a WASP could not get a good job, including southern Italians which had their own racial census category for some time. Paddy, the stereotypical Irish NYPD cop, was one of the few jobs a Catholic could get, back when being a cop was not a good profession. The Italians and Irish were forced into NYC ghettos since they could not get housing elsewhere. Jews of course were treated very similarly in terms of housing and jobs. African Americans were obviously treated worst of all. Treatment of Asians in California was also awful. We all know about the Japanese Americans during WW2, but the Chinese building the railroads were also denied housing and good jobs. Along with an immigration act targeting Chinese.

[pc in NM]

People of my heritage - the Irish - were not “white” in the 1800’s USA, and were pitted against African-Americans in competition for cheap labor. Similar transitions occurred with Spanish, Italian and other national groups...

All eventually became “white”, and in the case of most Irish Catholics, with a vengeance....

I recall reading about that years ago. The Irish actually contributed greatly to racism against African Americans since they were competing for the same jobs.

Anyone not a WASP could not get a good job, including southern Italians which had their own racial census category for some time. Paddy, the stereotypical Irish NYPD cop, was one of the few jobs a Catholic could get, back when being a cop was not a good profession. The Italians and Irish were forced into NYC ghettos since they could not get housing elsewhere. Jews of course were treated very similarly in terms of housing and jobs. African Americans were obviously treated worst of all. Treatment of Asians in California was also awful. We all know about the Japanese Americans during WW2, but the Chinese building the railroads were also denied housing and good jobs. Along with an immigration act targeting Chinese.

I highly recommend "How the Irish Became White" as a worthy, well-documented, and very readable account of this history...



And this commentary on the author is worth the time:

Noel Ignatiev’s Long Fight Against Whiteness

By Jay Caspian Kang
November 15, 2019

Noel Ignatiev.

In 1995, Noel Ignatiev, a recent graduate of the doctoral program in history at Harvard, published his dissertation with Routledge, an academic press. Many such books appear, then disappear, subsumed into the endless paper shuffling of the academic credentialling process. But Ignatiev was not a typical graduate student, and his book, “How the Irish Became White,” was not meant to stay within the academy. A fifty-four-year-old Marxist radical, Ignatiev had come to the academy after two decades of work in steel mills and factories. The provocative argument at the center of his book—that whiteness was not a biological fact but rather a social construction with boundaries that shifted over time—had emerged, in large part, out of his observations of how workers from every conceivable background had interacted on the factory floor. Ignatiev wasn’t merely describing these dynamics; he wanted to change them. If whiteness could be created, it could also be destroyed.

“How the Irish Became White” quickly broke out of the academic-publishing bubble. Writing in the Washington Post, the historian Nell Irvin Painter called it “the most interesting history book of 1995.” Mumia Abu-Jamal, the activist and death-row inmate, provided an enthusiastic back-cover blurb. Today, many of the ideas Ignatiev proposed or refined—about the nature of whiteness, and about the racial dynamics that unfold among immigrant workers—are taken for granted in classrooms; they influence films, literature, and art. But Ignatiev found it hard to accept the academic rewards that came with his book’s success. Committed to radicalism, he spent much of his time in academia doing what he had done on the factory floor: publishing leaflets and zines about the possibilities of revolutionary change.

Read it all - https://www.newyorker.com/news/postscri ... -whiteness" target="_blank

[CalStateTempe]

So I’m getting back into my Italian citizenship “jute sanguinis” search.

My great grandfather was a bad ass - left Italy at 15, came to Bisbee to work the mines, arrived in 1893, got naturalized in 1897, then returned to home town in the foothills near Turin, to meet, and married my great grandmother in summer of 1900, then sails back in fall of 1900 (with his MIL in tow) to settle down in Bisbee and give birth to my Grandfather in 1902.

Goes on to be a postmaster and head of the Italian miners union. Was a delegate to the bull moose party for Teddy Roosevelt, for the state of Arizona. Was involved in local politics for Bisbee from the 1910s till his death in 1940. Made 6 trips home to Italy over his lifetime.

An average story, but to me, awesome. To think what travel was like in those days and I’m totally romanticizing it, but I’d like to think he had a spirit of adventure and dedication to the civic good which makes me proud. I see those traits in my family to this day.

