UCLA Basketball in trouble!

[UAEebs86]

[AZCatGirl]

I'm saying this not having watched a full UCLA game, but it feels like the players have quit on Mick. Only question is how much longer will their AD let this go on?

[Merkin]

I'm saying this not having watched a full UCLA game, but it feels like the players have quit on Mick. Only question is how much longer will their AD let this go on?

I was thinking the same thing. Reminds me of the Ben Lindsey year when the players quit on him, and made the Cats look worse than they really were.

Will owe Mick $20M, but will save a bit if they wait until the season is over.

https://www.si.com/college/ucla/mens-ba ... %20clinics.

Either side would have to pay $24 million to break off the deal before March 31, 2023, $20 million before March 31, 2024, $16 million before March 31, 2025, $10 million before March 31, 2026, $6 million before March 31, 2027, and $2 million before March 31, 2028.

[MrBug708]

They will always have basketball money buyout money but he is in danger of equaling the 10-19 year that was awful

[TheCat]

Who do you suppose will be the head coach at UCLA next year?

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

[Beachcat97]

He was their 4th choice of coach. Not surprising that things are going this way.

Their last two hires are Alford and Cronin. Those aren’t the kind of names top programs hire. And their next coach won’t be much better.

[TheCat]

Listen Cronin as robbed these guys of any confidence and has demoralized the young men that chose to come to UCLA. I am confident that a lot of these guys, especially Mack, will be in the portal at year-end. Mack is a good player who Cronin says would play only 5 minutes on a experienced team. How about pumping him up while talking about room for improvement? No ..that would shine the light on the coach not getting the maximum from his players. While I always want to beat the hell out of the Bruins you have to feel sorry for the players that are playing with no hint of happiness or hope. They have pride, they want to win, they want to get NIL money and they have a coach that is making that more difficult.

[UAEebs86]

Listen Cronin as robbed these guys of any confidence and has demoralized the young men that chose to come to UCLA. I am confident that a lot of these guys, especially Mack, will be in the portal at year-end. Mack is a good player who Cronin says would play only 5 minutes on a experienced team. How about pumping him up while talking about room for approval? No ..that would shine the light on the coach not getting the maximum from his players. While I always want to beat the hell out of the Bruins you have to feel sorry for the players that are playing with no hint of happiness or hope. They have pride, they want to win, they want to get NIL money and they have a coach that is making that more difficult.

If this was 20 years ago this could have had a Mackovician ending with the players going to the ADs office. Now they can just transfer.

Bold strategy Cotton.

[dovecanyoncat]

In the time of NIL Mick keeps talking "loyalty". But it's actually a gimp suit, ball gag and Get back in the trunk BITCH!

[dovecanyoncat]

Imagine going through life with the Name Rod Palmer. I mean ..... jesus fucking christ.

[Merkin]

His dad probably knew he wouldn't be around. Just left him an old guitar and an empty bottle of booze. But he grew up quick and he grew up mean.

[dovecanyoncat]

His Dad Harry and his Mom Rose were just mad at the world.

[Beachcat97]

I can’t believe Cronin ditched the press conference last night. He made some remark recently about his players not being able to cry for mommy. Well, it sure looks like Micro Mick was sobbing under his bed last night while his assistant faced the media. Unbelievable.

[MrBug708]

Who do you suppose will be the head coach at UCLA next year?

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

Mick's complaint with UCLA is he can't afford the NIL game right now. Not sure that would be a problem at Louisville.

[84Cat]

[dovecanyoncat]

Heeeeey! We're not the only ones to push that meme!! Way to go knuckleheads!!!

[TheCat]

Who do you suppose will be the head coach at UCLA next year?

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

Mick's complaint with UCLA is he can't afford the NIL game right now. Not sure that would be a problem at Louisville.

Uh....you had a freshman last year that bought a porsche for himself and for his mom. Don't tell me guys can't get NIL money in Los Angeles.

[TheCat]

Sharks are circling because of his demeanor as much as performance.

https://www.latimes.com/sports/ucla/sto ... onsibility

[dovecanyoncat]

From the linked LA Times article: Aptitude? As to teaching, my Father taught college students for 66 years. I remember him saying two things: You cannot teach anyone who doesn't first grasp that there is something they don't know, that is, they must admit they are ignorant. Next, the same goes for teachers: they, as well, are taught by students, and will not actually teach if unable to admit to needing to be taught. Ultimately, learning to learn is what student and teacher provide each other.

[MrBug708]

Who do you suppose will be the head coach at UCLA next year?

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

Mick's complaint with UCLA is he can't afford the NIL game right now. Not sure that would be a problem at Louisville.

Uh....you had a freshman last year that bought a porsche for himself and for his mom. Don't tell me guys can't get NIL money in Los Angeles.

You are confusing athlete's brand portfolio with schools paying players. Amari Bailey was collecting money long before he was committed to UCLA because he had a large social media presence. Drake also took his mom on a date to Dodger Stadium. Bailey didn't come to UCLA for money...lol

[CatsbyAZ]

What a disaster

[TheCat]

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

Mick's complaint with UCLA is he can't afford the NIL game right now. Not sure that would be a problem at Louisville.

Uh....you had a freshman last year that bought a porsche for himself and for his mom. Don't tell me guys can't get NIL money in Los Angeles.

You are confusing athlete's brand portfolio with schools paying players. Amari Bailey was collecting money long before he was committed to UCLA because he had a large social media presence. Drake also took his mom on a date to Dodger Stadium. Bailey didn't come to UCLA for money...lol

Exactly what is his brand if not basketball? Schools are not the ones that provide real NIL money to athletes. Can't say why he went to UCLA or why he was drafted to tell the truth. I knew Drake was cheap.

[TheCat]

Who do you suppose will be the head coach at UCLA next year?

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

Mick's complaint with UCLA is he can't afford the NIL game right now. Not sure that would be a problem at Louisville.

BRO just reported that UCLA basketball is in the top 5 for NIL money. Not sure how they know that but whatever.

[Merkin]

NIL money is all confidential, why would anyone know that?

The only reason we know JDL made $8K a month NIL money because of the court filing.

ON3 just does valuation, not the actual NIL money paid.

[TheCat]

You would have to ask BRO how they know. We know for example KJ Lewis got an Audi from a dealership in Texas. Not sure of anything else for Az players because as you say it is private.

[U.P. Zona Fan]

Didn't dalen terry get an ice cream flavor a couple years ago?

[UAEebs86]

Didn't dalen terry get an ice cream flavor a couple years ago?

He tweeted trying to get an NIL hookup with Eegee's but I don't think it ever happened.

[MrBug708]

Who do you suppose will be the head coach at UCLA next year?

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

Mick's complaint with UCLA is he can't afford the NIL game right now. Not sure that would be a problem at Louisville.

BRO just reported that UCLA basketball is in the top 5 for NIL money. Not sure how they know that but whatever.

The only I think I saw posted today by BRO literally said the opposite, that it's not top 5, so if you have a link handy...?

[TheCat]

Mick does look like he wants to be in Louisville next year

Louisville is not going to hire a coach with a terrible demeanor or isolates players.

Mick's complaint with UCLA is he can't afford the NIL game right now. Not sure that would be a problem at Louisville.

BRO just reported that UCLA basketball is in the top 5 for NIL money. Not sure how they know that but whatever.

The only I think I saw posted today by BRO literally said the opposite, that it's not top 5, so if you have a link handy...?

Looks like he changed the article. Here is a reference on another UCLA site that says the article changed.
https://www.bruinzone.com/b12/messages/17329.shtml

Or maybe it was just poorly written and now says adequate.