Here’s the kicker, because he naturalized in 1897, his line is a no go for me due to the 1912 rule.

However because he married my great grandmother in Italy before returning, Italian law states that she never gave up her citizenship and her US citizenship is “involuntary” (captive spouse idea) per the 1948 rule, and can still be passed to her children born in the us.

Unclear if she ever naturalized. And she kept her last name after marriage! Pretty cool IMO.

So because of great grandma, I’m still eligible, I think!

[RichardCranium]

What's the "1912 rule"?

Was he involved in the Bisbee Deportation of 1917 Wikipedia Bisbee Deportation

Was he involved in the Bisbee Riot of 1919? Wikipedia Bisbee Riot

[84Cat]

So I’m getting back into my Italian citizenship “jute sanguinis” search.

My great grandfather was a bad ass - left Italy at 15, came to Bisbee to work the mines, arrived in 1893, got naturalized in 1897, then returned to home town in the foothills near Turin, to meet, and married my great grandmother in summer of 1900, then sails back in fall of 1900 (with his MIL in tow) to settle down in Bisbee and give birth to my Grandfather in 1902.

Goes on to be a postmaster and head of the Italian miners union. Was a delegate to the bull moose party for Teddy Roosevelt, for the state of Arizona. Was involved in local politics for Bisbee from the 1910s till his death in 1940. Made 6 trips home to Italy over his lifetime.

An average story, but to me, awesome. To think what travel was like in those days and I’m totally romanticizing it, but I’d like to think he had a spirit of adventure and dedication to the civic good which makes me proud. I see those traits in my family to this day.

Here’s the kicker, because he naturalized in 1897, his line is a no go for me due to the 1912 rule.

However because he married my great grandmother in Italy before returning, Italian law states that she never gave up her citizenship and her US citizenship is “involuntary” (captive spouse idea) per the 1948 rule, and can still be passed to her children born in the us.

Unclear if she ever naturalized. And she kept her last name after marriage! Pretty cool IMO.

So because of great grandma, I’m still eligible, I think!

This guy got his Italian citizenship recently through his family. He has a few posts about the process. Took him 3 years to complete it

https://www.traipsingabout.com/p/faqs-a ... itizenship

[gronk4heisman]

So I’m getting back into my Italian citizenship “jute sanguinis” search.

My great grandfather was a bad ass - left Italy at 15, came to Bisbee to work the mines, arrived in 1893, got naturalized in 1897, then returned to home town in the foothills near Turin, to meet, and married my great grandmother in summer of 1900, then sails back in fall of 1900 (with his MIL in tow) to settle down in Bisbee and give birth to my Grandfather in 1902.

Goes on to be a postmaster and head of the Italian miners union. Was a delegate to the bull moose party for Teddy Roosevelt, for the state of Arizona. Was involved in local politics for Bisbee from the 1910s till his death in 1940. Made 6 trips home to Italy over his lifetime.

An average story, but to me, awesome. To think what travel was like in those days and I’m totally romanticizing it, but I’d like to think he had a spirit of adventure and dedication to the civic good which makes me proud. I see those traits in my family to this day.

Here’s the kicker, because he naturalized in 1897, his line is a no go for me due to the 1912 rule.

However because he married my great grandmother in Italy before returning, Italian law states that she never gave up her citizenship and her US citizenship is “involuntary” (captive spouse idea) per the 1948 rule, and can still be passed to her children born in the us.

Unclear if she ever naturalized. And she kept her last name after marriage! Pretty cool IMO.

So because of great grandma, I’m still eligible, I think!

I am following the same process, luckily my great grandfather never naturalized.

[Alieberman]

My 2 son's and I are in the middle of gaining our Austrian citizenships through their Jewish Austrian Citizen descendant program. We just passed our FBI background check.

This process has been very interesting in figuring out the exact timeline of my grandparents escape. (They never talked about their lives pre- immigration to the United States.... even to their son - my father). We were able to track down their immigration papers and found out they got out of Austria about a month before Kristallnacht. Truly amazing.

We are all going on a European trip over the summer- focusing on Austria.... It should be fairly emotional.

[Merkin]

Amazing stories.

I saw a few weeks ago this Italian village will pay you to live there if you can work remotely.