[MrBug708]

Sounds like the Bruinzone guy misread the quote, but it could have been a typo. UCLA has long been cheap, not sure why anyone would believe they suddenly became top dollar in the world of NIL.

[Merkin]

UCLA needs another Sam Gilbert.

[MrBug708]

Those haircuts were a game changer!

[Alieberman]

I may have missed something...

But are we blaming UCLA's piss poor shit basketball on NIL?

[arizonawildcats]

Mick is doing that.

[TheCat]

Sounds like the Bruinzone guy misread the quote, but it could have been a typo. UCLA has long been cheap, not sure why anyone would believe they suddenly became top dollar in the world of NIL.

UCLA being cheap has nothing to do with players getting deals for their image and likeness. You think USC coordinated Caleb's deals? Arizona did not reach out to a car dealership in Texas to get an Audi for one of their players.

[wyo-cat]

Nothing is Mick’s fault.

What a lame ass. Dude should man up at some point and take some blame. At least his players might respect him for it and start playing.

[dovecanyoncat]

His latest presser was a soft-pedal. He got the news he fucked up.

[IrishAzCat]

[MrBug708]

Sounds like the Bruinzone guy misread the quote, but it could have been a typo. UCLA has long been cheap, not sure why anyone would believe they suddenly became top dollar in the world of NIL.

UCLA being cheap has nothing to do with players getting deals for their image and likeness. You think USC coordinated Caleb's deals? Arizona did not reach out to a car dealership in Texas to get an Audi for one of their players.

That's an interesting take. Thanks for the insight!

[TheCat]

Sounds like the Bruinzone guy misread the quote, but it could have been a typo. UCLA has long been cheap, not sure why anyone would believe they suddenly became top dollar in the world of NIL.

UCLA being cheap has nothing to do with players getting deals for their image and likeness. You think USC coordinated Caleb's deals? Arizona did not reach out to a car dealership in Texas to get an Audi for one of their players.

That's an interesting take. Thanks for the insight!

There is a huge difference between a NIL Deal and a NIL collective.

A NIL deal is an agreement or arrangement between a student-athlete and a third party, such as a brand, company or individual, where the student-athlete receives compensation for the use of their name, image and likeness.

NIL collectives are support networks for college athletes where donors pool together money to compensate athletes for their name, image and likeness. These independent organizations generate NIL deals for athletes at specific schools while operating separately from the schools themselves.

Each state has different requirements/regulations for their NIL and some states none at all. California is covered by state law and so is Arizona although the law may be different. A cottage industry has sprouted up to provide services to athletes in getting NIL deals. The reason you don't see Caleb (USC) in a USC uniform in his numerous commercials is that there must be permission granted by the University (trademark law). The NCAA and schools also have provision to protect corporate sponsors like NIKE or Coca Cola, IMG Sports etc.

The NCAA rules are pretty lax in all of this but they do prohibit pay for performance and as an inducement for RECRUITING.

Glad to be of service to you Mr. Bug. You can read the specifics for UCLA on their website. Their students are expected to discuss their NIL deal with coaches/administrators. The NCAA does not require this though.

The real money for SA's come from NIL deals not collectives.

[Merkin]

The reason you don't see Caleb (USC) in a USC uniform in his numerous commercials is that there must be permission granted by the University (trademark law).

Good example here of that. No reference at all to the UA, especially the block A and cactus logo are missing.

Even the "preferred" UA collective shirts just have a name and number.

https://arizonaassist.com/products/cale ... -shirt-red

[dovecanyoncat]

Sounds like the Bruinzone guy misread the quote, but it could have been a typo. UCLA has long been cheap, not sure why anyone would believe they suddenly became top dollar in the world of NIL.

UCLA being cheap has nothing to do with players getting deals for their image and likeness. You think USC coordinated Caleb's deals? Arizona did not reach out to a car dealership in Texas to get an Audi for one of their players.

That's an interesting take. Thanks for the insight!