My ancestry is Prussian, but think they ended the right to return in the 60s. Not that I could ever leave California.

[Chicat]

I’m in Cleveland tonight because my mom gave a lecture at the Cleveland Museum of Art (which is actually an incredible museum on par with the Met or the Art Institute of Chicago) talking about the painting The Power of Music by William Sydney Mount.

She wrote a book a few years back on Mount because he painted many members of our family who were free Blacks and indentured servants on Long Island in the early 1800s. She was able to identify them through genealogy and historical research and has proven that a number of them are our relatives, including the Black man in the painting that hangs in their gallery. So the museum reached out to her and flew her out to give this talk.

It was incredible to see my mother speaking to 30+ people about her research, the painting, and the author. I’m just so proud of her. They now have a plaque up next to the painting with her picture and the story of our family. To know that in a museum with multiple Van Goghs and Picassos and Monets and Warhols, that people can learn about my family and the efforts my mother has undertaken to document them and trace their lives and how they were immortalized by such a fine artist is simply amazing. Easily one of the proudest moments of my life.

[scumdevils86]

That's fantastic. The painting is incredible too. Thanks for sharing.

[84Cat]

You must be so proud. That's a wonderful story Chi!

[UAEebs86]

That is awesome Chi. Your mom rocks!

[CalStateTempe]

Awesome Chi, very proud of your family and your mom. Great painting

[dovecanyoncat]

Family legacy is so empowering. So proud for you Chi. I hope your boys feel the juice and carry it into the next generation.

[Alieberman]

Amazing. You should feel so proud

[Chicat]

Thank you Gents! I am not just proud, I’m in awe of her. To write her first book in her 70s, and for it to result in all of this is just so incredible. I had to hold back tears on too many moments during the event to count.

My wife, my boys, and my niece (3 out of her 4 grandchildren) all came to witness it as well. And I can see that they all think she’s as much of a rockstar as I do. They’ll be telling everyone forever about this.

And I have to say, I know it will be the rare occasion that you may find yourself in Cleveland, but the museum is truly incredible and if you are here for any reason you should check it out even if just for an hour or two. I had no idea, but it truly is a world class collection of art of all types (a huge Murakami exhibit is opening in May). We walked through with our mouths hung open at all the incredible art and artists and I wish we had given ourselves more time to explore. To top it off, it is completely FREE. All we paid for was parking. We are thinking of coming back possibly this summer because of just how cool it is.

[azgreg]

Fantastic chi.

[pc in NM]

Thanks for sharing, Chi! Bask in her reflected glory!! So cool!!

[gouacats]

Awesome!

[UAdevil]

That's so damn cool Chi.

[EastCoastCat]

Way to go Momcat!

Amazing story Chi. You must be so proud.

[Chicat]

Like you would not believe ECC. Still beaming a day later.

[azcat49]

Incredible reading about this! So amazing she is.

[Carcassdragger]

This is really great and cool. Thanks Chi.

[Alieberman]

My 2 son's and I are in the middle of gaining our Austrian citizenships through their Jewish Austrian Citizen descendant program. We just passed our FBI background check.

This process has been very interesting in figuring out the exact timeline of my grandparents escape. (They never talked about their lives pre- immigration to the United States.... even to their son - my father). We were able to track down their immigration papers and found out they got out of Austria about a month before Kristallnacht. Truly amazing.

We are all going on a European trip over the summer- focusing on Austria.... It should be fairly emotional.

Follow up-

It's been a pain the ass to get this paperwork done in the US. So my wife decided to reach out directly to the Austrian Consulate in Vienna. We now have someone in the Austrian Consulate's office emailing us almost every day to help us out... plus... he is coming to our hotel in Vienna next month when we are there to make this happen.

He basically told us he is going to get us our Citizenship that we are owed and that the County of Austria wants us to have.

And the cherry on the top... he is trying to go through old records to see if he can find anything on my grandparents. (Apartments they lived at, employment, other family records we don't know about)

I can't wait for this trip.

[dovecanyoncat]

A vital touchstone for your kids.

[Chicat]

That is amazing

[gronk4heisman]

Italy changed their citizenship laws this year, I was about midway through the process of getting my sister and I our citizenship paying a good deal of lawyer fees but as of a month ago we are no longer eligible.