There is a huge difference between a NIL Deal and a NIL collective.

A NIL deal is an agreement or arrangement between a student-athlete and a third party, such as a brand, company or individual, where the student-athlete receives compensation for the use of their name, image and likeness.

NIL collectives are support networks for college athletes where donors pool together money to compensate athletes for their name, image and likeness. These independent organizations generate NIL deals for athletes at specific schools while operating separately from the schools themselves.

Each state has different requirements/regulations for their NIL and some states none at all. California is covered by state law and so is Arizona although the law may be different. A cottage industry has sprouted up to provide services to athletes in getting NIL deals. The reason you don't see Caleb (USC) in a USC uniform in his numerous commercials is that there must be permission granted by the University (trademark law). The NCAA and schools also have provision to protect corporate sponsors like NIKE or Coca Cola, IMG Sports etc.

The NCAA rules are pretty lax in all of this but they do prohibit pay for performance and as an inducement for RECRUITING.

Glad to be of service to you Mr. Bug. You can read the specifics for UCLA on their website. Their students are expected to discuss their NIL deal with coaches/administrators. The NCAA does not require this though.

The real money for SA's come from NIL deals not collectives.

Thanks TC. So the deal(ers) are the funding source and the collectives are aggregators, all of which is mitigated by state, school, and NCAA. Surely there is a slot across the flow of funds for legal counsel to grab its taste and to play tricks within the wrinkle zone of "inducement for RECRUITING". Sounds like quite a fondue of influence for kids to dip into.

[gronk4heisman]

Basically Mick knows that he needs to have twice as much NIL money as other schools to convince players to play for him.

[TheCat]

Mara has gone from a potential lottery pick to less than 5 minutes per game in the last 4 PAC games. I never thought he was remotely a lottery but Peyton went from ball boy at UCLA to PRO so maybe it is just the environment. Mara can't rebound but is playing less at UCLA then he did for his professional team. Great recruiting pitch.

[TheCat]

Here is a link to a UCLA site. The sharks are circling. https://www.bruinzone.com/b12/messages/17421.shtml

SI says no fear because his buyout is so large but if he wants to leave (louisville) he pays the same so don't expect Cronin to go anywhere.

[84Cat]

Here is a link to a UCLA site. The sharks are circling. https://www.bruinzone.com/b12/messages/17421.shtml

SI says no fear because his buyout is so large but if he wants to leave (louisville) he pays the same so don't expect Cronin to go anywhere.

That is one ugly ui. How can anyone read that site for more than a couple of minutes at a time?

[Merkin]

Here is a link to a UCLA site. The sharks are circling. https://www.bruinzone.com/b12/messages/17421.shtml

SI says no fear because his buyout is so large but if he wants to leave (louisville) he pays the same so don't expect Cronin to go anywhere.

That is one ugly ui. How can anyone read that site for more than a couple of minutes at a time?

That looks like one of the original UA fan sites created in the 1990's. Just all text. UA????? something.

Pretty good site for knowledgeable posters.

[dmjcat]

UCLA needs another Sam Gilbert.

The amazing thing is that most UCLA fans don't even know who Sam Gilbert was (or refuse to admit they know)

https://www.esquire.com/sports/a5694/co ... tory-2009/

https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm ... story.html

The dark side of the UCLA basketball dynasty
BY CHRIS DUFRESNE
JUNE 8, 2010 12 AM PT


John R. Wooden, who died Friday at age 99, left for the ages an exemplary body of work in which the rewards, ten-fold, outweighed the trials.

No rendering of Wooden’s legacy, though, is complete without mention of a man who influenced one of sport’s most unimpeachable dynasties:

Sam Gilbert.

If Wooden was the father figure of UCLA basketball, Gilbert was its shadowy one.

Gilbert was a small, burly, self-made man with unfettered devotion to the Bruins. He could be benevolent yet, to nose-poking reporters, a bully. He attended UCLA in the 1930s but did not graduate, later to make his fortune as a contractor.

UCLA players recalled his showing up after Bruins games in the 1960s, dispensing apples and oranges.

He forged bonds with many Bruins who helped hang 10 national championship banners from 1964 to 1975, the year Wooden retired.

Gilbert held dinners at his home, provided UCLA players with advice, counsel and much, much more. He was “Papa Sam” to UCLA’s parade of All-Americans — he even negotiated contracts, usually taking only a dollar, when the NBA beckoned various Bruins.

“There were two people I listened to,” former UCLA star Lucius Allen once told The Times. “Coach Wooden as long as we were between the lines. Outside the court — Sam Gilbert.”

Wooden was wary of Gilbert but generally turned a blind eye.

“Maybe I had tunnel vision,” Wooden once said. “I still don’t think he’s had any great impact on the basketball program.”

Gilbert’s influence ultimately helped land UCLA basketball on NCAA probation. In December 1981, UCLA was cited for nine infractions and received two years’ probation, which included a one-year NCAA tournament ban and an order to vacate its 1980 NCAA national title game appearance against Louisville.

The most serious allegation levied against Gilbert was that he co-signed a promissory note so a player could buy a car. The NCAA ordered UCLA to disassociate Gilbert from its recruiting process.

Larry Brown was UCLA’s basketball coach in 1980; none of the violations were tied to Wooden’s era.

A 1981 Times investigative series, which interviewed 45 people connected with the basketball program, established Gilbert as “a one-man clearing house who has enabled players and their families to receive goods and services usually at big discounts and sometimes at no cost.”

The paper quoted Brent Clark, an NCAA field investigator who said that, in 1977, he was told to drop his case in Westwood. “If I had spent a month in Los Angeles, I could have put them on indefinite suspension,” he said of UCLA. An NCAA spokesman disputed this claim, saying that Clark was living a “fantasy world.”

The Times established that Gilbert, during Wooden’s heyday, helped players get cars, clothes, airline tickets and scalpers’ prices for UCLA season tickets. Gilbert allegedly even arranged abortions for players’ girlfriends.

One former UCLA All-American told The Times: “What do you want me to say? That’s my school. I don’t want to see them take away all those championships.” Gilbert considered many NCAA rules arcane and silly.

Larry Farmer, who played for Wooden and later became head coach, remarked of Gilbert: “I saw him move mountains.”

The Times’ investigation concluded Gilbert probably committed several NCAA violations in his dealings with UCLA players.

Wooden, in 1981, told The Times: “There’s as much crookedness as you want to find. There was something Abraham Lincoln said — he’d rather trust and be disappointed than distrust and be miserable all the time. Maybe I trusted too much.”

Times reporters Mike Littwin and Alan Greenberg opined:

“ . . . Wooden knew about Gilbert. He knew the players were close to Gilbert. He knew they looked to Gilbert for advice. Maybe he knew more. He should have known much more. If he didn’t, it was only because he apparently chose not to look.”

Gilbert died, at age 74, in 1987, four days before federal prosecutors, unaware of his passing, indicted him for racketeering and money laundering.

“I tried my best,” Wooden told the Basketball Times in 2005, “. . . My conscience is clear.”

[Beachcat97]

Here is a link to a UCLA site. The sharks are circling. https://www.bruinzone.com/b12/messages/17421.shtml

SI says no fear because his buyout is so large but if he wants to leave (louisville) he pays the same so don't expect Cronin to go anywhere.

Why would Louisville want to hire Mick Cronin? I'd think they'd have higher standards. ucla I can understand, but not Louisville.

[Merkin]

UA should model their contracts after UCLA's, where the coach's buyout is the same as the university's. Fisch's buyout is $5.5M next season, and drop each season. UA's buyout is 70% of his salary.

https://www.azdesertswarm.com/football/ ... gents-2023